The Suns

[NBARocks]

Booker is not a franchise player. Just the next Rudy Gay. And Ayton is just a rich man's Kanter. All points, no defense. They had Luka for the taking, and managed to screw that up. They need to clean house in that front office.

[SlovenianDragon]

Ive said this a thousand times and ill say it again...because people cant understand why the suns are struggling....

Name me one player on the Suns at the PG or PF position that would be in the rotation on another team?

The team has talented players but we are missing Huge holes in our roster at two positions and that's not a winning formula....

People act like Booker should be able to just put his team on his back and win a championship....And with Ayton that's all on Igor. His offense is just to use Ayton to set screens to set up 3 point shots. Igor has no idea how to use Ayton.

There is problems in phoenix the talent of some of the players mentioned in this thread isn't one of them.

[Johnny Firpo]

Koko is one of the biggest letdowns for me this season. I still grade him very high, but shocked that he could not do more this year.

[Bob8]

Ive said this a thousand times and ill say it again...because people cant understand why the suns are struggling....

Name me one player on the Suns at the PG or PF position that would be in the rotation on another team?

The team has talented players but we are missing Huge holes in our roster at two positions and that's not a winning formula....

People act like Booker should be able to just put his team on his back and win a championship....And with Ayton that's all on Igor. His offense is just to use Ayton to set screens to set up 3 point shots. Igor has no idea how to use Ayton.

There is problems in phoenix the talent of some of the players mentioned in this thread isn't one of them.

It’s a big difference between winning a championship and being the worst team in the league with 11 wins. I believe minimum expectation for them was 30+ wins before the season.

[smartyz456]

IDK where you get that from. They have the #1 overall pick in the draft who everybody loved. I never hear anything about him. They got Bridges which was considered the best 3+D player in the draft who everybody was high on---Hes a non factor.

None of those players are doing ish. None. Bridges is a non-factor. They have Jackson who they refused to include in a Kyrie Irving trade in the past who isnt doing a single thing.

Its a complete embarrassment

Bridges is good. Ayton was a mistake over Doncic.

But nobody thought they'd be close to the playoffs. If you could show us where.

Im not going to waste my time, but go back to the preseason thread power rankings that multiple posters created. Many many many people has the Suns in the middle of the West playoffs

i don't think people thought the suns would be a contender but a lot were optimistic about their future

and your google skills suck tbh if you can't link the threads

i'm gonna try to "defend" you though since i know the threads you are referring to:

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=1757153

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=1781240

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=1717597

[JB2]

Ive said this a thousand times and ill say it again...because people cant understand why the suns are struggling....

Name me one player on the Suns at the PG or PF position that would be in the rotation on another team?

The team has talented players but we are missing Huge holes in our roster at two positions and that's not a winning formula....

People act like Booker should be able to just put his team on his back and win a championship....And with Ayton that's all on Igor. His offense is just to use Ayton to set screens to set up 3 point shots. Igor has no idea how to use Ayton.

There is problems in phoenix the talent of some of the players mentioned in this thread isn't one of them.

The talent is the issue to a certain extent.. They've either made terrible choices lately or their player development is the worst in the NBA.

Booker- stud scorer and good play maker but no options around him and he plays 0 defense.
Bender- Hield and Murray were still on the table and as of now, he's look like straight garbage.
Chriss- gone and I won't hate on the pick.
Jackson- looks journey wingman, they could have Fox who'd be perfect. Lauri was an Arizona product right there. DSJ + Isaac were there.
Ayton- not going to hate on this pick as I think DA is an all star soon but empty stats all star and Doncic looks like a HOF/MVP/true superstar type and Egor knew all about him. They didn't even seem to consider Luka... or JJJ.
Bridges- could be a solid two way role player

So yeah, either they picked most the wrong guys, or they just don't know how to develop them and then you factor in signing guys to Chandler and Ariza to huge deals versus spreading money around and getting guys who can actually help win games.. lucky enough for them, they are in the middle of the Zion sweepstakes.

[Golden Knight]

Booker is on a personal 20 game losing streak.

