Road to a Championship start here, 2022 Draft.

[Whole Truth]

Jonas was drafted to a 34 win Raptor team coming off a 2 yr tank.
He was traded to a 22 win Memphis team in place of their star Gasol, looking to blow up their team, trade Conley.
He was then traded to a 31 win Pels team

With 3J missing a full season in Memphis in his 2nd yr & Zion missing a full season in his first yr with Pels, Jonas starting outside his rookie yr on 3 teams with sub 35 wins has a win loss record of -

459 - 311

+ 146 wins

Setting the culture - Raptors won a Championship. Memphis have become a finals contender & now Pels hold the #1 seed.

2 words - Consistency & reliabllity, sets a stable foundation to build off of.

[Duke4life831]

Great seeing CJ hit his shots. Zion for the last 15 games has been at a MVP level. Its been great to see.

I also think its up to Herb and BI to earn their spots back whenever they come back. What I mean by that is, for Herb I dont think he should be penciled in as the starter. Trey has come in, done his role very well, he is causing defenses to spread out and that is big for the starting lineup.

Then with BI, Ive been vocal as anyone saying I think this should be a Zion 1st, BI 2nd, then a gap between everyone else because a trio heavy offense doesnt work. Well CJ's last 14 games he has put up 22/5/6 on 56 TS%. While BI has missed over half the season so far. At this point BI hasnt shown to stay available enough to be one of the main guys an offense is built around. Zion is a generational talent and you put up with the missed time and CJ is Mr reliable when it comes to being available. Its now up to BI to find a way to fit in and not disrupt what the team is doing, because there is no denying the team is clicking right now.

[Whole Truth]

(4-16), 1-7 from 3,, 6 TO's & team high -27, who am I ?.

The issue against Memphis is mot fatigue, not a lack of talent, not matchup. Memphis has taken most of the matches over the last 2 seasons with similar results. IMO, the rotation & game plan needs to change.

Anyone want to guess why Adams plays Pels better than any other team ?.

Not only does Jenkins have Adams sitting in the paint muscling everyone with no worry because Pels continue to attack him in the paint... Adams is longer, stronger than both Zion & Jonas, with Jackson as the defensive weakside help.. Mempis are the #1 rim protectimg team with that duo of strength & recovery. With them leaving Herb open, Pels are already playing 4-5 offensively, so whem CJ, who's a defensive liability, goes 1-7 from 3, it allows them to shrink the floor even more on Zion & Jonas who had 5 FGA's in the inefficient play, where his defensive contribution struggles. Brooks, who is their best perimeter defender was on Zion at the point of attack & CJ went 4-16 with 6TO's unable to punish that decision. Memphis lived off CJ's inefficiency, team high (-27). In turn Zion had a much tougher task trying to break a wall consisting of Brooks, Adams & 3J, the best rim defending team in the league, leading to (9 TO's). Unlike CJ's TO's, ZIon was facing the grunt of their best perimeter defender Brooks, the strength/rebounding of Adams, Jonas man in the same space, Herbs man cheating off of him. These Memphis beat downs is Jenkins bending Green over. Zion walked through 3J as the primary, with Adams sitting in the paint, 3J strength is the help/recovery. Pels allowing Adams to comdortably sit in the paint as the primary is why Adams/Memphis, continues to dominate this team.. Green trying to play to one of his/Zion strengths, is allowing Memphis to fully play to theirs.

Memphis has shown now over 3 games, they have a good enough wall to stop Zion if he wants to run into it... how about trying something different ? Zion, CJ combined had 18 missed shots inside the arc & 15 TO's. That's the equivelent of Zion going 1-11 from 3. Just saying..Invert the game, draw Adams & post 3J. Instead of trying to have Zion run into their wall & Jonas D have to play in the inefficiency of 10-26 shooting & 15 TO's, 31 empty possessions. while his offensive strength is limited to 5FGA's. You can start to see how Jenkins has run circles. Zion had to try & break that wall, while Memphis couldn't be bothered to put their best perimeter defender Brooks on CJ who was 4-16 with that gravity..

What difference a game & a day makes, MF's have gone quiet.

