The Jaylen Nowell Thread

[shrink]

Nice breakdown here:

Watch on YouTube

Not bad.

Anyone listen to Locked On Wolves regularly? I like David Locke, and I was impressed with Locked On’s 2020 Mock Draft, but I’ve sampled Locked On Wolves in the past, and thought their main guy didn’t know what he was talking about. It reached a breaking point for me a few years back when the Wolves host said we’d bring back Derrick Rose for $9-10 mil a year, when it was clear we wouldn’t bring him back, and the CBA wouldn’t even allow us to legally make that offer!

Is this a new host? Is the show good enough to be worth the daily time commitment?

[PeeDee]

I listen to the locked on wolves podcast pretty regularly. The caster seems knowledgeable and even headed and backs up a lot of discussions with stats. It's worthwhile for those of us that like to deep dive into the team and league when there is a lull in league action.

[wolves_89]

Nice breakdown here:

Watch on YouTube

Not bad.

Anyone listen to Locked On Wolves regularly? I like David Locke, and I was impressed with Locked On’s 2020 Mock Draft, but I’ve sampled Locked On Wolves in the past, and thought their main guy didn’t know what he was talking about. It reached a breaking point for me a few years back when the Wolves host said we’d bring back Derrick Rose for $9-10 mil a year, when it was clear we wouldn’t bring him back, and the CBA wouldn’t even allow us to legally make that offer!

Is this a new host? Is the show good enough to be worth the daily time commitment?

I listen to Locked on Wolves occasionally, but I'd put him way behind Dane Moore and John Krawczynski in terms of Wolves podcasts. I've never been particularly impressed by the hosts NBA knowledge (Krawcynski's specialty) or ability to analyze the Wolves on court play (Moore's main strength).

[Zonarosa]

On the hand he is one of our best isolation scorers. On the other hand he is a good passer and has BBIQ for drive and kick. I think aside from his defense the real question for Nowell is whether he is a PG, SG, or both. Lob dunks are just icing on his cake.

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

I am not 100% sure that is true. I am not saying the transition is finished and he is 100% to start when Dlo is out, but I think the fact that he is working on lobs is a potential sign they are going to continue the transition. Of course everyone is learning to lob so it is far from dispositive, but I wouldn’t give up on it yet.

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

[KGdaBom]

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

I am not 100% sure that is true. I am not saying the transition is finished and he is 100% to start when Dlo is out, but I think the fact that he is working on lobs is a potential sign they are going to continue the transition. Of course everyone is learning to lob so it is far from dispositive, but I wouldn’t give up on it yet.

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

Welcome aboard Zona I think. Due to a certain 76er fan we are a bit leery about new accounts. I'm a Wolves fan in AZ. Are you in AZ by any chance?

[winforlose]

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

I am not 100% sure that is true. I am not saying the transition is finished and he is 100% to start when Dlo is out, but I think the fact that he is working on lobs is a potential sign they are going to continue the transition. Of course everyone is learning to lob so it is far from dispositive, but I wouldn’t give up on it yet.

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

Funny your account is active since July of this year, yet you remember things from last season.

[Zonarosa]

I am not 100% sure that is true. I am not saying the transition is finished and he is 100% to start when Dlo is out, but I think the fact that he is working on lobs is a potential sign they are going to continue the transition. Of course everyone is learning to lob so it is far from dispositive, but I wouldn’t give up on it yet.

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

Welcome aboard Zona I think. Due to a certain 76er fan we are a bit leery about new accounts. I'm a Wolves in AZ. Are you in AZ by any chance?

nah, it’s just the name of a restaurant I used to frequent up near our family cabin.

[Zonarosa]

I am not 100% sure that is true. I am not saying the transition is finished and he is 100% to start when Dlo is out, but I think the fact that he is working on lobs is a potential sign they are going to continue the transition. Of course everyone is learning to lob so it is far from dispositive, but I wouldn’t give up on it yet.

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

Funny your account is active since July of this year, yet you remember things from last season.

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

[KGdaBom]

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

Funny your account is active since July of this year, yet you remember things from last season.