The Suns are 3-12 (.200) without Booker and 8-37 (.178) with him in the line-up.

[Hesh]

After all the whining from the Suns fans about rigged lotteries, they get their #1 pick but still **** it up. For some reason, they were hyped about Kokoskov hiring, Ayton pick, Bridges trade, Booker was the 2nd coming of Jesus, and at that point, Sarver wasn't a problem. Suddenly Sarver is the root of all evil although the fans themselves bought into decisions FO made.

They are actually worse than last year.

I don't think there is even one suns fan who has ever been pro-Sarver, on this board or anywhere

-The GM who created this mess of a roster has just been fired days prior to the season starting (another re-build begins)
-No PG for almost 2 full seasons now (fault of the GM)
-3 rookies in the starting line-up for the majority of the season
-Missing on draft picks (again, fault of the GM) but I'll reserve judgement on Ayton
-Poor management & owner (Sarver micromanages and involves himself in much of the decision making)

Basically what everyone else here is saying.

Can't expect Igor to do much with this roster, that's not to say he's completely free of blame as some of his tactics have been questionable. Same goes for Booker.

[The_Hater]

Why are they bad. Booker, Ayton, Jackson, Bridges, Warren, Oubre, Holmes, Johnson ect, ect.

How in the hell is this team going to pick up their 534th lotto pick in a row this year? Whats wrong. How are they THIS bad.

Is this team the definition of why tanking should not be allowed?

Most people overrate their talent. They can’t defend a lick and they don’t play together enough on offense to create efficient shots as a team and they turn to ball over a ton.

[PlatinumState]

What happened to the Bridges praise from the beginning of the season? Now everyone saying he's horrible but I remember everyone saying Philly goofed when they traded him

[righterwriter]

Didn't draft Luka.

[CelticsLV]

After all the whining from the Suns fans about rigged lotteries, they get their #1 pick but still **** it up. For some reason, they were hyped about Kokoskov hiring, Ayton pick, Bridges trade, Booker was the 2nd coming of Jesus, and at that point, Sarver wasn't a problem. Suddenly Sarver is the root of all evil although the fans themselves bought into decisions FO made.

They are actually worse than last year.

I don't think there is even one suns fan who has ever been pro-Sarver, on this board or anywhere

-The GM who created this mess of a roster has just been fired days prior to the season starting (another re-build begins)
-No PG for almost 2 full seasons now (fault of the GM)
-3 rookies in the starting line-up for the majority of the season
-Missing on draft picks (again, fault of the GM) but I'll reserve judgement on Ayton
-Poor management & owner (Sarver micromanages and involves himself in much of the decision making)

Basically what everyone else here is saying.

Can't expect Igor to do much with this roster, that's not to say he's completely free of blame as some of his tactics have been questionable. Same goes for Booker.

Weird, where was this kind of sentiment before the season amongst Suns fans? I like to check around the different team boards and you guys seemed really hyped about everything.

These are your own words. Took 2 minutes to find.

I still can't believe what we have now. We go from having only JJ and Troy Williams as our best backup scoring options for Booker and TJ, to being overloaded with depth, all the wings you could want, a true C, a real vet who is actually capable of making an impact both on and off the court, better point guards.

This is all theoretical, I know, but it still amazing that we're just oozing with talent and we have so much depth now when we had absolutely none before. A new and smart coach to boot. It's still only the beginning of the offseason and we can still add MORE depth. By far, the most anticipated season for a suns fan.

I'm happy with this draft overall, MIA pick sucks but ah well, it's a long time away and we really need to get something going now. We got Ayton & Booker to build around, a bunch of recent lottery picks haven't reached expectations so I like the direction the ship is sailing now. Notice how bad everyone was feeling when it looked like no trade was happening and we'd be making an unpopular pick at #16.

and wow Shake Milton potentially going mid-first round to almost undrafted, feels bad man.

So why you weren't calling for McD's and Sarver's incompetent heads?