[Whole Truth]

Anyone catching the rig job going on in the Heat, LA match ?, lol.

My favorite sequence was Dedmon getting fouled on a rebound. He turns to complain to the ref baseline, which was stupid but that is based in the frustration, for how the game is being called on a whole. He gets strpped, steps in for what should have been a charge & gets a blocking foul & 1, LMAO.

NBA not even hiding, they're fake trash.

Heat r down 4 at the half but I doubt from what I've seen so far that I'm going to waste my time wathcing the 2nd half. No AD, no Lebron, no problem, refs stepping up their game to beyond obvious.

[Whole Truth]

Naji has to be the surprise of the season. He's been key all yr concerning all the injuries suffered & he looks to be getting better by the game..

Today vs Nets is no different.

[Whole Truth]

Also like clockwork. That 10-2 Nets run came off 3 consecutive CJ heavily guarded, forced misses. 1-6 but he will shoot his way out of it...

[Whole Truth]

Jose is back.. best game for him since getting injured.

[Whole Truth]

Sub out Jonas.. He has 3 boards & 5 FGA's..

[Whole Truth]

Let me see if I can take a different root in what I've been saying concerning CJ's fit with the starters & Jonas.

Magic traded Olidipo for Ibaka, they signed Biz in free agency to a large contract & thought combined with Gordon, they'd be good defendisvely.. What happened ? They were terrible defensively despite having a bunch of great indiviual defenders. Why would great individual defenders struggle to defend ? They couldn't put the ball in the hoop, they got killed in transition & often had to play defense without getting set. Offensive efficiency plays into defense just as defensive efficiency plays into offense. I've mentioned this before. Jonas has been on 3 seperate teams that have been top 5 defensively because he's efficient & closes possession with his ability to rebound but he has to play in efficiency to be effective. Sub 10 shots, you reduce his efficient offensive contribution. Officials like last night allowing Claxtion to man the rim by fouling.. kept him off the boards & out of the game.. Big reason Claxtion was a top performer for the Nets in +/- was officiating. Refs took the paint advantage away from NO's & Jonas. You saw that coming in the first 3 calls in the game where Jonas was complaining about getting hit in the head, whereas Herb who was doing a great job defending Durant, couldn't breathe on him.. Fouls & FT's being even is not the tale of the tape.

CJ is a scorer who can get tough buckets but he plays in inefficiency & needs to work his way into a rythym by plauing in isolation. That is what throws the entire team off it's offensive game & rythym. Like last game vs Houston, CJ led the team with 28pts but he also led them in +/- being the only Pel with a - 3 in a game they should have won by 15+.. Houston killed his units in transition. Vs Nets.. He once again led the team in scoring where some are saying where would this team be without his scoring ? ... his units were once again -16 in a 6pt loss while he put up a good individual performance.

I mentioned earlier in the game CJ taking 3 tough shots in succession that led to Nets early 10-2 run to get them back in the game.. CJ is having strong individual performances but his ISO ball is throwing the entire offensive rythym out of wack.. Players are watching him ISO & are going cold as a unit. CJ has his moments where he plays effectively in the flow of the offense but he doesn't do it enough. He looks off open players alot... One of those early misses, as off as Herb has been offensively, he was wide open corner 3 with CJ forcing over multiple defenders. Herb didn't have to take a shot.. make the right play & find the open man.. Trust your teammates...

If NO's insist on trying to incorporate CJ ineffecient ISO ball into the starting rotation, then take Jonas out of it. There's no consistency with streaky players & Jonas strength is not erasing mistakes. It's playing in efficiency.

[Whole Truth]

Pels getting a good whistle & wasting it. 10 Free points left on the line.

Mavs up 17. Pels 2-16 from 3 with some open looks & 10 missed FT's. Could easily be a close game.

I keep hearing Pels have one of the best shooting coaches..

[Whole Truth]

5-29 from 3, 17%, most of which were open looks
22-35 from the FT line, 13 missed, 62%

10 point loss.

