Eurobasket 2022 (daily OP updates), day 11, all quarter finals teams known, Italy shocks Europe, eliminates Serbia

[User_friendly]

I cannot fathom that Slovenia is leading this poll.

They have the best player in the tournament. Maybe Jokic can challenge that statement.
Slovenia is also leading the fiba-power rankings. It is not too much of a stretch putting Slovenia at No.1

No, they don't. Both Giannis and Jokic are a tier above.

Being all 3 in a very similar NBA level (all around TOP-5), having Luka proved so much more than both of them in FIBA basketball, and being it so differently ruled and played than NBA, i woudn't hold your take without gloves.

[SecondTake]

Anyone else feeling a slight red flag with Wembanyama already out because of injury?

I'm would be so wary about drafting him with a superhigh pick. Guys this tall just can't seem to stay healthy. I don't know the details of the injury, but if i have a top pick i'm definitely looking for someone else.

I already said it earlier in this thread: i think he is not playing to ensure that he will be the no.1 pick in the draft. He could only damage his reputation if he plays. If he hides until the draft he ll go no.1 100%.
That s why i m not buying his injury.

I would prefer if it was injury. What you're suggesting is that he believes he's a fraud and hiding from being exposed, which is terrible from a #1

[Ruma85]

Anyone else feeling a slight red flag with Wembanyama already out because of injury?

I'm would be so wary about drafting him with a superhigh pick. Guys this tall just can't seem to stay healthy. I don't know the details of the injury, but if i have a top pick i'm definitely looking for someone else.

I already said it earlier in this thread: i think he is not playing to ensure that he will be the no.1 pick in the draft. He could only damage his reputation if he plays. If he hides until the draft he ll go no.1 100%.
That s why i m not buying his injury.

I would prefer if it was injury. What you're suggesting is that he believes he's a fraud and hiding from being exposed, which is terrible from a #1

He is just pouting about playing time, not very serious.

[UcanUwill]

We all know Victor would have had limited role on National team, if he makes the team at all. Idea of him hiding himself is not valid, he has entire club season ahead of him, after downgrading the club and competition, he has to perform there.

[Swuul]

No, they don't. Both Giannis and Jokic are a tier above.

When playing with NBA rules, yes. Playing with FIBA rules, Jokic and especially Giannis have to change their style a lot, or they might foul themselves out during first half. Luka has proven time and again FIBA rules fit him extremely well, both offensively and defensively, while both Jokic and Giannis have so far not seemed to be able to adjust.

[Ruma85]

No, they don't. Both Giannis and Jokic are a tier above.

When playing with NBA rules, yes. Playing with FIBA rules, Jokic and especially Giannis have to change their style a lot, or they might foul themselves out during first half. Luka has proven time and again FIBA rules fit him extremely well, both offensively and defensively, while both Jokic and Giannis have so far not seemed to be able to adjust.

We haven't seen much of jokic on this stage since 2019, even then. he shot 75% from 2 40% from 3 and 80 from the line.

[wco81]

What exactly are the FIBA rules, more physical defense, like hand-checking?

Also a lot of back to the basket post plays with those wider lanes at the baseline?

More double-teaming of post players? Or more zone defenses?

[Sgt Major]

Jokic won Olympic silver when he was 21, I don't get this talk that he hasn't proved anything under FIBA rules.

[styLesdavis]

What exactly are the FIBA rules, more physical defense, like hand-checking?

Also a lot of back to the basket post plays with those wider lanes at the baseline?

More double-teaming of post players? Or more zone defenses?

Its not just about the rules but more about the physical play style.
It just doesn`t fit for guys like Giannis who are powering there way to the
paint in the NBA play after play. That won`t happen in Europe.

[mpoo_sin]

What exactly are the FIBA rules, more physical defense, like hand-checking?

Also a lot of back to the basket post plays with those wider lanes at the baseline?

More double-teaming of post players? Or more zone defenses?

The main thing is that there is no defensive 3 seconds rule and that the court is smaller. Teams can continiously pack the paint. That is the main reason why Antetokounmpo was so ineffective in international BBall until now. Let us see how he fares this time around.

[Swuul]

Main differences between NBA and FIBA rules:

1) No defensive 3 sec rule and smaller court means it is crowded close to the basket
2) Travelling and other offensive fouls are actually called unlike in NBA
3) Technical fouls are counted as personal fouls too under FIBA
4) Five fouls and your out in FIBA vs the six fouls in NBA
5) Under FIBA the ball can be cleared by defence after it has hit the rim (in NBA it can't be cleared if it is above the basket)
6) In FIBA matches there is only one time-out per quarter (two in the last quarter), and only the coach can call the time-out and only when the game is stopped
7) FIBA matches last 4x10 minutes

All that means players who mainly rely on their physical abilities to bulldoze to score are in serious trouble, because it is hard to get to dunk the ball and short-range lay-ups are much easier to be cleared. Also, without the plethora of time-outs available in NBA matches, big physical players tend to wear out faster even though the actual matches are shorter.

[AussieBuck]

The Giannis takes on international ball continue to be hilarious

[Pachinko_]

Greece is possibly a little better than I thought initially
Still not a great amount of talent (or shooting) around Giannis but at least almost all players showed up early at the camp, all healthy, and the coach is much better than we ever had in previous tournaments.

Might make some noise this time.

[Wagonband]

The Giannis takes on international ball continue to be hilarious

Why? Had you shown someone that doesn't watch the NBA the games of Giannis playing for Greece, there is not a single human being that would say that is the best player in the world.

In FIBA competitions so far Giannis has been terribly exposed. I actually give him even more credit that other guys for continuing to play for Greece given how much he struggles. Shows he really cares. But watching FIBA Giannis there is no way that you think that is top 5 player in the world.

