What is your personal big board right now?

[KobesScarf]

He's clearly the Raptors best player and his impact has been greater this year leading the Raptors to 60+ wins than it ever was.

He's not been clearly their best player and there's plenty of evidence that his impact isn't great at all. Agree to disagree.

Did you start watching basketball in 2014? The Warriors did not invent basketball.

Tell me, why are you here again? To be insolent to people who disagree with you while not adding anything of value to this board? But if you want to play that game: did you stop trying to understand basketball past 1980 when focusing primarily on basic boxscores without context was still acceptable? The Warriors have literally nothing to do with this by the way, but nice try.

edit: but this thread isn't about DeRozan. DeRozan was an example to illustrate my approach to eminence's interesting way to rank prospects. Nothing more and nothing less. If you want to have a discussion about the goodness and impact of DeRozan you might want to consider opening a thread on the PC board. Here it is clearly OT and I won't further comment on DeRozan in this thread.

Derozan is clearly the Raptors best player and there is not even a close 2nd. No one even debates this. But even if he was the 3rd best player your statement would still be ridiculous

You opinion of Derozan does illustrate a new basketball fans perspective where they view pretty much every aspect of basketball through the prototype of the Warriors and no matter how good if they don't fit in to the Warriors they more or less suck.

[Joel Embust]

Fine here it is heh

Outcome descriptors:
10 - MVP+
9 - All-NBA
8 - All-Star
7 - Great Starter
6 - Good Starter
5 - Okay Starter/Great Bench
4 - Low Starter/Good Bench
3 - Decent Bench
2 - Ehh Bench
1 - Questionable NBA Player

1. Marvin Bagley (4 - 8)
2. Deandre Ayton (3 - 8)
3. Luka Dončič (3 - 7)
4. Mikal Bridges (3 - 8)
5. Kevin Knox (2 - 8)
6. Jaren Jackson Jr. (3 - 8)
7. Mo Bamba (3 - 8)
8. Miles Bridges(3 - 8)
9. Trae Young (2 - 5)
10. Collin Sexton(2 - 6)

I don’t agree with you, but I appreciate your out-of-the-box thinking in terms of how you ranked players.

It is "eminence" who started ranking players like this earlier in the thread.

[Stillwater]

Fine here it is heh

Outcome descriptors:
10 - MVP+
9 - All-NBA
8 - All-Star
7 - Great Starter
6 - Good Starter
5 - Okay Starter/Great Bench
4 - Low Starter/Good Bench
3 - Decent Bench
2 - Ehh Bench
1 - Questionable NBA Player

1. Marvin Bagley (4 - 8)
2. Deandre Ayton (3 - 8)
3. Luka Dončič (3 - 7)
4. Mikal Bridges (3 - 8)
5. Kevin Knox (2 - 8)
6. Jaren Jackson Jr. (3 - 8)
7. Mo Bamba (3 - 8)
8. Miles Bridges(3 - 8)
9. Trae Young (2 - 5)
10. Collin Sexton(2 - 6)

I don’t agree with you, but I appreciate your out-of-the-box thinking in terms of how you ranked players.

It is "eminence" who started ranking players like this earlier in the thread.

It is an interesting yet pretty generalized way of saying how much or how little confidence someone has in any prospects.
Example: some think Sexton is too careless and not a good enough shooter to be more than good starter, but I think his athleticism, speed especially underated scoring and the fact that he is a relentless rebounder for a guard are all the type of attributes I'm looking for in a player who will be more than good starter if he develops in any way which is highly likely given the drive and will he possesses.I think his floor is a good starter.
But all that being said if he drafted by the wrong org that wants something different from him or doesn't play him enough, he could easily be stuck in a backup role.
Prospects like Sexton, Zhaire Smith, Robert Williams etc are at the biggest risk of being busts ONLY if they are brought in to the league by a org with high expectations of them quickly becoming shooters to match their athletic achievements defensively or scoring ability aside from high level shooting...that's not what they are NOW and it's the risk you take that they may never be that but what they bring in intangibles makes their ceilings higher and worth it over better shooters with lesser athletic ability and more importantly less drive and will to succeed as you could argue Zhaire or Sexton could be an all star or even the next Westbrook eventually whereas Mikal having a much more refined shooting stroke and solid defense after his junior season being 21 is unlikely to improve significantly beyond the floor he has reached which could in fact and will likely drop some against tougher opponents as proven against a near pro level defense at Texas Tech.

