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Offseason Plan

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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#941 » by badinage » Fri Jul 1, 2022 4:58 pm

Gonna be lanes, too, for Beal with The Zinger on the court and in the high post.

What matters to me:

Winning, yes, but — playing hard and the right way, playing D, sharing the ball, being cohesive, being easy to like and pull for, being interesting*.

* with The Zinger in the high post and as the best player on the roster, this team is interesting.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#942 » by nate33 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 7:19 pm

badinage wrote:What matters to me:

Winning, yes, but — playing hard and the right way, playing D, sharing the ball, being cohesive, being easy to like and pull for, being interesting*.


This is another reason I'm angry about the Beal signing. I'm getting pretty skeptical that Beal is capable of leading a team in a manner that gets them to play hard and play the right way. Far too often, Beal is going to fail to get back on D because he is barking at the refs, or he is going to take a bad isolation possession late in the 4th quarter because he is "the man", when in reality, the offense is always better with ball movement. And the coaches are going to have to look the other way.

We've had too much circumstantial evidence that this double standard around Beal is corrosive in the locker room. Why should everyone else bust their butt defensively on every possession when the star player does not?
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#943 » by NatP4 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 7:44 pm

Agree with everything you just said, Nate. I think there’s reason for optimism though. There’s no doubt that Brad is sitting there reading all the memes about his outrageous new contract. I’ve always felt like he acts that way because he doesn’t really look at the roster and think we have any shot at contending. If we can take one more swing this off-season for a guy like Collins, maybe Beal really buys back in and sees a chance to contend in the east.

Basically, if we have an actual good team and are winning games, I think Beal will lock back in.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#944 » by nate33 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 7:49 pm

NatP4 wrote:Agree with everything you just said, Nate. I think there’s reason for optimism though. There’s no doubt that Brad is sitting there reading all the memes about his outrageous new contract. I’ve always felt like he acts that way because he doesn’t really look at the roster and think we have any shot at contending. If we can take one more swing this off-season for a guy like Collins, maybe Beal really buys back in and sees a chance to contend in the east.

Basically, if we have an actual good team and are winning games, I think Beal will lock back in.

I hope you are right, but I'm not optimistic. Leopards rarely change their spots. Beal has had 4 years to develop these bad habits. I don't think he can flip a switch and eliminate them. And I don't think our young, 2nd year coach has the authority to appropriately discipline our max contract, "Face of the Franchise" whenever he screws up.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#945 » by 80sballboy » Fri Jul 1, 2022 7:59 pm

Good luck Neto.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#946 » by nate33 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:00 pm

80sballboy wrote:Good luck Neto.
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I always liked Neto. He is a useful backup PG that got bashed around here because he wasn't a starting-caliber PG. Good luck to him in Cleveland.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#947 » by 80sballboy » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:06 pm

nate33 wrote:
80sballboy wrote:Good luck Neto.
Read on Twitter
?s=20&t=faCymfFXBRXemMy5tjb9mw

I always liked Neto. He is a useful backup PG that got bashed around here because he wasn't a starting-caliber PG. Good luck to him in Cleveland.


Loved him two years ago when he shot 39% from 3. Last season, he shot 29% and was a turnover machine. Dude did hustle his ass off and got the best out of his 6-foot frame.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#948 » by Frichuela » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:19 pm

80sballboy wrote:
nate33 wrote:
80sballboy wrote:Good luck Neto.
Read on Twitter
?s=20&t=faCymfFXBRXemMy5tjb9mw

I always liked Neto. He is a useful backup PG that got bashed around here because he wasn't a starting-caliber PG. Good luck to him in Cleveland.


Loved him two years ago when he shot 39% from 3. Last season, he shot 29% and was a turnover machine. Dude did hustle his ass off and got the best out of his 6-foot frame.


Aye aye. I could not comprehend Wes’ love for him…I worry Barton may become the new Neto…
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#949 » by badinage » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:51 pm

Raul Neto is so likable. And in so many ways. I guess I’m not a “real GM,” because I like a certain kind of guy, and will pull for him, even if he has obvious shortcomings. I just can’t bring myself to be all — this dude is trash. Raul is a good guy, a good teammate, and a good player — he plays the right way, he hustles his arse off, he competes, and he can be very effective in a role … and that role is: 8 minutes a game, when the team needs a spark and guys are tired.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#950 » by badinage » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:54 pm

To add to this … KD, while an otherworldly talent, has become a lot less likable over the years with his decisions and actions and online doings, and, especially, his AAU maneuverings.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#951 » by 9 and 20 » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:54 pm

badinage wrote:Raul Neto is so likable. And in so many ways. I guess I’m not a “real GM,” because I like a certain kind of guy, and will pull for him, even if he has obvious shortcomings. I just can’t bring myself to be all — this dude is trash. Raul is a good guy, a good teammate, and a good player — he plays the right way, he hustles his arse off, he competes, and he can be very effective in a role … and that role is: 8 minutes a game, when the team needs a spark and guys are tired.


