2012 NBA Draft - Part V

[Mizerooskie]

Please explain to me what makes Beal better than Crawford? Crawford may be streaky and chuck, but at least he can create his own shot and shoot too. Both are slightly undersized.

I think Robinson is an over-achiever. Nothing wrong with that, but he has his professional limitations. He will be playing as a man among men now, instead of as a man among boys as a Jr. in college.

I'm leaning to drafting Barnes. He has legit size for his position, and can shoot. We already got creaters and defenders.

Higher basketball IQ, better rebounder, more athletic, better defender, better shooting mechanics (i.e. potentially a better shooter), better team player, etc.

[FAH1223]

which is better

drafting Trob and signing Eric Gordon

or drafting beal and signing Illysaova?

Ersan would help us on the boards greatly and be able to stretch the floor

[Brenice]

Please explain to me what makes Beal better than Crawford? Crawford may be streaky and chuck, but at least he can create his own shot and shoot too. Both are slightly undersized.

I think Robinson is an over-achiever. Nothing wrong with that, but he has his professional limitations. He will be playing as a man among men now, instead of as a man among boys as a Jr. in college.

I'm leaning to drafting Barnes. He has legit size for his position, and can shoot. We already got creaters and defenders.

Higher basketball IQ, better rebounder, more athletic, better defender, better shooting mechanics (i.e. potentially a better shooter), better team player, etc.

Which of those have Beal proven on the NBA level? I'm not saying Crawford is better, I'm just saying is Beal going to be #3 or closer to a Crawford level player in the NBA.

Then compare Beal to Barnes, considering they play different positions. Especially since Barnes is closer to ideal size for his position, and a better athlete.

[FAH1223]

Barnes is an EG pick... all world potential who will fail at the next level

Barnes, Drummond, and PG3 are the 3 guys I'm sure will dissappoint

[verbal8]

which is better
or drafting beal and signing Illysaova?

I see this as being the most likely of the two and the best case. Although Illysaova is a PF, I think he could be paired with Booker and Vesley at the Forward positions at least part time.

I don't see New Orleans letting Eric Gordon go.

[Mizerooskie]

Please explain to me what makes Beal better than Crawford? Crawford may be streaky and chuck, but at least he can create his own shot and shoot too. Both are slightly undersized.

I think Robinson is an over-achiever. Nothing wrong with that, but he has his professional limitations. He will be playing as a man among men now, instead of as a man among boys as a Jr. in college.

I'm leaning to drafting Barnes. He has legit size for his position, and can shoot. We already got creaters and defenders.

Higher basketball IQ, better rebounder, more athletic, better defender, better shooting mechanics (i.e. potentially a better shooter), better team player, etc.

Which of those have Beal proven on the NBA level? I'm not saying Crawford is better, I'm just saying is Beal going to be #3 or closer to a Crawford level player in the NBA.

Then compare Beal to Barnes, considering they play different positions. Especially since Barnes is closer to ideal size for his position, and a better athlete.

Obviously, he has proven none of that at the NBA level. What has Barnes proven at the NBA level? What about Davis?

[nate33]

I'm leaning to drafting Barnes. He has legit size for his position, and can shoot. We already got creaters and defenders.

But he really can't shoot all that well. We're talking about a guy whose claim to fame is that he's a deadeye shooter, yet he shot just 34% from 3 in his freshman year, and 35% his sophomore year. His eFG% was just .488 and .487 in his first two seasons respectively. His TS% was just .520 and .528 respectively. And he posted those lackluster numbers while getting a ton of good looks on a team with a good PG and a great college center.

It's also a red flag that he showed almost no improvement between his freshman and sophomore years.

By contrast, Beal had a 3P% of .339, an eFG% of .525, and a TS% of .575 as a freshman despite a slow start. His 3P% was .360 over the second half of the season (when facing stiffer competition) and my guess is that his eFG% and TS% improved accordingly. And Beal did it on a team with lousy offensive teammates and ball-hogging guards. Beal also beat Barnes by a significant margin in rebound percentage, assist percentage, steal percentage and block percentage. For all of Barnes' length and athleticism, Beal out rebounded him and blocked more shots!

[Brenice]

Thanks Nate. That's what I'm looking for. An analysis, not a debate.

[popper]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

EG would be admitting that Ves was not worth the #6 last year, therefore I don't see it happening. There are later first round picks we might be able to acquire, especially if we package our high second round pick with something or someone. I'm all for it in this deep draft.

[Brenice]

Now, we are modeling after OKC. OKC has hit home runs. Durant was an obvious pick. Westbrook was a scouting home run, not an obvious home run. Is their any, first of all, home runs in this draft after Davis, or is Beal the pick because of scouting the best player available?

