2020 Bron vs 1991 Jordan

[Cavsfansince84]

Maybe I missed something, but I don’t know that people are really saying “2020 Davis > 2020 LeBron.” What I do see people saying is that 2020 Davis was a better defender than 2020 LeBron. I also see people suggesting that 2020 Davis might’ve performed better in the playoffs. On that latter point, I note that, in those playoffs, the Lakers did better in the AD on, LeBron off minutes (+5.41) than they did in the LeBron on, AD off minutes (+2.29). The sample for each is only like 200 minutes, so it’s not particularly meaningful IMO, but am just saying that the form of analysis you’re using does not really suggest 2020 playoffs Davis > 2020 playoffs LeBron, and that’s the claim that is much more commonly made. That said, the regular season DRTG with LeBron on and AD off was better than vice versa. So this form of analysis does cut against the argument that 2020 AD was a better defender than 2020 LeBron. In both cases, though, I think we’re talking about some pretty small samples (cutting up playoff data always leads to tiny samples, and single-season on-off data in a shortened season is definitely noisy), so this kind of data probably shouldn’t form the basis for peoples’ views on these subjects.

When samples are small like this, I think it’s definitely better to look at all-in-one data. The whole point of those metrics is to produce meaningful data in samples that are too small for raw impact data to be very useful. On that front, we can look at EPM—which is IMO a good one to use here, since (1) it actually has playoff-specific data; and (2) one of the questions is defense specifically, and EPM actually uses defensive tracking data. We see that AD had a playoff EPM of +7.3, while LeBron had a playoff EPM of +6.6. Meanwhile, AD’s regular season D-EPM was +2.3, while LeBron’s regular season D-EPM was +1.6. And AD’s playoff D-EPM was +2.7, while LeBron’s playoff D-EPM was +1.5. So EPM suggests that AD was slightly better than LeBron overall in the 2020 playoffs, and that he was a better defender in both regular season and playoffs. I wouldn’t take this output as the perfect truth or anything (indeed, I’m not necessarily sure I personally agree with it, as it pertains to who was better overall in the playoffs), but it suggests that the takes I see in this thread on this are not silly. FWIW, it does have LeBron a little ahead of AD in regular season EPM that year, so it wouldn’t really support a more general “2020 AD > 2020 LeBron” take (though the two are close enough to suggest it’s not silly), but I don’t really see that as the argument people have made.

The only issue that I think should be at least be mentioned re how good 2020 AD was is how much of that had to do with LeBron? It's not like it happened in a vacuum. I can fully respect how good AD was that year in both the rs+ps but LeBron also had something to do with that.

[lessthanjake]

Maybe I missed something, but I don’t know that people are really saying “2020 Davis > 2020 LeBron.” What I do see people saying is that 2020 Davis was a better defender than 2020 LeBron. I also see people suggesting that 2020 Davis might’ve performed better in the playoffs. On that latter point, I note that, in those playoffs, the Lakers did better in the AD on, LeBron off minutes (+5.41) than they did in the LeBron on, AD off minutes (+2.29). The sample for each is only like 200 minutes, so it’s not particularly meaningful IMO, but am just saying that the form of analysis you’re using does not really suggest 2020 playoffs Davis > 2020 playoffs LeBron, and that’s the claim that is much more commonly made. That said, the regular season DRTG with LeBron on and AD off was better than vice versa. So this form of analysis does cut against the argument that 2020 AD was a better defender than 2020 LeBron. In both cases, though, I think we’re talking about some pretty small samples (cutting up playoff data always leads to tiny samples, and single-season on-off data in a shortened season is definitely noisy), so this kind of data probably shouldn’t form the basis for peoples’ views on these subjects.

When samples are small like this, I think it’s definitely better to look at all-in-one data. The whole point of those metrics is to produce meaningful data in samples that are too small for raw impact data to be very useful. On that front, we can look at EPM—which is IMO a good one to use here, since (1) it actually has playoff-specific data; and (2) one of the questions is defense specifically, and EPM actually uses defensive tracking data. We see that AD had a playoff EPM of +7.3, while LeBron had a playoff EPM of +6.6. Meanwhile, AD’s regular season D-EPM was +2.3, while LeBron’s regular season D-EPM was +1.6. And AD’s playoff D-EPM was +2.7, while LeBron’s playoff D-EPM was +1.5. So EPM suggests that AD was slightly better than LeBron overall in the 2020 playoffs, and that he was a better defender in both regular season and playoffs. I wouldn’t take this output as the perfect truth or anything (indeed, I’m not necessarily sure I personally agree with it, as it pertains to who was better overall in the playoffs), but it suggests that the takes I see in this thread on this are not silly. FWIW, it does have LeBron a little ahead of AD in regular season EPM that year, so it wouldn’t really support a more general “2020 AD > 2020 LeBron” take (though the two are close enough to suggest it’s not silly), but I don’t really see that as the argument people have made.

