Thoughts in General, Rumors, etc... 7.0

[MoneyTalks41890]

Count me as someone that sees Crowder for Bojan as hurting the Suns defensively.

But my opinion is that Crowder is gone. He's made some allusions to not being happy this summer, and responded pretty negatively to the Sarver report. I think he's asking out and I think he's getting traded.

[K_chile22]

. And Luka is a bit of a favorable matchup

Things I did not expect to read today, for $1000, Alex.

I know what you meant, but I also disagree. Luka absolutely cooked him. Now he was out there picking Luka up full court and absolutely competing his tail off, unlike the Utah guards ands wings, but the numbers tell us he was absolutely tragic trying to defend Luka.

Luka cooks everyone though lol I don't think either of us meant he was stopping him, just did about as well as an offensively focused 33 yo wing can expect
He also probably just looked better by comparison to the Conley, Mitchell and Clarkson's on the team lol

[babyjax13]

. And Luka is a bit of a favorable matchup

Things I did not expect to read today, for $1000, Alex.

I know what you meant, but I also disagree. Luka absolutely cooked him. Now he was out there picking Luka up full court and absolutely competing his tail off, unlike the Utah guards ands wings, but the numbers tell us he was absolutely tragic trying to defend Luka.

Luka cooks everyone though lol I don't think either of us meant he was stopping him, just did about as well as an offensively focused 33 yo wing can expect
He also probably just looked better by comparison to the Conley, Mitchell and Clarkson's on the team lol

Conley is fine on small guards. Clarkson is tragic and Mitchell put no effort in on defense the first two games of that series. Crowder is a better defender, I'm not trying to imply that, but Bojan is equally as bad/good as he has always been, but because his man gets a match-up advantage when the get the switch off Bojan and onto a small guard - which is what a lot of teams did - it makes him look worse defensively relative to...whoever our backup power forward was...Rudy Gay? I don't know.

[oldncreaky]

If the Lakers are really giving up two unprotected 1sts, Detroit should absolutely be shipping those guys to LA. That's a big overpay.

From a value perspective, you're probably right. I'll concede 2 unprotected firsts is a big overpay for Bey and Stewart, neither of which projects to be much more than a solid starter, and we may end up overpaying Bey in a year.

But those picks are 5 and 7 years out, so they don't align with Cade's timeline because Cade will be beyond team control before either of those picks provide anything on court. We've got 3 players who might be solid starters or better on a competitive team: Cade, Bey and Stewart. The rest of the roster is decent vets who belong on the bench, and unproven youngsters in various stages of development. I have high hopes for Ivey, but I once had hopes for Hayes too.

I think the Pistons getting back in the playoffs in 3 years is a realistic goal. We've been in the wilderness for more than a decade, and trading away 2 of your 3 best players for picks that won't play with anyone currently on your roster is a treadmill-in-the-lottery move. Treadmilling as a lottery team pretty much guarantees losing Cade eventually. You don't make that trade even if it makes sense from an ROI perspective.

I didn't provide much detail but my thinking is that they may never use the picks but having 2 unprotected 1sts (and cap space from not signing mediocre guys) is a good start for a future package if they see someone become available in the next 24 months for whatever reason (maybe Siakam gets squeezed out or some other player who would end up being an upgrade over Bey/ Stewart).

Taking on draft picks/prospects for bad contracts is something I, and a lot of other Pistons posters, have wanted to see more of. However, I don't think that moving starters on cheap rookie contracts makes sense because you're not creating enough space anyway. It makes more sense to trade vets Olynyk/Burks/kemba/noel/Cojo -- or just use the cap space we get when they expire. Also, to fit with Cade's timeline, any targets should be under 25, and Detroit just doesn't have enough assets to be thinking about consolidating them to get a star (we are a lottery team).

Also, GM Weaver has a clear pattern of using room when he has a specific move in mind, rather than creating it and waiting for an opportunity. Good example: he held on to Grant last TDL, then flipped him for a TPE, and then used that TPE within hours to get the lottery pick that became Duren.

[DoItALL9]

Westbrook and two firsts

For

Caruso, Ball, and Vucevic

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[Texas Chuck]

Westbrook and two firsts

For

Caruso, Ball, and Vucevic

Sent from my LM-G710 using RealGM mobile app

The problem is its hard for the Lakers to protect those picks while ensuring the Bulls get both of them. Because obviously a hurt guy, an expiring center, and a role player that LA passed on paying isn't likely a package they give up 2 unprotected picks to get back.

I'm also not seeing Chicago punt on this season yet, but I think the bigger issue is its hard to get value dialed in.

[DoItALL9]

Westbrook and two firsts

For

Caruso, Ball, and Vucevic

Sent from my LM-G710 using RealGM mobile app

The problem is its hard for the Lakers to protect those picks while ensuring the Bulls get both of them. Because obviously a hurt guy, an expiring center, and a role player that LA passed on paying isn't likely a package they give up 2 unprotected picks to get back.

I'm also not seeing Chicago punt on this season yet, but I think the bigger issue is its hard to get value dialed in.

That's fair, Maybe only one unprotected pick.

Or, the Lakers give two lottery protected picks that turn to seconds or extinguish if they don't have those seconds anymore already (I didn't check).

