Miami Heat 22-23 Regular Season Thread 2.0

[MettaWorldPanda]

Lowry landing with the Pelicans makes a ton of sense. Even a lot more then the Bulls. They are a young team knocking on the door of the West first seed that’s just missing a vet PG to team up with McCollum. It also reunites Lowry with Valencuinas for another championship run.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

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[DayofMourning]

Thanks for the info ICC. It fits what many if us had already deciphered.

We've been making mistakes for 8 years in a row now. We made a masterful trade to get Jimmy when his asking price was low due to the baggage. Since then we've made every effort to have 6'5" players tag team with Bam to solidify our front court and paid premium contracts to average players.

We've made collosal mistakes that can't be overcome unless we trade Butler.

[AirP.]

Thanks for the info ICC. It fits what many if us had already deciphered.

We've been making mistakes for 8 years in a row now. We made a masterful trade to get Jimmy when his asking price was low due to the baggage. Since then we've made every effort to have 6'5" players tag team with Bam to solidify our front court and paid premium contracts to average players.

We've made colossal mistakes that can't be overcome unless we trade Butler.

The issue with trading Butler is that you're now out of any chance to contend for a number of years. Miami can still be solid, possibly good but no real chance of contending so at the high level view you're now going waste 2-3 years just to try to get back on track building for a championship unless someone else forces their way to Miami which I'm not sure they will any time soon.

Ownership seems to be good spending up to the tax on the team unless you acquire a superstar (meaning basically a solid or better contender), so there's your minimum. It would also seem that the owner has agreed in the past, to being ok with going in the tax 1 year while transitioning from a high-priced player i.e. Lowry to another lower priced player but with how things are going is wanting to minimize that cost.

I'd expect Lowry to not be with Miami come opening night next year, possibly gone this season which will create more problems with Butler, and with that he may be moved this summer (but you probably aren't getting a whole lot for him with his age, type of game), but this team won't be a contender with those moves and with that, wasting some Bam seasons as he's hitting his prime. Miami will be good enough not to be in the high lottery and not good enough to contend for a championship, back to the middle (where they are currently because of the horrible contracts the FO has given out).

If Butler and Lowry are moved, Oladipo could be retained, Strus, Vincent and Yurtseven could also be retained and whoever you got in those trades. Oladipo, Herro, Martin, Jovic, Bam has some upside but probably not enough to be one of the better teams in the East anytime soon, Miami's going to need another big trade to fall in their laps.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

We have the assets to build a contender THIS year and I’ll keep saying it until I’m blue in the face. The higher ups need to get on the same page

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Also Micky needs to sell to cover his ass on carnival sucking, Wade and Shaq will gladly form a team to buy which will also be the final deciding factor in Mitchell coming in future free agency

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Read on Twitter

He’d love to be in Miami lol

[DayofMourning]

Thanks for the info ICC. It fits what many if us had already deciphered.

We've been making mistakes for 8 years in a row now. We made a masterful trade to get Jimmy when his asking price was low due to the baggage. Since then we've made every effort to have 6'5" players tag team with Bam to solidify our front court and paid premium contracts to average players.

We've made colossal mistakes that can't be overcome unless we trade Butler.

The issue with trading Butler is that you're now out of any chance to contend for a number of years. Miami can still be solid, possibly good but no real chance of contending so at the high level view you're now going waste 2-3 years just to try to get back on track building for a championship unless someone else forces their way to Miami which I'm not sure they will any time soon.

Ownership seems to be good spending up to the tax on the team unless you acquire a superstar (meaning basically a solid or better contender), so there's your minimum. It would also seem that the owner has agreed in the past, to being ok with going in the tax 1 year while transitioning from a high-priced player i.e. Lowry to another lower priced player but with how things are going is wanting to minimize that cost.

I'd expect Lowry to not be with Miami come opening night next year, possibly gone this season which will create more problems with Butler, and with that he may be moved this summer (but you probably aren't getting a whole lot for him with his age, type of game), but this team won't be a contender with those moves and with that, wasting some Bam seasons as he's hitting his prime. Miami will be good enough not to be in the high lottery and not good enough to contend for a championship, back to the middle (where they are currently because of the horrible contracts the FO has given out).

If Butler and Lowry are moved, Oladipo could be retained, Strus, Vincent and Yurtseven could also be retained and whoever you got in those trades. Oladipo, Herro, Martin, Jovic, Bam has some upside but probably not enough to be one of the better teams in the East anytime soon, Miami's going to need another big trade to fall in their laps.