[eminence]

Close to a final update, still making some small tweaks to player ranges, combine #'s could change guys just a bit.

Outcome descriptors:
10 - MVP+
9 - All-NBA
8 - All-Star
7 - Great Starter
6 - Good Starter
5 - Okay Starter/Great Bench
4 - Low Starter/Good Bench
3 - Decent Bench
2 - Ehh Bench
1 - Questionable NBA Player

Rank. Player: 20% Percentile Outcome - 80% Percentile Outcome
1. Luka Doncic: 5 - 9
2. Jaren Jackson Jr: 4 - 9
3. Trae Young: 3 - 9
4. Mikal Bridges: 4 - 8
5. Wendell Carter Jr: 3 - 8
6. Mohamed Bamba: 1 - 9
7. Landry Shamet: 3 - 7
8. Marvin Bagley III: 3 - 7
9. Michael Porter Jr: 1 - 8
10. DeAndre Ayton: 1 - 8
11. Gary Clark: 2 - 7
12. Shai Gilgeous-Alexander: 1 - 7
13. Zhaire Smith: 1 - 7
14. Jontay Porter: 2 - 6
15. Jacob Evans III: 2 - 6
16. DeVon Hall: 2 - 6
17. Jalen Brunson: 2 - 6
18. Shake Milton: 2 - 6

It's possible I missed someone, but everyone else I can think of off the top of my head has a 'reasonable' 1 - 6 range or lower (imo obviously).

[slc24]

I look for attitude/dedication/rate of improvement, measurables, production, motor, and then “it” factor.

1. Doncic
2. Melton
3. Bagley
4. JJJ
5. Okogie
6. Young
7. Miles
8. Mikal
9. Ayton
10. Okobo
11. Zhaire
12. Shai
13. Carter
14. Musa
15. Carr
16. Brunson
17. MPJ
18. Bamba
19. Jontay
20. KBD
21. Clark
22. DiVichenzo
23. Evans
24. Shamet
25. Williams
26. Sexton
27. Brown
28. Thomas
29. Milton
30. Walker

[Duke4life831]

Posted this on the other thread but this is probably the better thread to post it on

1. Bagley
2. Bamba
3. Ayton
4. MPJ
5. Carter
6. JJJ
7. Mikal
8. Robert Williams
9. Knox
10. Trevon Duval

For a more detail version on why I have some of these weird rankings. Here is a link to the other thread where I went into a little more detail.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1694006&start=20#p65671005

[eminence]

Posted this on the other thread but this is probably the better thread to post it on

1. Bagley
2. Bamba
3. Ayton
4. MPJ
5. Carter
6. JJJ
7. Mikal
8. Robert Williams
9. Knox
10. Trevon Duval

For a more detail version on why I have some of these weird rankings. Here is a link to the other thread where I went into a little more detail.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1694006&start=20#p65671005

Hmm, Knox is the big one for me, can you go in a bit more depth there?

[Duke4life831]

Posted this on the other thread but this is probably the better thread to post it on

1. Bagley
2. Bamba
3. Ayton
4. MPJ
5. Carter
6. JJJ
7. Mikal
8. Robert Williams
9. Knox
10. Trevon Duval

For a more detail version on why I have some of these weird rankings. Here is a link to the other thread where I went into a little more detail.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1694006&start=20#p65671005

Hmm, Knox is the big one for me, can you go in a bit more depth there?

The last 3 for in my top 10 are big reward and big risk guys. I really had a hard time filling out a top 10 after that 7 spot, Ive made it pretty clear Im not a fan of the depth of this draft at all (lottery depth specifically).

With Knox I like his athleticism where I think he can become a good defender and a good cutter and transition threat, I like his the form on his jumper and FT where I think he has a legit chance at becoming a solid-good shooter. A lot of it is I like the kid, from everything Ive heard he has a great work ethic and I dont really see a huge huge hole in his game where I think, "that one thing really scares me about his potential." But its kind of the same thing I say about Bagley, I like the foundation of his skills. No skill really blows me away right now, but I dont see huge holes in anyone skill set, so I can see him becoming pretty good in most areas.I dont think hes ever going to become a guy that can create his own shot consistently and usually that wouldve kept him out of my top 10, but again not in love with the depth. He's definitely a project, but if you told me 5 years from now he would quietly be a top 10 player from this draft I wouldnt be shocked and I like the odds of it.

