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Free agency

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Re: Free agency 

Post#81 » by BlazersBroncos » Fri Jul 1, 2022 4:42 pm

Roy The Natural wrote:Can we just blow this thing up already.... I mean... Does anybody legitimately think this team is anything but a bottom seed? I'm just tired... tired of trotting out the same roster construction year after year expecting different results. Hopefully I'm kneejerking here and Cronin proves me wrong and does something more...

This is pretty frustrating though. Dame, Simons, Keon, Hart, GP2, Sharpe... how many damn guards is this team going to assemble?


Hart and Sharpe can play SF. Hart plays much bigger and stronger than he is and Sharpe has a 7' wingspan.

No one ever complains about Nas being a 6'5 SF.

Its just crazy hard to find that Mikal Bridges guy these days - there is a league wide deficit of that archetype.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#82 » by JRoy » Fri Jul 1, 2022 4:45 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:
Roy The Natural wrote:Can we just blow this thing up already.... I mean... Does anybody legitimately think this team is anything but a bottom seed? I'm just tired... tired of trotting out the same roster construction year after year expecting different results. Hopefully I'm kneejerking here and Cronin proves me wrong and does something more...

This is pretty frustrating though. Dame, Simons, Keon, Hart, GP2, Sharpe... how many damn guards is this team going to assemble?


Hart and Sharpe can play SF. Hart plays much bigger and stronger than he is and Sharpe has a 7' wingspan.

No one ever complains about Nas being a 6'5 SF.


Little can’t play guard
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JRoy wrote:Monta Ellis have it all


I was hoping and expecting this to be one of the first replies. You did not disappoint. Jroy have it all.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#83 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 4:48 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:
Roy The Natural wrote:Can we just blow this thing up already.... I mean... Does anybody legitimately think this team is anything but a bottom seed? I'm just tired... tired of trotting out the same roster construction year after year expecting different results. Hopefully I'm kneejerking here and Cronin proves me wrong and does something more...

This is pretty frustrating though. Dame, Simons, Keon, Hart, GP2, Sharpe... how many damn guards is this team going to assemble?


Hart and Sharpe can play SF. Hart plays much bigger and stronger than he is and Sharpe has a 7' wingspan.

No one ever complains about Nas being a 6'5 SF.


I know they "can" play SF.... but that's not what we want. They're both players who are better fits at the 2. They're "capable" of playing the 3 like Little is "capable" of playing the 4. They can do it for stretches, but relying on Hart to cover opposing high-end 3's is going to be an exercise in futility. Honestly, in my view, Portland HAS to trade Hart for a real 3 at this point. Even if it's a slight downgrade in player quality, it would be more than worth it.

This is the same **** we say every year. Powell "can play the 3" we heard because he had at times in Toronto. We need a real 3, capable of guarding other good 3's throughout an entire game... we still don't have that. Instead we have a ludicrous amount guys who are 6'4" and under.

You can choose to stay positive... I see the exact same roster construction that always gets us into trouble... a bevy of guards... no true wings.. and a thin frontcourt... right back to Blazering. My money's on a 7 seed or lower, and probably a Dame trade either mid-season or upcoming offseason. I don't see how this team resigns potentially Little, Hart, Grant anyways this upcoming offseason. They're meteoring straight into the ground in my view. Though it's not unexpected.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#84 » by Norm2953 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 4:54 pm

Portland still needs a backup center and the way things are going, might just try to sign old friend
Robin Lopez.

The Bledsoe contract is the remaining arrow in the Blazers quiver. We're likely going to see the
Blazers market Hart +Bledsoe for the SF we all know the team needs.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#85 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 4:56 pm

Norm2953 wrote:Portland still needs a backup center and the way things are going, might just try to sign old friend
Robin Lopez.

The Bledsoe contract is the remaining arrow in the Blazers quiver. We're likely going to see the
Blazers market Hart +Bledsoe for the SF we all know the team needs.


Robin Lopez already signed with the Cavs I believe. Yea, I'm with you though. I like Hart, but there's just no way it makes any sense whatsoever to keep him at this point... go find a real 3 with more than 1 year on their contract and move him+stuff for that player.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#86 » by BlazersBroncos » Fri Jul 1, 2022 5:01 pm

I really dont understand what people were expecting from this offseason.

What needle mover did we miss out on? Which starting caliber SF did we miss out on w/ the MLE?

Kyle Anderson and OPJ are PF at this point, those are the only names I could think as argument for missing out on a SF. GSW fans, by all accounts, have indicated that GP2 was better guarding SF than OPJ.

Did we really think Simons would get paid the same money as Dort? Or that Nurkic, much more dynamic player on offense who you can run the offense through in the high post, would get the same as Mitch Robinson?