They've dug themselves a hole for sure. I think the way they rebounded with Butler after paying Dion, JJ, Hassan and TJ emboldened them for the worse. They figure they can recover no matter the extent of the mistakes they make.

As for our contending window...if you keep Butler, then you treadmill because he's about to get the full Heat salary service by being a shell of his former self while making mega money. Hard to be a true contender when you have his deal, Lowry deal, Duncan's deal, Max's upcoming deal, etc. They can't afford to keep a semi valuable bench piece in Strus because they've paid Lowry 10 times what he's worth.

We're out of contention, no matter if we tank or we keep these guys.

[AirP.]

We have the assets to build a contender THIS year and I’ll keep saying it until I’m blue in the face. The higher ups need to get on the same page

The FO has created this salary issue for the team and the only real way to get out of it is to spend more in the short term. The only problem with that is that they've not demonstrated that they can be smart with money since LeBron left. This current issue of overpaying Lowry and Robinson by a TON isn't the first time... just going off memory they maxed Whiteside, gave too much money to Waiters, T.Johnson, J.Johnson and quite possibly Herro unless he becomes solid on the defensive end. It didn't matter that much overpaying people while under the tax, but screwing up to the point where it's costing the owner a 10 mil dollar check and paying the luxury tax is a little bit much. The FO screwed up greatly and now it's time to make some really tough decisions. I can't stress how bad that 2021 plan was or the Band-Aid (Lowry) was that they tried to put over that plan when it failed.

On a side note, they shouldn't feel too bad moving Lowry since he made them part of a bidding war which has somewhat created this situation. What management needs to do it have a heart to heart with Butler, see if they can get on the same page but basically give him 2 options, be good moving Lowry and continue trying to build a contender or ask Butler for a list of teams he'd be interested in being traded to, maybe LeBron would recruit Butler and Miami could get those 2 potentially very high draft picks of LA. I do think NY/Thibs would push to acquire Butler which might net a couple of lower picks and maybe some players, possibly RJ or Randall.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Just throwing it out there but Duncan Jovic and a 1st for Clarkson and Vanderbilt works. Maybe send Strus or Gabe if needed as sweetener or to a 3rd team for some sort of asset going to the Jazz. Lauri gets a euro guy to develop next to him, Jazz get worse for a better pick and get a 1st

[DayofMourning]

We have the assets to build a contender THIS year and I’ll keep saying it until I’m blue in the face. The higher ups need to get on the same page

Seems like everyone who's an important decision maker is at odds with each other on how to build this team.

We're like a **** Picasso painting.

[AirP.]

Just throwing it out there but Duncan Jovic and a 1st for Clarkson and Vanderbilt works. Maybe send Strus or Gabe if needed as sweetener or to a 3rd team for some sort of asset going to the Jazz. Lauri gets a euro guy to develop next to him, Jazz get worse for a better pick and get a 1st

In a podcast someone mentioned Utah moving Clarkson, but an insider says ownership really likes Clarkson and wants to keep him.

Miami has to CUT money for next year in whatever moves it does, that means a player on an expiring contract they're willing to let walk next year. Moving Lowry this year means whatever expiring's they get they can save on next year. Moving Lowry next year means they can only cut ~75% of his contract because of the 125% rule unless he's traded to a team with capspace.

[ShulaDon92]

Not necessarily, he’s an expiring contract. That’s what we’re looking for.

Expiring contracts that we could affordably fit into our salary structure if we need to resign them. I don’t put a player like Turner under this category. It sounds like he’s demanding Ayton money. Vucevic makes a lot of sense cause at his age he should be reasonable to resign.

Adding Vuc Dragic and Naz would fix a lot if not all of our issues. You could maybe work in 1 more deal there for a high level role player if you needed to sell ownership on this team being able to win it all

Vuc,Naz is an insanely dreamy frontcourt package. Dream on, i love it. It would fix any size issues. Then we can focus on shooting.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

We have the assets to build a contender THIS year and I’ll keep saying it until I’m blue in the face. The higher ups need to get on the same page

The FO has created this salary issue for the team and the only real way to get out of it is to spend more in the short term. The only problem with that is that they've not demonstrated that they can be smart with money since LeBron has left. This current issue of overpaying Lowry and Robinson by a TON isn't the first time... just going off memory they maxed Whiteside, gave too much money to Waiters, T.Johnson, J.Johnson and quite possibly Herro unless he becomes solid on the defensive end. It didn't matter that much overpaying people while under the tax, but screwing up to the point where it's costing the owner a 10 mil dollar check and paying the luxury tax is a little bit much. The FO screwed up greatly and now it's time to make some really tough decisions. I can't stress how bad that 2021 plan was or the Band-Aid (Lowry) was that they tried to put over that plan when it failed.