Add On: This year Im also going with a lot more of my gut and trying to stay away from other mock drafts and big boards. Im with everyone else and almost having a consensus on that top 7 or so (I know some have Young in there), but after that I feel like its wide open and Im going with my gut. Even with how crazy it sounds to have guys like Williams, Knox and Duval in my top 10.

[NotACat]

I look for attitude/dedication/rate of improvement, measurables, production, motor, and then “it” factor.

1. Doncic
2. Melton
3. Bagley
4. JJJ
5. Okogie
6. Young
7. Miles
8. Mikal
9. Ayton
10. Okobo
11. Zhaire
12. Shai
13. Carter
14. Musa
15. Carr
16. Brunson
17. MPJ
18. Bamba
19. Jontay
20. KBD
21. Clark
22. DiVichenzo
23. Evans
24. Shamet
25. Williams
26. Sexton
27. Brown
28. Thomas
29. Milton
30. Walker

I love that you have Melton that high, I'm high on him as well. I'm curious why you have Shai at 12, by your priorities, shouldn't he be higher given how much he improved over the course of the season?

[slc24]

I love that you have Melton that high, I'm high on him as well. I'm curious why you have Shai at 12, by your priorities, shouldn't he be higher given how much he improved over the course of the season?

I really think Melton might be consensus top 5-10 had he been able to play this season.

With Shai, it’s possible that I’m underrating him, but the big question mark for me is his athleticism/handle for a PG. He seems more Delon Wright than Jrue Holiday in that regard. Still a good player and worth a lotto pick.

[916fan]

1. Ayton
2. Doncic
3. Young
4. Bagley
5. Jackson
6. Porter Jr
7. Bamba
8. Mikal
9. Sexton
10. Zhaire
11. Miles
12. Carter Jr
13. Knox
14. Hutchinson

[Davis]

I love that you have Melton that high, I'm high on him as well. I'm curious why you have Shai at 12, by your priorities, shouldn't he be higher given how much he improved over the course of the season?

I really think Melton might be consensus top 5-10 had he been able to play this season.

I'd love some elaboration on this as well. I like Melton, but it's hard to wrap my head around #2.

[daoneandonly]

Tier I:
1. Ayton
2. Bagley
3. Bamba

I think all 3 could be special, and I'm torn on who I'd want the Mavs to select between Bagley/Bamba if we end up at #3, still leaning towards Bagley

Tier II:
4. JJJ
5. Mikal Bridges
6. Porter Jr (only if healthy)

Tier III:
7. Luka Doncic
8. trae Young
9. Wendall Carter

[slc24]

I love that you have Melton that high, I'm high on him as well. I'm curious why you have Shai at 12, by your priorities, shouldn't he be higher given how much he improved over the course of the season?

I really think Melton might be consensus top 5-10 had he been able to play this season.

I'd love some elaboration on this as well. I like Melton, but it's hard to wrap my head around #2.

He checks all the boxes for me. He’s got a great motor, seems coachable, improved a ton from unranked HS player to top freshman in the country. He’s got nice size and length, not the best athlete but along the lines of Fultz which is still good. Defensively he’s already a stud, averaged a block a game as a guard which is very rare, led the Pac-12 in steals. Offensively he flashes everything you want to see, although most of it is inconsistent: good passer, shot looks very workable (reminds me a lot of Westbrook’s shot), creation/pull up potential, creative but inconsistent finisher, handle is good but not great. All of which should make him a no-brainer lotto pick in my opinion. The reason I have him so high is because watching his interviews and seeing his attitude I just have faith that he will put it all together and improve his weaknesses.

[daoneandonly]

I really think Melton might be consensus top 5-10 had he been able to play this season.

I'd love some elaboration on this as well. I like Melton, but it's hard to wrap my head around #2.