I dont see any issues with these deals. Maybe Nurkic by 1-1.5M, but who cares.

There isnt a SF available that is better than what Hart brings. His size is fine. We are in a league where DDR just had his best season at PF while being 6'6 220lbs for christ sake. This mysterious 6'7-6'8 SF is just not a real player.

Look at this list and find me a trade partner than has an avaliable 6'7+ SF who is better than Josh:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/players.html
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Re: Free agency 

Post#87 » by Blaze the Nugz » Fri Jul 1, 2022 5:40 pm

Dame Lizard wrote:
Blaze the Nugz wrote:
Dame Lizard wrote:Nurkic got 4/$70m. Eeeek that seems like an overpay.

Zubac for 3/$33m seems like a much better deal in comparison.

Seems like Portland has to pay a premium for talent compared to the big market teams. That said, Nurkic is definitely a better, more impactful player than Zubac.
Better and more impactful, yes, but also less durable and doesn't have as much youth upside.

If we're comparing Zubac and Nurk, neither of them have upside. They are what they are.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#88 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 5:46 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:I really dont understand what people were expecting from this offseason.

What needle mover did we miss out on? Which starting caliber SF did we miss out on w/ the MLE?

Kyle Anderson and OPJ are PF at this point, those are the only names I could think as argument for missing out on a SF. GSW fans, by all accounts, have indicated that GP2 was better guarding SF than OPJ.

Did we really think Simons would get paid the same money as Dort? Or that Nurkic, much more dynamic player on offense who you can run the offense through in the high post, would get the same as Mitch Robinson?

I dont see any issues with these deals. Maybe Nurkic by 1-1.5M, but who cares.

There isnt a SF available that is better than what Hart brings. His size is fine. We are in a league where DDR just had his best season at PF while being 6'6 220lbs for christ sake. This mysterious 6'7-6'8 SF is just not a real player.

Look at this list and find me a trade partner than has an avaliable 6'7+ SF who is better than Josh:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/players.html


We were expecting the team to take risks and take big swings... as our new GM stated he would.

Relate this to baseball... team is down 2 with a guy on second and 2 outs. Player walks up to the plate and takes 5 pitches looking. counts 3-2. He's got it in his mind he's going to not swing at that 6th pitch either... so either he's striking out, or he's walking to first.

A walk isn't the end of the world, but it's also hard to hit a homerun, or hell even hit a single to score a run when you don't swing.

If I'm being honest, this team didn't take a single risk this offseason to this point, and that's where my frustration comes in. No one is saying they need to make a move to get to contender status right away, but where were the risks and swings we were promised? I didn't see any.

I'll tell you how to take a risk... send a 2nd rounder or 2 to Chicago and unprotect that pick. Then dangle Hart, Keon, and some firsts and see wtf is out there. Or at least leak to the damn press that you're willing to unprotect that pick if you can get something good in a trade. Something.... anything.

All I saw this offseason was acquiring Grant in an admittedly good value move, which essentially held zero risk for the current team. Then taking zero swings. Cronin is going to get absolutely lambasted if this is the end of the offseason for the Blazers, and it will 100% be deserved. He promised swings... he sat there and watched 5 pitches fly right by to this point.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#89 » by red_power » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:07 pm

Hopefully the last year on Nurk's deal isn't fully guaranteed. Nurk's a nice dude, but he's also an injury-prone big on a verge of the beginning of his decline.
This contract smells trouble by a mile otherwise.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#90 » by BlazersBroncos » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:12 pm

I just dont believe the guy we all wish was out there is really out there.

We clearly tried and failed to make a move for OG (And if failed means they wanted more than 7, I am glad we failed). What other big forward has been rumored to be on the market?

And the KD dream was always harder to make reality than we wanted to believe. It would be contingent on Simons agreeing to be S&T (And not sure he would be the big city type) and waiting 30 days from signing Sharpe so he becomes eligible for trade.

Hayward was always my hope but now that Miles is likely headed to the slammer I doubt they care about saving on his last year anymore.

Masai was never trading Pascal.
SAC wants to win now, so no Barnes.
Wiggins was just arguable the finals MVP for GSW - no way they move him to a rival.
Why would NO trade BI right after the win-now move for CJ?
AG would be worth Bledsoe and a pick, but DEN wants to win.
Isaac is a huge risk, likely worth more to ORL than anyone else and is much better at PF.
Would love to get Brooks, but why does MEM move him as an ascending team?
Is trading a FRP for Royce O'Neal a better move than just using Hart at SF?

Maybe CHI would jettison DDR, but I doubt they pull the plug yet and he is a PF.
Maybe BRK would move Joe for the EC and a pick? (Is he really a better option than Hart at SF on a team building a defense first identity?)