I might as well be the shooting coach

[Duke4life831]

I will say there is one thing this team could use, an off ball mover/shooter. Dont get me wrong Trey is a sharpshooter, but Trey has very little off ball movement and shot versatility. And what I mean by that is, his feet need to be set and planted for him to shoot. No one really is a guy that can run off an off ball screen and curl, catch and turn and shoot. The closest is Graham, but he still isnt great moving off the ball and his shot has been horrific as of late (season 3pt% down to 32%).

A legit sharpshooter that you know you can pencil down for 38-42% from 3 and moves well off the ball and doesnt have to have his feet set and planted to get a shot. Also not saying he needs to be a big part of the offense, but a guy that can give you 10ppg without having to dribble and do it efficiently can be a nice pickup. After BI/CJ/Trey, not sure there are too many guys on a game to game basis I have faith theyre going to make their open 3s.

[Whole Truth]

I will say there is one thing this team could use, an off ball mover/shooter. Dont get me wrong Trey is a sharpshooter, but Trey has very little off ball movement and shot versatility. And what I mean by that is, his feet need to be set and planted for him to shoot. No one really is a guy that can run off an off ball screen and curl, catch and turn and shoot. The closest is Graham, but he still isnt great moving off the ball and his shot has been horrific as of late (season 3pt% down to 32%).

A legit sharpshooter that you know you can pencil down for 38-42% from 3 and moves well off the ball and doesnt have to have his feet set and planted to get a shot. Also not saying he needs to be a big part of the offense, but a guy that can give you 10ppg without having to dribble and do it efficiently can be a nice pickup. After BI/CJ/Trey, not sure there are too many guys on a game to game basis I have faith theyre going to make their open 3s.

Any chance Utah trades Clarkson at the deadline.

[Whole Truth]

I see posters flapping gums about those who wanted Jose to start over CJ as if all things r equal. lol

CJ has been better from the start of the season as a 2nd option with either Zion or BI out. 1st option with both out, where he can put up 20+ shots freely, shoot his way out of 1-8 starts to the game.

Tell me CJ advocates. When Zion & BI come back, is CJ still going to get 20+ shots a game ? Is either Zion or BI going to be the 3rd option to his usage ?

The main reason for CJ's early struggles is the fact he had to share the ball & usage with either or both ZIon & BI. The thing that has changed besides his recent play. There's no Zion & or BI. lol

Fact - This team all yr has played it's best ball with 1 or 2 of the top 3 options out.

I thought people would have learned after CJ''s last recent poor start not to jump the gun. Might want to wait till both Zion & BI r back with CJ before claiming right about Jose not being the better option with those 2 on court for the simple fact, ya dumb **** is making that claim with neither on court.

[Whole Truth]

Denver took one back from LA despite a 25-17 FT advantage without AD or Lebron again, lol. Let that be NO's. Jokic would have 27 FT's by himself while not getting t'd up for charging the refs on 2 occassions in a game that goes to OT. lol

Lakers with one possession wins without AD/Lebron over Heat/Kings (30+ FY's, in both). Difference between 6th & 9th pick 19-22, 17-24.

They have 2 days rest for Mavs, 2 days rest for Philly. Houston on the back end of their B2B. lol

[Duke4life831]

I will say there is one thing this team could use, an off ball mover/shooter. Dont get me wrong Trey is a sharpshooter, but Trey has very little off ball movement and shot versatility. And what I mean by that is, his feet need to be set and planted for him to shoot. No one really is a guy that can run off an off ball screen and curl, catch and turn and shoot. The closest is Graham, but he still isnt great moving off the ball and his shot has been horrific as of late (season 3pt% down to 32%).

A legit sharpshooter that you know you can pencil down for 38-42% from 3 and moves well off the ball and doesnt have to have his feet set and planted to get a shot. Also not saying he needs to be a big part of the offense, but a guy that can give you 10ppg without having to dribble and do it efficiently can be a nice pickup. After BI/CJ/Trey, not sure there are too many guys on a game to game basis I have faith theyre going to make their open 3s.

Any chance Utah trades Clarkson at the deadline.

