Make Your Best Offer: Gordon Hayward

NYG · Post #1 » by **NYG** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:07 pm

What would the Hornets want for Hayward? Which teams would make such an offer?

Wolveswin · Post #2 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:09 pm

How much value are Hornets willing to add to Hayward?

Is Hayward playing well enough to not be considered negative value?

Colbinii · Post #3 » by **Colbinii** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:12 pm

Wolveswin wrote:How much value are Hornets willing to add to Hayward?

Is Hayward playing well enough to not be considered negative value?

He is negative value

NYG · Post #4 » by **NYG** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:13 pm

Colbinii wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:How much value are Hornets willing to add to Hayward?

Is Hayward playing well enough to not be considered negative value?

He is negative value

So the Knicks could get him for Fournier and Rose?

Wolveswin · Post #5 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:16 pm

Colbinii wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:How much value are Hornets willing to add to Hayward?

Is Hayward playing well enough to not be considered negative value?

He is negative value

It was a leading question :wink:

Hayward finds himself already nominated (and most likely voted in) to top 10 worst NBA contracts as per very own RGM TNT poll. He is negative value.

Wolveswin · Post #6 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:17 pm

NYG wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:How much value are Hornets willing to add to Hayward?

Is Hayward playing well enough to not be considered negative value?

He is negative value

So the Knicks could get him for Fournier and Rose?

Why would Knicks do that? Fournier last year is TO, so he is same length as Hayward but less money. Rose is expiring on TO. Knicks would say no to Hayward zapping their cap flexibility.

Post #7 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:18 pm

NYG wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:How much value are Hornets willing to add to Hayward?

Is Hayward playing well enough to not be considered negative value?

He is negative value

So the Knicks could get him for Fournier and Rose?

Value, maybe, but I’m not sure why Charlotte would consider that specifically. Just to cut a little salary off Hayward for next year? Probably not enough of a reason.

NYG · Post #8 » by **NYG** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:19 pm

Wolveswin wrote:
NYG wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
He is negative value

So the Knicks could get him for Fournier and Rose?

Why would Knicks do that? Fournier last year is TO, so he is same length as Hayward but less money. Rose is expiring on TO. Knicks would say no to Hayward zapping their cap flexibility.

Hayward has been pretty bad when healthy I guess? I don't watch a ton of Charlotte games

Wolveswin · Post #9 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:22 pm

To try and find a solution…

Hayward

FOR

Robinson + Dipo

Heat shorten their years owed bad money and align to when Lowry expires.

Hornets take flyer on player young enough to take flyer in Robinson. Dipo most likely opts out of PO and ring chases.

Post #10 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:23 pm

NYG wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:
NYG wrote:
So the Knicks could get him for Fournier and Rose?

Why would Knicks do that? Fournier last year is TO, so he is same length as Hayward but less money. Rose is expiring on TO. Knicks would say no to Hayward zapping their cap flexibility.

Hayward has been pretty bad when healthy I guess? I don't watch a ton of Charlotte games

Charlotte is 7-12 when Hayward plays. They’re 3-14 when he doesn’t play. I think they’d say that he’s still a major positive impact on winning for them. :dontknow:

NYG · Post #11 » by **NYG** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:24 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
NYG wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:Why would Knicks do that? Fournier last year is TO, so he is same length as Hayward but less money. Rose is expiring on TO. Knicks would say no to Hayward zapping their cap flexibility.

Hayward has been pretty bad when healthy I guess? I don't watch a ton of Charlotte games

Charlotte is 7-12 when Hayward plays. They’re 3-14 when he doesn’t play. I think they’d say that he’s still a major positive impact on winning for them.

Is he even a talent upgrade to Fournier at this point?

Topofthekey · Post #12 » by **Topofthekey** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:25 pm

Wolveswin wrote:To try and find a solution…

Hayward

FOR

Robinson + Dipo

Heat shorten their years owed bad money and align to when Lowry expires.

Hornets take flyer on player young enough to take flyer in Robinson. Dipo most likely opts out of PO and ring chases.

Duncan Robinson is going to be 29 by the end of the season

He's not a young player

Wolveswin · Post #13 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:31 pm

Topofthekey wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:To try and find a solution…

Hayward

FOR

Robinson + Dipo

Heat shorten their years owed bad money and align to when Lowry expires.

Hornets take flyer on player young enough to take flyer in Robinson. Dipo most likely opts out of PO and ring chases.