8 minutes a game, one shot per minute, minimum. Passes not allowed, unless they're coming from someone else and directed at him.

He was like Jordan Crawford. The misses didn't phase him. Who else gonna shoot?
Can't say I do. Who else gonna shoot?
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#952 » by 80sballboy » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:56 pm

badinage wrote:To add to this … KD, while an otherworldly talent, has become a lot less likable over the years with his decisions and actions and online doings, and, especially, his AAU maneuverings.


As a PG County native, I'll always root for him, but it's getting tougher. I would still take him on my team any day of the week whether he's an ahole or social media or not.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#953 » by 80sballboy » Fri Jul 1, 2022 8:57 pm

9 and 20 wrote:
badinage wrote:Raul Neto is so likable. And in so many ways. I guess I’m not a “real GM,” because I like a certain kind of guy, and will pull for him, even if he has obvious shortcomings. I just can’t bring myself to be all — this dude is trash. Raul is a good guy, a good teammate, and a good player — he plays the right way, he hustles his arse off, he competes, and he can be very effective in a role … and that role is: 8 minutes a game, when the team needs a spark and guys are tired.


8 minutes a game, one shot per minute, minimum. Passes not allowed, unless they're coming from someone else and directed at him.

He was like Jordan Crawford. The misses didn't phase him. Who else gonna shoot?


It became hard to hide him on defense and when his shot was off, he became worthless.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#954 » by WallToWall » Fri Jul 1, 2022 9:34 pm

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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#955 » by doclinkin » Fri Jul 1, 2022 10:03 pm

nate33 wrote:
NatP4 wrote:Agree with everything you just said, Nate. I think there’s reason for optimism though. There’s no doubt that Brad is sitting there reading all the memes about his outrageous new contract. I’ve always felt like he acts that way because he doesn’t really look at the roster and think we have any shot at contending. If we can take one more swing this off-season for a guy like Collins, maybe Beal really buys back in and sees a chance to contend in the east.

Basically, if we have an actual good team and are winning games, I think Beal will lock back in.

I hope you are right, but I'm not optimistic. Leopards rarely change their spots. Beal has had 4 years to develop these bad habits. I don't think he can flip a switch and eliminate them. And I don't think our young, 2nd year coach has the authority to appropriately discipline our max contract, "Face of the Franchise" whenever he screws up.


There is a chance that Beal plays a different game now that he is paid in full. The de-evolution of his game started when he was snubbed for all-star games and his chances to earn the Super-max were jeopardized. It was then that instead of just moping when things didn't go his way, he started begging the refs and critiquing their calls. His rush to earn a scoring title also seemed self-interested, but at that point we needed every point he got for us. Then last year in his contract year, the league changed the rules on him and suddenly the Brad Beal that other teams had been tampering for for the past few years suddenly was average at best. Not worth rolling out a red carpet etc. At that point chemistry and team play go out the window. If teams aren't flying him out in the owner's jet and wining and dining then suddenly he doesn't have the negotiating leverage to push for a Max deal. Yeah yeah he could hope to rely on Ted, but Beal had been getting his ego stroked by every contending team in the league. To get big $$$ AND join a winning franchise was a realistic possibility. Had to be worth dreaming about even if he could only get fully SuperMaxed here.

Then he crapped the bed, and in his contract year tried to gun for stats. But the Brad that every Riley in the league wanted, was the guy who could play off the ball and didn't need it in his hands to be effective. The Brad who used screens and knew how to stay in motion to draw the defense out of the way. He knows how to play smart, to be involved even when the shot isn't designed for him. Games where he isn't hitting he still passes well and rebounds. Brad has dialed up defense at times. You hear him lecturing his AAU team and it sounds like advice he could have been shouting at himself the past couple years. He knows the right way to play. The only chance he has of re-igniting the bonfire of "come play with us and get a championship" is if he plays well enough to make the team look good. He has to hit his outside shots, attack the lane, play off the ball, make the smart cut, smart pass.