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[cgf]

Just gunna throw out (again) Randle for Crowder + Saric:

Paul | Payne
Booker | Shamet | Lee
Bridges | Craig
Randle | Johnson
Ayton | Biyombo

Brunson | Quickley | Rose
Grimes | Rose | Fournier
Barrett | Reddish | Fournier
Crowder | Toppin
Robinson | Hartenstein
+
McBride (PG), Hunt (F), Sims (C)


or Randle + Rose (+ Reddish?) for Crowder + Saric + Shamet + protected FRP (+ Craig?):

Paul | Payne
Booker | Rose | Lee
Bridges | Craig/Reddish
Randle | Johnson
Ayton | Biyombo

Brunson | Quickley
Grimes | Fournier | Shamet
Barrett | Fournier | Craig/Reddish
Crowder | Toppin
Robinson | Hartenstein
+
McBride (PG), Hunt (F), Sims (C)


Don't think our FO would actually go for the option with Rose involved, but I do think it would make Phoenix's starting lineup harder to defend without getting much worse defensively & give their bench the creation that it currently lacks.

While also being a good long-term move for us that gives Toppin more of a role and a more established / consistent defender to learn from...probably also bolsters our draft pick by a handful of spots.


EDIT:
Maybe Randle + Fournier for Crowder + Craig + Saric + Shamet, or would we owe a protected pick in this version...assuming Julius doesn't bounce back to his MIP-form?

Paul | Payne
Booker | Lee
Bridges | Fournier
Randle | Johnson
Ayton | Biyombo

Brunson | Quickley
Grimes | Rose | Shamet
Barrett | Reddish | Craig
Crowder | Toppin
Robinson | Hartenstein
+
McBride (PG), Hunt (F), Sims (C)

[babyjax13]

Jazz just signed Cody Zeller. I think the Westbrook trade is coming, if it is a full year contract, it does not make sense to sign someone with our roster crunch.

[cgf]

Jazz just signed Cody Zeller. I think the Westbrook trade is coming, if it is a full year contract, it does not make sense to sign someone with our roster crunch.

They can't use Sexton or Markannen in a Russ trade, right? So it would have to be some combination of Clarkson, Conley, Beasley, Bogey, & Gay?

[Scoot McGroot]

Jazz just signed Cody Zeller. I think the Westbrook trade is coming, if it is a full year contract, it does not make sense to sign someone with our roster crunch.

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Just a camp deal. They had 2 camp spots to fill. I don’t think it impacts a possible Russ deal in any way. Indy held off on signing anyone and just signed their camp contracts (and 2nd rounder) on Friday.

Jazz just signed Cody Zeller. I think the Westbrook trade is coming, if it is a full year contract, it does not make sense to sign someone with our roster crunch.

They can't use Sexton or Markannen in a Russ trade, right? So it would have to be some combination of Clarkson, Conley, Beasley, Bogey, & Gay?

They can’t trade Sexton until December 15. Markkanen can’t be aggregated for 2 months from the Mitchell trade, but he can be traded by himself anytime.

[Resistance]

Jazz just signed Cody Zeller. I think the Westbrook trade is coming, if it is a full year contract, it does not make sense to sign someone with our roster crunch.

They can't use Sexton or Markannen in a Russ trade, right? So it would have to be some combination of Clarkson, Conley, Beasley, Bogey, & Gay?

It depends on when the trade will be done and how it will be structured.

Markkanen was recently traded, so it will be a while until he can be aggregated/consolidated/packaged in a large trade. If the trade can be structured so that a trade of Markkanen can stand by itself, then he can go out in what appears to be a large trade when it is actually multiple trades done together from the Utah POV.

Sexton has a new contract, so it will be a while before he can be traded whether in a package or as a standalone entity.

Makkanen

Aggregate Trade Restriction: This player cannot be traded with other players until Nov 03, 2022.


Sexton

Trade Restriction: This player cannot be traded until Dec 15, 2022.


85. What is the Traded Player exception?

It is important to view a trade separately from each team's perspective, rather than as a single, unified transaction. This is because the same trade may be organized differently according to each team's needs. For example, a trade might be classified as a simultaneous trade from one team's perspective, but from the other team's perspective it's actually broken into two separate trades, one simultaneous and the other non-simultaneous, completing a trade they started months earlier.

[jayu70]

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[MoneyTalks41890]

And here.... we... go...

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[Scoot McGroot]

And here.... we... go...

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Yeah. An eventual return in one year seemed pretty untenable. For a rich dude, it wouldn’t be nearly the type of fun he’d want it to be, especially since he’s had his crap hauled out into public once, already.

[HornetJail]

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out of all the backup PGs still out there, wasn't expecting Dennis Smith to be the one we picked...

[Texas Chuck]

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out of all the backup PGs still out there, wasn't expecting Dennis Smith to be the one we picked...

Is this a gtd deal? Or just a camp deal? But went to NC State so maybe just hoping it interests a couple fans? IDK? He seems like a good dude, just not sure he's really an NBA player. He certainly wasn't good in Dallas.

[HornetJail]

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out of all the backup PGs still out there, wasn't expecting Dennis Smith to be the one we picked...

Is this a gtd deal? Or just a camp deal? But went to NC State so maybe just hoping it interests a couple fans? IDK? He seems like a good dude, just not sure he's really an NBA player. He certainly wasn't good in Dallas.

i read it was not guaranteed

which probably doesn't matter much without another signing, because Smith is the only other PG on the entire roster aside from LaMelo.

[zimpy27]

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The guy is crucial to the Bulls success.. hopefully he gets back by the end of the year

[zimpy27]

Bulls can't really tank the season either with their top 4 protected FRP owned by Magic. I feel like they're just going to lock in to this team that were 19-22 without Lonzo last season.