2025 Draft Thread - Part 3

[pcbothwel]

So basically he’s Jan Vesely

(Im on my phone and haven’t watched the vid)

I think you are kidding... But Beringer has natural defensive instincts, explosiveness, and reaction time that Maluach could only dream of.

[NatP4]

Still think they take a massive swing and trade up for Ace Bailey. Trying to talk myself into it

[Rafael122]

So maybe I need to get out of this mindset that it takes 3 first round picks or whatever to move up 2-3 spots. It sounds very NFL-ish. If all it takes is trading 18 and swapping 6 for 3 and taking on Eric Gordon's contract, that seems kinda...low?

[nate33]

Still think they take a massive swing and trade up for Ace Bailey. Trying to talk myself into it

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this shakes out. Kneuppel is still showing very well in most mocks. If either Charlotte or Utah secretly prefers Kneuppel to Bailey, I could see them trading down to us at #6 so they still land Kneuppel but hopefully get a little extra in the process.

Hopefully, we can do it without giving up #18. I'd certainly give up a couple of SRP's. I might give up that 2026 OKC pick if I had to, given how the recent changes in amateur pay compensation is degrading the quality of talent later in the draft.

I also think it's possible to move up to #3 with Philly. And if we get the #3, I think there's a good chance of moving up to #2 for Harper and a reasonable cost because I don't think San Antonio really wants to draft him.

[pcbothwel]

Still think they take a massive swing and trade up for Ace Bailey. Trying to talk myself into it

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this shakes out. Kneuppel is still showing very well in most mocks. If either Charlotte or Utah secretly prefers Kneuppel to Bailey, I could see them trading down to us at #6 so they still land Kneuppel but hopefully get a little extra in the process.

Hopefully, we can do it without giving up #18. I'd certainly give up a couple of SRP's. I might give up that 2026 OKC pick if I had to, given how the recent changes in amateur pay compensation is degrading the quality of talent later in the draft.

I also think it's possible to move up to #3 with Philly. And if we get the #3, I think there's a good chance of moving up to #2 for Harper and a reasonable cost because I don't think San Antonio really wants to draft him.

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

[Dat2U]

How I view the top 7 as of right now.

1. F Cooper Flagg
Dallas not taking any calls for #1 or even considering other prospects. Its Flagg in Dallas for the forseeable future.

2. G Dylan Harper
Spurs will play it safe and select Harper unless they get an offer they can't refuse despite online scuttlebutt suggesting Harper is not locked in at 2. I don't think Philly is willing to offer McCain & the 3rd.

3. G Tre Johnson (F Ace Bailey if there's a trade)
I think Philly is cool on Ace and wants to move up or down. I think they'd take Tre if they stay at 3 but my hunch is that they'll trade down. Look out for New Orleans and a deal involving Herb Jones.

4. G V.J. Edgecombe
VJ's floor I think is Charlotte which is why your hearing rumors of Philly being all over him - mostly to get Charlotte to trade up.

5. F Ace Bailey (G Tre Johnson if Ace is taken at 3)
Utah is Tre's floor with Ace as the fallback option. Don't buy the Kon rumors, Jazz need a high ceiling type.

6. G Jeremiah Fears
Wizards want Tre or Ace to fall in their laps but unless Knueppel or Fears move up, it appears they'll either have to move up to get either or VJ. If they stand put I think Fears is the default pick unless Maluach blows them away in workouts.

7. C Khaman Maluach
Hornets desperately want to trade up for Ace. If they stick at 7, they'll hope Fears is there with Maluach as a fall back.

[Dat2U]

Still think they take a massive swing and trade up for Ace Bailey. Trying to talk myself into it

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this shakes out. Kneuppel is still showing very well in most mocks. If either Charlotte or Utah secretly prefers Kneuppel to Bailey, I could see them trading down to us at #6 so they still land Kneuppel but hopefully get a little extra in the process.

Hopefully, we can do it without giving up #18. I'd certainly give up a couple of SRP's. I might give up that 2026 OKC pick if I had to, given how the recent changes in amateur pay compensation is degrading the quality of talent later in the draft.

I also think it's possible to move up to #3 with Philly. And if we get the #3, I think there's a good chance of moving up to #2 for Harper and a reasonable cost because I don't think San Antonio really wants to draft him.

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

[WizarDynasty]

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this shakes out. Kneuppel is still showing very well in most mocks. If either Charlotte or Utah secretly prefers Kneuppel to Bailey, I could see them trading down to us at #6 so they still land Kneuppel but hopefully get a little extra in the process.

Hopefully, we can do it without giving up #18. I'd certainly give up a couple of SRP's. I might give up that 2026 OKC pick if I had to, given how the recent changes in amateur pay compensation is degrading the quality of talent later in the draft.

I also think it's possible to move up to #3 with Philly. And if we get the #3, I think there's a good chance of moving up to #2 for Harper and a reasonable cost because I don't think San Antonio really wants to draft him.