Now that he is paid, I expect he may play a less selfish game. To me it seems like he has never fully been comfortable in the spotlight as The Man. And frankly his game suffers when he is, since it is vulnerable to defensive pressure. If teams are now loading up to stop the Zinger, then Brad suddenly has more room to move, literally. He used to have a trademark on that baseline cross past 2-3 screens. Running it all game. He can run it just as well with a high-post center as he did with a tall pure point guard.

Beal with fat pockets can now turn his attention to the game and not personal pursuits. Yeah okay he still has Q Mayo in his wife's ear telling him about what should and should not happen. But on the flip side, he has the thought that he may enter the front office when his playing days are done. Developing the talent that is here in a teaching role raises the value of that job, and provides more opportunities.

Too in Johnny Davis he has a guy who is going to push him in practice, and also look up to him and ask for tips on offense. You learn a great deal by teaching. And being a role model forces you to work harder. Darius Garland played on his AAU team and credits Beal as a mentor who helped develop his game. Seeing Johnny put the "D" in his last name should make other players want to make the same effort. You gonna let this kid who used to pick you as his guy in video games out work you and out hustle you in practice and on court? So there's a chance we get the Big Picture Brad. Not Brad-Me Beal.

I think if we suck, he sulks, same thing does on court. Meeting adversity with disappointment. If so, yeah he may check out and wish he had jumped ship earlier when everybody wanted him. But if the team plays well, and young players develop, and teams are unable to load up on him to choke out his game I do think he might re-engage and find the skills that got him here. Is that enough to make him worth a 50+mil a year contract? NNNNnnnope. But he is a smart player, a good player, and in the past has been a great team player. WIth the focus off him, maybe earns a significant portion of that paycheck. Making players around him better.

Though of course at $251m, the focus will never be off him again. So who knows.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#956 » by Kanyewest » Fri Jul 1, 2022 10:29 pm

doclinkin wrote:
nate33 wrote:
NatP4 wrote:Agree with everything you just said, Nate. I think there’s reason for optimism though. There’s no doubt that Brad is sitting there reading all the memes about his outrageous new contract. I’ve always felt like he acts that way because he doesn’t really look at the roster and think we have any shot at contending. If we can take one more swing this off-season for a guy like Collins, maybe Beal really buys back in and sees a chance to contend in the east.

Basically, if we have an actual good team and are winning games, I think Beal will lock back in.

I hope you are right, but I'm not optimistic. Leopards rarely change their spots. Beal has had 4 years to develop these bad habits. I don't think he can flip a switch and eliminate them. And I don't think our young, 2nd year coach has the authority to appropriately discipline our max contract, "Face of the Franchise" whenever he screws up.


There is a chance that Beal plays a different game now that he is paid in full. The de-evolution of his game started when he was snubbed for all-star games and his chances to earn the Super-max were jeopardized. It was then that instead of just moping when things didn't go his way, he started begging the refs and critiquing their calls. His rush to earn a scoring title also seemed self-interested, but at that point we needed every point he got for us. Then last year in his contract year, the league changed the rules on him and suddenly the Brad Beal that other teams had been tampering for for the past few years suddenly was average at best. Not worth rolling out a red carpet etc. At that point chemistry and team play go out the window. If teams aren't flying him out in the owner's jet and wining and dining then suddenly he doesn't have the negotiating leverage to push for a Max deal. Yeah yeah he could hope to rely on Ted, but Beal had been getting his ego stroked by every contending team in the league. To get big $$$ AND join a winning franchise was a realistic possibility. Had to be worth dreaming about even if he could only get fully SuperMaxed here.

But he crapped the bed, and in his contract year tried to gun for stats. But the Brad that every Riley in the league wanted, was the guy who could play off the ball and didn't need it in his hands to be effective. The Brad who used screens and knew how to stay in motion to draw the defense out of the way. He knows how to play smart, to be involved even when the shot isn't designed for him. Games where he isn't hitting he still passes well and rebounds. Brad has dialed up defense at times. You hear him lecturing his AAU team and it sounds like advice he could have been shouting at himself the past couple years. He knows the right way to play. The only chance he has of re-igniting the bonfire of "come play with us and get a championship" is if he plays well enough to make the team look good. He has to hit his outside shots, attack the lane, play off the ball, make the smart cut, smart pass.

Now that he is paid, I expect he may play a less selfish game. To me it seems like he has never fully been comfortable in the spotlight as The Man. And frankly his game suffers when he is, since it is vulnerable to defensive pressure. If teams are now loading up to stop the Zinger, then Brad suddenly has more room to move, literally. He used to have a trademark on that baseline cross past 2-3 screens. Running it all game. He can run it just as well with a high-post center as he did with a tall pure point guard.