On a side note, they shouldn't feel too bad moving Lowry since he made them part of a bidding war which has somewhat created this situation. What management needs to do it have a heart to heart with Butler, see if they can get on the same page but basically give him 2 options, be good moving Lowry and continue trying to build a contender or ask Butler for a list of teams he'd be interested in being traded to, maybe LeBron would recruit Butler and Miami could get those 2 potentially very high draft picks of LA. I do think NY/Thibs would push to acquire Butler which might net a couple of lower picks and maybe some players, possibly RJ or Randall.

Putting Lowry Duncan Dedmon Martin Jovic 3 1sts and whatever 2nds we have can fix your salary issues AND build a contender in the short term. FO has to get creative and more than anything just needs to wake the fuxk up

[MettaWorldPanda]

Writing has been in the wall with Lowry the moment Riley put him on notice last offseason about being out of shape. Probably around the same time Riley had the conversation with Butler.

[AirP.]

We have the assets to build a contender THIS year and I’ll keep saying it until I’m blue in the face. The higher ups need to get on the same page

The FO has created this salary issue for the team and the only real way to get out of it is to spend more in the short term. The only problem with that is that they've not demonstrated that they can be smart with money since LeBron has left. This current issue of overpaying Lowry and Robinson by a TON isn't the first time... just going off memory they maxed Whiteside, gave too much money to Waiters, T.Johnson, J.Johnson and quite possibly Herro unless he becomes solid on the defensive end. It didn't matter that much overpaying people while under the tax, but screwing up to the point where it's costing the owner a 10 mil dollar check and paying the luxury tax is a little bit much. The FO screwed up greatly and now it's time to make some really tough decisions. I can't stress how bad that 2021 plan was or the Band-Aid (Lowry) was that they tried to put over that plan when it failed.

On a side note, they shouldn't feel too bad moving Lowry since he made them part of a bidding war which has somewhat created this situation. What management needs to do it have a heart to heart with Butler, see if they can get on the same page but basically give him 2 options, be good moving Lowry and continue trying to build a contender or ask Butler for a list of teams he'd be interested in being traded to, maybe LeBron would recruit Butler and Miami could get those 2 potentially very high draft picks of LA. I do think NY/Thibs would push to acquire Butler which might net a couple of lower picks and maybe some players, possibly RJ or Randall.

Putting Lowry Duncan Dedmon Martin Jovic 3 1sts and whatever 2nds we have can fix your salary issues AND build a contender in the short term. FO has to get creative and more than anything just needs to wake the fuxk up

You don't morgage the future because you FU. It was on full display this summer, the FO stopped EVERYTHING to have a chance at a superstar. To me that says they know what must be done if they can't get a superstar but are trying to get the owner to change their mind.

Moving Lowry might mean they have to move Butler. I think they've run out of good will with him. He watched Crowder, Tucker and maybe Lowry leave. The one year they did nothing, Butler did nothing in the playoffs and they were swept. It may be time to move on which is probably the end of both Butler's and Miami's shot at a championship. It's going to take a few years and some good luck to get back into contention for Miami if they make the move.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Adding Clarkson Vanderbilt and Reid gives you possibly the best bench in the league and nice building blocks as role players next to Bam Herro and whatever star bam ends up recruiting.

Lowry/Dipo
Herro/Clarkson
Jimmy/Strus
Naz/Martin
Bam/Vanderbilt

Now we’re cooking. If you absolutely have to cut money then send Lowry to the pelicans with pelicans players going to the spurs with an asset and an expiring like JRich coming back to Miami. Boom.

You better believe we’ll be involved in a 3 team deal if Lowry and/or Duncan are going out.

Dipo/Gabe
Herro/Clarkson (PG over Gabe and slot JRich here?)
Jimmy/Strus or Jrich
Naz/Martin
Bam/Vanderbilt

Get creative and get on the same page Pat Andy and Micky!!!

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Hire me; I’ll build a contender this season that saves salary next season and doesn’t mortgage the future

[DayofMourning]

The part that blows my mind is we are somehow okay with just running with a mega contract like Butler and a bunch of g leaguers so long as we don't pay a tax bill. That's beyond disappointing.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

I am the light in all this darkness. I can make deals with Ainge and with Klutch.