Joel: unchained.

[Mik317]

the **** are you talking about lol.

every single contender the question is it depends on their best player.

also every single championship winning team is built to hide their best players flaws. Giannis can't shoot and isn't the best creator. They have Kris Middleton to be the late shot clock creator and Jrue Holiday to create. Bropez allows Giannis to roam and they have/had top tier shooters around him. Add in some injury luck and the CP3 curse lol and there ya go.

Curry spends most of the game off ball and running around tons of screens. Thats thanks to Draymond. Klay's gravity also makes it tough for teams to send everything to stop Curry. And his best teams has been full of athletes who can run and defend allowing them to hide him on defense.

Hell even the Kawhii Raptors was built to solve Kawhii's flaws via simply having all those athletic Africans to allow him to rest throughout the season and even in games (lost in that run was the fact that Kawhii didn't have to always guard the best players for example)

You have this strange idea that the only way to win is for your star to play perfectly and have no flaws...when that's never the reality. Basketball is a team sport in which each team is always going to have some type of weakness, and its all about covering up said weakness to the best of your ability whilst attacking your opponents weakness even if by over relying on your strengths.

Biid can be better. Never said otherwise. He has to realize that his composure and approach is what carries the team and not fall into the woe is me mentality as often as he does. HOWEVER, this franchise has simply done a piss poor job of covering up the weaknesses that no ammount of effort and want to will fix. Joel Embiid is a large human being, that means his stamina is not going to be the same as Giannis. So ideally you'd build a team that would solve that. He is also a center, centers generally can't get back on defense...thus get athletes. He seems to thrive off of movement shooters. Get some of those. To solve the stamina issues, we need to find a way to get him easy shots (Doc is a bum but to his credit during this recent stretch they have actually made his shot diet a lot less demanding IMO)...that is Harden but he can't be the only guy.

This franchise has never done what the above 3 examples have done. We spent years throwing **** at the wall to either play to Ben's strengths and now more of Harden's strengths. Or not actually allow things to play out before pivoting at the first sign on conflict (Dario Squad and Jimmy Squads).

Again Biid's not perfect. No star is IMO. He can do things better. Been saying for years he needs to lose some weight as I don't think that aspect of his game is needed anymore and being more spry and ideally eventually transitioning to a late career Duncan type beat is the wave (and it seems like that is the plan) but this weird idea that the FO has done enough and if we don't win it totally means Embiid isn't any good is nuts to me.

[Murray_17]

In what universe was Tobias a perfect fit with Joel and Ben?

That's next level of delusion

[76ciology]

Spoiler:

The idea of Tobias is the perfect fit with Embiid and Ben. The actual player Tobias is not a perfect fit on any contender, unless he's making fifteen million a year or less and used as a half decent bench creator (plot twist, he's not). Let's not forget Jerry West, a pretty good executive, offered Tobias a 4 year $80 million dollar deal, which Tobi turned down and West decided to unload him instead. Twenty million is about the limit of Tobi's actual value. Having him at 35m+ just handicaps roster construction to an almost irrecoverable level.

The guy doesn't really do anything at a plus level. He's an average wing catch and shoot shooter, he's an average isolation scorer, he's an average passer, a below average rebounder for his position, and a tweener on defense who's decent guarding bigger, slower wings but not good at guarding down onto quicker guards. He's not really a playmaker.

Now don't get me wrong, to be average at a bunch of things at the NBA level is hard and is worthy of rotational minutes, but it's simply not a star by any means. The problem is that when you do have plus level players, your need for your role players becomes more and more specific. For instance, if we had a healthy Harden, Embiid, and Maxey, if we could design a perfect complementary player for them, it would probably be an elite 3&D wing or motion shooter. They may not be as talented as Tobias overall, but the things they are good at, they're clearly very good at. Again, that doesn't describe Tobi.

Contenders rarely need more mediocre jack of all trades, they need impact players within their specific roles to surround their high impact superstars.


Uhh... yeah it depends on the guys around Steph. Did you forget that 2 seasons ago, Steph barely made the play-in and lost despite putting up some of his best numbers? Turns out the even superstar guys need good complementary players in a team sport. Who knew?

For Sixers, always has been “depends on Joel Embiid”.
Why is that?

Because he was the only one that was a star here, aside from Butler, easy to understand, the other guys are and were not dependable.

No. It’s because his physical, emotional and spiritual health are wildly inconsistent

[76ciology]

In what universe was Tobias a perfect fit with Joel and Ben?

That's next level of delusion

Consistently our top or one of the top 3 man unit since 2018-2019 and 2020-2021 ranges

Fun fact:
Harden-tobias-biid has a higher netrtg than harden-maxey-biid in 2021-2022

Tobias fill in the empty scoring needed for Ben.
Ben fill up the lack of intangibles from Tobias.
Tobias (among others) fill up the scoring when Biid is unavailable.
Tobias stretch 4 to space Biid and Ben.
Tobias transition to help Ben in transition
Tobias do some PnR but not too much PnR to not offend Ben
Ben and Embiid covers Tobias lack of defense.

[Bum Adebayo]

It doesn't matter what Ben could cover on defense, he was a zero on offense, at least in playoffs.

[phillynative]

When it rains it pours...

[TeamHigh]

Who knew?

Who knew Andrew Wiggins, who was once the +/- laughing stock. Famous for those 0 rebs 0 assists 0 stocks statline become a championship caliber player? My point? Tobias can be a championship caliber player if Biid and Ben lived up to their hype.

"Completely Unrelated Player became a championship caliber player, so that means Tobi can too." Do you see how silly this sounds?