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

Yeah to think that a person can only know Wolves stuff since they started RealGM is messed up, but I told you we're leery of new accounts.

[winforlose]

dude’s no point guard, but I remember you pushing for okogie to be one as well, so…

Funny your account is active since July of this year, yet you remember things from last season.

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

Possible but unlikely. Still, I don’t really care either way. To answer your original point, I believe a proper transition to PG from SG takes between 1-3 years depending on the player. I believe it requires a high BBIQ to understand opposing schemes. A sufficient handle, and a willingness to move the ball instead of seeking one’s own shot. JO showed a BBIQ often knowing where to pass when he drove. He showed a decent handle (but one that needed to improve,) and a willingness to pass the ball. I was not arguing for dropping him into the PG and letting him run the offense. I was advocating for teaching him how to play PG over time so as to allow us to play bigger. Nowell is already smart and has an unselfishness to his game. His handle is what worries me. Also, his timing for the passing is a little off, but that comes from experience.

To your second point, this is the most talented squad we have ever had. KG would have given 7 years of picks to play next to an equivalent of Ant, Dlo, and Gobert. KAT only had to give up 5.

[Zonarosa]

Funny your account is active since July of this year, yet you remember things from last season.

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

Possible but unlikely. Still, I don’t really care either way. To answer your original point, I believe a proper transition to PG from SG takes between 1-3 years depending on the player. I believe it requires a high BBIQ to understand opposing schemes. A sufficient handle, and a willingness to move the ball instead of seeking one’s own shot. JO showed a BBIQ often knowing where to pass when he drove. He showed a decent handle (but one that needed to improve,) and a willingness to pass the ball. I was not arguing for dropping him into the PG and letting him run the offense. I was advocating for teaching him how to play PG over time so as to allow us to play bigger. Nowell is already smart and has an unselfishness to his game. His handle is what worries me. Also, his timing for the passing is a little off, but that comes from experience.

To your second point, this is the most talented squad we have ever had. KG would have given 7 years of picks to play next to an equivalent of Ant, Dlo, and Gobert. KAT only had to give up 5.

whatever. i’ve been reading your inanities for two years now and decided to speak on it. it’s over. move on.

[KGdaBom]

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

Possible but unlikely. Still, I don’t really care either way. To answer your original point, I believe a proper transition to PG from SG takes between 1-3 years depending on the player. I believe it requires a high BBIQ to understand opposing schemes. A sufficient handle, and a willingness to move the ball instead of seeking one’s own shot. JO showed a BBIQ often knowing where to pass when he drove. He showed a decent handle (but one that needed to improve,) and a willingness to pass the ball. I was not arguing for dropping him into the PG and letting him run the offense. I was advocating for teaching him how to play PG over time so as to allow us to play bigger. Nowell is already smart and has an unselfishness to his game. His handle is what worries me. Also, his timing for the passing is a little off, but that comes from experience.

To your second point, this is the most talented squad we have ever had. KG would have given 7 years of picks to play next to an equivalent of Ant, Dlo, and Gobert. KAT only had to give up 5.

whatever. i’ve been reading your inanities for two years now and decided to speak on it. it’s over. move on.

You two have got off to a horrible start. How about trying not to be di cks to each other.

[fattymcgee]

Funny your account is active since July of this year, yet you remember things from last season.

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

Possible but unlikely. Still, I don’t really care either way. To answer your original point, I believe a proper transition to PG from SG takes between 1-3 years depending on the player. I believe it requires a high BBIQ to understand opposing schemes. A sufficient handle, and a willingness to move the ball instead of seeking one’s own shot. JO showed a BBIQ often knowing where to pass when he drove. He showed a decent handle (but one that needed to improve,) and a willingness to pass the ball. I was not arguing for dropping him into the PG and letting him run the offense. I was advocating for teaching him how to play PG over time so as to allow us to play bigger. Nowell is already smart and has an unselfishness to his game. His handle is what worries me. Also, his timing for the passing is a little off, but that comes from experience.

