#10 - Spida Thread - I hate sham

[Reign23]

Read on Twitter

yep the first one was also my final prediction a few days ago.

[god shammgod]

Sexton isn't coming close to getting the Cavs Mitchell though. That is really all the Knicks care about. Jazz can go ahead and trade Conley for Sexton if they want

There also isn't a player on the Knicks who is getting Mitchell. This is about unprotected picks. If New York is only offering 2 unprotected picks, the Cavs won't have trouble beating that.

Yeah but the Cavs are also gonna be really good.

Game set match.

they probably aint getting a lottery pick anytime soon either way to be fair.

no matter what happens, they'll likely end up the losers of this deal. those are the breaks when you trade an all-star. we don't even really care about the stuff we're trading, we care about having enough of it left that we can make another trade like this after. kind of tells you the value of it.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Sexton isn't coming close to getting the Cavs Mitchell though. That is really all the Knicks care about. Jazz can go ahead and trade Conley for Sexton if they want

There also isn't a player on the Knicks who is getting Mitchell. This is about unprotected picks. If New York is only offering 2 unprotected picks, the Cavs won't have trouble beating that.

Yeah but the Cavs are also gonna be really good.

Game set match.

Probably, but whoever Utah trades Mitchell to, they will be gambling that things will fall apart before the unprotected picks have all been conveyed. That's why Ainge won't accept a trade where Knicks offer only 23 and 25 unprotected picks. He wants that 27 and 29(or at least one of those), because the farther out those picks are, the better the odds a team will have problems.

[Oscirus]

I thought they were rebuilding, why they want old assed obi so bad?

[Oscirus]

Im surprised there are no swaps

[Cappy_Smurf]

Yeah but the Cavs are also gonna be really good.

Game set match.

they probably aint getting a lottery pick anytime soon either way to be fair.

no matter what happens, they'll likely end up the losers of this deal. those are the breaks when you trade an all-star. we don't even really care about the stuff we're trading, we care about having enough of it left that we can make another trade like this after. kind of tells you the value of it.

Bingo.

This seems to be something most fans don't understand. Trading away a dollar for a handful of nickels and dimes isn't going to go your way most of the time. That's why Ainge is trying to get as many quarters thrown in as he can.

[mpharris36]

Read on Twitter

Makes total sense!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No way they trade Rj Folksssssss no way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sham I want my respect!

hard knicks life ??!?! this is whose word you're taking ? might as well go to green arrow for your sources

along with common sense...

[god shammgod]

Sham I want my respect!

hard knicks life ??!?! this is whose word you're taking ? might as well go to green arrow for your sources

along with common sense...

no

Spoiler:

whether they trade rj or not, it was fun torturing you all today with this rumor

[mpharris36]

hard knicks life ??!?! this is whose word you're taking ? might as well go to green arrow for your sources

along with common sense...

no

Spoiler:

whether they trade rj or not, it was fun torturing you all today with this rumor

see you have me all wrong. If Utah would accept an RJ centric package that cuts some of our unprotected picks going out I would be all for it.

1. It doesn't make sense for Utah to lose unprotected picks for RJ
2. Knicks value RJ more than Utah because the Knicks will go over the cap to extend RJ and then they can figure out a trade that RJ will probably go out for another player to pair with Mitchell down the road.

[Chanel Bomber]

At least that settles the debate on whether RJ can accept being a role player on a winning team. Case closed.

Well not necessarily, because they have since expanded his role and allowed him to think of himself as a rising star.

It remains to be seen whether he's willing to accept a reduced role in a contract year and be a good soldier for the sake of winning.

The difference between RJ 2 years ago and last year is a whopping 4% usage and less than 3 more shots per game. Yeah Knicks really overwhelmed him last year with that increased role

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, in all honesty.

It's pretty clear that RJ had a bigger role last year, especially as of late December. More touches, more FGAs, and a higher usage. Those differences that you mentioned are not insignificant, by the way.

RJ was better in his role in 2020-21 than he was in his role in 2021-22. He was better on defense, and less inefficient on offense. All the stats (and common sense imo) support this.

If your point is that RJ had more or less the same role (which I don't think is true), then his regression in terms of defense and efficiency should be even more alarming. But it's known that his role expanded, which explains to a large degree his regression in several facets of the game.

[3toheadmelo]

Sexton isn't coming close to getting the Cavs Mitchell though. That is really all the Knicks care about. Jazz can go ahead and trade Conley for Sexton if they want

There also isn't a player on the Knicks who is getting Mitchell. This is about unprotected picks. If New York is only offering 2 unprotected picks, the Cavs won't have trouble beating that.