Duncan Robinson is going to be 29 by the end of the season

He's not a young player

I didn’t say he was a young player. Young enough. Because he isn’t 33yo Hayward.

Resistance · Post #14 » by **Resistance** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:32 pm

Topofthekey wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:To try and find a solution…

Hayward

FOR

Robinson + Dipo

Heat shorten their years owed bad money and align to when Lowry expires.

Hornets take flyer on player young enough to take flyer in Robinson. Dipo most likely opts out of PO and ring chases.

Duncan Robinson is going to be 29 by the end of the season

He's not a young player

Hayward

Born: March 23, 1990 (Age: 32-283d) in Indianapolis, Indiana

Wolveswin · Post #15 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:33 pm

Resistance wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:To try and find a solution…

Hayward

FOR

Robinson + Dipo

Heat shorten their years owed bad money and align to when Lowry expires.

Hornets take flyer on player young enough to take flyer in Robinson. Dipo most likely opts out of PO and ring chases.

Duncan Robinson is going to be 29 by the end of the season

He's not a young player

Hayward

Born: March 23, 1990 (Age: 32-283d) in Indianapolis, Indiana

Read post exchange again. Top of the key was aging Robinson by a year, Hayward gets same.

Colbinii · Post #16 » by **Colbinii** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:35 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
NYG wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:Why would Knicks do that? Fournier last year is TO, so he is same length as Hayward but less money. Rose is expiring on TO. Knicks would say no to Hayward zapping their cap flexibility.

Hayward has been pretty bad when healthy I guess? I don't watch a ton of Charlotte games

Charlotte is 7-12 when Hayward plays. They’re 3-14 when he doesn’t play. I think they’d say that he’s still a major positive impact on winning for them.

Keep in mind 8 of the 19 games Hayward played in were with Ball [Ball has played in just 12 games].

The sample size is really small [19 games with, 17 games without] and his +/- family numbers aren't great [+4.4 On/Off].

Hayward is still a positive player [I wouldnt say major but thats a subjective term] but he misses time [a lot of time] which doesn't justify his current contract.

I dont see Charlotte doing the deal unless one of the protected 1sts are coming back.

Fournier + Rose + Protected 1st which becomes 2nds for Hayward

facothomas22 · Post #17 » by **facothomas22** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:35 pm

The issue here is that Gordan Haywood is negative salary. Unless the Hornets are willing to take on even worse salary than his, they won't get any value for Haywood and likely have to attach assets if they want any decent value players.

Wolveswin · Post #18 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:37 pm

Colbinii wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
NYG wrote:
Hayward has been pretty bad when healthy I guess? I don't watch a ton of Charlotte games

Charlotte is 7-12 when Hayward plays. They’re 3-14 when he doesn’t play. I think they’d say that he’s still a major positive impact on winning for them.

Keep in mind 8 of the 19 games Hayward played in were with Ball [Ball has played in just 12 games].

The sample size is really small [19 games with, 17 games without] and his +/- family numbers aren't great [+4.4 On/Off].

Hayward is still a positive player [I wouldnt say major but thats a subjective term] but he misses time [a lot of time] which doesn't justify his current contract.

I dont see Charlotte doing the deal unless one of the protected 1sts are coming back.

Fournier + Rose + Protected 1st which becomes 2nds for Hayward

I have 1st owed by Hornets.

Resistance · Post #19 » by **Resistance** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:38 pm

Wolveswin wrote:
Resistance wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:Duncan Robinson is going to be 29 by the end of the season

He's not a young player

Hayward

Born: March 23, 1990 (Age: 32-283d) in Indianapolis, Indiana

Read post exchange again. Top of the key was aging Robinson by a year, Hayward gets same.

I am not assigning any upside to Robinson. Just that Hayward is (4) years older and declining.

Wolveswin · Post #20 » by **Wolveswin** » Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:41 pm

Resistance wrote:
Wolveswin wrote:
Resistance wrote:
Hayward

Born: March 23, 1990 (Age: 32-283d) in Indianapolis, Indiana

Read post exchange again. Top of the key was aging Robinson by a year, Hayward gets same.

I am not assigning any upside to Robinson. Just that Hayward is (4) years older and declining.

I am not sure Robinson has any upside either. But does make more sense for Hornets (bottom team) to have a 4 year younger player on smaller (per year) contract.