To your second point, this is the most talented squad we have ever had. KG would have given 7 years of picks to play next to an equivalent of Ant, Dlo, and Gobert. KAT only had to give up 5.

I lurked on the various Wolves forums for years before ever posting. I've read a Wolves forum (ESPN, KFAN, RealGM, rubechat, i think I'm missing one) basically daily (a lot more than that the last few years) for the past 2+ decades but I don't post that much. Totally reasonable that he's been reading for years without posting.

[LSWF]

is it not possible for me to have been lurking for a few years during our **** seasons? we’ve got a squad built for excitement now.

Possible but unlikely. Still, I don’t really care either way. To answer your original point, I believe a proper transition to PG from SG takes between 1-3 years depending on the player. I believe it requires a high BBIQ to understand opposing schemes. A sufficient handle, and a willingness to move the ball instead of seeking one’s own shot. JO showed a BBIQ often knowing where to pass when he drove. He showed a decent handle (but one that needed to improve,) and a willingness to pass the ball. I was not arguing for dropping him into the PG and letting him run the offense. I was advocating for teaching him how to play PG over time so as to allow us to play bigger. Nowell is already smart and has an unselfishness to his game. His handle is what worries me. Also, his timing for the passing is a little off, but that comes from experience.

To your second point, this is the most talented squad we have ever had. KG would have given 7 years of picks to play next to an equivalent of Ant, Dlo, and Gobert. KAT only had to give up 5.

I lurked on the various Wolves forums for years before ever posting. I've read a Wolves forum (ESPN, KFAN, RealGM, rubechat, i think I'm missing one) basically daily (a lot more than that the last few years) for the past 2+ decades but I don't post that much. Totally reasonable that he's been reading for years without posting.

As a long suffering wolves fan(1989 to present), I've lurked on these boards for years.

[TheZachAttack]

Read on Twitter

On the hand he is one of our best isolation scorers. On the other hand he is a good passer and has BBIQ for drive and kick. I think aside from his defense the real question for Nowell is whether he is a PG, SG, or both. Lob dunks are just icing on his cake.

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

Nowell was a 99th percentile pick and roll/pop ball-handler last season in terms of PPP generated—this includes all outcomes where he started as a ball handler and the play ended in either his own shot or a teammates. He also had a 90th+ percentile assist to turnover ratio.

There is sample evidence that you don’t want him to be your primary initiator (the guy that brings the ball up the court and controls pace/tempo), but I would argue you’re completely wrong about Nowell being the primary ball-handler in the half court to generate offense through.

[winforlose]

On the hand he is one of our best isolation scorers. On the other hand he is a good passer and has BBIQ for drive and kick. I think aside from his defense the real question for Nowell is whether he is a PG, SG, or both. Lob dunks are just icing on his cake.

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

Nowell was a 99th percentile pick and roll/pop ball-handler last season in terms of PPP generated—this includes all outcomes where he started as a ball handler and the play ended in either his own shot or a teammates. He also had a 90th+ percentile assist to turnover ratio.

There is sample evidence that you don’t want him to be your primary initiator (the guy that brings the ball up the court and controls pace/tempo), but I would argue you’re completely wrong about Nowell being the primary ball-handler in the half court to generate offense through.

I remember watching summer league 2021 and worrying about Nowell’s handle. Then I watched him play in 21/22 and there were moments that I cringed watching him ball handle. Nothing so obvious as dribbling off his foot or getting his pocket picked too easily. Just little things that I wish he could clean up. Nowell has a PG’s BBIQ. He can read defenses well enough to know who is open and when to dish. He thrives in isolation because he is good at deciding when help is coming and when it isn’t. But I have to agree I don’t want someone with his handle bringing the ball up (especially in pressure situations,) nor do I want him running the offense as he tends to pass to much and shoot to little when he does. But, those are things that you can fix with practice and experience. You cannot expect a person to change religion completely in a single day, it is the same with position. There is a night and day difference between PG and SG, and the conversion can take years. Some guys cannot do it at all. I agree with Zach that there is sufficient evidence to suggest he can. But I also agree with So Money that last year he wasn’t good enough to be a full time PG. I think the question for this year is how much more he can be converted, and how much is just too deeply ingrained?

