Packers News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - 2023 Off Season

[RRyder823]

Hasn't the Packers is God crowd been championing the "He can play at a high level into his 40's"?

If so then a year to develop some young players shouldn't be some unthinkable thing versus fielding a team not as quite as good as the team the year before that wasn't good enough.

Now we can talk about whether they should be better then they have been. I'd absolutely agree and part of it is Rodgers regression but there are also other factors as well.

But even without that regression if anyone thought this team was going to improve on, or stay relatively close to, the impact brought by Adams and MVS (which is what it would take to win a SB) in one offseason that's on them.

Point to the Chiefs I guess if you want but they have an All World TE. We don't. And we also don't have a QB playing at an MVP level. They do

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Wait, so you are trying to excuse the Packers failure to acquire viable WRs after trading away Davante Adams by pointing out the Chiefs have an "All World TE" in Kelce?

Well, despite KC having Kelce rather than a mediocre TE coming off an ACL like Tonyan, KC still went out after trading Tyreek Hill and signed two viable veteran WRs in MVS and Juju rather than dumpster diving with Sammy Watkins.

They also, like Gute, drafted a WR in round 2 Skyy Moore. And last week they shipped a 3rd and a 6th to the Giants for Toney.

Hence, the evidence establishes that even though KC had a much better TE than GB they still did more to get Mahomes new WRs than GB did for Rodgers.

If Gute was actively sabotaging Rodgers he would be hard pressed to do any better than saddling him with a still recovering Tonyan and the worthless/raw corps WRs he has put together.

Their assertions don't hold up under the most basic of scrutiny. I don't know why it's so hard to just admit the Packers brass has mismanaged this team for a decade now.

Litterally never "excused" anything as I've maintained it was a mistake to extend Rodgers. That was a mistake and a costly one that I said was a a bad decision at the time while others maintained Rodgers was going to be a Pro Bowler until his mid 40's

Only the assertion that you and others think this team was in position to win it all this year and couldve had different moves been made this offseason. (still waiting on the moves)

And no pointing to what KC did as exhibit A as to how the Packers could look if they tried doesn't hold up as 1: That guy named Kelce and 2: Their QB still being really freaking good

Edit: Thought about it and If you want to say I've excused them of not trading draft picks mid-season for a bandaid that wouldn't help be my guest. I definitely said that they shouldn't do it

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[CWoodfan]

Wait, so you are trying to excuse the Packers failure to acquire viable WRs after trading away Davante Adams by pointing out the Chiefs have an "All World TE" in Kelce?

Well, despite KC having Kelce rather than a mediocre TE coming off an ACL like Tonyan, KC still went out after trading Tyreek Hill and signed two viable veteran WRs in MVS and Juju rather than dumpster diving with Sammy Watkins.

They also, like Gute, drafted a WR in round 2 Skyy Moore. And last week they shipped a 3rd and a 6th to the Giants for Toney.

Hence, the evidence establishes that even though KC had a much better TE than GB they still did more to get Mahomes new WRs than GB did for Rodgers.

If Gute was actively sabotaging Rodgers he would be hard pressed to do any better than saddling him with a still recovering Tonyan and the worthless/raw corps WRs he has put together.

Their assertions don't hold up under the most basic of scrutiny. I don't know why it's so hard to just admit the Packers brass has mismanaged this team for a decade now.

Litterally never "excused" anything as I've maintained it was a mistake to extend Rodgers. That was a mistake and a costly one that I said was a a bad decision at the time while others maintained Rodgers was going to be a Pro Bowler until his mid 40's

Only the assertion that you and others think this team was in position to win it all this year and couldve had different moves been made this offseason. (still waiting on the moves)

And no pointing to what KC did as exhibit A as to how the Packers could look if they tried doesn't hold up as 1: That guy named Kelce and 2: Their QB still being really freaking good

Edit: Thought about it and If you want to say I've excused them of not trading draft picks mid-season for a bandaid that wouldn't help be my guest. I definitely said that they shouldn't do it

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There you go, admitting that Packer management F'd up by not trading Rodgers is the first step in recognizing how management has screwed up the franchise and screwed up big time.

Next step, OK you decide to keep the soon to be 39 year old Rodgers, I guess it is time to go all in to try and get back to another Super Bowl right Packer management? Wrong.

After deciding not to trade Rodgers and instead giving him a massive new deal, management goes ahead and trades Adams a guy who wanted a contract in the summer of 2021 but did not get one and who did not want to be on the team if Love was going to be the QB. (Jason Wilde on his radio show is the source for this information).

Wow, not exactly a win now move, but hey KC had to get rid of Hill, so while trading away Davante may not have been ideal, Packer management is going to get aggressive and go get some pass catchers while going all in right? Wrong.