Beal with fat pockets can now turn his attention to the game and not personal pursuits. Yeah okay he still has OJ Mayo in his wife's ear telling him about what should and should not happen. But on the flip side, he has the thought that he may enter the front office when his playing days are done. Developing the talent that is here in a teaching role raises the value of that job, and provides more opportunities.

Too in Johnny Davis he has a guy who is going to push him in practice, and also look up to him and ask for tips on offense. You learn a great deal by teaching. And being a role model forces you to work harder. Darius Garland played on his AAU team and credits Beal as a mentor who helped develop his game. Seeing Johnny put the "D" in his last name should make other players want to make the same effort. You gonna let this kid who used to pick you as his guy in video games out work you and out hustle you in practice and on court? So there's a chance we get the Big Picture Brad. Not Brad-Me Beal.

I think if we suck, he sulks, same thing does on court. Meeting adversity with disappointment. If so, yeah he may check out and wish he had jumped ship earlier when everybody wanted him. But if the team plays well, and young players develop, and teams are unable to load up on him to choke out his game I do think he might re-engage and find the skills that got him here. Is that enough to make him worth a 50+mil a year contract? NNNNnnnope. But he is a smart player, a good player, and in the past has been a great team player. WIth the focus off him, maybe earns a significant portion of that paycheck. Making players around him better.

Though of course at $251m, the focus will never be off him again. So who knows.


The last time Beal was in a contract year in 2016, he also crapped the bed. And he followed that with a career year.

I think his sulky behavior will be tolerable if the Wizards actually win more often than not and Beal actually becomes a reliable 3 point shooter as he only shot 30% last season- a

Pretty much most of the league's star players have this habit of sulking. LeBron, Luka, Westbrook, Tatum- but yeah he has to get back on defense.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#957 » by B8RcDeMktfxC » Sat Jul 2, 2022 12:21 am

doclinkin wrote:
nate33 wrote:
NatP4 wrote:Agree with everything you just said, Nate. I think there’s reason for optimism though. There’s no doubt that Brad is sitting there reading all the memes about his outrageous new contract. I’ve always felt like he acts that way because he doesn’t really look at the roster and think we have any shot at contending. If we can take one more swing this off-season for a guy like Collins, maybe Beal really buys back in and sees a chance to contend in the east.

Basically, if we have an actual good team and are winning games, I think Beal will lock back in.

I hope you are right, but I'm not optimistic. Leopards rarely change their spots. Beal has had 4 years to develop these bad habits. I don't think he can flip a switch and eliminate them. And I don't think our young, 2nd year coach has the authority to appropriately discipline our max contract, "Face of the Franchise" whenever he screws up.


There is a chance that Beal plays a different game now that he is paid in full. The de-evolution of his game started when he was snubbed for all-star games and his chances to earn the Super-max were jeopardized. It was then that instead of just moping when things didn't go his way, he started begging the refs and critiquing their calls. His rush to earn a scoring title also seemed self-interested, but at that point we needed every point he got for us. Then last year in his contract year, the league changed the rules on him and suddenly the Brad Beal that other teams had been tampering for for the past few years suddenly was average at best. Not worth rolling out a red carpet etc. At that point chemistry and team play go out the window. If teams aren't flying him out in the owner's jet and wining and dining then suddenly he doesn't have the negotiating leverage to push for a Max deal. Yeah yeah he could hope to rely on Ted, but Beal had been getting his ego stroked by every contending team in the league. To get big $$$ AND join a winning franchise was a realistic possibility. Had to be worth dreaming about even if he could only get fully SuperMaxed here.

But he crapped the bed, and in his contract year tried to gun for stats. But the Brad that every Riley in the league wanted, was the guy who could play off the ball and didn't need it in his hands to be effective. The Brad who used screens and knew how to stay in motion to draw the defense out of the way. He knows how to play smart, to be involved even when the shot isn't designed for him. Games where he isn't hitting he still passes well and rebounds. Brad has dialed up defense at times. You hear him lecturing his AAU team and it sounds like advice he could have been shouting at himself the past couple years. He knows the right way to play. The only chance he has of re-igniting the bonfire of "come play with us and get a championship" is if he plays well enough to make the team look good. He has to hit his outside shots, attack the lane, play off the ball, make the smart cut, smart pass.

Now that he is paid, I expect he may play a less selfish game. To me it seems like he has never fully been comfortable in the spotlight as The Man. And frankly his game suffers when he is, since it is vulnerable to defensive pressure. If teams are now loading up to stop the Zinger, then Brad suddenly has more room to move, literally. He used to have a trademark on that baseline cross past 2-3 screens. Running it all game. He can run it just as well with a high-post center as he did with a tall pure point guard.

