Danny Ainge just took the whole NBA execs to school

[Ruma85]

Ok, but they won't going to win with those 2. as there main options.

Yep. They will surely win with that kid in the 8th grade.

It is really one thing what Ainge did in Boston. Pierce was 36. Garnett was 37. Ray Allen was gone. That was the end of the era.

Compare that to giving up on a 25 year old with a three year contract and a former DPOY who still has many years ahead.

The Jazz have already been doing that. They traded multiple 1sts to get Conley, and another future first to move off of Derrick Favors salary, it still didn’t work.

And after getting the big haul for Gobert, they’d still have to give up over half of what they got for Rudy without even knowing how they (the Jazz) play without Gobert.

I think the Jazz move was keep both or move both, but before the deals the Jazz have no young guys that any teams would want so they would have to keep giving away firsts further down the road.

But as I said. Trying is risky. Ainge could have traded picks and expirings to add players and the team could have still failed. This is certainly the easy way out. Nobody will ask him about winning a game yet a championship for many years. Heck they will demand losses

Maybe they will, who knows how good those players will be. For Danny to do this takes balls. Salute.

[Ill News]

Show me one team that has won a championship by hoarding picks and turning the franchise into a disgrace for years on end.

It’s the most lauded team-building strategy that has never produced even a finalist.

I take issue with the bolded part, since Ainge literally built the current Celtics core that just reached the Finals a few months ago. With his war chest of draft picks, Ainge drafted a slew of stars and valuable role players:

Tatum (#3)
Brown (#3)
Smart (#6)
Robert Williams (#27)
Grant Williams (#23)
Pritchard (#26)

Then there was Terry Rozier (picked 16th) and Kelly Olynyk (picked 13th), two role players that are still thriving in the league today, and Romeo Langford and Aaron Nesmith (both 14th) who were eventually packaged for Derrick White and Malcolm Brogdon (though Brad is the one who pulled these moves). Ainge had some misses, but that's to be expected when you're picking in the mid- to late-first round and second round too often. But he nailed all of his high lottery picks, and the overall result of his drafting resulted in a team that came within 2 wins of a title.

[Grubie024]

Look at all these anons on a website. They know the biz better than tenured pro GM's.
"Fleeced" "Swindled"
lol can't wait for the season to start.

[Exp0sed]

I fail to see how Cleveland overpaid. Those picks they gave up aren't going to amount to much since Cleveland will be a playoff team for years to come. Keep in mind, Allen, Mobley and Garland are all under the age of 24. And Mitchell turns 26 this year. For some teams like the Nets, it makes little sense because their top players are coming close to the tail ends of their careers. But that is not the case for Cleveland.

I agree this was a good trade for Cleveland but i would be careful about saying "they won't amount to much". Those picks don't start conveying until 25 and the NBA has repeatedly shown things can change extremely quickly

Exactly. Is DM even signed past '25? Whose to say a small backcourt is even going to work in Cleveland? 3 years is an eternity in the NBA.

meh, the Cavs were on pace for 50+ wins (comfortably) before Rubio and then their bigs went out with injuries. they had a weak second half to the season because of injuries and still managed to win 44 games with rookie Mobley

Sexton didn't play all season (he's awful so that actually helped them win) but my point is that those wins weren't generated by Sexton+Lauri

Jafro is still young(ish) Mobley is only gonna get better and so do the rest of their young pieces, Garland, Okoro etc. We don't see many max rookies bolt before their 2nd contract and I doubt Evan is gonna be the exception

it's very unlikely the Cavs will be bad 3 years from now or even 5 for that matter
Altman has been pretty capable too

sure, anything's possible but it's very likely that the Cavs will be a playoff team, even if Mitchell doesn't resign in 3 years, not to mention that if he won't resign - there's a decent chance he'll be traded or signed and traded for value

I get the deal for both sides but if Ainge is banking on a Cavs imploding - that's a highly unlikely scenario - even in 3 years time
I think 4 frps and 2 swaps is a decent\fair haul for Mitchell, but let's not get carried away

[Dr Aki]

Danny Warchest Ainge knows what he wants and knows how to get it

[Ryoga Hibiki]

Just saying, the actual Jazz team is not nearly as bad as you think, if they decide to compete.
They got a bunch of starter and totation level players back for those picks, with a good defensive coach that's enough for 35+ wins.

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[Ryoga Hibiki]

Modern NBA fan: Utah should have traded Stockton and Malone by ‘89 for picks because it was obvious they couldn’t win

said nobody

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[Ryoga Hibiki]

Oh yeah, anything can happen, just as I said in another post in this thread. There's definitely an element of risk in these kinds of trades, no doubt about it. It's just not the same as the trade with the Nets, where everyone basically KNEW the Celts were getting some lotto picks.

That’s funny, cause that’s not at all how it went. Immediately after the trade the nets were the clear winner. Only in the next year did things start falling apart.

Dude, KG was 36/37 (!) when that trade happened. Paul Pierce was 35/36, LOL. Everyone saw from a mile away that the Celtics were going to get lottery picks a few years later.

no, they were not.
https://youtu.be/UJzx-PeG8zs

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[Mamba81p]

The amount of respect I have for that franchise, to take a team that was guaranteed to make the playoffs but also guaranteed to never contend, and blow it up is sky high. They could’ve just stayed as a 1st round contender and kept their fan base happy but they aren’t settling.

I usually don't respect teams that win playoff series regularly but are not contenders, and decide to blow it up. Would you respect a team like 2019 Blazers that blow it up in 2019, or Memphis in 2013?

