Demar Vents Frustration About Loyalty

[Raptorfan2012]

Read on Twitter

LOL whats with all these has-beens coming back with their digs? the sign up for Big3 tournament is over there folks.

[whysoserious]

What is so loyal about him that he did in the public eye that other NBA players doesn't do?

For myself I tend to work backwards. I look at the result and I take an educated guess on someone's mindset.
When everything has pretty much worked out for derozan in Toronto: being the alpha dog in marke t all by himself; receiving a big contract; living in a place where he gets worshipped; super long leash didn't have to play defense. All things lead me to the conclusion that the advantage he gains being here is large enough that loyalty doesn't really need to factor into the decision.

Loyalty isn't something to boast about when things are going peachy returning to a team year after year of stumbling in the playoffs and getting another shot to prove your worth. Loyalty is when you get traded away from a situation that clearly isn't working and being understanding and not bad-mouthing your former team and crying on social media. That'd the standard I ahere to, and if he step outside he is no longer loyal IMO.

He publicly stated he wanted to be in Toronto multiple times, when things were bad he still wanted to be here. He never wanted out despite all the playoff struggles and media calling him out (how quickly the US media has turned on that front).

So what if he was given all those things in Toronto, does that go against him being loyal? No, it's all a factor, why do you dismiss it so easily.

Where did he bad mouth anyone? Where has he been shown to suddenly be disloyal? He's venting about being told one thing and the opposite happening and he's showing you just how much he wanted to stay here, that he didn't want to leave.

[Hero_Panda]

And here I thought it was completely understandable that Demar would feel this way, and that others could empathize with it. Like what Richard Jefferson said "The first breakup is always the hardest."

[Chandan]

.

[GoodOne]

Sources close to DeRozan told ESPN that DeRozan met with Toronto brass in Las Vegas during summer league and was told he would not be traded.

Makes sense why he was mad.

Didn't Masai say at the beginning of the off season that as far as trades go, nobody on the roster was untouchable? So why would they then tell DD that he wouldn't be traded?

[Local_NG_Idiot]

What is so loyal about him that he did in the public eye that other NBA players doesn't do?

For myself I tend to work backwards. I look at the result and I take an educated guess on someone's mindset.
When everything has pretty much worked out for derozan in Toronto: being the alpha dog in marke t all by himself; receiving a big contract; living in a place where he gets worshipped; super long leash didn't have to play defense. All things lead me to the conclusion that the advantage he gains being here is large enough that loyalty doesn't really need to factor into the decision.

Loyalty isn't something to boast about when things are going peachy returning to a team year after year of stumbling in the playoffs and getting another shot to prove your worth. Loyalty is when you get traded away from a situation that clearly isn't working and being understanding and not bad-mouthing your former team and crying on social media. That'd the standard I ahere to, and if he step outside he is no longer loyal IMO.

He publicly stated he wanted to be in Toronto multiple times, when things were bad he still wanted to be here. He never wanted out despite all the playoff struggles and media calling him out (how quickly the US media has turned on that front).

So what if he was given all those things in Toronto, does that go against him being loyal? No, it's all a factor, why do you dismiss it so easily.

Where did he bad mouth anyone? Where has he been shown to suddenly be disloyal? He's venting about being told one thing and the opposite happening and he's showing you just how much he wanted to stay here, that he didn't want to leave.

Showing loyalty includes the difficult times. DD had the opportunity to bite his tongue on a management mistep and keep his anger within his own private circle, but no, the first time he feels the team disrespects him and it's off to the races on social media.

Pop showed loyalty after Kawhi holds one of a handful of Pop's last coaching seasons hostage, acted like an infant in forcing his way out of the organization @ .25 cents on the dollar and yet Pop STILL comes out and praises Kawhi. THAT is loyalty, not what DeRozan did when times were easy on him and the franchise catered to his wishes.

[Ando]

The Toronto raptors signed DeMar DeRozan signed to a 5 year / $139,000,000 contract. Although he was traded from the organization, the organization was loyal enough to spend that kind of money on a player that was unproven in the playoffs.

Also DeRozan was not traded for a bag of chips either. The organization holds his value high and only traded him to take a chance on a top 5 player.