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

This elite level analysis from this board. First step is absolutely the most valuable asset on all of offensive basketball. Big hands are huge too. I noticed ace doesn't have alot lower body strength to maintain his angle after getting by his man. He usually gets bullies ofd the angle created by his first step. His high center of gravity while attacking the rim prevents him from controlling a defenders hips unlike SGA who can accelerate and still maintain low center of gravity and hence high volume and high efficiency. He can always create with is his first step using either hand and he can stay low with power and knock an out of position defender trying to recover from the vloe by first step...off balance because he is so low to ground and create separation. Basically what jordan would have become on perimter if he had an elite off hand speed dribble ( not slow jordan bounces).. classic byron russell knee guard championship shot because russell could keep his chest in front MJ poor lateral movement. Dedender throws out his knee to slow down dedender because they cant get chest in front..knee damage wear and tear. SGA constantly punishes defender because he can stop on a dime and keep low dribble and body control at 6'6...and he his elbow to control a defenders hip..which controls the defenders knees and exposes poor dedense. Locks dedenders hip with elbow check to hip and then pull up separation. Jumper or zero to 100 acceleration after hip check..and he stop and goes with his off hand...super elite low speed dribble. Now if he was fears size, he would be much less efficient doing the same thing. Fears and SGA same game except one has point guard size.. and cant defend sgs. This board really starting to think like wolves instead of sheep.

[nate33]

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this shakes out. Kneuppel is still showing very well in most mocks. If either Charlotte or Utah secretly prefers Kneuppel to Bailey, I could see them trading down to us at #6 so they still land Kneuppel but hopefully get a little extra in the process.

Hopefully, we can do it without giving up #18. I'd certainly give up a couple of SRP's. I might give up that 2026 OKC pick if I had to, given how the recent changes in amateur pay compensation is degrading the quality of talent later in the draft.

I also think it's possible to move up to #3 with Philly. And if we get the #3, I think there's a good chance of moving up to #2 for Harper and a reasonable cost because I don't think San Antonio really wants to draft him.

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

I'm with you. I don't understand the hype for Knueppel either, but so many mocks really like him.

He does have more ball handling chops as a freshman than Kispert had as a junior. I suppose a best case scenario is that he is the next Austin Reaves.

[TheBlackCzar]

Beringer is an interesting prospect who In addition to
attractive measurables is very young. Thing is though,
Maluach is barely older and has a more attractive
list of strengths on Tankathon. Beringer could be there
at 18, Maluach probably wouldn't be. There are obvious
reasons for this.

Beringer can also switch out and guard on the perimeter and has now grown into legit C size.

If we really believe that Sarr is going to be mid usage guy, then someone like Beringer is PERFECT. Bigger Gafford.
I would love a big swing draft and trade down and end up with a 1-5 of Traore - Coward - Bryant - Essengue - Beringer.

The guys at 6 just arent selling me as steals. Love Tre & Kon's skill, but I worry about their ceiling due to defense and creation ability. I love Fears & VJ's tools and mindset but worry about their ceiling due to vision and shooting. I would take any and all at 10, but Im not sure I see the giant gap between them and the guys above.

You love having 5 players who can't get to the rim??? Essengue no skill, Coward is a low level player as he always was a combine doesn't change that reality, Bryant has no first step, Beringer is raw and unskilled, and Traore has just as much of a shooting issue as Fears and isn't as quick which is why his stocks down... None of these guys can be a potential franchise player and definitely not going to the playoffs with a team of unskilled players running around not knowing how to play basketball.....

So why do you love these guys who outside of Traore really haven't played that much basketball in their lives?

[TheBlackCzar]

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

I'm with you. I don't understand the hype for Knueppel either, but so many mocks really like him.

He does have more ball handling chops as a freshman than Kispert had as a junior. I suppose a best case scenario is that he is the next Austin Reaves.

Austin Reaves was a better scorer and ball handler than this Dookey..... Just cuz he white dont make them have the same skill set.... I don't care who drafts him, just don't want it to be us....

[TheBlackCzar]

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

This elite level analysis from this board. First step is absolutely the most valuable asset on all of offensive basketball. Big hands is huge too. This board really starting to think like wolves instead of sheep.

Hence why I was intrigued by Fears, he probably has the best 1st step in this class....

[Kanyewest]

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this shakes out. Kneuppel is still showing very well in most mocks. If either Charlotte or Utah secretly prefers Kneuppel to Bailey, I could see them trading down to us at #6 so they still land Kneuppel but hopefully get a little extra in the process.

Hopefully, we can do it without giving up #18. I'd certainly give up a couple of SRP's. I might give up that 2026 OKC pick if I had to, given how the recent changes in amateur pay compensation is degrading the quality of talent later in the draft.

I also think it's possible to move up to #3 with Philly. And if we get the #3, I think there's a good chance of moving up to #2 for Harper and a reasonable cost because I don't think San Antonio really wants to draft him.

