2009 66 wins Cvaliers with Iguodala replacing LeBron, how many wins do the get?

[An Unbiased Fan]

The east had a winning record vs the west in 2009, but even if that was not the case conference disparity has minimal influence in record

The SRS of the East teams speak for themselves, going by East vs West is rather pointless.

If we use Iggy in Philly as a baseline, that's 41 wins. So how much better is the 09 Cavs cast than the 09 76ers, I would say quite a bit. That would vault them past the Hawks at 47 wins and to the 3rd seed

It is pretty relevant if you want to argue east teams had inflated records from not playing in the west

Do you think the cavs would have a much better supporting cast around iggy than pihhly did in 2009?

Was old elton brand worse than older ben wallace? Thadeus young that much worse than past his prime ilgauskaz?, mo williams than andre miller?

Yes the Cavs had a better cast.

-Elton Brand playing 29 games, and shot 48.4% TS. Like what did he bring, not much.
-Thaddeus was a PF who grabbed 8.8 TRB%. Which is nearly the same as Iggy who was on the perimeter. Vareflop was 15% and Big Z 16% TRB.
-Mo was a 18ppg scorer on 59% TS and 44% 3pt shooting.

How in the world were the Cavs not better than that 76er squad?

[HeartBreakKid]

The SRS of the East teams speak for themselves, going by East vs West is rather pointless.

If we use Iggy in Philly as a baseline, that's 41 wins. So how much better is the 09 Cavs cast than the 09 76ers, I would say quite a bit. That would vault them past the Hawks at 47 wins and to the 3rd seed

It is pretty relevant if you want to argue east teams had inflated records from not playing in the west

Do you think the cavs would have a much better supporting cast around iggy than pihhly did in 2009?

Was old elton brand worse than older ben wallace? Thadeus young that much worse than past his prime ilgauskaz?, mo williams than andre miller?

Yes the Cavs had a better cast.

-Elton Brand playing 29 games, and shot 48.4% TS. Like what did he bring, not much.
-Thaddeus was a PF who grabbed 8.8 TRB%. Which is nearly the same as Iggy who was on the perimeter. Vareflop was 15% and Big Z 16% TRB.
-Mo was a 18ppg scorer on 59% TS and 44% 3pt shooting.

How in the world were the Cavs not better than that 76er squad?

Elton Brand was a good defender, but he did not play many games so I did not include him.

Thad Young...is a much better player than Varejao. He was a 15 ppg guy on 55 TS%. Thad Young played on a team that has Reggie Evans, Elton Brand, Dalembert, Speights, and good rebounding guards. So yes, he didn't have a lot of rebounds, even in his prime he does not get a lot of rebounds. You think Varajao is better than him because he is a better rebounder, when he was basically a rebounding specialist?

Mo Williams isn't as good as Andre Miller. Even the year Mo Williams made the all-star game no one thought that. Mo Williams a good shooter, not much else. Andre Miller was a comparable scorer (who created his own shot) and a better passer/playmaker. He simply did not have large stats and a didn't have an eye popping style.

Andre Miller is consistently on top of lists of best players to never make an all-star game. Mo Williams is consistently on top of lists of worst players to make an all-star team. It's pretty obvious who is better.

[An Unbiased Fan]

The east had a winning record vs the west in 2009, but even if that was not the case conference disparity has minimal influence in record

The SRS of the East teams speak for themselves, going by East vs West is rather pointless.

If we use Iggy in Philly as a baseline, that's 41 wins. So how much better is the 09 Cavs cast than the 09 76ers, I would say quite a bit. That would vault them past the Hawks at 47 wins and to the 3rd seed

The Sixers won 41 games because they had okay depth, not because Iguodala is worth 41 games.

When Iguodala left the sixers the sixers lost only one more game than the previous year. One game. So using your criteria it doesnt seem like he would pop the Cavs into a 50 win team.


Andre Miller and Thad Young is better than anyone on the Cavs. Mo Williams, Varajao, West aren't as good as them, not even that close - really, and that's with the boost they got playing off of James.

Explain how 09 Miller and Young were better than Mo and Vareflop? Never mind that the Cavs had more depth with guys like Big Z and Delonte. And you say not even close? By what metric other than to devalue that supporting cast?