The only issue that I think should be at least be mentioned re how good 2020 AD was is how much of that had to do with LeBron? It's not like it happened in a vacuum. I can fully respect how good AD was that year in both the rs+ps but LeBron also had something to do with that.

I think for me that argument was in play immediately after that 2020 run, but the door has basically been shut on it after seeing how AD has actually been relatively disappointing for the rest of his time on the Lakers, even leaving aside availability issues. Of course, he’s a great player so he’s still been good in other years as a Laker, but I definitely expected more from AD in his age 27-31 span than what we saw. Which makes it very hard for me to come to the conclusion that 2020 AD was so good because of playing with LeBron. And that’s especially true when I think 2020 AD wasn’t really particularly out of line with 2018 and 2019 AD. Obviously 2020 AD actually had a good enough team to show his stuff in the business end of the playoffs (and LeBron is of course a big part of the team being good in general!), but 2018 and 2019 AD was actually generally a bit better in the various all-in-one metrics we have. I think one would really have to come at this with LeBron-tinted glasses to come to the conclusion that 2020 AD was so good individually because of playing with LeBron.

[Cavsfansince84]

I think for me that argument was in play immediately after that 2020 run, but the door has basically been shut on it after seeing how AD has actually been relatively disappointing for the rest of his time on the Lakers, even leaving aside availability issues. Of course, he’s a great player so he’s still been good in other years as a Laker, but I definitely expected more from AD in his age 27-31 span than what we saw. Which makes it very hard for me to come to the conclusion that 2020 AD was so good because of playing with LeBron. And that’s especially true when I think 2020 AD wasn’t really particularly out of line with 2018 and 2019 AD. Obviously 2020 AD actually had a good enough team to show his stuff in the business end of the playoffs (and LeBron is of course a big part of the team being good in general!), but 2018 and 2019 AD was actually generally a bit better in the various all-in-one metrics we have. I think one would really have to come at this with LeBron-tinted glasses to come to the conclusion that 2020 AD was so good individually because of playing with LeBron.

AD for the most part was still really good after 2020 but he missed like 30-40% of his games after that. On top of other things like LeBron getting older, coaches coming and going and the gm dropping the ball. A guy with chronic health issues for 8-10 years is going to decline regardless. You honestly don't think LeBron's level of play at pg in 2020 was boosting everyone else on that team? I mean what are we even doing here.

[lessthanjake]

I think for me that argument was in play immediately after that 2020 run, but the door has basically been shut on it after seeing how AD has actually been relatively disappointing for the rest of his time on the Lakers, even leaving aside availability issues. Of course, he’s a great player so he’s still been good in other years as a Laker, but I definitely expected more from AD in his age 27-31 span than what we saw. Which makes it very hard for me to come to the conclusion that 2020 AD was so good because of playing with LeBron. And that’s especially true when I think 2020 AD wasn’t really particularly out of line with 2018 and 2019 AD. Obviously 2020 AD actually had a good enough team to show his stuff in the business end of the playoffs (and LeBron is of course a big part of the team being good in general!), but 2018 and 2019 AD was actually generally a bit better in the various all-in-one metrics we have. I think one would really have to come at this with LeBron-tinted glasses to come to the conclusion that 2020 AD was so good individually because of playing with LeBron.

AD for the most part was still really good after 2020 but he missed like 30-40% of his games after that. On top of other things like LeBron getting older, coaches coming and going and the gm dropping the ball. A guy with chronic health issues for 8-10 years is going to decline regardless. You honestly don't think LeBron's level of play at pg in 2020 was boosting everyone else on that team? I mean what are we even doing here.

