Eurobasket 2022 (daily OP updates), day 11, all quarter finals teams known, Italy shocks Europe, eliminates Serbia

[Bob8]

Brazdeikis was born in Lithuania's second-biggest city Kaunas in 1999, but migrated with his parents to the US when he was three.

That is straight from the article

Oh, I know. This is also in the article:
“His citizenship has been restored because the amendments allowing children who were born Lithuanian citizens, but later acquired the citizenship of another state, to keep both citizenships came into force on January 1,” - and this after playing for the Canadian youth team.

And that reminds me of when Slovenia changed their citizenship law in 2017 to allow Randolph to play for them. The original poster was talking about respect for Lithuania and no respect for Slovenia in 2017, and I just wanted to point the fallacy in that argument.

Look at this photo https://sportklub.n1info.si/kosarka/randolph-seveda-bom-rekel-da-je-bila-nasa-ekipa-boljsa/
That is Randolph a month ago watching the NT in Ljubljana, Slovenia (he is not curtently on the team). My question to all who say "must have a connection with the country to play or it's cheating"... So now Randolph is Slovenian enough to play? A five year loyalty is enough?

Citizenship Law is complicated and varies. There is no way to make it "fair" for everyone. People can buy citizenships or receive them for merit and they don't even have to live there in certain countries. It is what it is.

I made my position on the issue clear a couple of pages back in this thread, so I'll let it go now.

I am sorry but it's not comparable at all. Ignas Brazdeikis has a Lithuanian first name, Lithuanian last name, was born in Lithuania, has Lithuanian parents, and speaks Lithuanian. Anthony Randolph does not have a Slovenian first name, does not have a Slovenian last name, was not born in Slovenia, neither of his parents are Slovenian, and he doesn't speak Slovenian. Yes, Randolph is not Slovenian enough.

I didn't say it's the same, I said he couldn't play Lithuania with previous rules, because he played for Canada before.

Rules allow 1 naturalised player. Dorsey is part Greek but he's still naturalised. Fiba doesn't care about players roots, if he hasn't passport by 18, he can play only as naturalised.

About Slovenia. Slovenia has only 2 mio people and it's almost impossible to find someone over 2.10. They have great basketball school, producing many guards, which is the biggest problem in Europe. You can't teach height, so using Fiba's option is the only way to have playable big.

[Sgt Major]

**** Spain and **** hiring of guys with no ties to the countries they play for.

[zzzyyxyyxzzz]

I am sorry but it's not comparable at all. Ignas Brazdeikis has a Lithuanian first name, Lithuanian last name, was born in Lithuania, has Lithuanian parents, and speaks Lithuanian. Anthony Randolph does not have a Slovenian first name, does not have a Slovenian last name, was not born in Slovenia, neither of his parents are Slovenian, and he doesn't speak Slovenian. Yes, Randolph is not Slovenian enough.

Sure it is. They are both (North) American naturalized players competing for European countries at Eurobasket.

Is Gregor Fučka an Italian name?
Serge Ibaka and Nikola Mirotić are Spanish names?
What is Mirsad Türkcan's real name, does it sound Turkish?

So stop this American boo boo game. European powerhouses (Spain, Italy, Greece, Turkey) have been doing this for decades within Europe itself. You and I don't get to decide who is Lithuanian or Slovenian, but the repective governments of said countries do. That's how it works.

[BadaBoom]

I didn't want Embiid to play for us in the first place, but seeing Lithuania losing to Brown who can't even make a whole Spanish sentence, guess mercenaries are the way to go in Europe these days. At least Embiid has ties to France unlike most of these players..

And Embiid speaks french

Personally i'm against it because he does not have any real ties with France other than speaking the language because it is an official language of Cameroun. It's better than 90% of the mercenaries playing for a country they know nothing about but still, he never lived in France and don't have a french parent.

I think it's really a shame that now almost every country has a fake guy playing for them, it's plain stupid. For me it always feels like "country + that guy". If Embiid joins France (it's likely what's going to happen seeing the federation and GM statements) it will be France + Embiid, not France.

All in all I think a country should rather lose with only legit guys than win with a random imported piece that does not even care about them...

[BadaBoom]

Has Brown ever lived in Spain?

Is he getting paid a salary to play for them?

If we had Ricky probably he wouldn't get selected even a lot of people was mad in Spain because he never played or lived here. But I'm sure that a lot of people now are happy lol. It's the same with the most of the countries that have an north american guard in this tournament.

This one is very unique.

Literally asking the government "Hey, give this guy citizenship because we suck at PG".