[SO_MONEY]

On the hand he is one of our best isolation scorers. On the other hand he is a good passer and has BBIQ for drive and kick. I think aside from his defense the real question for Nowell is whether he is a PG, SG, or both. Lob dunks are just icing on his cake.

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

Nowell was a 99th percentile pick and roll/pop ball-handler last season in terms of PPP generated—this includes all outcomes where he started as a ball handler and the play ended in either his own shot or a teammates. He also had a 90th+ percentile assist to turnover ratio.

There is sample evidence that you don’t want him to be your primary initiator (the guy that brings the ball up the court and controls pace/tempo), but I would argue you’re completely wrong about Nowell being the primary ball-handler in the half court to generate offense through.

I didn't say you couldn't run offense through him, his role is his role and he is good at that. I am a big Nowell guy, but he is awful as a PG (the guy that does the things like bring the ball up and control tempo) and why the experiment was abandoned. And as I said that is okay.

[MN7725]

On the hand he is one of our best isolation scorers. On the other hand he is a good passer and has BBIQ for drive and kick. I think aside from his defense the real question for Nowell is whether he is a PG, SG, or both. Lob dunks are just icing on his cake.

I think there is sufficient evidence he isn't a PG, they tried, it didn't work. That's okay...he is still talented just the same.

Nowell was a 99th percentile pick and roll/pop ball-handler last season in terms of PPP generated—this includes all outcomes where he started as a ball handler and the play ended in either his own shot or a teammates. He also had a 90th+ percentile assist to turnover ratio.

There is sample evidence that you don’t want him to be your primary initiator (the guy that brings the ball up the court and controls pace/tempo), but I would argue you’re completely wrong about Nowell being the primary ball-handler in the half court to generate offense through.

He was similar the year before too, albeit even less possessions, but the dude is clearly a crafty pick/roll operator.

It seems like the best use of Nowell will be a Jamal Crawford role, who was definitely a primary ball handler but also not a "PG" in any sense or playmaker for others

But that's fine if Nowell is in a lineup with like Gobert/McDaniels/Prince, none of whom can really do much with the ball anyway.

[Klomp]

He was similar the year before too, albeit even less possessions, but the dude is clearly a crafty pick/roll operator.

It seems like the best use of Nowell will be a Jamal Crawford role, who was definitely a primary ball handler but also not a "PG" in any sense or playmaker for others

But that's fine if Nowell is in a lineup with like Gobert/McDaniels/Prince, none of whom can really do much with the ball anyway.

Bingo. You can whine about how Crawford was not a PG so Nowell can't be either, but the point is that the second unit offense absolutely could run through Crawford just like it absolutely can run through Nowell.

Look back at the three times Crawford won 6MOY:
2009-10: The backup PG was a rookie Jeff Teague. Not exactly the best backup PG, but was never asked to be because Crawford handled a lot of the backcourt responsibilities for the second unit.
2013-14: Backup PG Darren Collison equaled his lowest assists per36 of his career playing next to Crawford.
2015-16: Funny enough, the backup PG was Austin Rivers. Unless you'd give those duties to 38-year old Pablo Prigioni (another connection for that signing that hasn't really been discussed this offseason).

[urinesane]

I went to that free summer showcase last year (I was actually in MN for the summer) and out of everyone on that roster, Nowell looked different.

He wasn't joking around and having fun during warm ups. He had his sleeveless hoody on and was clearly visualizing and mentally preparing for it. He carried himself with the energy of a samurai type figure... calm, confident, and focused.

It wasn't surprising to see how effective he was this season in limited action for the Wolves, because even just from seeing him at that event, it was clear that he gets it. I honestly think he is going to be REALLY good for the Wolves this year with an increased opportunity, because no situation is too big for him. He's super focused on the task while not getting too high or too low.

The guy has that "it" factor that is hard to quantify. Not sure if he will be a starter in the league, but he can definitely be a valuable rotational player and a potential 6MOY candidate.