It feels like there’s a little bit of a circular element to this. To tie it back to the discussion I’d initially inserted myself into, it seems like your point may basically be “LeBron was better than AD in 2020 because he made AD better, and we know LeBron made AD better because LeBron is so good.” I get the point, but it seems a bit unfalsifiable, because the point would basically fall apart unless we assume in the first instance that LeBron was the better/more important player. I’m not sure that I even disagree with that conclusion (as mentioned, I’m definitely far from convinced that AD was better in 2020), but it seems hard to meaningfully discuss the premise.

And, for what it’s worth, in the 2020 regular season, the Lakers had a better net rating in LeBron-ON/Davis-OFF minutes than they did in LeBron-ON/Davis-ON minutes. Which hardly seems like LeBron was supercharging AD’s impact. To be fair, LeBron-ON/Davis-ON minutes in the playoffs were better than LeBron-ON/Davis-OFF minutes, but the overall picture isn’t really indicative of LeBron driving Davis’s impact. And, to expand it out to a larger sample, if we look at regular season games they both played in during the entire 2020-2025 span they played together, it still is the case that the Lakers did worse in LeBron-ON/AD-ON minutes than they did in LeBron-ON/AD-OFF minutes. And, as we might expect, the LeBron-OFF/AD-ON minutes were far better than LeBron-OFF/AD-OFF minutes. Basically, in their time together on the Lakers, AD being on the court was impactful when LeBron wasn’t on, but if LeBron was on the court then AD’s presence didn’t seem to make the Lakers do better at all. Again, it’s hard for me to look at that and think AD’s impact was being improved by LeBron.

[Cavsfansince84]

It feels like there’s a little bit of a circular element to this. To tie it back to the discussion I’d initially inserted myself into, it seems like your point may basically be “LeBron was better than AD in 2020 because he made AD better, and we know LeBron made AD better because LeBron is so good.” I get the point, but it seems a bit unfalsifiable, because the point would basically fall apart unless we assume in the first instance that LeBron was the better/more important player. I’m not sure that I even disagree with that conclusion (as mentioned, I’m definitely far from convinced that AD was better in 2020), but it seems hard to meaningfully discuss the premise.

And, for what it’s worth, in the 2020 regular season, the Lakers had a better net rating in LeBron-ON/Davis-OFF minutes than they did in LeBron-ON/Davis-ON minutes. Which hardly seems like LeBron was supercharging AD’s impact. To be fair, LeBron-ON/Davis-ON minutes in the playoffs were better than LeBron-ON/Davis-OFF minutes, but the overall picture isn’t really indicative of LeBron driving Davis’s impact. And, to expand it out to a larger sample, if we look at regular season games they both played in during the entire 2020-2025 span they played together, it still is the case that the Lakers did worse in LeBron-ON/AD-ON minutes than they did in LeBron-ON/AD-OFF minutes. And, as we might expect, the LeBron-OFF/AD-ON minutes were far better than LeBron-OFF/AD-OFF minutes. Basically, in their time together on the Lakers, AD being on the court was impactful when LeBron wasn’t on, but if LeBron was on the court then AD’s presence didn’t seem to make the Lakers do better at all. Again, it’s hard for me to look at that and think AD’s impact was being improved by LeBron.

I don't even care whether people think AD in 2020 is > LeBron that season. What I'm saying is that AD benefited more from LeBron's presence in terms of +/- or w/e data set than vice versa. It's just context to consider. If I honestly have to make a huge case to over how/why LeBron was probably actually the better player that year then I don't have time for that. Regardless, its sort of the pg's job to do that on offense. Much like how a big usually will anchor the defense. So chances are that part of what made AD so good offensively that year is LeBron having what is widely thought of as one of the best pg seasons of all time. Also, the on/off +/- data you seem to be alluding to goes against everything I have seen from that season regarding these two. What I have seen is that the Lakers were way better with just LeBron on than with just AD on.

[Top10alltime]

It was AD who anchored that 2020 team and besides, they were stacked to the brim with other good defenders like Howard, KCP, Caruso, Green, Rondo, Kuzma, McGee... The reason the Lebron lineups without AD did pretty well on D is that Dwight Howard would come in to replace AD.

AD in 2020 was way better on defense than Lebron was. I mean that isn't even debatable. It's as obvious as the sky being blue. Lebron's impact metrics on D look much better in 2020 and 2021 than in any surrounding years because the roster was so stacked defensively. Literally just about any player who's on the court with Lebron was a good defender. But Lebron himself had moments of strong defense but was cruising most of the time. Low motor generally through and in the Finals got badly exposed when guarding Jimmy.

