2023 NBA Draft Thread

[Ducklett]

21-51- season ( year 1)
20-62 season ( year 2)
0-5 season ( ongoing season 3).

You discredit first year of rebuild because "old players were there" . Well they hardly there.
Gordon played 25 games. Vuc 44 , Evan 26, Fultz 8, Isaac 0. And yet that was supposed to be starting 5.


Literally nobody but Dwayne Bacon played more than 48 games. It was clear tank effort mid season.

It's not about "winning". It's about zero desire to compete.
You won't just collect some imaginary Victor/Scoot/ & Franz and Banchero, flip the switch and win 45 games next year. That type of thing happend literally once in history, with OKC and 3 HOF rookies. And yet ,even that team never won anything due financial difficulities of having 3 max contracts and trying to build contender .

This is complete and utter bull*** and let me tell you execlly why and why 2020-2021 is first Magic tank year.

Season starts at december 23rd, 2020 ( delayed schedule post covid since 2019-20 season ended mid October).

Jonathan Isaac is already hurt and out for a year ( bubble ACL tear)
Fultz tears his ACL in 8th game.

9th game of regular season and Magic rotation 5, at January 8th, 2021 is:
PG: rookie Cole Anthony
SG: Tyler Ennis ( out of nba after Magic)
SF: Dwayna Bacon ( out of nba after Magic)
PF: Clark ( out of nba after Magic)
C: Vuc

Bench: own bust Bamba, Ross, Mane and Bone 5 out of 9 players are complete fillers. But there is kicker. 4 starters are "fillers".


Somwhere between January and February something happend.
Gordon goes in public and demands trade, he also said in throwaway line that he informed front office before he went in public.

Evan around start of that season for Franch media hints that he is not resigning with Orlando.

Vuc in exit interview says that him and Hammond & Weltman planned his exit.

So you get very clear picture that after Fultz domino fell, team geared up in tank mode and in matter of month and half- two months most, they removed old players. Mostly because those players expressed desire to leave. Diretlly to media, or silent or, via third media.

Therfore this is 3rd year of rebuild. Magic were pretending to be competitive for about 12 days of 2020-21 season.

You can spout all of the hindsight facts you want pepe, it doesn't change that you are making these proclamations after the fact with 100% perfect knowledge. This isn't the messaging of the team that year, who were excited to build off the "better" playoff run we had in the bubble and Vuc trying to be a repeat all-star etc.

Fact: We kept Steve Clifford in the off season instead of finding a "rebuild" coach because the plan was playoff again.
Fact: AG didn't ask to be moved until we were 14-28, well into the season after it was clear the team was trash.
Fact: The Magic started that season 6-2 and, until the Fultz injury, we were predicted to finish in the 4-6 seeds of the playoffs (simple google searches reveal this).

"Vucevic has thrived in the void left by all the injuries. So, the Magic standing pat at the deadline shouldn’t alarm anyone. The 6-2 start wasn’t a fluke, despite the wins coming mostly against struggling teams. They owe it to themselves to take their time determining the future." - Michael C. Wright, NBA.com Senior Writer

Among other takes and quotes from non-Magic sports writers and commentators that thought the Magic would be playoff bound if not for the injuries and expected the Magic to run it back.

[pepe1991]

LOL

"hindsight".

You don't need to fire coach to start rebuild. Hint: his name is Greg and he is 5 times nba champion. He is on rebuild team now.

We don't know when Gordon asked to be traded front office. We know when he said it in public after they didn't trade him on their own. He hinted he told them first.

Magic started with 6-2 record. Good. 19-63 76ers in 2013-14 started with 3-0. Actually on opening night they beat nba champions Heat. So... no tank there as well? Damn you Hinkie, you should have tanked it!