In other words, damn Ernie, who would OKC management draft for the current Wizards team.

[WizarDynasty]

who was beal competing with for rebounds and what was their rebounding rate. Barnes is competing with two potential lottery bigs who strength happen to be rebounds.
Neither Zeller or Henson are known for creating easy shots for others or for their passing. Neither is great at setting picks. I think Barnes game will flourish here with Wizards if both AD's are gone. I would target beal with a mid 1st round pick but he isn't a dominant offensive player and he definitely doesn't change the game defensively. Role player that goes after pick 10 is how he would rate in most drafts. If he was very long and considered a shut down defender---he would boost his stocks...then he would need to be able to overmatch defenders physically every night. He is a two leg jumper, small hands, and not fast at all. He has nice shifty moves, and can draw contact once he has his man beat but he can't finish against length in the post. I have seen this guy shot get swatted by mediocre college players. He may be able to shoot wide open shots but he doesn't create shots himself under pressure with the clock clicking down. he is a catch and shoot wide open shot type of guy who fits into a system, but you can't build an offense around him. You need your shooting guard to create mismatches on the perimeter in a half court set. EG does this with his quick first step and ball handling, Harden creates and advantages by using his 220lb bulky frame, Gilbert did it with his 215 pound frame and explosive one leg leaping ability, and explosive first step and body control.

at the bare minimum, a shooting guard needs speed and exceptional bulk--harden, gordon, and gilbert, explosive athleticism, body control, and above the rim finishing jumping off one leg hang time--jordan, kobe, ray allen, clyde drexler, j. erving, dwade at age 24, tmac, dominique wilkens. drafting beal compared to players that have proven to be allstars is a huge mistake.

[Jay81]

its funny when i read headlines saying that "CHO is modeling OKC model:

Does that model include the sheer amount of stupidity and luck involved in getting a once in a generation player like Durant?

What if Memphis had taken Harden instead of Thatbeet. Alot of the OKC model is based on ernie like stupidity from other GM's

[popper]

I'd would be happy with the following draft assuming we could acquire another second round pick.

Beal - round 1

Plumlee - round 2

Crowder - round 2

English - round 2

[nate33]

I'd would be happy with the following draft assuming we could acquire another second round pick.

Beal - round 1

Plumlee - round 2

Crowder - round 2

English - round 2

I seriously doubt we will add another 2nd rounder. If anything, we will combine our two 2nds and move up.

[Severn Hoos]

which is better

drafting Trob and signing Eric Gordon

or drafting beal and signing Illysaova?

I'll take Door #2, Monte.

[Dat2U]

which is better

drafting Trob and signing Eric Gordon

or drafting beal and signing Illysaova?

I don't trust Gordon. It's a bad combination to be an undersized wing that relies heavily on athleticism & be injury prone. And he's coming off of a knee injury. There's just too much risk there.

Ilyasova was a top 10 PF last season. He's fairly young and has an ideal skill set to complement Wall. Add MKG or Beal and the Wizards have taken a significant step forward.

[dobrojim]

my ideal draft

3rd - Davis (both CHA and NOH have brain farts like the character in the Holy Grail
that gets asked his favorite color, red, no green, and gets cast into the chasm)

then anything else

more seriously -

3rd pick Beal
2nd rnd - Crowder or Green
2nd 2nd - Denmon

lineup
PG - Wall/Crawford/Mack
SG - Beal/Crawford/Denmon
SF - Chris Singleton (yeah I know almost everyone hates this)/ Crowder/Martin
PF - Nene/Vesely/Booker/JSingleton
C - Seraphin/Nene/Vesely

12 man roster
(starters)
Wall
Beal
CSing
Nene }
KSera } the bruise brothers

bench
Crawford
Mack
Denmon
Booker
Crowder
JSingleton
Vesely

extra player(s) on 15 man roster
CMartin

If we were able to sign Ilyasova, good. He squeezes someone off the active roster.
If we sign someone like D or G Green, someone else gets squeezed off the active roster.

[fishercob]

Are we not even having Barnes on for a workout? I haven't seen anything on workouts for top guys other than Beal, Mkg and Robinson.

[mg]

I noticed this on twitter:

@GoodmanCBS
Harrison Barnes vs. Bradley Beal in Cleveland on Saturday, source told CBSSports. Should be interesting to see what happens in that one.

[7-Day Dray]

Are we not even having Barnes on for a workout? I haven't seen anything on workouts for top guys other than Beal, Mkg and Robinson.

A lot of the top prospects haven't worked out for teams yet. IDK why. I would hope that we schedule a workout for him though. And Drummond.