Also the notion that the 76ers only lost 1 games without Iggy is wrong because.....in 2012 is was a shortened season. 2012 76ers were 35-31 on 3.59 SRS. 2013 76ers w/o Iggy were 34-48 on -3.51 SRS.

Again, Philly won 41 games in 2009, so I don't get why people are acting like it wouldn't go up with a better cast.

[An Unbiased Fan]

Andre miller, thadeus young, elton brand (past his prime)

Mo willians, zidraunas (past his prime), ben wallace (past his prime)

Is the philly cast supposed to be the worst one? Aside of chemistry/fit i would say iggy philly had a better top 3 around iggy (in a vacuum) than lebron had in cleveland

Brand played 29 games

Miller, Young? really?

Big Z past prime is still better than anyone on that Philly cast. Mo William again was 18ppg on 59% TS. Is that supposed to not be good?

This is silly. That Cavs cast was clearly better.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Andre Miller for passing.
Mo Williams for scoring
Miller is better but not by all that much.

Thaddeus Young, Really?
I kept waiting for Thaddeus to emerge because people kept saying he was an up and coming star but I don’t think he ever became a star.

Brand 20 games is not enough.
Lou Williams made a nice bench gunner not a starter.
I like Dalembert more than most people did but 2009 was not a good year for him.


Willie Green started 60 games. I doubt he was as good as Delonte West
I don’t remember Willie Green. Willie Green must have been good on defense because he does not have starter offensive numbers.
By process of eliminaton Iguodala had to start 21 games at off guard and 61 games at small forward with Thaddeus Young starting at small forward. This seemed to be the November starters with Elton Brand starting at power forward. Iguodala is the only person on the roster that baskballreference lists as a small forward.

76ers supporting cast might be better or worse than the Cavaliers supporting cast. I am guessing they are about equal.

2006 Lakers supporting cast looks a bit worse than 2009 Cavaliers and 76ers supporting casts

[An Unbiased Fan]

It is pretty relevant if you want to argue east teams had inflated records from not playing in the west

Do you think the cavs would have a much better supporting cast around iggy than pihhly did in 2009?

Was old elton brand worse than older ben wallace? Thadeus young that much worse than past his prime ilgauskaz?, mo williams than andre miller?

Yes the Cavs had a better cast.

-Elton Brand playing 29 games, and shot 48.4% TS. Like what did he bring, not much.
-Thaddeus was a PF who grabbed 8.8 TRB%. Which is nearly the same as Iggy who was on the perimeter. Vareflop was 15% and Big Z 16% TRB.
-Mo was a 18ppg scorer on 59% TS and 44% 3pt shooting.

How in the world were the Cavs not better than that 76er squad?

Elton Brand was a good defender, but he did not play many games so I did not include him.

Thad Young...is a much better player than Varejao. He was a 15 ppg guy on 55 TS%. Thad Young played on a team that has Reggie Evans, Elton Brand, Dalembert, Speights, and good rebounding guards. So yes, he didn't have a lot of rebounds, even in his prime he does not get a lot of rebounds. You think Varajao is better than him because he is a better rebounder, when he was basically a rebounding specialist?

Mo Williams isn't as good as Andre Miller. Even the year Mo Williams made the all-star game no one thought that. Mo Williams a good shooter, not much else. Andre Miller was a comparable scorer (who created his own shot) and a better passer/playmaker. He simply did not have large stats and a didn't have an eye popping style.

Andre Miller is consistently on top of lists of best players to never make an all-star game. Mo Williams is consistently on top of lists of worst players to make an all-star team. It's pretty obvious who is better.

Brand's legs were gone by 2009.

And how was Young "a much better player" than Varejao? He scored more on higher USG, but we're talking 54.9% Ts vs 53.6% TS. Not much of a gap. Meanwhile Vareflop was a MUCH better rebounder, Young was a horrific rebounder at PF.

Mo isn't as good as Miller? In what way. No Miller was not a comparable scorer that season.

Who knew the 76ers cast had so many world-beaters.

[Homer38]

The cavs were 26-4 against the west in 2009.Their 66 wins season have nothing to do with the conference.

[falcolombardi]

Andre miller, thadeus young, elton brand (past his prime)

Mo willians, zidraunas (past his prime), ben wallace (past his prime)

Is the philly cast supposed to be the worst one? Aside of chemistry/fit i would say iggy philly had a better top 3 around iggy (in a vacuum) than lebron had in cleveland

Brand played 29 games

Miller, Young? really?