Beal with fat pockets can now turn his attention to the game and not personal pursuits. Yeah okay he still has OJ Mayo in his wife's ear telling him about what should and should not happen. But on the flip side, he has the thought that he may enter the front office when his playing days are done. Developing the talent that is here in a teaching role raises the value of that job, and provides more opportunities.

Too in Johnny Davis he has a guy who is going to push him in practice, and also look up to him and ask for tips on offense. You learn a great deal by teaching. And being a role model forces you to work harder. Darius Garland played on his AAU team and credits Beal as a mentor who helped develop his game. Seeing Johnny put the "D" in his last name should make other players want to make the same effort. You gonna let this kid who used to pick you as his guy in video games out work you and out hustle you in practice and on court? So there's a chance we get the Big Picture Brad. Not Brad-Me Beal.

I think if we suck, he sulks, same thing does on court. Meeting adversity with disappointment. If so, yeah he may check out and wish he had jumped ship earlier when everybody wanted him. But if the team plays well, and young players develop, and teams are unable to load up on him to choke out his game I do think he might re-engage and find the skills that got him here. Is that enough to make him worth a 50+mil a year contract? NNNNnnnope. But he is a smart player, a good player, and in the past has been a great team player. WIth the focus off him, maybe earns a significant portion of that paycheck. Making players around him better.

Though of course at $251m, the focus will never be off him again. So who knows.

Nice post. I'm optimistic too, although a little more hesitant over how well Beal will hold up physically.

However, the whole thing really comes down to KP (staying fit and) playing well and, the key, Beal understanding that the offence should basically be run through a high post KP and that will give him a huge opportunity to exploit defences. Even through he's the guy making the most money. If Beal doesn't buy into that then things are going to be very tough very quickly.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#958 » by Godymas » Tue Jul 5, 2022 1:22 pm

the Will Barton move was a good move, the return for KCP was solid. KCP and Ish for Will Barton and Monte Morris. I'd value Will Barton and Morris more than just having KCP and Ish is really just filler at this point.

I do wonder then, does Johnny Davis compete for the starting PG with Delon Wright/Monte Morris? Wikipedia says Johnny Davis is SG/SF, no way that's really the case for a guy that's 6'4. Or maybe Beal comes back and is running the point, he did have that 20 assist game last year before going down with injury? Maybe the real goal here is that we've surrounded Beal with guys that don't really have many holes in their offensive game and are verifiable upgrades over the previous cast Beal had. Tie that in with the wildcard that is Porzingis who was actually REALLY good in the last month he was on the court and Washington is going to be a sleeper team going into next season, possibly sniffing the 6th seed if things mesh well. Rui showed some promise too after returning.

The depth we have is underrated

PG- Beal/Morris/Davis/Wright
SG - Beal/Barton/Kispert
SF - Kuzma/Deni/Kispert/Barton
PF - Rui/Porzingis/Gill/Kuzma
C - Porzingis/Gafford/???

Basically a ton of flexibility to roll out guys at different positions for different line-ups. Opportunity to play a big line-up with Porzingis/Gafford/Rui/Kuzma/Beal, small ball opportunities with Porzingis being a big guy that plays small and guards/wings. Really what this team needs is a good defensive minded back-up big man. Similar to the role that Biyombo plays in PHX, a guy that can maybe pull off a block and 8 boards in 15mpg, a few finishes at the rim. Like if Hassan Whiteside is still available he'd be a really great pick-up.
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#959 » by payitforward » Tue Jul 5, 2022 1:31 pm

Godymas wrote:...The depth we have is underrated

PG- Beal/Morris/Davis/Wright
SG - Beal/Barton/Kispert
SF - Kuzma/Deni/Kispert/Barton
PF - Rui/Porzingis/Gill/Kuzma
C - Porzingis/Gafford/???
...

Especially if we can start Brad at two positions! :)
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Re: Offseason Plan 

Post#960 » by Godymas » Tue Jul 5, 2022 1:32 pm

payitforward wrote:
Godymas wrote:...The depth we have is underrated

PG- Beal/Morris/Davis/Wright
SG - Beal/Barton/Kispert
SF - Kuzma/Deni/Kispert/Barton
PF - Rui/Porzingis/Gill/Kuzma
C - Porzingis/Gafford/???
...

Especially if we can start Brad at two positions! :)


Well Beal will be starting at either of those positions no matter what on a night in night out basis, but if you need it spelled out i won't be doing it for you

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