Killian Hayes is Really...Bad

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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#161 » by UcanUwill » Wed Nov 2, 2022 12:11 am

MrBigShot wrote:I'd say he is a an average athlete by NBA standards.

He can't shoot, he can't get to the rim, he can't finish at the rim, his handle sucks. Passing ability is irrelevant if you can't run an offense as a guard, so all you really have is a guy that is passable defensively. I could tell within the first few weeks of his 2nd year he was not an NBA player...no improvement, constant deer in the headlights demeanor.


He will go back in Europe, and probably going to be good. In a sense Nick Calathes is good, terrible scorer, but good to very good in some other impactful areas. having vision and handle is still not a given in Europe, but as you said, in the NBA, if you not a threat yourself, no one will give you the ball to just playmake. In the NBA, most guys can dribble and playmake a bit, but mostly only guys who are also star scorers get to carry the ball these days, they are simply the most optimal guys to have the ball. Thats why Campazzo is legend in international ball, but he is a complete flop in the NBA, cause he just cant score so all he gets to do is stand in the corner, there is simply better talent for having ball in their hands.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#162 » by kieferli » Wed Nov 2, 2022 12:20 am

Laimbeer wrote:Piston first rounders

Year, Round, Pick
2020 1 7 Killian Hayes France ratiopharm Ulm (Germany)
2020 1 16 Isaiah Stewart United States Washington
2019 1 15 Sekou Doumbouya France Limoges CSP
2017 1 12 Luke Kennard United States Duke
2016 1 18 Henry Ellenson United States Marquette
2015 1 8 Stanley Johnson United States Arizona
2013 1 8 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope United States Georgia
2012 1 9 Andre Drummond United States Connecticut
2011 1 8 Brandon Knight United States Kentucky
2010 1 7 Greg Monroe United States Georgetown
2009 1 15 Austin Daye United States Gonzaga
2008 1 29 D. J. White United States Indiana
2007 1 15 Rodney Stuckey United States Eastern Washington
2007 1 27 Arron Afflalo United States UCLA
2005 1 26 Jason Maxiell United States Cincinnati
2003 1 2 Darko Miličić Serbia and Montenegro Hemofarm Vršac (Serbia and Montenegro and Adriatic League)
2003 1 25 Carlos Delfino Argentina Skipper Bologna (Italy)
2002 1 23 Tayshaun Prince United States Kentucky
2001 1 9 Rodney White United States Charlotte
2000 1 14 Mateen Cleaves United States Michigan State
1998 1 11 Bonzi Wells United States Ball State
1997 1 19 Scot Pollard United States Kansas
1996 1 26 Jerome Williams United States Georgetown
1995 1 18 Theo Ratliff United States Wyoming
1995 1 19 Randolph Childress United States Wake Forest
1994 1 3 Grant Hill United States Duke
1993 1 10 Lindsey Hunter United States Jackson State
1993 1 11 Allan Houston United States Tennessee
1992 1 19 Don MacLean United States UCLA



Wow Look pretty bad for last 10 years only Andre Drummond make All Star?
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#163 » by Plutonashfan » Sat Nov 5, 2022 1:02 am

Thought people were being tough but after watching him in action tonight I approve this message, dude is completely losted out there
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#164 » by Mirotic12 » Tue Nov 8, 2022 4:49 pm

Harry Garris wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:Knew little about him, but I know he struggled in Europe too, and he wasnt playing on Euroleague team or anything like that, so its not surprising. I still havent figured how these scouts decide one Euro scrub is super hyped and the others not.


They're trying to highlight the parts of their game that are valuable in a NBA style offense. Killian Hayes was a big, switchable defensively guard that could already attack off of the dribble and make plays for others at only 18 years old.

Clearly his time in the NBA has shown he was only good at doing that against lesser competition, but it's no surprise that NBA scouts were intrigued by him. That's the exact kind of player that you would be excited about finding as a NBA scout.


