It’ll be interesting to see how Turner responds next season

[Wizop]

I'd like to see what the max numbers we could offer RIGHT NOW would be just to have a sense of what he may be gambling against. Has there been any reporting about whether we've actually offered an extension or where that stands?

I think a regular extension would be limited to a 20% bump in year one which would be 21+m. there would be annual raises from there. since we are under the cap there is a renegotiation option which may only be limited by the max rule although it may also be limited by our available cap space - it could also be front loaded.

[boomershadow]

New article on the Athletic: LINK, but there's a paywall

So, what's Kravitz's deal? I feel like he's really the one pushing the Turner has to be traded narrative.

heading into his eighth season, both sides have made it clear the relationship is not going to last.

Is he a mouthpiece for management? Is he just making an educated guess? It just seems like he's continuously beating this drum and while stories about Turner getting traded crop up here and there...have they always been from Kravitz and I just wasn't noticing?

Among reporters that cover the Pacers, he might be the most "have to produce content of some sort" and there's nothing that drives clicks the way trade rumors do. He might also just be noticing that we have too many centers lol.

[Scoot McGroot]

New article on the Athletic: LINK, but there's a paywall

So, what's Kravitz's deal? I feel like he's really the one pushing the Turner has to be traded narrative.

heading into his eighth season, both sides have made it clear the relationship is not going to last.

Is he a mouthpiece for management? Is he just making an educated guess? It just seems like he's continuously beating this drum and while stories about Turner getting traded crop up here and there...have they always been from Kravitz and I just wasn't noticing?

Among reporters that cover the Pacers, he might be the most "have to produce content of some sort" and there's nothing that drives clicks the way trade rumors do. He might also just be noticing that we have too many centers lol.

Kravitz is only writing on the Pacers because he has to in order to keep receiving his paycheck from the Athletic. He was hired on as a columnist, and survived the huge layoff/purge, but had to provide something more on a daily basis. They laid off Scott Agness to save his paycheck, and have since focused on NFL with 2! Colts beat writers, so Bob had to do SOMETHING. He’s never really covered the Pacers at all and he hasn’t been a beat writer for over 20 years since he moved to Indy from Denver.

He might be right. Or he might be writing from a columnist perspective, and not a beat writer that has sources to double prove a report like this. He’s probably writing an “I think” instead of “I know”.

[Wizop]

focused on NFL with 2! Colts beat writers

Bob also writes Colts pieces so really they have 3 guys following the Colts and no one other than the national guys doing the Pacers, IU, Purdue, or ND. I was going to cancel my membership but when I started down that road their site offered me a don't leave promo that was too good to refuse.

[Wizop]

Is Turner worth less than Herron?

Read on Twitter

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[Topofthekey]

Is Turner worth less than Herron?

Read on Twitter

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Sent from my Pixel 6 using RealGM mobile app

How come Turner's extension with Pacers is limited to only $97m but Heat get to extend Herro at that amount?

[DNP-Old]

How come Turner's extension with Pacers is limited to only $97m but Heat get to extend Herro at that amount?

From cbabreakdown.com:

Extentions of Rookie Scale Contracts —

Any Rookie Scale Contract can be extended during the off-season before the rookie’s fourth year in the league (i.e., July 1 to the day before the regular season).

Regular Extensions —

A regular extension of a Rookie Scale Contract may add up to 4 new years to the player’s contract (for a total of 5 years when the remaining year is included, as these contracts can only be extended just before the fourth year of the contract, between the end of the moratorium period in July through the day before the regular season season starts).

The player’s salary in the first year of the extended term can be any amount up to his applicable maximum annual salary. Salary may increase (or decrease) in the extended term by up to 8% (instead of 5%) of the salary in the first year of the extension.


Extentions of Veteran Contracts —

Regular Extensions — Unless a veteran’s contract is going to be extended during the last season of his contract, the extension can only be negotiated and entered into during the off-season (i.e., July 1 to the day before the regular season).

A regular extension of a veteran’s contract may cover 5 years (including the years remaining on the original contract when the extension is signed).

The player’s salary in the first year of the extension may be up to the greater of: (i) 120% of the player’s salary in the last year of the original contract, and (ii) 120% of the estimated average player salary in the year the extension is signed. Salary may increase (or decrease) in the extended term by up to 8% (instead of 5%) of the salary in the first year of the extension.