This part is the worst I think. In any country it's hell to get papers if you are an immigrant who is there for many years, working and all. And then, a sport federation needs a guy so they just sign papers like it doesn't mean anything. It's really a shame

[Evenacus]

Croatia also had a naturalized player before. It was Dontaye Draper but unlike Smith, he at least played a few years in Croatia so he actually had some connections before being given the passport. I am not saying that should be enough but it's something at least.
Bo Mccaleb is the greatest example what a difference can a naturalized player have for a smaller team. His efforts gave a massive boost to that Macedonian team.

[Pachinko_]

I don't care to be honest. I mean sure I'm Greek and I want Greece to be good, but ultimately deep down I just want to watch some competitive basketball in the summer, just find a way to split some good players in a few teams and get playing. I don't care where people are from. The main thing to me is they play under FIBA rules and format, I can't stand the NBA any more, I can only sit myself down for the play offs.

[Mavrelous]

I don't care to be honest. I mean sure I'm Greek and I want Greece to be good, but ultimately deep down I just want to watch some competitive basketball in the summer, just find a way to split some good players in a few teams and get playing. I don't care where people are from. The main thing to me is they play under FIBA rules and format, I can't stand the NBA any more, I can only sit myself down for the play offs.

You have NBA and Euroleague for that, international teams are for national identity, but like others said, unlike football, basketball level is much more affected by single player at key position, and you have a lot of tiny of countries that it will make a huge difference, if Lithuania had a normal guard, they would be contention talks, Slovenia has no center other than Tobey, Spain has no PG other than Brown since Rubio is out.
I think the one naturalized player is a good trade off, the other solution is many case like Lithuania, really good team that's missing a key part and dropping the level because of it.
Eurobasket level this year is really high, in football international games are (IMO at least) at much lower level than Champions league, still the international games attract insane amount of viewership.

[UcanUwill]

What are those ratings?

I am not 100% sure, but I think it is still the relic from EuroCup days:
(Points + Rebounds + Assists + Steals + Blocks + Fouls Drawn) - (Missed Field Goals + Missed Free Throws + Turnovers + Shots Rejected + Fouls Committed)

So essentially just PER?

No, PER counts production per minute, you can play 2 minutes and have highest PER, EFF is just combined box score impact.

I couldnt watch today, was busy with work stuff

How did spain play to beat lithuania? I didnt expect that result

In the first half, Spanish bench players were really good, their back up PG, Diaz, was amazing, he was so good on defense he cut Lithuanian creators very successfully. Spanish coach was switching defenses all game, he took Lithuanian bigs out of the game completely with zone and with the help of Diaz, Lithuania was still leading cause they were still finding open shots to beat zone, but at the end of the game, crucial shots did not fall.
Valanciunas got in early foul trouble and due to that and Spanish defense, he couldn't find rythm at all. Garuba dominated on offensive glass, Spain had lots of second chance points. And at the end, Lorenzo Brown was unstoppable, he closed the game. As I said, this is modern basketball, you can have 2 star centers, they still aren't worth a damn if your opponent just has head and shoulders better creator closer guard.

Basically, Lithuania was outcoached and outplayed at perimeter.

[Alonzo_Morning]

Croatia also had a naturalized player before. It was Dontaye Draper but unlike Smith, he at least played a few years in Croatia so he actually had some connections before being given the passport. I am not saying that should be enough but it's something at least.
Bo Mccaleb is the greatest example what a difference can a naturalized player have for a smaller team. His efforts gave a massive boost to that Macedonian team.

Dontaye Draper! Now that's a blast from the past (NBL)

I believe he won a title there

[Pachinko_]

You have NBA and Euroleague for that

The Euroleague simply doesn't have players like that, and the NBA regular season I can't even watch it. I don't understand the rules (I'm not even sure if they actually have rules), I dont know if teams are trying to win or lose, I don't know if coaches are just testing systems and players that they're not even gonna use in the playoffs, I don't know if players are actually injured or resting, the constant breaks annoy me, the meaningless games annoy me. People love it and that is great, but it's just not for me.

This Eurobasket has been a breath of fresh air for me, I haven't enjoyed basketball like that in a while.


Sent from my M2101K6G using Tapatalk

[UcanUwill]

I didn't say it's the same, I said he couldn't play Lithuania with previous rules, because he played for Canada before.

Rules allow 1 naturalised player. Dorsey is part Greek but he's still naturalised. Fiba doesn't care about players roots, if he hasn't passport by 18, he can play only as naturalised.

About Slovenia. Slovenia has only 2 mio people and it's almost impossible to find someone over 2.10. They have great basketball school, producing many guards, which is the biggest problem in Europe. You can't teach height, so using Fiba's option is the only way to have playable big.