I don't think the Jazz were guaranteed to make the playoffs. With Clippers and Nuggets healthy they could have been a play-in team, with no chance to win a first round. I think they were in decline and decided to sale 1 year earlier, rather than 1 year late, which was the right move.

[bbalnation]

Re season ticket sales for the next couple years,

With the trade for Lauri, Utah got their guy.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

I am trying to compare a mentality. If they couldn’t win in a year or two at most three, time to blow up. Trying to build something is way too tough

The Jazz got the #1 seed in the West and proceeded to lose to a Clips team that lost Kawhi halfway thru the series and played with a frontcourt of Morris/Batum. That was pretty telling and a lot of people would've just blown up the team right after that.

Jazz ran it back the following year. They got the 5th seed in what was a soft year in the Western Conference and they lost in the 1st round to a Mavs team that didn't have Luka in 2 out of 6 games. I couldn't blame anyone who wanted to blow that team up.

As I said, you would also want to trade Stockton and Malone if you were a fan back then. Those two didn’t make the finals until their 30s

No you don't, because in 89 you had a 25 yo 1st team All NBA and a 26 yo 2nd team All NBA, an extremely strong core to build around, something Gobert and Mitchell (who also had a bad personal fit) were not.
Moreover, a draft pick in 1989 was not worth as much as in 2022, with the different rules.in place.


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[Exp0sed]

Modern NBA fan: Utah should have traded Stockton and Malone by ‘89 for picks because it was obvious they couldn’t win

said nobody

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First of all, things were different back then meaning - the culture and player's mentality

secondly, i'd guess Mitchell and Gobert never liked each other or really got along well, but it worsened during and after that childish tantrum by Mitchell when he was publicly "angry" at Gobert for exposing him to Covid or whatever

the reality is these guys hated each other these past couple of years and it showed on and off the court. when your two best players don't get along - it's very hard to create team chemistry, unity etc, unless your'e like a Phil Jackson level manipulator who can somehow use that personal rift to propel the two to compete

one of them should have been traded 2 years ago to solve this issue and this has been very obvious to everyone except Utah's old GM, I guess. I'm guessing Utah believed that winning can solve this problem so...they tried to win (and failed) and after that, the wheels just came off

Ainge did the right thing by blowing it up, the time for trading one of them has blown by and it was too late for that as the rest of the cast is too old and neither is good enough to build an actual contender around, trading one of those was fine in the summer in 2020 but not now.

Good move and he got a very nice haul for both combined. now just gotta draft well

[Ryoga Hibiki]

Stockpiling picks is the easiest thing to do. It's turning those picks into assets that is the difficult part. Those picks are likely all going to be late in the first round and Ainge has a terrible track record of drafting in that range.

Netting the two Williams there is already an amazing result.
You don't need to hit everytime (and you can't).

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[timO]

how can you be sure the players you will select with those picks (arguably all late 1st round) will even sniff to be as good as Mitchell and Gobert?

Gilbert was a 27, Mitchell a 13.

[whatisacenter]

You have to tip your cap to Ainge. If you are a Jazz fan he just got you more than you probably dreamed imaginable for Gobert/Mitchell. The Jazz had plateaued and if you are going to reboot, this is how you do it.

[BelgradeNugget]

One question. Is there anybody here who will be willing to pay for season tickets to watch THT and Sexton play? I would be excited if I was Wolfes or Cavs fan to watch their new teams play but if I was Jazz fan what would I do? Go to hibernation. Support some other team temperately until 2027 comes so Utah drafts a young exciting player, and then wait for another 3-4 years for him to develop.
Wake me up in 10 years.

[Jables]

One question. Is there anybody here who will be willing to pay for season tickets to watch THT and Sexton play? I would be excited if I was Wolfes or Cavs fan to watch their new teams play but if I was Jazz fan what would I do? Go to hibernation. Support some other team temperately until 2027 comes so Utah drafts a young exciting player, and then wait for another 3-4 years for him to develop.
Wake me up in 10 years.

Jazz tickets will be cheap as hell are you kidding!? Ask how many Sixers fans how painful it was to be able to actually go to their games during the Hinkie era.

[BelgradeNugget]

One question. Is there anybody here who will be willing to pay for season tickets to watch THT and Sexton play? I would be excited if I was Wolfes or Cavs fan to watch their new teams play but if I was Jazz fan what would I do? Go to hibernation. Support some other team temperately until 2027 comes so Utah drafts a young exciting player, and then wait for another 3-4 years for him to develop.
Wake me up in 10 years.

Jazz tickets will be cheap as hell are you kidding!? Ask how many Sixers fans how painful it was to be able to actually go to their games during the Hinkie era.

Yes but still. I wouldn't go to their games if they pay me. People can say whatever they want but Jazz team that was broken played beautiful basketball, competed, and won some games. Didn't win the championship but 29 teams didn't either.
Watching THT and Sexton play can cause serious damage to your brain.

[Slava]

Like with anything else, tearing things down is not hard, even David Griffin did a similar job with New Orleans by trading away Davis and Holiday. Its building things up that is harder.

[tmorgan]

Sure, it’s true, this was the easier part, but Ainge still got (what I perceive to be) fair value for Mitchell and more than fair value for Gobert, considering his age and contract. I hate Ainge (the player — that face that needed punching) but it was good work.

He drafted well, if not exceptionally well, in Boston. Just gotta do it again.