He wasn't good at doing that in EuroCup (2nd tier European league). Anyone that understands proper basketball could see he was a below average player (at best) in Europe's secondary level competition.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#165 » by Blame Rasho » Tue Nov 8, 2022 4:51 pm

Let’s give him some credit, he was better than Vassilis Spanoulis when he was in the NBA.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#166 » by Mirotic12 » Tue Nov 8, 2022 5:01 pm

UcanUwill wrote:He will go back in Europe, and probably going to be good. In a sense Nick Calathes is good, terrible scorer, but good to very good in some other impactful areas. having vision and handle is still not a given in Europe, but as you said, in the NBA, if you not a threat yourself, no one will give you the ball to just playmake. In the NBA, most guys can dribble and playmake a bit, but mostly only guys who are also star scorers get to carry the ball these days, they are simply the most optimal guys to have the ball. Thats why Campazzo is legend in international ball, but he is a complete flop in the NBA, cause he just cant score so all he gets to do is stand in the corner, there is simply better talent for having ball in their hands.


1. Nick Calathes, despite being hugely overrated in Europe, is way better than Hayes. Hayes is a poor man's version of Vangelis Mantzaris.

2. Campazzo is no legend in international basketball............seriously? "Legend"? NO........and I have been a fan of his for a long time. No way is he a legend internationally though, unless you mean just for Argentina.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#167 » by UcanUwill » Tue Nov 8, 2022 5:16 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:He will go back in Europe, and probably going to be good. In a sense Nick Calathes is good, terrible scorer, but good to very good in some other impactful areas. having vision and handle is still not a given in Europe, but as you said, in the NBA, if you not a threat yourself, no one will give you the ball to just playmake. In the NBA, most guys can dribble and playmake a bit, but mostly only guys who are also star scorers get to carry the ball these days, they are simply the most optimal guys to have the ball. Thats why Campazzo is legend in international ball, but he is a complete flop in the NBA, cause he just cant score so all he gets to do is stand in the corner, there is simply better talent for having ball in their hands.


1. Nick Calathes, despite being hugely overrated in Europe, is way better than Hayes. Hayes is a poor man's version of Vangelis Mantzaris.

2. Campazzo is no legend in international basketball............seriously? "Legend"? NO........and I have been a fan of his for a long time. No way is he a legend internationally though, unless you mean just for Argentina.


1. Its hard to tell how good Hayes is. I mean he is very bad in the NBA, but we had examples of Euros looking like they didnt improve in the NBA at all, but they actually do, but it only translates to Euro level. I am not betting on Hayes to be one of those guys, but you never know. He has size, if he can dribble drive and is good passer, he could be very good in Europe.

2. Campazzo was named ACB MVP of the decade and hes been tier 2 Euroleague MVP candidate for a while with Real Madrid.

P.S. I am not really responding to you, because I know your stick, you will just bend truth to make Euro players look better by downgrading anything else, so I will not change your mind, cause you aren't really here for debate purposes. I am just responding for whoever else who is reading.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#168 » by Liam_Gallagher » Tue Nov 8, 2022 6:24 pm

He and Kendrick Nunn are competing for the most trash lefty point guards in the league. Both are so bad.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#169 » by Harry Garris » Tue Nov 8, 2022 6:43 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:
Harry Garris wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:Knew little about him, but I know he struggled in Europe too, and he wasnt playing on Euroleague team or anything like that, so its not surprising. I still havent figured how these scouts decide one Euro scrub is super hyped and the others not.


They're trying to highlight the parts of their game that are valuable in a NBA style offense. Killian Hayes was a big, switchable defensively guard that could already attack off of the dribble and make plays for others at only 18 years old.

Clearly his time in the NBA has shown he was only good at doing that against lesser competition, but it's no surprise that NBA scouts were intrigued by him. That's the exact kind of player that you would be excited about finding as a NBA scout.


He wasn't good at doing that in EuroCup (2nd tier European league). Anyone that understands proper basketball could see he was a below average player (at best) in Europe's secondary level competition.


I didn't say he was an elite player in Europe. I said he was a big guard with intriguing tools at 18 years old. Also with a proper understanding of basketball you would know that as a NBA scout you're not always looking for what a player can do right now, especially not with young players. You're trying to project how they're going to develop. That is way harder to do than recognizing already realized talent.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#170 » by jasonxxx102 » Tue Nov 8, 2022 6:54 pm

Liam_Gallagher wrote:He and Kendrick Nunn are competing for the most trash lefty point guards in the league. Both are so bad.