[Chandan]

What is so loyal about him that he did in the public eye that other NBA players doesn't do?

For myself I tend to work backwards. I look at the result and I take an educated guess on someone's mindset.
When everything has pretty much worked out for derozan in Toronto: being the alpha dog in marke t all by himself; receiving a big contract; living in a place where he gets worshipped; super long leash didn't have to play defense. All things lead me to the conclusion that the advantage he gains being here is large enough that loyalty doesn't really need to factor into the decision.

Loyalty isn't something to boast about when things are going peachy returning to a team year after year of stumbling in the playoffs and getting another shot to prove your worth. Loyalty is when you get traded away from a situation that clearly isn't working and being understanding and not bad-mouthing your former team and crying on social media. That'd the standard I ahere to, and if he step outside he is no longer loyal IMO.

He publicly stated he wanted to be in Toronto multiple times, when things were bad he still wanted to be here. He never wanted out despite all the playoff struggles and media calling him out (how quickly the US media has turned on that front).

So what if he was given all those things in Toronto, does that go against him being loyal? No, it's all a factor, why do you dismiss it so easily.

Where did he bad mouth anyone? Where has he been shown to suddenly be disloyal? He's venting about being told one thing and the opposite happening and he's showing you just how much he wanted to stay here, that he didn't want to leave.

Ahhh but he did want out when he heard his buddy Lowry was being traded and team was going to tank mode.

[whysoserious]

Showing loyalty includes the difficult times. DD had the opportunity to bite his tongue on a management mistep and keep his anger within his own private circle, but no, the first time he feels the team disrespects him and it's off to the races on social media.

Pop showed loyalty after Kawhi holds one of a handful of Pop's last coaching seasons hostage, acting like an infant and forcing his way out of the organization @ .25 cents on the dollar and yet Pop STILL comes out and praises Kawhi. THAT is loyalty, not what DeRozan did when times were easy on him and the franchise catered to his wishes.

But has he been disloyal or is he simply stating his views? He hasn't dissed the organization or anything. He stated he was told one thing and the opposite happens. From his perspective he was lied to in this regard (which I've posted multiple times that I don't think he was lied to because I don't believe there was intent to hide something here).

But even if we accept your premise of his reaction, is one post or series of posts an indication of his entire history and character? Or do we go by the overall body of work? Same thing applies to Masai where people are hating him for lying to Demar. His entire history shows he's a players manager and has good relationships with the players, does he seem like the type that will lie to players?

[whysoserious]

What is so loyal about him that he did in the public eye that other NBA players doesn't do?

For myself I tend to work backwards. I look at the result and I take an educated guess on someone's mindset.
When everything has pretty much worked out for derozan in Toronto: being the alpha dog in marke t all by himself; receiving a big contract; living in a place where he gets worshipped; super long leash didn't have to play defense. All things lead me to the conclusion that the advantage he gains being here is large enough that loyalty doesn't really need to factor into the decision.

Loyalty isn't something to boast about when things are going peachy returning to a team year after year of stumbling in the playoffs and getting another shot to prove your worth. Loyalty is when you get traded away from a situation that clearly isn't working and being understanding and not bad-mouthing your former team and crying on social media. That'd the standard I ahere to, and if he step outside he is no longer loyal IMO.

He publicly stated he wanted to be in Toronto multiple times, when things were bad he still wanted to be here. He never wanted out despite all the playoff struggles and media calling him out (how quickly the US media has turned on that front).

So what if he was given all those things in Toronto, does that go against him being loyal? No, it's all a factor, why do you dismiss it so easily.

Where did he bad mouth anyone? Where has he been shown to suddenly be disloyal? He's venting about being told one thing and the opposite happening and he's showing you just how much he wanted to stay here, that he didn't want to leave.

Ahhh but he did want out when he heard his buddy Lowry was being traded and team was going to tank mode.

Omg, so when the team was tearing it down he voiced his opinion that if they were rebuilding then he should be traded too and wanted out. Wow, such strong evidence of a lack of loyalty? They weren't even that good of friends at that point, it was a reaction to the organization going in a different direction. Is that being disloyal? I don't think so. But again, why are we focusing on all this other stuff outside of the basketball reasons. We have nothing to go off on the personal side of things.