Yeah but the Cavs are also gonna be really good.

Game set match.

[god shammgod]

along with common sense...

no

Spoiler:

whether they trade rj or not, it was fun torturing you all today with this rumor

see you have me all wrong. If Utah would accept an RJ centric package that cuts some of our unprotected picks going out I would be all for it.

1. It doesn't make sense for Utah to lose unprotected picks for RJ
2. Knicks value RJ more than Utah because the Knicks will go over the cap to extend RJ and then they can figure out a trade that RJ will probably go out for another player to pair with Mitchell down the road.

i didn't mean just you, i meant everyone

maybe utah thinks it can flip rj...who knows

[whocares1]

no

Spoiler:

whether they trade rj or not, it was fun torturing you all today with this rumor

see you have me all wrong. If Utah would accept an RJ centric package that cuts some of our unprotected picks going out I would be all for it.

1. It doesn't make sense for Utah to lose unprotected picks for RJ
2. Knicks value RJ more than Utah because the Knicks will go over the cap to extend RJ and then they can figure out a trade that RJ will probably go out for another player to pair with Mitchell down the road.

i didn't mean just you, i meant everyone

maybe utah thinks it can flip rj...who knows

They probably could. Which is why they may see him as more valuable. And what’s the point of seeing RJ play 4th option here anyway.

[Esq-4]

The RJ leak to make trade look less bad makes me think both Obi and Grimes are gone. Not cool.

[TheGreenArrow]

It’s going to be grimes/Obi/McBride/Fournier/3unprotected picks/2protected picks

That’s the farthest I’ll/we should go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mpharris36]

see you have me all wrong. If Utah would accept an RJ centric package that cuts some of our unprotected picks going out I would be all for it.

1. It doesn't make sense for Utah to lose unprotected picks for RJ
2. Knicks value RJ more than Utah because the Knicks will go over the cap to extend RJ and then they can figure out a trade that RJ will probably go out for another player to pair with Mitchell down the road.

i didn't mean just you, i meant everyone

maybe utah thinks it can flip rj...who knows

They probably could. Which is why they may see him as more valuable. And what’s the point of seeing RJ play 4th option here anyway.

because Randle has no future here...whether they can do it this year or next...Randle is not a long term option with Brunson/Mitchell.

[god shammgod]

see you have me all wrong. If Utah would accept an RJ centric package that cuts some of our unprotected picks going out I would be all for it.

1. It doesn't make sense for Utah to lose unprotected picks for RJ
2. Knicks value RJ more than Utah because the Knicks will go over the cap to extend RJ and then they can figure out a trade that RJ will probably go out for another player to pair with Mitchell down the road.

i didn't mean just you, i meant everyone

maybe utah thinks it can flip rj...who knows

They probably could. Which is why they may see him as more valuable. And what’s the point of seeing RJ play 4th option here anyway.

there is no point. and if rj doesn't go in this trade, he'll likely go in the next one since that's the plan.

[AusKnicksTape]

The RJ leak to make trade look less bad makes me think both Obi and Grimes are gone. Not cool.

Yeh. Agreed. Not cool.

Just go three unprotected IMO.

[god shammgod]

i didn't mean just you, i meant everyone

maybe utah thinks it can flip rj...who knows

They probably could. Which is why they may see him as more valuable. And what’s the point of seeing RJ play 4th option here anyway.

because Randle has no future here...whether they can do it this year or next...Randle is not a long term option with Brunson/Mitchell.

but even after randle is gone the plan is to get another all-star. and brunson is above rj now in the pecking order. he'll still end up the 4th option.

[mpharris36]

no

Spoiler:

whether they trade rj or not, it was fun torturing you all today with this rumor

see you have me all wrong. If Utah would accept an RJ centric package that cuts some of our unprotected picks going out I would be all for it.

1. It doesn't make sense for Utah to lose unprotected picks for RJ
2. Knicks value RJ more than Utah because the Knicks will go over the cap to extend RJ and then they can figure out a trade that RJ will probably go out for another player to pair with Mitchell down the road.

i didn't mean just you, i meant everyone

maybe utah thinks it can flip rj...who knows

Andy Larsen says the Jazz don't really want RJ if it comes at he expense of removing valuable picks in the deal...and the Knicks aren't just throwing in RJ to not reduce the amount of draft capital in the deal. So again it really doesn't make sense from Utah's point of view.

I'm sure the sticking point is the 2027 1st round pick. The Jazz want that one unprotected. I don't think they are discussing 2029...they want 5 1st rounders but 3 of them unprotected is the point where this deal goes to being accepted in my eyes.