[Topofthekey]

So if Turner extends, the maximum value of the first year of his new contract is 120% x $18m = $21.6m

But as a free agent, the maximum would be 30% of the salary cap which is projected to be $134m, so 30% x $134m = $40.2m

So extension = $21.6m + 8% annual increments

Free agent = $40.2m + 8% annual increments

That is a huge difference

[Scoot McGroot]

So if Turner extends, the maximum value of the first year of his new contract is 120% x $18m = $21.6m

But as a free agent, the maximum would be 30% of the salary cap which is projected to be $134m, so 30% x $134m = $40.2m

So extension = $21.6m + 8% annual increments

Free agent = $40.2m + 8% annual increments

That is a huge difference

Yes. This is what some of us have been saying for awhile. Going back in time, similar extension limitations existed for Victor Oladipo and Lance Stephenson (the very first time around, before he signed in Charlotte), too.

However, Indy is in a unique position where they can utilize a "Renegotiate and extension" for Myles Turner. We could use our existing cap space to renegotiate his salary this year anywhere up to the maximum salary for him, and then extend him based off of that number, so the 20% raise wouldn't be an issue. We could also renegotiate this year's salary up to his maximum, and then drop next year's salary down up to 40% from whatever we renegotiate up to.

[Scoot McGroot]

Is Turner worth less than Herron?


How come Turner's extension with Pacers is limited to only $97m but Heat get to extend Herro at that amount?

As DNP-OLD pointed out, 1st round rookie contracts specifically operate under a unique situation in the CBA as to extensions.

[Wizop]

Is Turner worth less than Herron?


How come Turner's extension with Pacers is limited to only $97m but Heat get to extend Herro at that amount?

As DNP-OLD pointed out, 1st round rookie contracts specifically operate under a unique situation in the CBA as to extensions.

but if Turner thinks he could get Herro money next summer, he's not signing an extension now. however, perhaps if this sets the market, he could bargain for a renegotiated extension in this range.

[Scoot McGroot]

As DNP-OLD pointed out, 1st round rookie contracts specifically operate under a unique situation in the CBA as to extensions.

but if Turner thinks he could get Herro money next summer, he's not signing an extension now. however, perhaps if this sets the market, he could bargain for a renegotiated extension in this range.

Sure. Important to point out though that Herro's rookie contract extension will start at 20% of the salary cap, which was almost exactly what Myles Turner's current contract was extended as. So, in theory, Herro's deal is almost exactly the same as Turner's deal, just inflation adjusted.

Keep that in mind, as the salary cap jumped 10% this year, is expected to jump another 10% next year, and may have a huge jump again with the inevitable new CBA starting in 2025 (with both sides having an early opt out ability after this season).

[Topofthekey]

Yea, people have been saying that Turner can potentially get more money signing a new contract as a free agent vs extending his current contract with Pacers, but to see it in simple numbers like this ($21.6m + 8% increments vs $40.2m + 8% increments) really highlights how big a difference it is

[basketballwacko2]

Yea, people have been saying that Turner can potentially get more money signing a new contract as a free agent vs extending his current contract with Pacers, but to see it in simple numbers like this ($21.6m + 8% increments vs $40.2m + 8% increments) really highlights how big a difference it is

Well unless he comes out and looks like Rudy Gobert he's not getting $40 million from anyone, and the 8% raise is only if he signs with us if I'm not mistaken, say he signs with Charlotte he'd be limited to 5% raises and a 4 year deal.

I'd like to know if he and the Pacers are considering a renegotiate and extend and how much we could give him, and "would" give him.

I think there is a cutoff for it but don't know when that is.

[Pacers Forever]

Personally I think anything over 25,000 a year for Turner is too much for his skill set. His career stats are as follows:

Games played per season
60, 81, 65, 74, 62, 47, 42 not a good trend and not durable compared to other centers

Minutes per game
23, 31, 28, 28, 29, 31, 29 —-14th of top centers last season

FG made - FG attempted career average
5-10 for 49% from the field which shows his lack of easy buckets at the rim because his inside game sucks offensively which usually pushes big men’s % higher.

3 pt % career
1 make every 2.5 shots for 35% not bad

FT % career
77% not horrible

Rebounding career
Offensive 1.5 per game —WEAK Again leads to his low shooting % and lack of scoring in paint.

