Isaiah Livers Appreciation Thread

[hippesthippo]

Just wanna put this out there:

Livers was a legit talent at Michigan when he was healthy. He's got big wing size [6'7", 230lbs], and his shot is pure [.465 fg, .412 3pt, .856 ft in 119 college games], [.456 fg, .422 3pt, .857 ft in 19 NBA games].

He play's with effort and communication on defense, where he looks like a smart off-ball defender. He isn't going to be locking down point guards, but he may end up being the Pistons best defensive option at Forward. On offense he's a knock-down shooter off the catch and he's also shown he can post-up smaller defenders on the switch. His face-up and off-the-dribble game are purely hypothetical, but if his handle improves incrementally he should at least be able to finish straight line drives off of close-outs.

I'm a fan of Livers and believe he's ready for a bit of a breakout next year. He averaged 20 minutes in the few games he played last year. I can easily see that number going up to 24-28 minutes this year backing up Bojan and Bey at PF/SF.

The only way I see him getting fewer minutes is if Duren ends up proving he's ready earlier than most believe and Casey gives too many minutes to Stewart/Bagley at PF.

Prediction: 24mpg, 10pts, 4.5r, 1.5a, .7s, .5b, 1.5threes



Any other members of the Livers fan club?

[Kilo]

Bojan acquisition probably impacts Livers minutes the most. I see him out of the rotation until post-TDL, barring injuries.

[edmunder_prc]

Yeah - I've been on the Livers to PF hype train for a while. He put the ball on the floor a few times that looked great.

He's Bogdan, but 10 years younger, better defense (man and team), although his shooting is good its not Bogdan excellent. But who knows, give him 25 minutes a game, it might be excellent. Plus some assists, highlight blocks, a dunk or two.

Much rather see Livers than Bagley on the floor.

Way too many SF/PF on the roster that need minutes - either vets to showcase for trades (BoJan) or guys like Diallo, Livers, Knox, Bagley that all need minutes to improve or figure out if they need to be here going forward. Plus Bey who will play 30+ minutes every game - that guy is tough.

[theBigLip]

Usually a thread title like this means the player was just traded - you scared me

Livers is good. He would have been a FRP if he had been healthy. He’s going to get significant minutes this year. He’s too good to keep off the court.

[zeebneeb]

Livers might be the answer to the teams starting lineup issue by being a knockdown three point shooter, and a lob threat. A combo of Bagley and Stewart.

Casey has a hell of a job ahead of his this season, trying to juggle playing time for all these guys.

[tmorgan]

Although they aren’t the same size and don’t have the same strengths, picking up Bojan (not Bogdan, c’mon people) makes the overpriced Bagley signing all the more frustrating to me. Yeah, I know, he’s an expiring and much, much older, but this is supposed to be a developmental year, and Livers is near the very top of the list of players I want to see “developing”. That’s gonna be hard if we’re playing Bojan, Bagley and Bey serious minutes.

I suppose Bags can get some time at center (but yuuuuck), but Livers is still likely to play less than I’d like.

[bstein14]

He's a very high IQ player that makes the right plays for his teammates. As I mentioned in the summer league thread, he was showing more athleticism than I saw from him as a rookie and appears to be fully ready to do this year after a long rehab. I think he is a player that could take a big jump for sure, but as others have mentioned he might be the guy that gets his minutes limited the most with the recent trade. I still think he's at least a 16 MPG backup for us, and hopefully more. When factoring in defense, you can easily say his impact is close to that of Bey out there even if he isn't the volume scorer that Bey appears to be on track to be.

[flow]

I get the Livers love and all, being that we're in Michigan.

But why are we making an appreciation thread for someone who has yet to do anything as a pro?

[vege]

Livers and Bey could learn a lot from Bojan, I could see them being our starters in the future. I love Livers, I expect him to be Bullock 2.0

[MotownMadness]

I thought he got cut or something lol

[Snakebites]

Yeah, there's always been a percentage of Piston fans who are really proponents of this guy. I saw a spot in the rotation for him- Jerami was gone and there wasn't an obvious fill for the minutes he would leave behind- but that's now filled by Bojan- at least for next season.

[FloridaMan78]

Livers should still get 20 mins a night.

Bey (32) Livers (16)
Bojan (32) Bagley (12) Livers (4)
Stewart (25) Bagley (13) Duren (10)

Noel might get Duren’s mins until he’s ready. Diallo should be traded.