I dont think Dorsey and Brazdeikis count as naturalize players, I might be wrong, but I dont think thats the case at all. Jordan Clarkson is not considered naturalized for Gilas, even Matt Freije was not technically naturalized for Lebanon, him and Joe Vogel were able to play for Lebanon at the same time, so I really doubt Dorsey and Brazdeikis are naturalized, Greece and Lithuania does not have naturalized players, they have players will dual citezenships who had multiple options to choose witch nation to represent without being counted as naturalized. THese players are rare, but they arent naturalized. Personally, I dont know how Ignas is capable of playing for Lithuania, as been said, he played for Canadian youth teams, but obviously I dont know the rules.

[Mavrelous]

You have NBA and Euroleague for that

The Euroleague simply doesn't have players like that, and the NBA regular season I can't even watch it. I don't understand the rules (I'm not even sure if they actually have rules), I dont know if teams are trying to win or lose, I don't know if coaches are just testing systems and players that they're not even gonna use in the playoffs, I don't know if players are actually injured or resting, the constant breaks annoy me, the meaningless games annoy me. People love it and that is great, but it's just not for me.

This Eurobasket has been a breath of fresh air for me, I haven't enjoyed basketball like that in a while.


Sent from my M2101K6G using Tapatalk

It is a really great tournament this year.

[Evenacus]

Croatia also had a naturalized player before. It was Dontaye Draper but unlike Smith, he at least played a few years in Croatia so he actually had some connections before being given the passport. I am not saying that should be enough but it's something at least.
Bo Mccaleb is the greatest example what a difference can a naturalized player have for a smaller team. His efforts gave a massive boost to that Macedonian team.

Dontaye Draper! Now that's a blast from the past (NBL)

I believe he won a title there

He played for Cedevita and one 2 Croatian cups and played in the final four of one of those Euro cups or whatever it was called.

[UcanUwill]

Sad to see Ukraine go down. After yesterday, I am more sensitive to Slaughters and Brown's when usual. How is Len an NBA player though, he is terrible, and I dont mean terrible for an NBA guy, but just terrible. Half of Ukraine's team is better than him, and they are a bunch of no names.

[Ruma85]

You have NBA and Euroleague for that

The Euroleague simply doesn't have players like that, and the NBA regular season I can't even watch it. I don't understand the rules (I'm not even sure if they actually have rules), I dont know if teams are trying to win or lose, I don't know if coaches are just testing systems and players that they're not even gonna use in the playoffs, I don't know if players are actually injured or resting, the constant breaks annoy me, the meaningless games annoy me. People love it and that is great, but it's just not for me.

This Eurobasket has been a breath of fresh air for me, I haven't enjoyed basketball like that in a while.


Sent from my M2101K6G using Tapatalk

I watch as many games in the regular season as I can, but I watch a couple hours after there done usually without overtime the games are around an hour and 45 minutes, which is okay as I pause them when I need to or want to do something else. The games are much quicker in the Euroleague or fiba because most of the time the clock runs, which I don't agree with. I ask myself sometimes when there's fouls called do the refs see what they actually called or is it just an reaction because of the speed of the play, I only watched an NBL game live once there was a few bad calls, though I know for a fact players move at a different pace in the fiba ,nba , euroleague.

When you say constant breaks like what, commercials?

[Ruma85]

You have NBA and Euroleague for that

The Euroleague simply doesn't have players like that, and the NBA regular season I can't even watch it. I don't understand the rules (I'm not even sure if they actually have rules), I dont know if teams are trying to win or lose, I don't know if coaches are just testing systems and players that they're not even gonna use in the playoffs, I don't know if players are actually injured or resting, the constant breaks annoy me, the meaningless games annoy me. People love it and that is great, but it's just not for me.

This Eurobasket has been a breath of fresh air for me, I haven't enjoyed basketball like that in a while.


Sent from my M2101K6G using Tapatalk

It is a really great tournament this year.

why isn't it?

[Ruma85]

Sad to see Ukraine go down. After yesterday, I am more sensitive to Slaughters and Brown's when usual. How is Len an NBA player though, he is terrible, and I dont mean terrible for an NBA guy, but just terrible. Half of Ukraine's team is better than him, and they are a bunch of no names.

Can you elaborate on Len?, I watch him play in the NBA, he seems fine, his talent is good, sometimes he doesn't know what his doing on the court.

[Mavrelous]

why isn't it?

I'm not sure I understand I said it IS a great tournament.

[Ruma85]

why isn't it?

I'm not sure I understand I said it IS a great tournament.

I misread :