Instead of acquiring a legitimate veteran, Gutey signs old, injured has been Sammy Watkins who is on his 5th team in 6 years and gullible fans eat it up like it is a consequential signing. This, after MVS is also allowed to walk out the door.

OK, but hey we've got all that draft capital so surely Packer management is going to attack the WR position in the draft right? Well sort of but not in a win now way. Instead of moving up to get one of the top WRs, Gutey uses his 2 1st round picks on an inside linebacker and a 24 year old defensive tackle. Then, with a chorus of what the hells gaining steam locally and nationally, Gutey overpays the Vikings to select a fast, slight, and unpolished FCS WR in round 2 and an equally raw WR in round 4.

Both Watson and Doubs are projects who might pay off in the future (and Doubs has been pretty productive this season but is still a raw rookie) but they are not in any way win now players.

That is is the extent of management's attempt to fill the Adams/MVS void in 2022, Watkins and two rookies. Those are not moves of a team trying to win now. Yesterday's inactivity was just the cherry on top of the sundae.

So the Packers are not in a win now mode at WR/TE while paying Rodgers a king's ransom and cannot even move on from Rodgers next year without devastating their salary cap.

If this is not GM malpractice, what would be?

[Treebeard]

At this point, I haven't a clue what the Packer's FO plan was. However, I am pretty sure, at this point, whatever it was, it's not working - at all.

[ReasonablySober]

Would love to hear the win now moves that would have taken this team from being legitimately bad to contending.

[Kerb Hohl]

I would've supported something like a 6th or 7th for some extremely mediocre WR, because I would've been OK putting a very small amount of assets on just getting more depth to make things work there. I don't even have any proposed names, but somebody that might've been able to turn his career around here or something.

Beyond that, one of the few things that surprised me is Gute may not have much slack left for his tenure and it's moderately surprising he didn't try to save it. Setting himself up, I guess, to maybe try to feign going for it one last time in 2023 or didn't use any assets as the rebuild starts in 2023.

I am personally fine doing nothing. Would've supported a soft sell at the deadline, but this is fine. 2023 is probably gonna be a "sure, why not" year where we see what happens with Rodgers but it could turn to a tank/clean house sort of deal mid-season.

[Treebeard]

Would love to hear the win now moves that would have taken this team from being legitimately bad to contending.

Yeah, there was no available single WR that was going to fix the defectively inconsistent line, mend whatever has caused a theoretically personnel deep Defense to underperform, keep Watkins, Cobb, and Watson in the lineup and give Doubs and Toure two years of experience with Rogers, and backup the clock on Aaron's arm a couple three years.

Too much is not working as hoped, nor as advertised before the start of the season.

[jakecronus8]

Of all the years for people to be mad about not making a trade they choose the year where Green Bay is butt-ass to go nuclear.

[CWoodfan]

Would love to hear the win now moves that would have taken this team from being legitimately bad to contending.

Would love to hear how it was smart that a team that is "legitimately bad" did not either try to (a) acquire players to not become legitimately bad in an alleged ALL IN season or (b) trade away players from the legitimately bad team that is facing significant salary cap restraints now and in the future and presumably could use all the draft capital it can get in order to become not legitimately bad.

Standing pat has been the approach each and every season in Green Bay, it does not make it the right approach.

[VooDoo7]

Of all the years for people to be mad about not making a trade they choose the year where Green Bay is butt-ass to go nuclear.

This isn't a one year thing. Also, people wouldn't be so irritated had the front office not extended Rodgers in the off-season. That is as "win now" as it gets. Gute did a horrible job assembling this WR/TE corp...and that's even BEFORE Adams left town.

[VooDoo7]

Would love to hear the win now moves that would have taken this team from being legitimately bad to contending.

For starters fire Joe Barry. All the hype about how great the unit was gonna be this year, and they're absolutely terrible. Hold somebody accountable.

[LUKE23]

Assuming AR retires, which at this point looks like a lock, Packers are headed for a relatively long rebuild given the offensive "talent" and the cap issues. So in that vein, we need as many draft picks as possible to add cheap talent to this roster.

That said, it is absolutely criminal what Gute trotted out there at WR/TE this season (and most fans were saying this prior to the year). In the past 30 years, this may be the worst skill position group the Packers have had, even including AJ. It's basically a bunch of guys who can't **** run and then two rookies, behind an OL that unfortunately had two mega injuries to all Pros. I guess what I'm sayig is - the offensive struggles are not surprising at all. And I'm not holding AR blameless either, he's a bitch, but man he doesn't have much to work with.

The D is antother story - Barry should have been fired by now but that won't happen.

Absolutely disastrous year for Gute. If he didn't have three 13 win seasons backing him, his job would be in jeopardy.

[LUKE23]

This isn't a one year thing. Also, people wouldn't be so irritated had the front office not extended Rodgers in the off-season. That is as "win now" as it gets. Gute did a horrible job assembling this WR/TE corp...and that's BEFORE Adams left town.