The bolded part is not true. Lebron has a very very good argument for being the better defender than AD. And he might as well be a better defender.. I guess you're just misinformed by the Jordan stans, but I don't know why anyone who isn't uninformed would think this way..

Saying Lebron is a better defender than AD is an insane take. That would be like a Jordan stan saying that he has a good argument to be a better defender than Hakeem or Robinson. It's lunacy...

And why is that so? I’ll give my points on LeBron later, just curious on what makes you think this way.

[eminence]

Small aside, I personally wouldn't count Bron as a guard (yeah yeah, his argument is just as good as the one for Magic). Oh well, convention.

But anywho.

Some team eval first.

'91 Bulls - 61-21, +9.5 Net, +8.6 SRS, +6.7 Offense, -2.7 Defense, #1 Seed in the East, #2 Overall (Blazers #1)
'20 Lakers - 60-22 (adj to 82), +5.7 Net, +6.3 SRS, +1.4 Offense, -4.3 Defense, #1 Seed in the West, #3 Overall (Bucks #1, Raptors #2 - at least I'm pretty sure the Raptors had the #2 seed, not 100% due to the uneven # of games)

'91 Bulls Top 11:
MJ 3034
Pippen 3014
Grant 2641
Cartwright 2273
Paxson 1971
Armstrong 1731
King 1198
Levingston 1013
Perdue 972
Hodges 843
Hopson 728

'20 Lakers Top 10:
LeBron 2316
Davis 2131
KCP 1762
Green 1687
Kuzma 1526
Howard 1306
Bradley 1186
Caruso 1175
McGee 1130
Rondo 984

Bulls PO performance
1st round: 3-0, +21.9 vs the -0.2 Knicks (+21.7 relative), +8.8 rel O, -12.9 rel D - absolute domination of the Knicks in round 1, both ends
2nd round: 4-1, +10.2 vs the -0.2 Sixers (+10.0 relative), +10.8 rel O, +0.6 rel D - a solid win, seemingly all O
ECF: 4-0, +13.1 vs the +3.5 Pistons (+16.6 relative), +17.0 rel O, +0.3 rel D - more domination, all-time O
Finals: 4-1, +11.2 vs the +7.1 Lakers (+18.3 relative), +10.7 rel O, -7.6 rel D - more domination, D comes back (notably Worthy/Scott dinged up)

Bulls Playoff Top 9:
Pippen 704
MJ 689
Grant 666
Cartwright 511
Paxson 487
Armstrong 273
Hodges 209
Perdue 198
Levingston 192

Lakers PO performance (no Avery Bradley in the POs)
1st Round: 4-1, +10.4 vs the -1.1 Blazers (+9.3 relative), +0.1 rel O, -9.2 rel D - solid win, seemingly all D (Dame missed a game)
2nd Round: 4-1, +7.4 vs the +2.8 Rockets (+10.2 relative), +5.0 rel O, -5.2 rel D - another solid win, more balanced effort O/D (no Capela, and House...)
WCF: 4-1, +4.5 vs the +2.1 Nuggets (+6.6 relative), +6.0 rel O, -0.6 rel D - an offensive series win for the Lakers (Barton out)
Finals: 4-2, +5.8 vs the +3.0 Heat (+8.8 relative), +7.4 rel O, -1.4 rel D - and another offensive series win (Bam/Dragic dinged up)

Lakers Playoff Top 9
Davis 769
LeBron 762
KCP 608
Green 525
Caruso 510
Kuzma 484
Rondo 395
Morris 385
Howard 282

Worth noting that the 2020 PO relative ratings are probably less reliable than most seasons.

So not a huge gap, but a clear edge to the Bulls in the regular season. Bulls notably more reliant on their offense (still a good defense), while the Lakers leaned more on their defense (still a decent offense). Lakers 'overachieved' their point differential meaningfully, but with 2nd Cavs/early Lakers LeBron I generally take it as a relatively 'real' overperformance.

In the playoffs the Bulls went on one of the most dominant runs ever, stomping out every team that went against them. Their offense was particularly bonkers. The Lakers didn't exactly get seriously challenged, but it wasn't all-time dominant either. The O stepped up notably in the later rounds after a relatively underwhelming RS.

Coming back later for how to divvy out the credit for each team, but as a baseline there's a fair amount more credit to go around on the '91 Bulls.