Who is Michael C wright and how is anything he says relevant? It's a team beatwriter , you know part of same PR media that lies how player broke his toe ?
Did any nba.com writer ever acknowledged tanking as part of any teams's strategy? No. They are regime media.
Let's see what nba.com says about Magic today. Any tank mention? Oh look...not at all, it's fluff how Magic have to take adventage of points in paint vs Hornets. And whole bunch of nothigness.


Season that didn't orginally started as rebuild year one, but after injuries AND trade requests it turned into season one of rebuild.
Case and point: 3rd worst record and as direct result- 5th overall pick in lottery . In other words- first year of rebuild already done.

Year two is last year and even worst 20-62 record.
And ongoing disaster of 0-5 season and 0 guards aveliable is year three.

What's there so hard to understand? Can't count to three?
It's like saying Nets didn't want to compete for title because they lost in first round. They did. But they lost. But that doesn't mean it doesn't count. Same as Magic. They went for playoffs, wheels fell off and season turned into rebuild year. Case closed.

[Knightro]

This is the 2023 Draft thread.

The Magic have two first round picks in the 2023 draft.

If you don’t like the fact this thread exists in October, don’t post in it.

Anyone who continues to post in this thread bemoaning tanking moving forward is going to get warned/temp banned.

Keep it on topic. Period.

[pepe1991]

This is the 2023 Draft thread.

The Magic have two first round picks in the 2023 draft.

If you don’t like the fact this thread exists in October, don’t post in it.

Anyone who continues to post in this thread bemoaning tanking moving forward is going to get warned/temp banned.

Keep it on topic. Period.

College season starts in 11 days.
G league season in 8 days.
And since this year is everything about Victor Wembanyama, he won't be playing nothing but Franch league because he decided to transfer from ASVEL to Metropolitans, who don't play nothing but French league.
Can't blame him, last year for him in Euroleague was nightmare experience as he shot 35% FG and averaged more fouls than FGA.


Let people talk about whatever until there is anything to be said about prospect who are yet to step foot on court?

[JBSouthpaw]

https://theathletic.com/3717627/2022/10/27/2023-nba-mock-draft-wembanyama-2/

Sam Vecenie's mock. Has it by predicted finishes, not by current standings.

7. Orlando Magic
Dariq Whitehead | 6-6 wing | 18 years old | Duke
Dariq Whitehead is the first of three Duke players featured highly on this mock, an aggressive, downhill attacking wing who will try to put one down on your head every time he enters the paint if it’s available. He’s also a pretty reliable shooter off the catch, and at 6-foot-6 with solid length, he has the tools and measurements to be a starting NBA wing. However, like Whitmore above him, Whitehead’s status for the start of the upcoming season is in question after he had surgery on his right foot in late August. Given how foot injuries can fester and knock off someone’s explosion by just a little bit here or there, or knock off the balance and rhythm of their jumper, it’ll be interesting to see how quickly Whitehead can recover and get back to 100 percent. If he gets there, he’s seen as a good chance to be a lottery pick.

14. Orlando Magic (via Chi)
Dereck Lively II | 7-1 center | 18 years old | Duke
Dereck Lively is one of those guys with whom scouts just feel very comfortable. He’s a 7-foot-1 center who is the best rim protector in the class due to his 7-foot-7 wingspan. That length also allows him to be one of the best rim runners in the class, as he has good hands and can catch the ball on the move. He moves his feet well enough to not be a liability in space even if you’re always going to run drop coverage with him, and he has long-term upside to shoot the ball. The only issue is that Lively is not a shot creator for himself at all, and teams have shown real reluctance in the last two years to spend significant draft capital on bigs who don’t really create their own shot. But Lively is a terrific, high-motor player who teams feel confident is a starting-caliber center in the NBA at some point.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

https://theathletic.com/3717627/2022/10/27/2023-nba-mock-draft-wembanyama-2/

Sam Vecenie's mock. Has it by predicted finishes, not by current standings.