Killian Hayes is really bad, but Kendrick Nunn doesn't deserve to be on an NBA roster. He barely has g league talent
76ciology wrote:Wouldn't Edey have a better chance of winning the scoring battle against Tatum in the post after a switch than Tatum shooting over Edey's 9'6" standing reach?
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#171 » by foreigngrammar » Tue Nov 8, 2022 6:57 pm

Laimbeer wrote:Piston first rounders

Year, Round, Pick
2020 1 7 Killian Hayes France ratiopharm Ulm (Germany)
2020 1 16 Isaiah Stewart United States Washington
2019 1 15 Sekou Doumbouya France Limoges CSP
2017 1 12 Luke Kennard United States Duke
2016 1 18 Henry Ellenson United States Marquette
2015 1 8 Stanley Johnson United States Arizona
2013 1 8 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope United States Georgia
2012 1 9 Andre Drummond United States Connecticut
2011 1 8 Brandon Knight United States Kentucky
2010 1 7 Greg Monroe United States Georgetown
2009 1 15 Austin Daye United States Gonzaga
2008 1 29 D. J. White United States Indiana
2007 1 15 Rodney Stuckey United States Eastern Washington
2007 1 27 Arron Afflalo United States UCLA
2005 1 26 Jason Maxiell United States Cincinnati
2003 1 2 Darko Miličić Serbia and Montenegro Hemofarm Vršac (Serbia and Montenegro and Adriatic League)
2003 1 25 Carlos Delfino Argentina Skipper Bologna (Italy)
2002 1 23 Tayshaun Prince United States Kentucky
2001 1 9 Rodney White United States Charlotte
2000 1 14 Mateen Cleaves United States Michigan State
1998 1 11 Bonzi Wells United States Ball State
1997 1 19 Scot Pollard United States Kansas
1996 1 26 Jerome Williams United States Georgetown
1995 1 18 Theo Ratliff United States Wyoming
1995 1 19 Randolph Childress United States Wake Forest
1994 1 3 Grant Hill United States Duke
1993 1 10 Lindsey Hunter United States Jackson State
1993 1 11 Allan Houston United States Tennessee
1992 1 19 Don MacLean United States UCLA



Aside from Milicic and maybe White this could be anybodys track record. But of course Stanley Johnson and Hayes suck and were bad picks
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#172 » by Billl » Tue Nov 8, 2022 7:44 pm

kieferli wrote:
Laimbeer wrote:Piston first rounders

Year, Round, Pick
2020 1 7 Killian Hayes France ratiopharm Ulm (Germany)
2020 1 16 Isaiah Stewart United States Washington
2019 1 15 Sekou Doumbouya France Limoges CSP
2017 1 12 Luke Kennard United States Duke
2016 1 18 Henry Ellenson United States Marquette
2015 1 8 Stanley Johnson United States Arizona
2013 1 8 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope United States Georgia
2012 1 9 Andre Drummond United States Connecticut
2011 1 8 Brandon Knight United States Kentucky
2010 1 7 Greg Monroe United States Georgetown
2009 1 15 Austin Daye United States Gonzaga
2008 1 29 D. J. White United States Indiana
2007 1 15 Rodney Stuckey United States Eastern Washington
2007 1 27 Arron Afflalo United States UCLA
2005 1 26 Jason Maxiell United States Cincinnati
2003 1 2 Darko Miličić Serbia and Montenegro Hemofarm Vršac (Serbia and Montenegro and Adriatic League)
2003 1 25 Carlos Delfino Argentina Skipper Bologna (Italy)
2002 1 23 Tayshaun Prince United States Kentucky
2001 1 9 Rodney White United States Charlotte
2000 1 14 Mateen Cleaves United States Michigan State
1998 1 11 Bonzi Wells United States Ball State
1997 1 19 Scot Pollard United States Kansas
1996 1 26 Jerome Williams United States Georgetown
1995 1 18 Theo Ratliff United States Wyoming
1995 1 19 Randolph Childress United States Wake Forest
1994 1 3 Grant Hill United States Duke
1993 1 10 Lindsey Hunter United States Jackson State
1993 1 11 Allan Houston United States Tennessee
1992 1 19 Don MacLean United States UCLA



Wow Look pretty bad for last 10 years only Andre Drummond make All Star?