Look, I would love a true SF as much as anyone, but I just dont see the play. Vaguely saying dangle this or that is not facing reality, the reality is the true SF sits at the top of the most in-demand archetype in the NBA right now. I just dont think the market allowed for a move to bring one in.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#91 » by Norm2953 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:14 pm

Roy The Natural wrote:
Norm2953 wrote:Portland still needs a backup center and the way things are going, might just try to sign old friend
Robin Lopez.

The Bledsoe contract is the remaining arrow in the Blazers quiver. We're likely going to see the
Blazers market Hart +Bledsoe for the SF we all know the team needs.


Robin Lopez already signed with the Cavs I believe. Yea, I'm with you though. I like Hart, but there's just no way it makes any sense whatsoever to keep him at this point... go find a real 3 with more than 1 year on their contract and move him+stuff for that player.


I do wonder what they could get from trading Hart + Bledsoe contract. They still need a PF/C with just Eubanks/Watford
behind the always injured Nurk and could certainly use a SF with some size as well.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#92 » by zzaj » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:15 pm

As long as he can play most of a season, Nurkic at 17.5m is a good deal.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#93 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:18 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:I just dont believe the guy we all wish was out there is really out there.

We clearly tried and failed to make a move for OG (And if failed means they wanted more than 7, I am glad we failed). What other big forward has been rumored to be on the market?

And the KD dream was always harder to make reality than we wanted to believe. It would be contingent on Simons agreeing to be S&T (And not sure he would be the big city type) and waiting 30 days from signing Sharpe so he becomes eligible for trade.

Hayward was always my hope but now that Miles is likely headed to the slammer I doubt they care about saving on his last year anymore.

Masai was never trading Pascal.
SAC wants to win now, so no Barnes.
Wiggins was just arguable the finals MVP for GSW - no way they move him to a rival.
Why would NO trade BI right after the win-now move for CJ?
AG would be worth Bledsoe and a pick, but DEN wants to win.
Isaac is a huge risk, likely worth more to ORL than anyone else and is much better at PF.
Would love to get Brooks, but why does MEM move him as an ascending team?
Is trading a FRP for Royce O'Neal a better move than just using Hart at SF?

Maybe CHI would jettison DDR, but I doubt they pull the plug yet and he is a PF.
Maybe BRK would move Joe for the EC and a pick? (Is he really a better option than Hart at SF on a team building a defense first identity?)

Look, I would love a true SF as much as anyone, but I just dont see the play. Vaguely saying dangle this or that is not facing reality, the reality is the true SF sits at the top of the most in-demand archetype in the NBA right now. I just dont think the market allowed for a move to bring one in.


We do this coping thing every year. What you are implying is the same thing we always do. We rationalize that nothing was out there because it wasn't acquirable without risk. That's exactly the attitude we need to leave behind. There's plenty out there for the right price, but you have to take a risk and pay that price.

But things aren't over, I'd agree with that. So I will wait until the Durants stuff clears up to make final judgements. I think Hart, Keon, and 2 firsts will get you something pretty shiny at the 3. There's a ton of risk there, but that's a swing. We can't prove the negative right now. We don't know what the cost is for any specific player, but I can absolutely guarantee you that if you dangled 2 first, Hart, and Keon you're going to have some good trade discussions about some damn good players. Especially with the potential in Portland for things to fall apart, team's are going to be all over future Portland 1sts.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#94 » by Case2012 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:20 pm

I like this team for athleticism and defense but yeah, really punted it. No big swings like we were promised and sold on for months.

Hart isn't a SF. He should be our starting 2 while Simons should've been traded for a wing like OG or included in a KD trade with Sharpe, Keon, Nas, and a million picks we could've sent after lifting the protections. That would've been a swing for the fences move. Instead it's more incremental approaches ala olshey.

I like the Grant trade and I like Payton, but so far I really don't like Cronin at all. Overpaying our own players when there wasn't the cap space out there for teams to really steal them from us is classic olshey.

Why would we trade Bledsoe for Powell and not use him in trades? Maybe he'll be more valuable at the deadline but until then he's another guard taking up a roster spot. We have 2 tpe's we're going to waste AGAIN.

Meh. We needed to shake things up but it's more lateral moves. Cronin was olshey's right hand man, so this feels like a typical olshey off season to me.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#95 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:25 pm

Case2012 wrote:I like this team for athleticism and defense but yeah, really punted it. No big swings like we were promised and sold on for months.

Hart isn't a SF. He should be our starting 2 while Simons should've been traded for a wing like OG or included in a KD trade with Sharpe, Keon, Nas, and a million picks we could've sent after lifting the protections. That would've been a swing for the fences move. Instead it's more incremental approaches ala olshey.