Clarkson would be a really bad fit. Would just be another guy that doesnt know how to play off ball and loves to create his own shot. Im talking more like a Corey Kispert kind of player. Kispert has yet to make a 3pt shot that wasnt assisted on, he averages just 0.6 dribbles per touch. His off ball movement is insane. I think a player like that could be a nice fit with this team. 20 minutes off the bench but when he's in there he provides legit spacing and real good off ball movement. Because ya that is one thing I have noticed with this team, not too many guys move well out on the perimeter. Also not saying Kispert specifically, just a player like that.

But I guess the next question would be who does he take minutes from? Graham would be the easy choice I guess, but when everyone is healthy Im not sure he is going to be getting too many minutes.

Again not a desperate need or anything, just a small thing that I think could help this offense out a little.

[Duke4life831]

I see posters flapping gums about those who wanted Jose to start over CJ as if all things r equal. lol

CJ has been better from the start of the season as a 2nd option with either Zion or BI out. 1st option with both out, where he can put up 20+ shots freely, shoot his way out of 1-8 starts to the game.

Tell me CJ advocates. When Zion & BI come back, is CJ still going to get 20+ shots a game ? Is either Zion or BI going to be the 3rd option to his usage ?

The main reason for CJ's early struggles is the fact he had to share the ball & usage with either or both ZIon & BI. The thing that has changed besides his recent play. There's no Zion & or BI. lol

Fact - This team all yr has played it's best ball with 1 or 2 of the top 3 options out.

I thought people would have learned after CJ''s last recent poor start not to jump the gun. Might want to wait till both Zion & BI r back with CJ before claiming right about Jose not being the better option with those 2 on court for the simple fact, ya dumb **** is making that claim with neither on court.

Ill say this as one of the louder criticizers of CJ. This is where having him comes in handy. It seems like you cant even count on BI to play 60 games and Zion has yet to prove he can stay healthy as well. So I guess the question of the fit for all 3 of them is kind of a mute point since it seems like its impossible for all 3 to be healthy at the same time.

But ya it still remains to be seen on how the offense is going to look when those 3 are together. I know in their limited minutes they have a very good offensive rating together (122). But that was really before a much heavier influx of point Zion. And its not like CJ was really lighting it up when those 3 were playing together, also I guess I should also mention that BI/Zion with no CJ has a 126 offensive rating. So the question still remains, is their a benefit of playing all 3 together.

But massive props to CJ for actually being available and holding the ship together. That definitely cant be overlooked.

[Whole Truth]

I see posters flapping gums about those who wanted Jose to start over CJ as if all things r equal. lol

CJ has been better from the start of the season as a 2nd option with either Zion or BI out. 1st option with both out, where he can put up 20+ shots freely, shoot his way out of 1-8 starts to the game.

Tell me CJ advocates. When Zion & BI come back, is CJ still going to get 20+ shots a game ? Is either Zion or BI going to be the 3rd option to his usage ?

The main reason for CJ's early struggles is the fact he had to share the ball & usage with either or both ZIon & BI. The thing that has changed besides his recent play. There's no Zion & or BI. lol

Fact - This team all yr has played it's best ball with 1 or 2 of the top 3 options out.

I thought people would have learned after CJ''s last recent poor start not to jump the gun. Might want to wait till both Zion & BI r back with CJ before claiming right about Jose not being the better option with those 2 on court for the simple fact, ya dumb **** is making that claim with neither on court.

Ill say this as one of the louder criticizers of CJ. This is where having him comes in handy. It seems like you cant even count on BI to play 60 games and Zion has yet to prove he can stay healthy as well. So I guess the question of the fit for all 3 of them is kind of a mute point since it seems like its impossible for all 3 to be healthy at the same time.

But ya it still remains to be seen on how the offense is going to look when those 3 are together. I know in their limited minutes they have a very good offensive rating together (122). But that was really before a much heavier influx of point Zion. And its not like CJ was really lighting it up when those 3 were playing together, also I guess I should also mention that BI/Zion with no CJ has a 126 offensive rating. So the question still remains, is their a benefit of playing all 3 together.

But massive props to CJ for actually being available and holding the ship together. That definitely cant be overlooked.