[eminence]

'20 Lakers Credit divvying

Noting that with the additional data, along with it having been a fairly recent season I've seen much more of - I am much more confident in my takeaways on the Lakers than I will be on the Bulls.

Broad team eval based on 1st post. Slightly below average RS for a championship squad, strengthened to an above average PO run. Solid reliance on D in RS, which held up alright in the playoffs (maybe a slight underperformance relative to baseline expectations). Offense notably stepped up in the POs. Didn't play any particularly notable squads in the POs, we remember them a half decade out, but I don't see them lasting (last hurrah Rockets, baby Nuggets, Jimmy on his bull).

RS 4 Factors:
Off eFG% - 5th
Off Tov% - 23rd
ORB% - 4th
O FT/FGA - 15th
Def eFG% - 7th
Def Tov% - 3rd
DRB% - 7th
D FT/FGA - 16th

They made their shots and forced misses, won the rebounding battle convincingly, and had a slight turnover edge (forced a bunch, but also a bit turnover prone themselves). Pretty neutral in the FT battle.

Their surprise top two in TS Add were - Davis and Howard (McGee 3rd/LeBron 4th). Howard was absurdly efficient at very low volume and McGee was a lesser version of the same, credit to them for strong work on the offensive glass and being generally good finishers, but also a lot of credit to LeBron for feeding them. LeBron the teams only real unassisted bucket getter and did so at good volume/decent efficiency. AD also had a high shot volume/decent efficiency from the floor but was much more of a finisher. Davis had a great foul draw rate and hit them. Howard had an absurd foul draw rate (some intentional), but didn't hit them.

On the other end Howard/McGee both made sure to use their fouls when they were on the court, nobody else particularly foul prone. LeBron particularly foul avoidant on a personal level.

Turnovers - LeBron a bit turnover prone, but high value stuff. Secondary creators being underwhelming compounded the issue. LeBron/Davis both clear positives in forcing turnovers (great athletes with good anticipation force turnovers?!?), Green/Caruso also great here.

Rebounding - LeBron/Davis/Howard all very strong positional rebounders (McGee great on the offensive glass, but less great on D). Running a lot of lineups that had size advantage. Bron running the offense from the 3 allowed a bit more size/defense focus from the 1 as well, though I think it was mostly the goodness of the bigger guys.

Def eFG% - looking at individual shot defense it looks largely like Davis, but he shows up a bit underwhelmingly in team measures. LeBron looks strong in both, though low volume individual shot defense.

Top lineups:
Bradley/Green/LeBron/Davis/McGee - 25-7 starting, 389 minutes, +12.2
KCP/Green/LeBron/Davis/McGee - 18-4 starting, 294 minutes, -1.7
Rondo/KCP/LeBron/Kuzma/Howard - 144 minutes, +15.5

LeBron/AD Wowy (RS) - databallr
Both, 1455 minutes, +8.8
Bron, 862 minutes, +10.0
AD, 677 minutes, -2.4
Neither, 425 minutes, +0.8

The Bradley to KCP change there is certainly not *that* big of deal, but it does point towards his bubble loss maybe being a bigger deal than one might initially expect. Not going to list out all their lineups (they ran a bunch), but broadly what we saw is that the starters were strong with Bradley, Bron+depth = great lineup, Davis+depth not so great. In individual on/off data - we see LeBron as being clearly the most impactful on both ends, with regression Davis sometimes takes the lead on defense, but LeBron still the clear overall/offensive lead. Caruso is notably defensively impactful in limited minutes (strongly believable with his continued performance since then), the rest of the cast has no real standouts positive or negative in impact numbers, just a bunch of solid role guys who fit in decently around the stars.

Broad takeaways - Two star squad (duh), with a defensively slanted cast (duh). Bron/AD in the realm of co-anchors for the D (in impact, not role), with Bron floating an otherwise underwhelming offense to respectability (AD played well off Bron, but couldn't lead the squad offensively).

POs - taking the above as baselines and mostly looking for changes in any particular series.

Round 1 vs the Blazers
-Defensive domination, they turned all the Blazers over (Caruso moving up in the rotation without Bradley contributing?) and the Blazers couldn't make baskets.
-Dame did a fair job getting to the line.
-LeBron/AD scoring very well, but the role guys weren't hitting.
-Rondo didn't play this series.