I like the Grant trade and I like Payton, but so far I really don't like Cronin at all. Overpaying our own players when there wasn't the cap space out there for teams to really steal them from us is classic olshey.

Why would we trade Bledsoe for Powell and not use him in trades? Maybe he'll be more valuable at the deadline but until then he's another guard taking up a roster spot. We have 2 tpe's we're going to waste AGAIN.

Meh. We needed to shake things up but it's more lateral moves. Cronin was olshey's right hand man, so this feels like a typical olshey off season to me.


TPE was used in Grant trade... Bledsoe will be waived almost assuredly.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#96 » by Case2012 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:30 pm

Awe yes, the grand prize for Powell was Bledsoes deal that was much heralded as a genius move by our salary cap guru. If we waive and stretch bledsoe I'm going to pour acid on my face. Aren't we still paying AV and Nicholson? Lol I guarantee that was Cronin 100%
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Re: Free agency 

Post#97 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:32 pm

Case2012 wrote:Awe yes, the grand prize for Powell was Bledsoes deal that was much heralded as a genius move by our salary cap guru. If we waive and stretch bledsoe I'm going to pour acid on my face. Aren't we still paying AV and Nicholson? Lol I guarantee that was Cronin 100%


I mean... Bledsoe is partially guaranteed he's only a $3.5M hit when waived.... I don't even think it's possible for the Blazers to keep him now that they're hard capped, so you might want to prep that acid.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#98 » by skoharry » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:33 pm

Resigning ANT and nurk are win now moves. I will say that while I was happy with Ants improvement, who knows how well he plays next to dame and while we're not in tank mode. We overpaid for payton. He's another score first guard which we don't need and Eubanks played good for us while in tank mode, so who knows how he does when we're trying to win. I would have preferred this
Resign ant and burn
Sign Rolo, mcgee, biyombo, drummond, or bamba to backup C
Sign wright, dunn, or e.Payton to backup PG
Sign Thad young or favors
Trade bledsoe, sharpe, Covington tpe, and 2 1st for OG

So
Dame/Wright
Ant/Hart
OG/Little
Grant/Favors
Nurk/Rolo
Defense and rebounding wins games
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Re: Free agency 

Post#99 » by Roy The Natural » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:39 pm

skoharry wrote:Resigning ANT and nurk are win now moves. I will say that while I was happy with Ants improvement, who knows how well he plays next to dame and while we're not in tank mode. We overpaid for payton. He's another score first guard which we don't need and Eubanks played good for us while in tank mode, so who knows how he does when we're trying to win. I would have preferred this
Resign ant and burn
Sign Rolo, mcgee, biyombo, drummond, or bamba to backup C
Sign wright, dunn, or e.Payton to backup PG
Sign Thad young or favors
Trade bledsoe, sharpe, Covington tpe, and 2 1st for OG

So
Dame/Wright
Ant/Hart
OG/Little
Grant/Favors
Nurk/Rolo


Well... the proposed asking price for OG was Hart, #7, Little, and a future 1st... so that doesn't work. GP2 is a defense first guard so you're way off the mark there. I agree that Portland needs another big really badly. They also need a true 3 as well. They can still dangle some stuff in a trade.

Maybe Portland will go balls to the wall for Mikal Bridges when/if the Suns trade for Durant. Something like Hart, Little, and 2 firsts?.... Who knows what Brooklyn wants, but that would make a lot of sense for Portland I would think in a compete now move, and you would think that Brooklyn would be amenable.
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Re: Free agency 

Post#100 » by BlazersBroncos » Fri Jul 1, 2022 6:42 pm

But things aren't over, I'd agree with that. So I will wait until the Durants stuff clears up to make final judgements. I think Hart, Keon, and 2 firsts will get you something pretty shiny at the 3. There's a ton of risk there, but that's a swing. We can't prove the negative right now. We don't know what the cost is for any specific player, but I can absolutely guarantee you that if you dangled 2 first, Hart, and Keon you're going to have some good trade discussions about some damn good players. Especially with the potential in Portland for things to fall apart, team's are going to be all over future Portland 1sts.


Give me some SF names that we could snag for Hart, Keon and 2 FRP.

Harrison Barnes? Is paying that cost really worth 3" height, 10lbs and 2" WS.

Something like Hart, Little, and 2 firsts?


Why does PHX make that trade when KD now mostly plays PF? They would just keep Mikal at SF. A move for KD means all-in win-now, making a asset gathering trade makes no sense for them. EDIT - I misread your post, you meant as part of a KD trade - my error. Yes, I would love that move. But given Bridges age I bet BRK would keep him - who knows though.

I would prefer to use Bledsoe, Little, 2 FRP and a swap though.

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