Defensive 5.5 per game - WEAK for his height and position

Total rebounds 7 per game - too low for a dominant starting center position Sabonis has 2 rebounds more Turner was 29th in rebounds last season among centers and that SUCKS

Assists career average
1- appears low to me again by his lack of involvement in offensive sets Sabonis has 2 more assists per
Turner is 42nd among centers last season that SUCKS

Steals career average
1- seems ok

Block career average
2.3- has modeled his game around this which is effective certain times but detracts from being an all around better defender and player
Turner #1 among centers last season great but can’t be 1 dimensional

Turnover career average
1- Great but I think partially it’s low because he doesn’t get involved enough in offensive sets

Fouls career average
3- doesn’t play nearly aggressive enough underneath but does play under control. Needs to be more physical and own the paint offensively and defensively

Points per game career average
13- a bit too low for a veteran starting center tied for 19th highest scoring centers with LaMarcus Aldridge

Player efficiency rating
Well folks you have to play 70% of teams games to qualify which Myles hasn’t done the last 2 seasons. Thus a scary trend.

In summary I can’t pay him Superstar money based on his career stats and recent inability to stay healthy. He’s missing too many games leaving us reliant on backups, his rebounding is weak for his size and position, I think his body needs strengthening to defend the center position more physically and to ward off possible minor injuries, offensive game needs interior improvement, and weak assists because of not being aggressive in offensive sets. I’d rather look for a lower cost center and pay bigger money to a well rounded Superstar player.

When I classify Turner’s potential salary as Superstar money I get it that salaries are on the rise. I just don’t think his game warrants it if you compare a 30-40,000 a year player to him. I also think the monetary gap between him and a manageable center 25,000 to 10,000 a year for example is not worth the extra $15,000 per season.

[Topofthekey]

Thing is though, $10m per year probably gets you the Mason Plumlees of the league

We'll then be like the Hornets fanbase, complaining about how much our C sucks, and wondering why some other team won't trade us a Myles Turner for our spare change

[8305]

Yea, people have been saying that Turner can potentially get more money signing a new contract as a free agent vs extending his current contract with Pacers, but to see it in simple numbers like this ($21.6m + 8% increments vs $40.2m + 8% increments) really highlights how big a difference it is

Well unless he comes out and looks like Rudy Gobert he's not getting $40 million from anyone, and the 8% raise is only if he signs with us if I'm not mistaken, say he signs with Charlotte he'd be limited to 5% raises and a 4 year deal.

I'd like to know if he and the Pacers are considering a renegotiate and extend and how much we could give him, and "would" give him.

I think there is a cutoff for it but don't know when that is.

I wonder if the Pacers are that excited about resigning him? I haven’t seen where any executive in the Pacers organization has come out and said we want to extend Myles. Given his injury history and the young bigs behind him does it make that much sense even at the lower salary? Today if we could get LA’s 27 pick unprotected and Westbrook for Hield and Turner I’d do it. Frankly it’s the best offer I’ve seen.

[Tom White]

We'll then be like the Hornets fanbase, complaining about how much our C sucks.....

Doesn't a good bit of the Pacers fanbase do this already?

[Wizop]

Personally I think anything over 25,000 a year for Turner is too much for his skill set.

you have to think in terms of percentage of the cap. what 25mm bought you 4 years ago will not buy you the same player next summer.

[Scoot McGroot]

Yea, people have been saying that Turner can potentially get more money signing a new contract as a free agent vs extending his current contract with Pacers, but to see it in simple numbers like this ($21.6m + 8% increments vs $40.2m + 8% increments) really highlights how big a difference it is

Well unless he comes out and looks like Rudy Gobert he's not getting $40 million from anyone, and the 8% raise is only if he signs with us if I'm not mistaken, say he signs with Charlotte he'd be limited to 5% raises and a 4 year deal.

I'd like to know if he and the Pacers are considering a renegotiate and extend and how much we could give him, and "would" give him.

I think there is a cutoff for it but don't know when that is.

I wonder if the Pacers are that excited about resigning him? I haven’t seen where any executive in the Pacers organization has come out and said we want to extend Myles. Given his injury history and the young bigs behind him does it make that much sense even at the lower salary? Today if we could get LA’s 27 pick unprotected and Westbrook for Hield and Turner I’d do it. Frankly it’s the best offer I’ve seen.

The organization has talked broadly, but not specifically, of how they’d love to keep Turner long term.

In terms of trade, the Lakers previously offered the unprotected 2027 first and a couple 2nds, I believe, so I imagine the front office would want at least that.

And with Russ already burning bridges on the court last light, they might be looking at giving up 2 1sts. Maybe one is too 4 protected or something, but I think they’ll eventually give up 2 1sts.