Right, to me, lets look at KC. Already had a game-changing weapon in Kelce.

Added: MVS, JuJu, Moore, Toney

Packers - zero studs on team (I guess we can count AJ)

Added: Watkins, Watson, Doubs, Toure

The biggest issue here - it would shock absolutely nobody if all four of the above players the Packers added didn't contribute at all. Watkins hasn't had a big year in several years and is always hurt, the other three are ROOKIES. That's added to the most unexplosive WR trio in the NFL in Cobb, Lazard, and Amari, and an average at best TE in Tonyan.

Gute had a terrible offseason.

[LittleRooster]

For whatever it’s worth, was listening to a dynasty podcast hosted by Matt Williamson. He’s actually a former scout and works with the Steelers still or has connections. He said the Packers offered their 2nd for Claypool but the Bears 2nd was accepted over the Packers.


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[Ron Swanson]

Don't think anyone here would've not accepted a 5th/6th rounder for a guy like Cooks/Bourne as a reasonable compromise, but all in all yeah, Gute botched the offseason bigly based on current returns. Where the complete disconnect is that I guess he deserves zero credit for building the talent base for three straight 13-win teams in the first place, and there's a crowd who thinks SB title windows are infinite as long as your GM isn't a **** moron and keeps pushing the cap can down the road further. While again, half this board was firmly on the "don't half-ass the rebuild" train and warned of this exact thing happening. We had three straight 13-win seasons and Gute should've seen the writing on the wall after the "last dance" (lol in hindsight) season.

[LUKE23]

Sticking with Barry (and hiring him in the first place) is probably the biggest issue in all of this, putting the O aside for a moment. Their DVOA ranks are:

2019 - 15th
2020 - 17th
2021 - 22nd
2022 - 22nd

Not only are they not producing, but our DC is not building a scheme around the personnel, he's just picking a scheme and telling our personnel to play it. It honestly reminds me of sticking with Capers too long.

[Ron Swanson]

Sticking with Barry (and hiring him in the first place) is probably the biggest issue in all of this, putting the O aside for a moment. Their DVOA ranks are:

2019 - 15th
2020 - 17th
2021 - 22nd
2022 - 22nd

Not only are they not producing, but our DC is not building a scheme around the personnel, he's just picking a scheme and telling our personnel to play it. It honestly reminds me of sticking with Capers too long.

As one of the biggest Capers bashers his last several years here, at least he produced two consecutive Top-10 scoring defenses with arguably less talented rosters.

[ReasonablySober]

In case you want a refresher on what some here were saying pre and post-Rodgers coming back, enjoy this one.

[raysbookclub]

This current team was built to win with great D and a great running game, with a passing offense to come along and special teams to be just good enough. With the defense's high draft picks, expensive free agents, and the success against SF in the playoffs last year, along with Jones and Dillon at RB, that was a reasonable expectation. But the D has been just average and we haven't committed to the run. That's why they're 3-5.

If their D were playing like a top-10 unit, with more commitment to running the ball, it's not a huge leap to think they could be 5-3 or 6-2, with their only losses being @Min and @Buf.

I don't expect a DC change at this point, but Barry has got to pick it up a gear or two.

[th87]

For whatever it’s worth, was listening to a dynasty podcast hosted by Matt Williamson. He’s actually a former scout and works with the Steelers still or has connections. He said the Packers offered their 2nd for Claypool but the Bears 2nd was accepted over the Packers.


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Then they could've offered a conditional future pick to beat the Bears offer.

[ReasonablySober]

They offered a second-round pick for Pittsburgh Steelers wide receiver Chase Claypool, the source said, but the Steelers decided to take the Chicago Bears’ offer of a second-round pick because they thought it would be the better of the two picks.

According to another source, the Bears wanted to give up the second-round pick they had just gotten from Baltimore for linebacker Roquan Smith, but the Steelers demanded it be the Bears’ own second-round pick. The Steelers expected the 3-5 Bears to finish with a worse record than the 5-3 Ravens.

And when it came to evaluating Green Bay’s offer, they expected the 3-5 Bears to finish with a worse record than the 3-5 Packers. How much worse likely dictated what the Steelers wanted from Green Bay in draft choice compensation to make up the difference. The additional pick presumably would have had to be commensurate with whatever difference the Steelers thought there would be between where the Bears pick and the Packers pick.

So, if they thought it was a 10-pick difference, for example, the Packers would have had to give up an additional fourth-round pick.

The source said the Packers turned their sights on Claypool after a deal they thought they had for another offensive prospect – one not mentioned much in trade rumors – fell through when the other team pulled out at the last minute. The source said the Packers wouldn’t want him to divulge the name of the player so he would only say it was someone who could have helped the offense greatly.

The only way we would have gotten Claypool is with a 1st rounder. That obviously would have been awful.

Would love to know who the other offensive target was.