[Pointgod]

The Suns are a cautionary tale to the whole we’ll tank our way to winning strategy. It sometimes works but the majority of the time all it does is alienate your vets (Bledsoe and Chandler) in addition creating a losing culture. Lottery picks doesn’t mean jack ****. Suns wasted two on Chriss and Bender. It’s not a surprise that a team who’s strategy is to be horrible continues to struggle.

[Hesh]

After all the whining from the Suns fans about rigged lotteries, they get their #1 pick but still **** it up. For some reason, they were hyped about Kokoskov hiring, Ayton pick, Bridges trade, Booker was the 2nd coming of Jesus, and at that point, Sarver wasn't a problem. Suddenly Sarver is the root of all evil although the fans themselves bought into decisions FO made.

They are actually worse than last year.

I don't think there is even one suns fan who has ever been pro-Sarver, on this board or anywhere

-The GM who created this mess of a roster has just been fired days prior to the season starting (another re-build begins)
-No PG for almost 2 full seasons now (fault of the GM)
-3 rookies in the starting line-up for the majority of the season
-Missing on draft picks (again, fault of the GM) but I'll reserve judgement on Ayton
-Poor management & owner (Sarver micromanages and involves himself in much of the decision making)

Basically what everyone else here is saying.

Can't expect Igor to do much with this roster, that's not to say he's completely free of blame as some of his tactics have been questionable. Same goes for Booker.

Weird, where was this kind of sentiment before the season amongst Suns fans? I like to check around the different team boards and you guys seemed really hyped about everything.

These are your own words. Took 2 minutes to find.

I still can't believe what we have now. We go from having only JJ and Troy Williams as our best backup scoring options for Booker and TJ, to being overloaded with depth, all the wings you could want, a true C, a real vet who is actually capable of making an impact both on and off the court, better point guards.

This is all theoretical, I know, but it still amazing that we're just oozing with talent and we have so much depth now when we had absolutely none before. A new and smart coach to boot. It's still only the beginning of the offseason and we can still add MORE depth. By far, the most anticipated season for a suns fan.

I'm happy with this draft overall, MIA pick sucks but ah well, it's a long time away and we really need to get something going now. We got Ayton & Booker to build around, a bunch of recent lottery picks haven't reached expectations so I like the direction the ship is sailing now. Notice how bad everyone was feeling when it looked like no trade was happening and we'd be making an unpopular pick at #16.

and wow Shake Milton potentially going mid-first round to almost undrafted, feels bad man.

So why you weren't calling for McD's and Sarver's incompetent heads?

I was really excited about this season. Ayton, trading the pick for Bridges, and drafting Okobo. These were all moves that I was on board with and still am. McD got the team some nice potential pieces and tradeable assets for the future of the team but they're only rookies and he didn't round out the roster to fill positions of need or acquire a veteran PG. He also missed on many draft picks (Alex Len, Chriss, Bender), traded/lost players like Dragic, Bledsoe, and IT, while also being unable to produce a serviceable roster in previous seasons. So yeah, I liked the direction the team was finally going in, but I was expecting more moves to be made before the season started.

Every NBA fan, not just suns fans, know how incompetent Sarver is, and that goes without saying. I don't know where you're getting this notion that myself or other suns fans hold him in high regard.

[CelticsLV]

Spoiler:

I don't think there is even one suns fan who has ever been pro-Sarver, on this board or anywhere

-The GM who created this mess of a roster has just been fired days prior to the season starting (another re-build begins)
-No PG for almost 2 full seasons now (fault of the GM)
-3 rookies in the starting line-up for the majority of the season
-Missing on draft picks (again, fault of the GM) but I'll reserve judgement on Ayton
-Poor management & owner (Sarver micromanages and involves himself in much of the decision making)

Basically what everyone else here is saying.

Can't expect Igor to do much with this roster, that's not to say he's completely free of blame as some of his tactics have been questionable. Same goes for Booker.

Weird, where was this kind of sentiment before the season amongst Suns fans? I like to check around the different team boards and you guys seemed really hyped about everything.

These are your own words. Took 2 minutes to find.