Round 2 vs the Rockets
-Lakers hit their shots in this one and erased Houston from the offensive glass.
-Bron/AD were still scorching, but additionally all the role guys were hitting in this series.
-Rockets tiny ball unsurprisingly bullied on the glass even with the Lakers benching the bigs (Howard/McGee) and moving AD to the 5. Tucker/Covington/Jeff Green as your big rotation is just not getting it done against a LeBron/AD frontline.
-Rondo was back and the Lakers moved (relatively) a lot of the playmaking duty to him.

Round 3 vs the Nuggets
-Howard back into the lineup to combat Jokic, did a pretty good job of it.
-Both teams turned it over and it was a bit of a FT fest (AD in particular with 55 FTA in 5 games, hitting 50 of them). So I guess I'm a bit unsure if this series was actually the offenses taking over or if it was a tight whistle leading to the Ortgs. Would have to go back and watch to see how I felt.
-Nuggets stars were feasting, but they didn't get their 4th/5th starters going offensively (Millsap/Harris), seemed to have more success when they went to the bench duo of Morris/MPJ
-Similar story for the Lakers with Danny Green struggling a bit, but Rondo looking good.

Finals vs the Heat
-More games the Lakers won by dominating on the glass, largely with AD at the 5. LeBron/AD seemingly the two doing the bullying.
-Bron/AD again dominant on offense, but the support struggling a bit again. Rondo continue to make plays.
-Jimmy does his best Bron impression on the other side, but Bam isn't AD even when healthy and he wasn't healthy. Support from 3 on down looked pretty good from the Heat, outside of Herro, who as a rookie with #2 offensive duties was unsurprisingly out of his depth in the NBA Finals.

LeBron/AD WOWY (PO)
Both, 566 minutes, +13.9 (even better as a duo in the POs)
Davis, 203 minutes, +5.1 (Rondo being healthy/stepping up seems to have briefly unlocked the AD+depth lineups)
James, 196 minutes, +2.3 (less dominant than the RS, but still good)
Neither, 43 minutes, -44.7 (tiny sample in largely meaningless minutes)

POs Overall
-Shifted smaller and saw a corresponding shift from defense to offense.
-Among the role guys particular credit to Caruso/Rondo for the PO run relative to the RS. The bigs got left behind a bit, but Howard still stepped in and did the job when they needed him against Jokic (and they may have really needed him based off what Jokic has done to AD the last few PO runs, though Jokic may have not been ready for that yet in '20).
-Credit to LeBron/AD for maintaining good defense shifting to the 4/5, naturally letting their offense flourish a bit more.
-In the PO run it feels more like a 1a/1b run for the two vs the 1/2 during the regular season. Still going with LeBron as the 1a because I was particularly impressed with his rebounding work at the 4 (feel he was their top PO rebounder) and he always drew more attention on offense even when Davis was scorching.
-Stylistically I absolutely love the LeBron at the 4 we briefly saw this PO run, would be one of my favorite players to build around ever.

LeBron credit overall
-Good argument as the best defensive season ever from a guy who could serve as a fulltime perimeter initiator (think it comes down to if you prefer any of his earlier seasons defensively or if you think KG/Giannis could ever really serve as fulltime initiators). My take is this was his best and they couldn't, so 2020 LeBron for #1. Great communicator, avoided fouling, very good work on the glass, strong man defender with lots of versatility (though not a primary role). Added a bit as a secondary rim protector.
-Offensively not nearly as impressive, and not close to a top end LeBron season, arguably his worst in prime season. His assist volume rose but it felt more due to role/decline of his own scoring necessitating it than due to any direct changes in him as a playmaker (I'd say he'd declined there a bit from the 2nd Cleveland stint where he was really pushing All-time level, though still a step behind Magic/Nash imo). Scoring wise, not what he once was, worse from pretty much everywhere on the floor. Obviously all relative and still more than capable in an absolute sense.

Combines to make a very strong season that I can see putting in the very top tier of seasons all-time, my instinct would have it towards the bottom of that tier. I could reasonably see it towards the top of tier 2, but I personally don't feel there's a tier of season up from 2020 LeBron.

[IG2]

I'll take 1991 MJ over any version of LeBron or anybody else for that matter. It's also not a fair comparison. This is a 27/28 year old MJ at his absolute zenith versus a 35 year old LeBron who only resembled his late-prime self in the bubble playoffs.