7. Orlando Magic
Dariq Whitehead | 6-6 wing | 18 years old | Duke
Dariq Whitehead is the first of three Duke players featured highly on this mock, an aggressive, downhill attacking wing who will try to put one down on your head every time he enters the paint if it’s available. He’s also a pretty reliable shooter off the catch, and at 6-foot-6 with solid length, he has the tools and measurements to be a starting NBA wing. However, like Whitmore above him, Whitehead’s status for the start of the upcoming season is in question after he had surgery on his right foot in late August. Given how foot injuries can fester and knock off someone’s explosion by just a little bit here or there, or knock off the balance and rhythm of their jumper, it’ll be interesting to see how quickly Whitehead can recover and get back to 100 percent. If he gets there, he’s seen as a good chance to be a lottery pick.

14. Orlando Magic (via Chi)
Dereck Lively II | 7-1 center | 18 years old | Duke
Dereck Lively is one of those guys with whom scouts just feel very comfortable. He’s a 7-foot-1 center who is the best rim protector in the class due to his 7-foot-7 wingspan. That length also allows him to be one of the best rim runners in the class, as he has good hands and can catch the ball on the move. He moves his feet well enough to not be a liability in space even if you’re always going to run drop coverage with him, and he has long-term upside to shoot the ball. The only issue is that Lively is not a shot creator for himself at all, and teams have shown real reluctance in the last two years to spend significant draft capital on bigs who don’t really create their own shot. But Lively is a terrific, high-motor player who teams feel confident is a starting-caliber center in the NBA at some point.

this is my guy with that bulls pick.

Terquavion Smith | 6-4 guard | 19 years old | N.C. State
This goes to the Knicks from Dallas following the Kristaps Porziņģis trade. Terquavion Smith is as dynamic a pull-up scorer as you’ll find in the country. As a freshman last season in ACC play, he averaged 18.3 points and shot over 40 percent from 3 on nine attempts per game, many of which were of the pull-up variety. He’s a lethal shot creator from behind the arc and would have been a first-round pick in 2022 if he had stayed in the draft class. He needs to improve as a finisher at the rim, as he was one of the worst in the country statistically last season. He also could stand to improve a bit defensively. But Smith has real tools as a lightning athlete with real explosiveness in and out of his moves and is a weirdly impressive off-hand dunker who showcases some real finishing upside long term.

Watch on YouTube

[OrlMagic05]

Fruits of rebuild.
Mario Hezonja
Elfrid Payton
Aaron Gordon
One hour of Domas Sabonis
Gordon in Paul George wannbe teenage phase
JOnathan " MIA" Isaac
Fultz as reminder it could have been Maxey

Patience would make sense if Magic were contender in 2019 and now go through rough patch. Magic haven't been relevant in last 11 years. Kid that 11 years ago was in highschool now has own kids. Person who was in his 50s last time Magic were relevant probably already has grandkids and/or is planning his retirment.

You might enjoy empty calory stats of Banchero and watch him and Franz Wagner average 50% of all shots of a team while losing comfortablly against team that looks like it's toying with us. I really don't.
I didn't watch last year's last 20 games because i figured there is nothing new i could learn . Guess what? i was right.

Same this year. It is just yet another throwaway season. Enjoying process only makes sense if process is leading to something. This is nothing but aimless stumbling from year to year. What happends if they draft 6th or 7th this year ? Try 2024? Then 2025, then 2026? Because it's clear that THIS front office won't commit toward building basketball , competitive team in near future.

Then, why are you here?

Why you can't reply with objective arguments what's there to support instad of most childish reply possible ?