Good chance Kon becomes better than Ace.
The more I see/read, the more I cool on Ace. Film + interviews show a low(er) IQ player that is a little too JR Smith for my liking.
VJ is a dog with a chip and Tre also has a no-nonsense vibe. Ace has small hands and poor feel, and I just dont see the hype. Again, if he falls to 6 and Dawkins likes him...fine. But not a trade up guy.

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

The two separating factors that Knueppel has from Kispert is a quicker shot release an that he's younger and showed more playmaking skills. They both seem to have concerns about keeping up with defenders coming out.

[nate33]

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

I'm with you. I don't understand the hype for Knueppel either, but so many mocks really like him.

He does have more ball handling chops as a freshman than Kispert had as a junior. I suppose a best case scenario is that he is the next Austin Reaves.

Austin Reaves was a better scorer and ball handler than this Dookey..... Just cuz he white dont make them have the same skill set.... I don't care who drafts him, just don't want it to be us....

Freshman Knueppel performed about as well as senior Reaves:

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=kon-knueppel--austin-reaves

[Kanyewest]

I'm with you. I don't understand the hype for Knueppel either, but so many mocks really like him.

He does have more ball handling chops as a freshman than Kispert had as a junior. I suppose a best case scenario is that he is the next Austin Reaves.

Austin Reaves was a better scorer and ball handler than this Dookey..... Just cuz he white dont make them have the same skill set.... I don't care who drafts him, just don't want it to be us....

Freshman Knueppel performed about as well as senior Reaves:

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=kon-knueppel--austin-reaves

I was just looking the Reaves college stats - looks like he went to the free throw line 6.8 times per game in his senior season. He only went 1.1 times per game in 11 minutes per game as a freshman.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/austin-reaves-1.html

[Rafael122]

Kneuppel has like a +1 wingspan. I mean you're looking at a Bojan-like player at 6. We also haven't seen his athletic testing results which he conveniently skipped due to injury. Almost as if his agents are trying to hide him a bit.

[DCZards]

This scuttlebutt about the Zards moving up in the draft has me somewhat excited…but I’m not overly optimistic that that will happen.

It would be great if the Zards could be in position to draft Harper but I don’t think it’s in the cards. A more likely scenario is that they move into a position to draft Bailey. I’d like that because there’s a good chance Ace will end up being one of the top 3 players in this draft.

If we move back in the draft, say to 8, then my guy Carter Bryant is in play… or Maluach who I think is the most likely between him, Johnson and Fears to slip to 8.

I know there are major questions about Bryant, mostly due to his limited role at Ariz. But I’m seeing a long, athletic, high IQ, elite defender who will figure it out on the offensive end. His 3pt shooting is already showing signs of being above average.

If we stay at 6, I’d be fine with Johnson, Fears or Maluach.

[AFM]

So maybe I need to get out of this mindset that it takes 3 first round picks or whatever to move up 2-3 spots. It sounds very NFL-ish. If all it takes is trading 18 and swapping 6 for 3 and taking on Eric Gordon's contract, that seems kinda...low?

I think it depends on the draft. But remember it only cost us 2 second round picks to move up a spot to select Bilal.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Played in the ABA, same league as Topic/Jokic/Jovic/Djurisic. Been playing basketball for only 3 years now. Measured in at 6’10 in shoes a year ago.

18.8 minutes per game, per 36: 10.3 points 9.4 rebounds 0.9 assists 1.0 steals 2.6 blocks 1.3 turnovers 64% TS 125 O-rating 103 D-rating

Played in the French junior league (same as Bilal) in 23/24 and posted per 36: 15 points 14 rebounds 2.8 blocks 1.3 steals on 64% TS

FT% is brutal at both levels though

The player I’m thinking of is Giannis. His age, size, length, grace, speed, defense, dunking, shot blocking, power, ability to switch out on the perimeter, as well as the shooting deficiencies and FT%.

[pcbothwel]

There's a good chance that Kon is no better than Corey Kispert or Luke Kennard. I keep looking for what this imaginary on-ball upside and I don't see it. Corey got to the rack alot more in college. I appreciate Kon's connectivity as a passer but usually having no first step means your mostly going to be off the ball. Kon didn't even show much off the dribble shooting to be confident in.

And we have not even discussed him being an early target on defense until he proves he can handle it.

This elite level analysis from this board. First step is absolutely the most valuable asset on all of offensive basketball. Big hands is huge too. This board really starting to think like wolves instead of sheep.

Hence why I was intrigued by Fears, he probably has the best 1st step in this class....

Fears, VJ & Tre are the guys worth taking. 18/19 y/o kids with talent and drive cant be ruled out. These guys make so much money and have access to coaching, training, nutrition, etc. that if they have work ethic and process the game fast enough, there is always a chance to be a really good player.

Fears is also going to be rough in his first year, which is perfect for us as we can give him minutes/reps while losing enough games to retain our 2026 pick.
Fears @ 6 & Beringer @ 18 would definitely represent a swing.
This draft really falls off around ~35. I hope we make a small trade (Smart?) that allows us to move up from 40 => 25-30 so we can net one of Penda, Hugo, Powell, Thiero, Broome, Yang, etc.