[AussieBuck]

The Giannis takes on international ball continue to be hilarious

Why? Had you shown someone that doesn't watch the NBA the games of Giannis playing for Greece, there is not a single human being that would say that is the best player in the world.

In FIBA competitions so far Giannis has been terribly exposed. I actually give him even more credit that other guys for continuing to play for Greece given how much he struggles. Shows he really cares. But watching FIBA Giannis there is no way that you think that is top 5 player in the world.

Giannis hasn't played internationally for years and when he last did he was playing out of position and role as an off ball small forward on a team with no spacing with some idiot as coach who had no interest in using his strengths on offense. Despite that he scored well, rebounded and played defense like a **** god. It's a very casual fan/no idea what you're looking at thing to think his impact wasn't very high.

[AussieCeltic]

The Giannis takes on international ball continue to be hilarious

Why? Had you shown someone that doesn't watch the NBA the games of Giannis playing for Greece, there is not a single human being that would say that is the best player in the world.

In FIBA competitions so far Giannis has been terribly exposed. I actually give him even more credit that other guys for continuing to play for Greece given how much he struggles. Shows he really cares. But watching FIBA Giannis there is no way that you think that is top 5 player in the world.

Giannis hasn't played internationally for years and when he last did he was playing out of position and role as an off ball small forward on a team with no spacing with some idiot as coach who had no interest in using his strengths on offense. Despite that he scored well, rebounded and played defense like a **** god. It's a very casual fan/no idea what you're looking at thing to think his impact wasn't very high.

Come on man. I know you’re defending your boy, but he clearly didn’t have the same impact in the FIBA WC in 2019 as he did in the NBA.

He was constantly in foul trouble, struggled to score and get assists. He only averaged 14.8 points and 2.6 assists per game in 25 mins.

He had a 24/10 game against NZ, but other than that, was pretty lacklustre for his standards.

[mpoo_sin]

The Giannis takes on international ball continue to be hilarious

Why? Had you shown someone that doesn't watch the NBA the games of Giannis playing for Greece, there is not a single human being that would say that is the best player in the world.

In FIBA competitions so far Giannis has been terribly exposed. I actually give him even more credit that other guys for continuing to play for Greece given how much he struggles. Shows he really cares. But watching FIBA Giannis there is no way that you think that is top 5 player in the world.

Giannis hasn't played internationally for years and when he last did he was playing out of position and role as an off ball small forward on a team with no spacing with some idiot as coach who had no interest in using his strengths on offense. Despite that he scored well, rebounded and played defense like a **** god. It's a very casual fan/no idea what you're looking at thing to think his impact wasn't very high.

I think Antetokounmpo is one of the three best players in the NBA. Do you think that he is as good in Fiba Basketball as he is in the NBA?

You can not objectively believe that. Defensively it very well might be the case but offensively Fiba Basketball clearly is disadvantagious to his skillset.

[AussieBuck]

Why? Had you shown someone that doesn't watch the NBA the games of Giannis playing for Greece, there is not a single human being that would say that is the best player in the world.

In FIBA competitions so far Giannis has been terribly exposed. I actually give him even more credit that other guys for continuing to play for Greece given how much he struggles. Shows he really cares. But watching FIBA Giannis there is no way that you think that is top 5 player in the world.

Giannis hasn't played internationally for years and when he last did he was playing out of position and role as an off ball small forward on a team with no spacing with some idiot as coach who had no interest in using his strengths on offense. Despite that he scored well, rebounded and played defense like a **** god. It's a very casual fan/no idea what you're looking at thing to think his impact wasn't very high.

Come on man. I know you’re defending your boy, but he clearly didn’t have the same impact in the FIBA WC in 2019 as he did in the NBA.

He was constantly in foul trouble, struggled to score and get assists. He only averaged 14.8 points and 2.6 assists per game in 25 mins.

He had a 24/10 game against NZ, but other than that, was pretty lacklustre for his standards.

I mean I've mentioned he didn't have the ball/it wasn't his role and you've chosen to ignore that. If he was out there shooting 25% with 8 turnovers I guess you'd have a point?

[Beorn]

Last time Giannis played for Greece, we were running out there with a PG that couldn't shoot, a streaky SF that couldn't dribble at SG, Giannis at the SF and 2 non-shooting bigs. up front. Also the team was running pretty much nothing from him. Also Giannis has improved a little since '19

[AussieCeltic]

Giannis hasn't played internationally for years and when he last did he was playing out of position and role as an off ball small forward on a team with no spacing with some idiot as coach who had no interest in using his strengths on offense. Despite that he scored well, rebounded and played defense like a **** god. It's a very casual fan/no idea what you're looking at thing to think his impact wasn't very high.

Come on man. I know you’re defending your boy, but he clearly didn’t have the same impact in the FIBA WC in 2019 as he did in the NBA.

He was constantly in foul trouble, struggled to score and get assists. He only averaged 14.8 points and 2.6 assists per game in 25 mins.

He had a 24/10 game against NZ, but other than that, was pretty lacklustre for his standards.

I mean I've mentioned he didn't have the ball/it wasn't his role and you've chosen to ignore that. If he was out there shooting 25% with 8 turnovers I guess you'd have a point?

Ok. So that’s the arbitrary cut off for you to say he performed poorly (to his standard).

On one hand you say he played fine, on the other hand you say he played bad because of his coach/role.

He was not up to his back to back MVP standards. It’s ok to say your fav player didn’t play great. I think we all think Giannis is a beast, but if you think he played well averaging 14/8/2 then I’ve got a bridge to sell you.