That's the point though Duke. The criticism was about balance & fit not their individual talent (They're making it about who's the better individual talent). With either or both Zion & BI out for extended periods we still don't know how their combined fit will progress. So far the team has performed best with either 1 or 2 of the 3 out, fact.

If anything, CJ producing best as a #2 with one out or better yet, as the primary, with both out. Lends to the point of him being a #1 option coming off the bench, not that he won't finish games. Green can close with him once he finds a rythym against lesser comp as the clear #1 not overthinking trying to involve Zion & BI... It resolves a streaky CJ shooting his way into a rythym early taking attempts away from Zion & BI out the gate for what were early slow starts with all 3 healthy, small sample. The bench units with Zion/Nance/CJ carried/lifted those slow first Q's..

I understand, name, rep & salary complicates the situation but LA found a better balance moving the former MVP on a 40m contract to the bench. Does that mean Beverley or Shroeder whoever took his starting spot is a better individual talent ?.. Davis goes down & Lebron sits, does he not then take a more prominant role...

Simplistic view points distortes the real criticism behind bringing CJ off the bench.

[Duke4life831]

I see posters flapping gums about those who wanted Jose to start over CJ as if all things r equal. lol

CJ has been better from the start of the season as a 2nd option with either Zion or BI out. 1st option with both out, where he can put up 20+ shots freely, shoot his way out of 1-8 starts to the game.

Tell me CJ advocates. When Zion & BI come back, is CJ still going to get 20+ shots a game ? Is either Zion or BI going to be the 3rd option to his usage ?

The main reason for CJ's early struggles is the fact he had to share the ball & usage with either or both ZIon & BI. The thing that has changed besides his recent play. There's no Zion & or BI. lol

Fact - This team all yr has played it's best ball with 1 or 2 of the top 3 options out.

I thought people would have learned after CJ''s last recent poor start not to jump the gun. Might want to wait till both Zion & BI r back with CJ before claiming right about Jose not being the better option with those 2 on court for the simple fact, ya dumb **** is making that claim with neither on court.

Ill say this as one of the louder criticizers of CJ. This is where having him comes in handy. It seems like you cant even count on BI to play 60 games and Zion has yet to prove he can stay healthy as well. So I guess the question of the fit for all 3 of them is kind of a mute point since it seems like its impossible for all 3 to be healthy at the same time.

But ya it still remains to be seen on how the offense is going to look when those 3 are together. I know in their limited minutes they have a very good offensive rating together (122). But that was really before a much heavier influx of point Zion. And its not like CJ was really lighting it up when those 3 were playing together, also I guess I should also mention that BI/Zion with no CJ has a 126 offensive rating. So the question still remains, is their a benefit of playing all 3 together.

But massive props to CJ for actually being available and holding the ship together. That definitely cant be overlooked.

That's the point though Duke. The criticism was about balance & fit not their individual talent (They're making it about who's the better individual talent). With either or both Zion & BI out for extended periods we still don't know how their combined fit will progress. So far the team has performed best with either 1 or 2 of the 3 out, fact.

If anything, CJ producing best as a #2 with one out or better yet, as the primary, with both out. Lends to the point of him being a #1 option coming off the bench, not that he won't finish games. Green can close with him once he finds a rythym against lesser comp as the clear #1 not overthinking trying to involve Zion & BI... It resolves a streaky CJ shooting his way into a rythym early taking attempts away from Zion & BI out the gate for what were early slow starts with all 3 healthy, small sample. The bench units with Zion/Nance/CJ carried/lifted those slow first Q's..

I understand, name, rep & salary complicates the situation but LA found a better balance moving the former MVP on a 40m contract to the bench. Does that mean Beverley or Shroeder whoever took his starting spot is a better individual talent ?.. Davis goes down & Lebron sits, does he not then take a more prominant role...

Simplistic view points distortes the real criticism behind bringing CJ off the bench.

Ya dont get me wrong, I still got the same exact questions with the trio today as I did during the summer. Because I do think its pretty simple, you can have an offense with 2 dominant players (shots and ball time) but you cant have 3. If you want that elite 3rd, he has to be a Klay/Bojan kind of player. Those guys can get you 20ppg on 14 FGAs and barely touch and dribble the ball.