Unhealthy obsesssion with tanking is most anti sportsmenship behavior one fan can step into. You lierally watch games to cheer for opponents in hope more losing will lead toward better lottery position to draft "player" ( read: kid ) who is yet to shave for first time.
And you justfy proces of cheering against your team with " this young players put numbers ,therfore they "develop". No they don't. They just spend enough time on the floor to have enough balls bounce their way ( Rebounds!!) and pass around ball just enough to stumble to 3,4 "assists" by accident, and shoot just about 50% of all team's shots.
If that is name of "development" than Elfrid Payton second part of the season miracle triple doubles on awful teams would already developed him into Chris Paul. Spoiler alert, he was same player year in and year out because he kept playing on same, uncompetitive , bad teams, was never challenged as starter and never felt need to improve .

Franz Wagner looks identical, if not worst like he did last year. Why ? Well because team is actually somehow even worst than last year. He looked good/ great on Eurobasket because , for that competition, he had more talent around him, so mainly Schroder got out best of him.
Now Franz is "point forward" in role he has no business playing. He looks worst, His FG% is worst than last year, he shoots 20% for 3, he draws almost no fouls and to get 1,1 assist more, he averages 1,7 turnovers more. All advanced stats in dumpster.

Also let's not forget third member of "process ". Jalen Suggs. What if 2023 draft prospect turns into similar player to him. Somebody so green that you can't realisticlly depend on for couple of years at least? So you go back in 2024 lottery again? Than 2025. Than 2026.
And what happends if in that "process" Banchero or Wagner ask to be traded out of your mess since you are good for nothing but losing? You know, those players don't really have patience to waste their life, talent and health forever on awful teams.

Trae Young told Hawks after second year that he will ask trade if they don't get him actual basketball players.

Warnings have been given. I once again am asking you all very respectfully to keep it on topic.

We don't need posters to police other posters for being "too negative" once it's already been addressed by the mods. - Knightro

[Audi]

Question for everyone - are future firsts on a team like ours currently more valuable after the lottery or before? For instance - would our 2023 first bring more value as an unknown now than it would as, say, #5? Or, put another way, what #x pick value would you put on our pick pre-lottery?

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Question for everyone - are future firsts on a team like ours currently more valuable after the lottery or before? For instance - would our 2023 first bring more value as an unknown now than it would as, say, #5? Or, put another way, what #x pick value would you put on our pick pre-lottery?

I would imagine our 1st round picks for the next 2 year are pretty valuable and then after that it's TBD. We're a bad team with 3 bright spots, a mediocre PG rotation & a bench that's YMCA level once you get past 6th 7th man. In 2 years those issues should be fixed through the draft and in FA

[Audi]

https://theathletic.com/3717627/2022/10/27/2023-nba-mock-draft-wembanyama-2/

Sam Vecenie's mock. Has it by predicted finishes, not by current standings.

7. Orlando Magic
Dariq Whitehead | 6-6 wing | 18 years old | Duke
Dariq Whitehead is the first of three Duke players featured highly on this mock, an aggressive, downhill attacking wing who will try to put one down on your head every time he enters the paint if it’s available. He’s also a pretty reliable shooter off the catch, and at 6-foot-6 with solid length, he has the tools and measurements to be a starting NBA wing. However, like Whitmore above him, Whitehead’s status for the start of the upcoming season is in question after he had surgery on his right foot in late August. Given how foot injuries can fester and knock off someone’s explosion by just a little bit here or there, or knock off the balance and rhythm of their jumper, it’ll be interesting to see how quickly Whitehead can recover and get back to 100 percent. If he gets there, he’s seen as a good chance to be a lottery pick.

14. Orlando Magic (via Chi)
Dereck Lively II | 7-1 center | 18 years old | Duke
Dereck Lively is one of those guys with whom scouts just feel very comfortable. He’s a 7-foot-1 center who is the best rim protector in the class due to his 7-foot-7 wingspan. That length also allows him to be one of the best rim runners in the class, as he has good hands and can catch the ball on the move. He moves his feet well enough to not be a liability in space even if you’re always going to run drop coverage with him, and he has long-term upside to shoot the ball. The only issue is that Lively is not a shot creator for himself at all, and teams have shown real reluctance in the last two years to spend significant draft capital on bigs who don’t really create their own shot. But Lively is a terrific, high-motor player who teams feel confident is a starting-caliber center in the NBA at some point.

this is my guy with that bulls pick.