Big Z past prime is still better than anyone on that Philly cast. Mo William again was 18ppg on 59% TS. Is that supposed to not be good?

This is silly. That Cavs cast was clearly better.

I stand corrected on brand, But then ben wallace played only 53 games amd ilgauskaz 65

Yes andre miller is probably better than mo williams

Thadeus young was a excelent role player, he was not worse than 34 years old ilgauskas or young varejao

[falcolombardi]

Yes the Cavs had a better cast.

-Elton Brand playing 29 games, and shot 48.4% TS. Like what did he bring, not much.
-Thaddeus was a PF who grabbed 8.8 TRB%. Which is nearly the same as Iggy who was on the perimeter. Vareflop was 15% and Big Z 16% TRB.
-Mo was a 18ppg scorer on 59% TS and 44% 3pt shooting.

How in the world were the Cavs not better than that 76er squad?

Elton Brand was a good defender, but he did not play many games so I did not include him.

Thad Young...is a much better player than Varejao. He was a 15 ppg guy on 55 TS%. Thad Young played on a team that has Reggie Evans, Elton Brand, Dalembert, Speights, and good rebounding guards. So yes, he didn't have a lot of rebounds, even in his prime he does not get a lot of rebounds. You think Varajao is better than him because he is a better rebounder, when he was basically a rebounding specialist?

Mo Williams isn't as good as Andre Miller. Even the year Mo Williams made the all-star game no one thought that. Mo Williams a good shooter, not much else. Andre Miller was a comparable scorer (who created his own shot) and a better passer/playmaker. He simply did not have large stats and a didn't have an eye popping style.

Andre Miller is consistently on top of lists of best players to never make an all-star game. Mo Williams is consistently on top of lists of worst players to make an all-star team. It's pretty obvious who is better.

Brand's legs were gone by 2009.

And how was Young "a much better player" than Varejao? He scored more on higher USG, but we're talking 54.9% Ts vs 53.6% TS. Not much of a gap. Meanwhile Vareflop was a MUCH better rebounder, Young was a horrific rebounder at PF.

Mo isn't as good as Miller? In what way. No Miller was not a comparable scorer that season.

Who knew the 76ers cast had so many world-beaters.

The 76'rs aside of iguodala were not full of world beaters, no but they were not bad players either

Similar to the cavs without lebron

[An Unbiased Fan]

Andre miller, thadeus young, elton brand (past his prime)

Mo willians, zidraunas (past his prime), ben wallace (past his prime)

Is the philly cast supposed to be the worst one? Aside of chemistry/fit i would say iggy philly had a better top 3 around iggy (in a vacuum) than lebron had in cleveland

Brand played 29 games

Miller, Young? really?

Big Z past prime is still better than anyone on that Philly cast. Mo William again was 18ppg on 59% TS. Is that supposed to not be good?

This is silly. That Cavs cast was clearly better.

I stand corrected on brand, But then ben wallace played only 53 games amd ilgauskaz 65

Yes andre miller is probably better than mo williams

Thadeus young was a excelent role player, he was not worse than 34 years old ilgauskas or young varejao

Big Ben at 53 and Big Z at 65 is far better than Brand at 29 games and 48.4% TS. And then you have Mo, Delonte and decent roleplayers

[TheLand13]

So let me see if I understand this correctly.

You make the thread based on this post:

another piss poor take

I don't know why you expect me to read any of that. Again, go ruin another thread with your terrible takes. The topic of this thread isn't about whether or not LeBron's team would win 45 games with an average SF.

But hey, here's an idea. Why don't you make a thread making that very same claim, and I'll gladly explain in full on detail why you are wrong. Sound like a plan?

And your "average SF" is... Andre Iguodala? The guy who put up 18/5/5 on very good defense that season and 21/6/6 in the playoffs? The guy who was a top ten player at his very own position in the league? In what world is that an average SF? Do you not understand what average means? Average means mediocre. Average means literally middle of the barrel. In what world does Andre Iguodala in 2009 fall under that category?

Congrats, you've failed spectacularly. Give me a starting SF who actually is AVERAGE and then we can talk.