It didn't fall on Steph to make Andrew Wiggins into a championship caliber player. Steph had the same qualities in 2021 as he did in 2022. He didn't suddenly "live up to his hype" at age 34. Andrew Wiggins simply played better. Likewise Draymond Green, Klay Thompson got healthy and Jordan Poole improved.

You managed to miss the point entirely even when I said it explicitly (that even "great" superstar players like Steph need help to win, as evidenced by how he was barely a play-in team in 2021 and a champion in 2022). At this point it sounds like you're being deliberate.

Everyone knows what to expect from Steph. And when he has a bad game, he still provides gravity that frees up other guys on offense while he does not have any negative affect on defense.

Yeah you're right, Embiid has never provided any gravity or positive impact on defense, or anything. It's not like he consistently anchors a good defense, or has led Seth Curry and JJ Redick to the best years of their career. Or that there's not stats (

Read on Twitter

) to suggest he's made impact in the playoffs.

It's bizarre that you would accuse someone of being "a big fan of Embiid" while you seem to be the biggest fan of Tobias Harris, to the point where you can't even objectively see that he's not on the level of Middleton/Holiday or Wiggins/Draymond. He's not a championship level #3, and in 2021 he needed to be a championship level #2 considering Ben Simmons decided to go missing.

You have this strange idea that the only way to win is for your star to play perfectly and have no flaws...when that's never the reality. Basketball is a team sport in which each team is always going to have some type of weakness, and its all about covering up said weakness to the best of your ability whilst attacking your opponents weakness even if by over relying on your strengths.

Bingo.

I can't think of any other superstar where the standard for them is just, "oh he needs to play perfectly." The production Embiid has given in the playoffs in the past has absolutely been championship caliber. Go find how many players have averaged 30ppg on 63% TS% over a 7-game series. You won't find a long list. And that's WITH Ben Simmons and Matisse Thybulle (two known floor shrinkers) both starting alongside him and making the defense collapse on him even more.

The equivalent would be if you surrounded Giannis with 2 paint bound players and then asked, "why he didn't just play better?" as he attacks into a wall of opposing jerseys every possession.

Fun fact:
Harden-tobias-biid has a higher netrtg than harden-maxey-biid in 2021-2022

And Harden-Embiid-Shake had a higher net rating than both. I guess that proves Shake is better than Maxey...

Did you read anything I said or do you just respond to the whispers in your head? I said the team lacks any functional wings that when someone as average as Danny Green goes down, the team fell apart. I think not having any competent wings on the floor is going to hurt your team more than the impact of a second-year guard, yes.

Tobias stretch 4 to space Biid and Ben.
Tobias transition to help Ben in transition

Tobi has never been good as a "stretch 4." He's not a particularly high volume C&S 3 point shooter, nor does he have unlimited range or a quick trigger. The guy still has instincts to pass up openish 3s and put the ball on the floor. Also if you play him at the 4, his poor rebounding gets exposed.

He's also not an athletic player and has never been a plus transition player.

Again, you seem to be confusing the idea of Tobias Harris over the actual play of Tobias Harris.

[76ciology]

Joel Embiid over his last 5 games:

30 PTS - 8 REB - 7 AST
32 PTS - 9 REB - 6 AST
32 PTS - 11 REB - 8 AST
59 PTS - 11 REB - 8 AST
42 PTS - 10 REB - 6 AST

[Bum Adebayo]

Joel Embiid over his last 5 games:

30 PTS - 8 REB - 7 AST
32 PTS - 9 REB - 6 AST
32 PTS - 11 REB - 8 AST
59 PTS - 11 REB - 8 AST
42 PTS - 10 REB - 6 AST

He doesn't put dat effort though...

[Bum Adebayo]

Just amazing to witness the magnificence of sir Joel Hans Embiid

[76ciology]

Joel Embiid over his last 5 games:

30 PTS - 8 REB - 7 AST
32 PTS - 9 REB - 6 AST
32 PTS - 11 REB - 8 AST
59 PTS - 11 REB - 8 AST
42 PTS - 10 REB - 6 AST

He doesn't put dat effort though...

Yup, before that stretch. But he bounced back. And he could not have bounced back if he was satisfied with his level of play before that stretch.

And we need him to play at this level to win the championship

[Bum Adebayo]

Joel Embiid has the 5th highest RPM in the entire NBA, even with his subpar start. It's evident what's happening here, and it's not him, it's the horrendous team around him.

[Stanford]

It is a little insane that he's having another MVP caliber year (maybe his best ever, especially considering he's a slow starter) and everyone thinks he's a hack fraud

[phillynative]

Hook shot ? Where is his go 2 hook shot. I feel like a simple hook or push shot when his jumper isn't falling can go a long way for him.

[Bum Adebayo]

Hook shot ? Where is his go 2 hook shot. I feel like a simple hook or push shot when his jumper isn't falling can go a long way for him.

62% TS, his scoring is more than fine thank you. BTW what is the rest of the team doing exactly?
The only player more unstoppable on offense when he has the touches is Zion, it's time to let Embiid alone and focus on the other players!

[Negrodamus]

He’s ironically defending Embiid but with unironic great points. The end goal is still unclear.

[Arsenal]

Bum has now become the voice of reason lol

[SixthStreet]

Bum is the Brook Lopez of the RealGM 76ers forum. Unrecognizable from early in his career.

[eyeatoma]

Bum has now become the voice of reason lol

I've been saying this the last few weeks, bra making good posts about Embiid lol. Not sure if his plan is backfiring lol.

Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

[76ciology]

Bum is the Brook Lopez of the RealGM 76ers forum. Unrecognizable from early in his career.

Started from being a liability on defense into defensive player of the year.

Keep it up Bum, I’ll email Howardmass to make you Mod here.