Terquavion Smith | 6-4 guard | 19 years old | N.C. State
This goes to the Knicks from Dallas following the Kristaps Porziņģis trade. Terquavion Smith is as dynamic a pull-up scorer as you’ll find in the country. As a freshman last season in ACC play, he averaged 18.3 points and shot over 40 percent from 3 on nine attempts per game, many of which were of the pull-up variety. He’s a lethal shot creator from behind the arc and would have been a first-round pick in 2022 if he had stayed in the draft class. He needs to improve as a finisher at the rim, as he was one of the worst in the country statistically last season. He also could stand to improve a bit defensively. But Smith has real tools as a lightning athlete with real explosiveness in and out of his moves and is a weirdly impressive off-hand dunker who showcases some real finishing upside long term.

Watch on YouTube

A prospect hitting 40% on 9 3pa/game is exactly the type of selection I’d like to see if we do take on another rookie this draft. Definitely keeping eyes on this kid - nice find!

[Magic#1]

https://theathletic.com/3717627/2022/10/27/2023-nba-mock-draft-wembanyama-2/

Sam Vecenie's mock. Has it by predicted finishes, not by current standings.

7. Orlando Magic
Dariq Whitehead | 6-6 wing | 18 years old | Duke
Dariq Whitehead is the first of three Duke players featured highly on this mock, an aggressive, downhill attacking wing who will try to put one down on your head every time he enters the paint if it’s available. He’s also a pretty reliable shooter off the catch, and at 6-foot-6 with solid length, he has the tools and measurements to be a starting NBA wing. However, like Whitmore above him, Whitehead’s status for the start of the upcoming season is in question after he had surgery on his right foot in late August. Given how foot injuries can fester and knock off someone’s explosion by just a little bit here or there, or knock off the balance and rhythm of their jumper, it’ll be interesting to see how quickly Whitehead can recover and get back to 100 percent. If he gets there, he’s seen as a good chance to be a lottery pick.

14. Orlando Magic (via Chi)
Dereck Lively II | 7-1 center | 18 years old | Duke
Dereck Lively is one of those guys with whom scouts just feel very comfortable. He’s a 7-foot-1 center who is the best rim protector in the class due to his 7-foot-7 wingspan. That length also allows him to be one of the best rim runners in the class, as he has good hands and can catch the ball on the move. He moves his feet well enough to not be a liability in space even if you’re always going to run drop coverage with him, and he has long-term upside to shoot the ball. The only issue is that Lively is not a shot creator for himself at all, and teams have shown real reluctance in the last two years to spend significant draft capital on bigs who don’t really create their own shot. But Lively is a terrific, high-motor player who teams feel confident is a starting-caliber center in the NBA at some point.

this is my guy with that bulls pick.

Terquavion Smith | 6-4 guard | 19 years old | N.C. State
This goes to the Knicks from Dallas following the Kristaps Porziņģis trade. Terquavion Smith is as dynamic a pull-up scorer as you’ll find in the country. As a freshman last season in ACC play, he averaged 18.3 points and shot over 40 percent from 3 on nine attempts per game, many of which were of the pull-up variety. He’s a lethal shot creator from behind the arc and would have been a first-round pick in 2022 if he had stayed in the draft class. He needs to improve as a finisher at the rim, as he was one of the worst in the country statistically last season. He also could stand to improve a bit defensively. But Smith has real tools as a lightning athlete with real explosiveness in and out of his moves and is a weirdly impressive off-hand dunker who showcases some real finishing upside long term.

Watch on YouTube

I'm guessing at least one of Ross or Harris will not be on our roster next year, maybe both. Smith could be on the radar as a replacement. But he's not the tallest or longest guy, and that isn't exactly our management's MO. For me, it depends on where the pick ends up. If it's late teens or early 20s, Smith's shooting would be intriguing off the bench.