He checks all the boxes for me. He’s got a great motor, seems coachable, improved a ton from unranked HS player to top freshman in the country. He’s got nice size and length, not the best athlete but along the lines of Fultz which is still good. Defensively he’s already a stud, averaged a block a game as a guard which is very rare, led the Pac-12 in steals. Offensively he flashes everything you want to see, although most of it is inconsistent: good passer, shot looks very workable (reminds me a lot of Westbrook’s shot), creation/pull up potential, creative but inconsistent finisher, handle is good but not great. All of which should make him a no-brainer lotto pick in my opinion. The reason I have him so high is because watching his interviews and seeing his attitude I just have faith that he will put it all together and improve his weaknesses.

Interesting, lot of the reports coming out also indicate he has a great motor and will be very coachable

[clyde21]

Okay, been going back and forth on a few of these players in the last few years but I think I've settled on a top 10 for the time being.

1. DeAndre Ayton, C, Arizona
2. Mohamed Bamba, C, Texas
3. Mikal Bridges, SG, Villanova
4. Isaac Bonga, SF, Frankfurt
5. Dzanan Musa, SF, Cedevita
6. Luka Doncic, SG, Real Madrid
7. Marvin Bagley, PF, Duke
8. Jontay Porter, C, Missouri
9. Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
10. Donte DiVincenzo, SG, Villanova

Will try to round out the top 20 when I watch more of the players.

[yoyoboy]

Okay, been going back and forth on a few of these players in the last few years but I think I've settled on a top 10 for the time being.

1. DeAndre Ayton, C, Arizona
2. Mohamed Bamba, C, Texas
3. Mikal Bridges, SG, Villanova
4. Isaac Bonga, SF, Frankfurt
5. Dzanan Musa, SF, Cedevita
6. Luka Doncic, SG, Real Madrid
7. Marvin Bagley, PF, Duke
8. Jontay Porter, C, Missouri
9. Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
10. Donte DiVincenzo, SG, Villanova

Will try to round out the top 20 when I watch more of the players.

No Jackson in the top 10?

And so you really like Bonga and Musa a lot then. Is it that you think that their floors as players are higher than most people believe, or that their upside simply makes it worth it to gamble on them with that high of a pick?

[Bob8]

Okay, been going back and forth on a few of these players in the last few years but I think I've settled on a top 10 for the time being.

1. DeAndre Ayton, C, Arizona
2. Mohamed Bamba, C, Texas
3. Mikal Bridges, SG, Villanova
4. Isaac Bonga, SF, Frankfurt
5. Dzanan Musa, SF, Cedevita
6. Luka Doncic, SG, Real Madrid
7. Marvin Bagley, PF, Duke
8. Jontay Porter, C, Missouri
9. Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
10. Donte DiVincenzo, SG, Villanova

Will try to round out the top 20 when I watch more of the players.

if you have ever watched Musa and Doncic in person, you wouldn’t never make that kind of a board.

[clyde21]

Okay, been going back and forth on a few of these players in the last few years but I think I've settled on a top 10 for the time being.

1. DeAndre Ayton, C, Arizona
2. Mohamed Bamba, C, Texas
3. Mikal Bridges, SG, Villanova
4. Isaac Bonga, SF, Frankfurt
5. Dzanan Musa, SF, Cedevita
6. Luka Doncic, SG, Real Madrid
7. Marvin Bagley, PF, Duke
8. Jontay Porter, C, Missouri
9. Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
10. Donte DiVincenzo, SG, Villanova

Will try to round out the top 20 when I watch more of the players.

No Jackson in the top 10?

And so you really like Bonga and Musa a lot then. Is it that you think that their floors as players are higher than most people believe, or that their upside simply makes it worth it to gamble on them with that high of a pick?

No Jackson Jr. in my top 10. There's something that feels off about him as a player, in my opinion. Some softness there, and I don't think he's as good of a defender as a lot of people seem to think.

That said, he was a hard eval for me on many levels and I wouldn't be surprised if I am completely wrong on him. I just feel more comfortable with the guys I have up there in the top 10 already.

HUGE fan of Bonga and Musa. I really like lengthy wings/bigs that can handle, push and facilitate. I think it provides a lot of value and flexibility to the team and these guys still have a lot of room to grow as players so I really like the ceiling as well.

[Stillwater]

not much has changed for me until after the combine and I know who is in and no longer testing the waters etc.
Right now I give Doncic the edge over Ayton but it's a toss up really.