I still can't believe what we have now. We go from having only JJ and Troy Williams as our best backup scoring options for Booker and TJ, to being overloaded with depth, all the wings you could want, a true C, a real vet who is actually capable of making an impact both on and off the court, better point guards.

This is all theoretical, I know, but it still amazing that we're just oozing with talent and we have so much depth now when we had absolutely none before. A new and smart coach to boot. It's still only the beginning of the offseason and we can still add MORE depth. By far, the most anticipated season for a suns fan.

I'm happy with this draft overall, MIA pick sucks but ah well, it's a long time away and we really need to get something going now. We got Ayton & Booker to build around, a bunch of recent lottery picks haven't reached expectations so I like the direction the ship is sailing now. Notice how bad everyone was feeling when it looked like no trade was happening and we'd be making an unpopular pick at #16.

and wow Shake Milton potentially going mid-first round to almost undrafted, feels bad man.

So why you weren't calling for McD's and Sarver's incompetent heads?

I was really excited about this season. Ayton, trading the pick for Bridges, and drafting Okobo. These were all moves that I was on board with and still am. McD got the team some nice potential pieces and tradeable assets for the future of the team but they're only rookies and he didn't round out the roster to fill positions of need or acquire a veteran PG. He also missed on many draft picks (Alex Len, Chriss, Bender), traded/lost players like Dragic, Bledsoe, and IT, while also being unable to produce a serviceable roster in previous seasons. So yeah, I liked the direction the team was finally going in, but I was expecting more moves to be made before the season started.

Every NBA fan, not just suns fans, know how incompetent Sarver is, and that goes without saying. I don't know where you're getting this notion that myself or other suns fans hold him in high regard.

Every NBA fan, not just Kings fans, knew how incompetent Vivek was (as recently as last season). Haven't heard that in a while. I wonder why...

[Hesh]

Sorry, I didn't mean for that last line to sound condescending or anything.

[dakomish23]

They need an engine - they have the other pieces to turn into a sports car.

Jrue would do wonders for this team

[dakomish23]

The Suns are a cautionary tale to the whole we’ll tank our way to winning strategy. It sometimes works but the majority of the time all it does is alienate your vets (Bledsoe and Chandler) in addition creating a losing culture. Lottery picks doesn’t mean jack ****. Suns wasted two on Chriss and Bender. It’s not a surprise that a team who’s strategy is to be horrible continues to struggle.

That wasn’t their strategy. They ended up in the lottery as they kept trying to win now.

Their goal was to tank when they signed Chandler?

That’s ridiculous.

[Amare_1_Knicks]

For starters, those are all young, unproven players — a lot of whom don’t play any defense. No point guard on the team either to run the show, so Booker’s been the defacto PG as a result most of the time.

Even young OKC struggled about 10 years ago. Second year KD and J.Geeen, with rookie Westbrook won 23 games in 08-09.

The big thing right now seems to be the glaring hole at PG, playing defense, and quite possibly a HC change.

[Illmatic12]

For starters, those are all young, unproven players — a lot of whom don’t play any defense. No point guard on the team either to run the show, so Booker’s been the defacto PG as a result most of the time.

Even young OKC struggled about 10 years ago. Second year KD and J.Geeen, with rookie Westbrook won 23 games in 08-09.

The big thing right now seems to be the glaring hole at PG, playing defense, and quite possibly a HC change.

They just had a HC change! This current season is the result of that change. You can't keep changing head coaches and GMs every year, at a certain point it becomes a joke and a mockery of our league.


PHX Suns are FUBARed beyond belief. Not even Zion will save them. Normally you'd say they should bring in some vets for stability. But most quality vets won't even consider signing there. And the ones who do just want to get paid, and once the season starts they'll check out and ask for a buyout .

OKC struggled early on, but by the time Durant was on his second contract they were contenders. Devin Booker has already exhausted his entire rookie deal and the team is still awful. This is an advanced form of tanking that we haven't seen. I think Phoenix is dangerously close to Silver and the league office stepping in to overrule Sarver.