As I stated, there's enough basketball reasons to make this decision from the Raptors side of things, why focus on this and try to tear down a guy who has been an overall positive player for the city on the court and off.

[Chandan]

Showing loyalty includes the difficult times. DD had the opportunity to bite his tongue on a management mistep and keep his anger within his own private circle, but no, the first time he feels the team disrespects him and it's off to the races on social media.

Pop showed loyalty after Kawhi holds one of a handful of Pop's last coaching seasons hostage, acting like an infant and forcing his way out of the organization @ .25 cents on the dollar and yet Pop STILL comes out and praises Kawhi. THAT is loyalty, not what DeRozan did when times were easy on him and the franchise catered to his wishes.

But has he been disloyal or is he simply stating his views? He hasn't dissed the organization or anything. He stated he was told one thing and the opposite happens. From his perspective he was lied to in this regard (which I've posted multiple times that I don't think he was lied to because I don't believe there was intent to hide something here).

But even if we accept your premise of his reaction, is one post or series of posts an indication of his entire history and character? Or do we go by the overall body of work? Same thing applies to Masai where people are hating him for lying to Demar. His entire history shows he's a players manager and has good relationships with the players, does he seem like the type that will lie to players?

again, what exactly is this entire history and character other than "he wants to be here" in a situation that benefits him.
I've mentioned multiple times, what he does is pretty much the norm for a "nice" nba player. Talk good about the city, back a few charities, shoots videos of his workout. What exactly separates him from let's say.... Mike Conley?
Actually, the only thing special about him is actually how this franchise supported him and pretty much pushed him to star status.

[CantStopTheRock]

What is so loyal about him that he did in the public eye that other NBA players doesn't do?

For myself I tend to work backwards. I look at the result and I take an educated guess on someone's mindset.
When everything has pretty much worked out for derozan in Toronto: being the alpha dog in marke t all by himself; receiving a big contract; living in a place where he gets worshipped; super long leash didn't have to play defense. All things lead me to the conclusion that the advantage he gains being here is large enough that loyalty doesn't really need to factor into the decision.

Loyalty isn't something to boast about when things are going peachy returning to a team year after year of stumbling in the playoffs and getting another shot to prove your worth. Loyalty is when you get traded away from a situation that clearly isn't working and being understanding and not bad-mouthing your former team and crying on social media. That'd the standard I ahere to, and if he step outside he is no longer loyal IMO.

He publicly stated he wanted to be in Toronto multiple times, when things were bad he still wanted to be here. He never wanted out despite all the playoff struggles and media calling him out (how quickly the US media has turned on that front).

So what if he was given all those things in Toronto, does that go against him being loyal? No, it's all a factor, why do you dismiss it so easily.

Where did he bad mouth anyone? Where has he been shown to suddenly be disloyal? He's venting about being told one thing and the opposite happening and he's showing you just how much he wanted to stay here, that he didn't want to leave.

He was also contemplating asking for a trade when it looked like we were blowing things up after the Rudy Gay trade. You really thing if we kept going down that path that he would still want to be here when he stated he was contemplating leaving right after the trade happened?

Of course he was going to say he wanted to be here when we could offer him more than anywhere else and he was currently employed by the Raptors. People are confusing loyalty with staying in the best possible situation for him (ie. face of franchise, more money).

That would be like me saying I got job offers for less money, less vacation and a longer commute but I decided to stay because i am loyal.

The only discussion we can have is about the raptors telling him he was not being traded and then he got traded. Woj was just being interviewed saying the raptors brass told him that he wasn't involved in trade discussions at that time and also brought up that Masai stated several times that everyone is on the table. For all we know Masai was trying to get the deal down without demar.

Even if that did happen, it is being blown way out of proportion. Players don't honor their contracts, force their way out, and collude, yet not nearly as much backlash (outside some collusion).

[Local_NG_Idiot]

Showing loyalty includes the difficult times. DD had the opportunity to bite his tongue on a management mistep and keep his anger within his own private circle, but no, the first time he feels the team disrespects him and it's off to the races on social media.

Pop showed loyalty after Kawhi holds one of a handful of Pop's last coaching seasons hostage, acting like an infant and forcing his way out of the organization @ .25 cents on the dollar and yet Pop STILL comes out and praises Kawhi. THAT is loyalty, not what DeRozan did when times were easy on him and the franchise catered to his wishes.