BI and CJ arent those kinds of players. The closest player to that would be Zion. Zion can get you 22ppg with a Time Per Possession around 2. And that is how Zion was being used his first 12 games. 22ppg on 61 TS% and a Time Per Possession of 2.4. The flip side of that though is, Zion over his last 17 games 28ppg on 67 TS% and a Time Per Possession of 4.9.

It goes beyond those numbers as well, point Zion (essentially Zion with the ball and creating from the perimeter) I think puts a completely different level of pressure on a defense. I think really the only negative to this style is if you dont think Zion can handle playing this style (talking about his body holding up and not getting injured). But I think for this team to reach its ceiling, that is the kind of play and style you need from Zion.

Which again leads to the next question. You got 1 more spot open for a guy to score and create with the ball and you got 2 guys that essentially need that role to maximize their skill set. And when you put the 3rd one in there, do you actually see an improvement with the offense or have you reached the law of diminishing returns? Again super small sample, but right now the offense of just BI/Zion has out performed the offense with all 3 out there. Was CJ just in a shooting slump at the time? Was he in a slump because he was struggling to fit into that all 3 guys reduce their roles so all 3 can get a chunk of the pie? Remains to be seen but Ive been pretty vocal on my views on that one.

But ya sadly I think we just havent seen enough of all 3 healthy at once for either side to plant a victory flag for their argument haha.

[Whole Truth]

Ya dont get me wrong, I still got the same exact questions with the trio today as I did during the summer. Because I do think its pretty simple, you can have an offense with 2 dominant players (shots and ball time) but you cant have 3. If you want that elite 3rd, he has to be a Klay/Bojan kind of player. Those guys can get you 20ppg on 14 FGAs and barely touch and dribble the ball.

BI and CJ arent those kinds of players. The closest player to that would be Zion. Zion can get you 22ppg with a Time Per Possession around 2. And that is how Zion was being used his first 12 games. 22ppg on 61 TS% and a Time Per Possession of 2.4. The flip side of that though is, Zion over his last 17 games 28ppg on 67 TS% and a Time Per Possession of 4.9.

It goes beyond those numbers as well, point Zion (essentially Zion with the ball and creating from the perimeter) I think puts a completely different level of pressure on a defense. I think really the only negative to this style is if you dont think Zion can handle playing this style (talking about his body holding up and not getting injured). But I think for this team to reach its ceiling, that is the kind of play and style you need from Zion.

Which again leads to the next question. You got 1 more spot open for a guy to score and create with the ball and you got 2 guys that essentially need that role to maximize their skill set. And when you put the 3rd one in there, do you actually see an improvement with the offense or have you reached the law of diminishing returns? Again super small sample, but right now the offense of just BI/Zion has out performed the offense with all 3 out there. Was CJ just in a shooting slump at the time? Was he in a slump because he was struggling to fit into that all 3 guys reduce their roles so all 3 can get a chunk of the pie? Remains to be seen but Ive been pretty vocal on my views on that one.

But ya sadly I think we just havent seen enough of all 3 healthy at once for either side to plant a victory flag for their argument haha.

Great post.. I don't think it's a coincidence CJ's game improved with one out & is at it's best now with both out. He's showing he's best & needs to be on ball, where with Zion & BI I think he struggled playing in that off ball role as a 3rd option. It's also note worthy that everyone of the big 3 has performed best with 1 or 2 of them out. So I think there skillsets are diminished outside of Zion's efficiecny as u posted.

Offensively & defensively, it's a weird balance top to bottom.. With Herb in the rotation & CJ struggling from range... This team has it's worst win percentage with Zion playing. Herb gets injured & the offense hums. Easy to wall Zion off with teams sagging off Herb & Jonas man sitting in the paint.. This is where we'd have to question Jonas/Herb's fit too. Unfortunately, Nance cannot log heavy starters minutes without potential for injury in that role.

Maybe a deadline trade for a defensive stretch 5, if available & the asking price is right.

I still feel this team would be best served letting Zion & BI kick off games & have CJ in that Manu Westbrook off the bench supersub role/closing games in a ryhtym built against lesser comp.