[Manocad]

The only way I’d see Livers’ minutes being a problem, I.e. he plays well enough that he should play more, is if EVERYBODY in the F/C roles is playing well, and EVERY game. And quite frankly, that is by no means a problem.

[bstein14]

The only way I’d see Livers’ minutes being a problem, I.e. he plays well enough that he should play more, is if EVERYBODY in the F/C roles is playing well, and EVERY game. And quite frankly, that is by no means a problem.

You can tell Casey also really likes Livers because Livers understands how to play winning basketball.... I think Livers is pretty locked into being in the 10 man rotation. Pistons beat writer mentioned earlier this offseason that he thoughts Burks or Livers would start because Weaver/Casey wanted another shooter in the lineup with Cade/Ivey.

[FloridaMan78]

The only way I’d see Livers’ minutes being a problem, I.e. he plays well enough that he should play more, is if EVERYBODY in the F/C roles is playing well, and EVERY game. And quite frankly, that is by no means a problem.

You can tell Casey also really likes Livers because Livers understands how to play winning basketball.... I think Livers is pretty locked into being in the 10 man rotation. Pistons beat writer mentioned earlier this offseason that he thoughts Burks or Livers would start because Weaver/Casey wanted another shooter in the lineup with Cade/Ivey.

With really good depth at the 3/4/5 it should mean no three guard line ups. No Diallo. No Knox. Unless there’s injuries.

[edmunder_prc]

The only way I’d see Livers’ minutes being a problem, I.e. he plays well enough that he should play more, is if EVERYBODY in the F/C roles is playing well, and EVERY game. And quite frankly, that is by no means a problem.

You can tell Casey also really likes Livers because Livers understands how to play winning basketball.... I think Livers is pretty locked into being in the 10 man rotation. Pistons beat writer mentioned earlier this offseason that he thoughts Burks or Livers would start because Weaver/Casey wanted another shooter in the lineup with Cade/Ivey.

With really good depth at the 3/4/5 it should mean no three guard line ups. No Diallo. No Knox. Unless there’s injuries.

Diallo becomes even better than last year with more shooters on the floor with him.

Cade/Burks/Diallo/Livers or Bey or Bojan/Stewart

No Diallo minutes is a crime like no Livers minutes.

[FloridaMan78]

You can tell Casey also really likes Livers because Livers understands how to play winning basketball.... I think Livers is pretty locked into being in the 10 man rotation. Pistons beat writer mentioned earlier this offseason that he thoughts Burks or Livers would start because Weaver/Casey wanted another shooter in the lineup with Cade/Ivey.

With really good depth at the 3/4/5 it should mean no three guard line ups. No Diallo. No Knox. Unless there’s injuries.

Diallo becomes even better than last year with more shooters on the floor with him.

Cade/Burks/Diallo/Livers or Bey or Bojan/Stewart

No Diallo minutes is a crime like no Livers minutes.

Someone has to be shutout. You don’t play 11 players. And if they start competing for a play in they cut it to a 9 man rotation.

You have to pick one. Diallo or Livers. Bojan is getting 30+ Bey 30 +

[hippesthippo]

Yeah, I've never been a huge Diallo fan. He's one guy I see playing less this year. I'd rather see the Cade or Ivey with the ball and Hamidou has always been a black hole.

As for the the title, I suppose maybe "appreciation," was the wrong word.

I know a lot of people think the Bojan trade cuts Livers out of the rotation, but I just can't see that. There's plenty of playing time for both, just like Stewart still got minutes after we signed and traded for 5 other centers.

[Uncle Mxy]

You have to pick one. Diallo or Livers. Bojan is getting 30+ Bey 30 +

Obviously, you pick Kevin Knox and trade both Diallo and Livers.

Seriously, Bey isn't so obvious to me. Sure, he'll get minutes at the start, but he better raise his game up a notch to keep them. A league-average volume 3P shooter who's below average defensively? Livers might quickly surpass him. We'll see. Diallo is a change-of-pace Microwave backup wing. I'd rather keep him around than Bey, at the moment. I'd like Bey's play to prove me wrong.

[zeebneeb]

If Diallo had a consistent shot, and tighter handles, he would be an all-star. As it stands, I don't see how he gets minutes on this current team, and I expect him to be moved in short order.

I mean, who does he backup? No chance at the 2 guard, or PG slot, and Livers due to his defense, and shooting will/should get the minutes at SF/PF off the bench.

I just don't see it.