But has he been disloyal or is he simply stating his views? He hasn't dissed the organization or anything. He stated he was told one thing and the opposite happens. From his perspective he was lied to in this regard (which I've posted multiple times that I don't think he was lied to because I don't believe there was intent to hide something here).

Has he been disloyal? Of course! He knew full well stating that view for everyone to see that the org lied to him is completely throwing the org under the bus for the great two-way relationship there has been for the past 9 seasons.

But even if we accept your premise of his reaction, is one post or series of posts an indication of his entire history and character? Or do we go by the overall body of work? Same thing applies to Masai where people are hating him for lying to Demar. His entire history shows he's a players manager and has good relationships with the players, does he seem like the type that will lie to players?

Same applies to the org. Do we judge Toronto Raps organization's treatment of DeMar on a management mistep of not telling him there's still a chance he's being traded, or do we judge the Raps on how they treated DD on their total body of work?

If you are attempting to advocate that DD remained loyal based upon the entirety of his tenure and you want to throw out his intent to tarnish the Raps org with his social media posts (yes there is 100% intent there, no doubt), then the same must apply to the org that and their treatment of DD over the entire tenure.

[whysoserious]

again, what exactly is this entire history and character other than "he wants to be here" in a situation that benefits him.
I've mentioned multiple times, what he does is pretty much the norm for nba players. Talk good about the city, back a few charities, shoots videos of his workout. What exactly separates him from let's say.... Jonas Valanciuas?

I acknowledge that there's many reasons for him to want to stay here. Those all play in to it. There's lots of NBA players that like where they are because it benefits them, so why do you and others feel the need to dismiss it when a guy like Demar is on his way out? What does it benefit you?

Again, I go back to it, why is his character up for discussion or being hated on? There's enough basketball reasons to discuss the trade and why we did it. Why do we even need to focus on the loyalty aspect? I certainly am not. I'm only questioning those that are making stuff up about his character which was my original response in this thread with no facts to back them up. That is what I was responding to.

Whether he's loyal or not, who cares. He was a good soldier in his time in Toronto. He played hard, he worked hard, he was a part of our most successful period as a franchise. Thanks for that Demar. If he feels he was lied to and is disappointed he's not in Toronto anymore, why should we hate him for that?

[whysoserious]

Has he been disloyal? Of course! He knew full well stating that view for everyone to see that the org lied to him is completely throwing the org under the bus for the great two-way relationship there has been for the past 9 seasons.


Same applies to the org. Do we judge Toronto Raps organization's treatment of DeMar on a management mistep of not telling him there's still a chance he's being traded, or do we judge the Raps on how they treated DD on their total body of work?

If you are attempting to advocate that DD remained loyal based upon the entirety of his tenure and you want to throw out his intent to tarnish the Raps org with his social media posts (yes there is 100% intent there, no doubt), then the same must apply to the org that and their treatment of DD over the entire tenure.

Or he's simply venting in reaction to something he totally didn't expect.

I've posted many times that I don't believe he was lied to by this organization and stand by that. But I can acknowledge that he perceives things that way. We don't know, there's a lot of grey area in those conversations. I stated that Masai just doesn't seem like the type to lie to one of his players. I think he truly believed he wasn't trading him at the time they sat down and chatted. So there were some assurances given in some manner, whether they were outright our subtle.

I'm not going to judge Demar off of a reaction to a post on social media just as I'm not taking his word that he was lied to. But as I stated above, he was nothing but a good soldier here his whole time, he was part of the most successful period of basketball in this city, there were many great moments shared. That's it. There is enough basketball reasons to justify this deal, there's no need to focus on the off court stuff, especially some of the BS on here that is just being made up. It's unnecessary.

Thanks for your time Demar, you'll be missed and now we move on with Kawhi. Which is a great deal for this organization. Simple as that.

[mieshpal]

He is right.... this franchise smells like crap the day Casey got the boot... now Derozan. The guy that improved every year, and gave everything he had.


You guys wanted to change at any cost, good luck with your mercenary.