Yeah, our drafting sucked. I think the problem was more that kept trying to treadmill instead of do a proper rebuild though. It's pretty tough to land all-stars if you are drafting at the end of the lottery every year. Once we finally picked a direction, we landed good picks and nabbed Cade and Ivey. We'll see if they develop into all-stars, but at least they have a chance.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#173 » by FluLikeSymptoms » Tue Nov 8, 2022 7:54 pm

Decent gamble, that top-10 was a crapshoot and there were worse picks above you. Of course with your two picks that year you’d rather have one of the Tyreses if not both, or Bane, but everyone blew it on those 3.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#174 » by jordanwilliams6 » Tue Nov 8, 2022 8:07 pm

jasonxxx102 wrote:
Liam_Gallagher wrote:He and Kendrick Nunn are competing for the most trash lefty point guards in the league. Both are so bad.


Killian Hayes is really bad, but Kendrick Nunn doesn't deserve to be on an NBA roster. He barely has g league talent

You have this the wrong way around.

Hayes literally does not have the talent to be in the league and hasn’t shown a thing. Nunn has already put together a couple of solid NBA seasons and is now coming off a serious long term injury..
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#175 » by jasonxxx102 » Tue Nov 8, 2022 8:14 pm

jordanwilliams6 wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
Liam_Gallagher wrote:He and Kendrick Nunn are competing for the most trash lefty point guards in the league. Both are so bad.


Killian Hayes is really bad, but Kendrick Nunn doesn't deserve to be on an NBA roster. He barely has g league talent

You have this the wrong way around.

Hayes literally does not have the talent to be in the league and hasn’t shown a thing. Nunn has already put together a couple of solid NBA seasons and is now coming off a serious long term injury..


based on this comment I'm not sure you've actually watched either of them play. Hot take machine is firing today I see

Nunn is a terrible NBA player.

Hayes gives you above average on ball defense and playmaking with good size. Nunn can't do anything even at an average NBA level. Oh and Nunn is 27 and Hayes is 21.

Kendrick Nunn will not be on an NBA roster in 2 years, I can almost guarantee Hayes will.
76ciology wrote:Wouldn't Edey have a better chance of winning the scoring battle against Tatum in the post after a switch than Tatum shooting over Edey's 9'6" standing reach?
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#176 » by God Squad » Tue Nov 8, 2022 8:18 pm

jordanwilliams6 wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
Liam_Gallagher wrote:He and Kendrick Nunn are competing for the most trash lefty point guards in the league. Both are so bad.


Killian Hayes is really bad, but Kendrick Nunn doesn't deserve to be on an NBA roster. He barely has g league talent

You have this the wrong way around.

Hayes literally does not have the talent to be in the league and hasn’t shown a thing. Nunn has already put together a couple of solid NBA seasons and is now coming off a serious long term injury..

One was also undrafted and the other was the 7th pick.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#177 » by JackTalkThai » Fri Dec 2, 2022 3:35 am

Killian Hayes might not be that bad after all.

22 points
8 assists
4 rebounds
10/13 FGM
2/4 3PM

Against the Mavs. Back to back 3’s to close it out. 14 points in the 4th quarter and OT.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#178 » by GrindCityHustle » Fri Dec 2, 2022 3:36 am

JackTalkThai wrote:Killian Hayes might not be that bad after all.

22 points
8 assists
4 rebounds
10/13 FGM
2/4 3PM

Against the Mavs. Back to back 3’s to close it out. 14 points in the 4th quarter and OT.



Glad to see he is gaining confidence. Good sign for Detroit.
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#179 » by rocketsfan100 » Fri Dec 2, 2022 3:37 am

As soon as Cade went down and he was given MEANINGFUL minutes and a real OPPORTUNITY he has played well. Who’d figure?
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Re: Killian Hayes is Really...Bad 

Post#180 » by azcatz11 » Fri Dec 2, 2022 3:38 am

Who has more trade value - Hayes or Cade?
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