Stalwart wrote:tsherkin wrote:He was asked to play a role which made sense based on the other talent on the roster. Why do you make this sound like a profound thing? It was alarmingly obvious that both Lebron and Wade were better-suited to carrying the offense than Bosh, particularly come the playoffs.
Maybe you didn't read what Chris Bosh actually said so let me post it again:
"But, I’d say just getting used to being uncomfortable took… a season and a half to fit into my rolling in. Even after that I had to get used to things changing.”"It was one of those things where I constantly had to reinvent myself."He wasn't asked to play a role that best suited the other talent. He was asked to constantly change the role he played. And he was asked to do that in order to specifically suit Lebron James. Instead of playing to and utilizing his strengths as a basketball player he was asked to constantly reinvent himself. He had to morph. He had to be uncomfortable.
Is the goal of basketball to not adapt next to players better at your primary skills, or is it to win a championship.
Why do you think this was unique to Bosh. Lebron had to adapt immensely. Developed a post-game, developed his shooting, developed his off-ball game. Lebron changes his approach on every team for every circumstance, but you are not lamenting how “uncomfortable” that must make him.
Yeah, he had to learn to be good at defence. Everyone should.
Yeah, he had to learn to shoot threes. In the modern league, everyone should. Grant and Pippen would have needed to as well, but they played in the 1990s, not the 2010s.
He had to evolve… because that is how they won two championships. Time and time again you pretend Jordan would never force anyone to adapt. How. How do you think Jordan would have no impact on Wade or Bosh. It is completely disconnected from reality, but of course so far you have shown absolutely zero inclination to engage with that hypothetical. Grant and Pippen grew around Jordan. From the beginning, their entire games were structured around him. How did Jordan work to accommodate them. Learn the triangle? Focus more on fourth quarter scoring? Such sacrifice.
Jordan never needed to adapt to playing next to legitimately high volume scorers. He never needed to adapt to playing with bad defenders. He never needed to adapt to deal with terrible spacing relative to other teams. The only marginally valid point here is that he does take less away from lead creators…
because he is an underwhelming lead creator. What other player gets coddled like this and then praised for that coddling.
Is it any wonder why a player like Chris Bosh and Kevin Love eventually lost the ability to produce consistently and reliably on the offensive end? And by "offensive end" Im not referring to raw PPG. Im talking about being able to produce points, rebounds, and finish plays on a consistent and reliable basis independent of Lebron. Like when he goes to the bench or gets leg cramps.
Any real numbers here, or just more invented narrative.
Wade also had to adapt to Lebron in order to make him feel comfortable:
“Taking a step back to ‘Bron, that was the toughest part for me at the time,” Wade told Michael Lee of The Athletic. “Obviously, before my injuries, I was a bad boy. It was my city, my team. (If) we win the Finals that year (in 2011), I’m arguably Finals MVP. I didn’t need to… but we got two out of the next three championships and I’d still do it all over again.”
“I just felt, sitting back, watching the way he played and playing against him for so long, he wasn’t as comfortable as he needed to be,” Wade continued. “And it was too much of him looking over his shoulder or looking at me. He wasn’t just playing. It wasn’t clear mind. He was always thinking about me or looking for me and I just wanted him to be play and allow him to be great.”
The only reason Wade had to take a step back was because Lebron was uncomfortable and flamed out in the 2011 Finals. Why does everyone have to change, adapt, and reinvent themselves when playing next to Lebron?
Because it cost them a title, and then with a declining Wade they won the next two titles. Such a mystery!
Players don't have to do that when they play next to Kobe.
Based on what.
Or Jordan.
Based on what, he played with the same co-star his entire career and only had specialists past that.
Or Wade.
Bruh.
Wade was the reason the Heat struggled so badly to fit. Which two of the trio had to learn to shoot? Which two had to learn to fundamentally change their off-ball game? It was not Wade!
If it were not already obvious that you were incapable of any honest assessment on these players, this would make it undeniable. Wade’s “sacrifice” was recognising Lebron needed to lead the team by virtue of being a better player. Imagine if Pippen complained about Jordan taking away his primacy after returning from retirement.
Or Steph.
Again, Steph’s team collapses without him, so by your own standards, he is actually bad for teammates.
Or KD.
Lol everyone in Golden State worked to accommodate him. In Brooklyn, Harden scaled back his scoring to accommodate him — and oh wow, it seems he has since become a worse player, what did Durant do to him.
Again, when it comes to Lebron James its high floor, low ceiling(relatively speaking).
Relative to what. Kobe winning three titles next to Shaq? You sincerely think that would be an issue for Lebron? Do you think Lebron would have a hard time winning with Klay and Durant?
The reason his teams have a low ceiling is because his all star teammates have to adjust, change, and reinvent themselves.
Because that is what usually happens when you pair up random scoring stars. Which, again, Jordan never had to do.
Jordan has a lower floor than Lebron James but he has a much higher ceiling due to his diverse skillset, adaptability, and portability as a player. And its that higher ceiling that brings you championships.
Ceiling to what? Jordan had a top ten player next to him for a decade, a top three coach, an elite supporting cast, a worse league, and consistently worse opposition. Yeah, he won more titles — when Lebron had anything close to the same, so did he.
Why do we continue to praise Jordan for having the perfect set-up? Imagine if the Cavaliers had drafted clones of Manu and Al Horford in 2006, and then hired Popovich — oh, and ensured they never encountered any team with an 8 SRS or higher. That is as a base analogy for the situation in which Jordan won his six.