Man what are you talking about....we got swept last year by a team who got taken to 7 games by Boston and Indy. Boston didn't even have Irving and Hayward too. We had several kicks at the can with a DD led team. We need much more firepower to build a team with DD because he needs to be a third option with top tier talent, similar to Bosh.


We got a top 5 talent now and a solid who make are team way more versatile and if things dont work out you move forward with the young guys and you still have vet assets like Lowry and Val.

I would understand your argument more if this was a one or even two time situation where a DD led team didn't **** the bed, but that is not the case.

Sent from my SM-G950W using RealGM mobile app

[MEDIC]

Showing loyalty includes the difficult times. DD had the opportunity to bite his tongue on a management mistep and keep his anger within his own private circle, but no, the first time he feels the team disrespects him and it's off to the races on social media.

Pop showed loyalty after Kawhi holds one of a handful of Pop's last coaching seasons hostage, acting like an infant and forcing his way out of the organization @ .25 cents on the dollar and yet Pop STILL comes out and praises Kawhi. THAT is loyalty, not what DeRozan did when times were easy on him and the franchise catered to his wishes.

But has he been disloyal or is he simply stating his views? He hasn't dissed the organization or anything. He stated he was told one thing and the opposite happens. From his perspective he was lied to in this regard (which I've posted multiple times that I don't think he was lied to because I don't believe there was intent to hide something here).

But even if we accept your premise of his reaction, is one post or series of posts an indication of his entire history and character? Or do we go by the overall body of work? Same thing applies to Masai where people are hating him for lying to Demar. His entire history shows he's a players manager and has good relationships with the players, does he seem like the type that will lie to players?

Well said.

Demar was here when all of the Bosh crap went down & saw what the fans went through.

After that he made a personal commitment to the franchise and the city. It was important for him to stay loyal to the fans & not do what other players had done.

From what I saw, he took ownership of things. Wanted to get the franchise back to respectability & eventually wanted to bring a championship to the city. It was important to him & he put his heart & pride into it.

All of that was taken from him when this trade went down. All of those years of taking ownership of the situation & working his azz off to improve as a player & as a team.

He is a genuinely good dude. It's a good thing that he is so upset rather than being apathetic towards the franchise & city like so many other were.

Give the guy a break for being upset.

I still totally support him.

[Chandan]

Omg, so when the team was tearing it down he voiced his opinion that if they were rebuilding then he should be traded too and wanted out. Wow, such strong evidence of a lack of loyalty? They weren't even that good of friends at that point, it was a reaction to the organization going in a different direction. Is that being disloyal? I don't think so. But again, why are we focusing on all this other stuff outside of the basketball reasons. We have nothing to go off on the personal side of things.

As I stated, there's enough basketball reasons to make this decision from the Raptors side of things, why focus on this and try to tear down a guy who has been an overall positive player for the city on the court and off.

I am not tearing down a guy. Do i want to make him look like a scumbag criminal who beats his girlfriend/wife who will go broke after his nba career? No. Do I think he is more loyal than Kyle Lowry? No. I think he is very average player who happened to fell into a situation he liked and benefited him, so he stayed, and for lots and lots of money. He is now pinning this loyalty ribbon on himself for the moral high ground and using it as a weapon to damage the management who hurt his feelings.
He has been given way more credit than he deserves during his time in toronto.

[mieshpal]

I love and respect DD, but we were more than loyal to him. The franchise gave him multiple attempts to take them to the finals and last year was embarrassing. If you can get Kawhi in a package after that display than I am sorry we saw what peak Lowry and Dd can do

Sent from my SM-G950W using RealGM mobile app

[dTox]

Demar didn't take a max contract....he purposely left a few million on the table for us to work with.....

this place has the worst raptor "fans"

sorry how much did Korver and JR make?

'he left a few million for us". Yeah the Raptor fans are terrible, it took 3 sweeps in 4 years for this finally to happen.

Enjoy it ****

Maybe we should of put a team around him instead of a 33 year old Lowry?

But yeah it's DD's fault.

Korver and JR are not All NBA All Stars...

You do realize that the team performed better in the playoffs with Derozan on the bench right? Statistically, factually, those are the numbers.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/900cpd/demar_derozans_playoff_plusminus_has_been/

But yah, its the team's fault