[Knightro]

Question for everyone - are future firsts on a team like ours currently more valuable after the lottery or before? For instance - would our 2023 first bring more value as an unknown now than it would as, say, #5? Or, put another way, what #x pick value would you put on our pick pre-lottery?

Depends on what happens in the lottery

In all seriousness, the Magic's 2023 1st round pick is wildly valuable right now. That's how much teams want to get a shot at Wembanyama.

I genuinely think if the Magic made that pick available, they could get anyone on the trade market immediately and that includes guys like SGA, Beal - truly anyone good that may possibly be traded in the next 6-12 months could be had right now for the Magic's unprotected 2023 1st rounder.

But I do not think the Magic will even consider trading the pick until after the draft lottery. If the Magic end up with the No. 1 or No. 2 pick, they're absolutely keeping and making the pick.

If they come in at the No. 3 or No. 4 pick, I'd imagine they'll aggressively look to trade up to 1 or 2 and if they can't, then they may explore shopping the pick for an all-star.

[RookieStar]

Yeah... we really are jumping the gun here. Can't we at least feature the draft prospects in the 14-18 range? Lol

The Magic can still go 77-5 after all !


..

I like your thinking!!!

[DiplomaticMagic]

I know Wenbenyama and Scoot are the real big prizes but I really like the Thompson twins.

[Audi]

Question for everyone - are future firsts on a team like ours currently more valuable after the lottery or before? For instance - would our 2023 first bring more value as an unknown now than it would as, say, #5? Or, put another way, what #x pick value would you put on our pick pre-lottery?

Depends on what happens in the lottery

In all seriousness, the Magic's 2023 1st round pick is wildly valuable right now. That's how much teams want to get a shot at Wembanyama.

I genuinely think if the Magic made that pick available, they could get anyone on the trade market immediately and that includes guys like SGA, Beal - truly anyone good that may possibly be traded in the next 6-12 months could be had right now for the Magic's unprotected 2023 1st rounder.

But I do not think the Magic will even consider trading the pick until after the draft lottery. If the Magic end up with the No. 1 or No. 2 pick, they're absolutely keeping and making the pick.

If they come in at the No. 3 or No. 4 pick, I'd imagine they'll aggressively look to trade up to 1 or 2 and if they can't, then they may explore shopping the pick for an all-star.

I guess I’m not quite seeing the “generational talent” aspect of Wemby and Scoot. I understand Wemby is an alien specimen and Scoot is a boy excelling against men, but I still see injury prone physical freak and alpha-dog guard who can’t shoot 3s well. Hopefully I can see what others are seeing over the course of their season, but if we really could have our pick of all-star talent right now on an unknown lottery result...shopping that pick is incredibly enticing.

[tooler]

I think I'd take a flyer on two guards/wings, then sign some stiff as backup center if needed.

[penny_nz]

In either this draft, of this off season, we MUST get some above average 3pt shooters. I feel like I've said this every offseason, but with Franz & Paolo, and the brewing combo we have there, give these dudes some spacers and let their gravity create open shots for people who can HIT shots. Only then, can we start playing some real offense imo

[thelead]

Spurs did us a solid tonight. They win and beat the Bulls. Interesting to see the Bulls bench Vuc down the stretch in favor of Drummond.

[meatwad4343]

If we end up with the first pick is there any serious consideration on taking scoot ahead of wemby? Seems like scoot would fit in way better and we badly need better guard play vs another big. Or do you just take wemby and worry about how it all fits together later?

[Knightro]

If we end up with the first pick is there any serious consideration on taking scoot ahead of wemby? Seems like scoot would fit in way better and we badly need better guard play vs another big. Or do you just take wemby and worry about how it all fits together later?

You take Wemby and trade Carter/Bamba/whoever you need to trade IMO.