Killian Hayes, most complete PG of the 2020 class

reanimator · Post #201 » by **reanimator** » Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:15 pm

Yeah, I don't expect all star, but to be a competent rotational guard would be a huge win after looking like he'd wash out of the league relatively quickly.

Big J · Post #202 » by **Big J** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 2:48 am

Remember when dudes here were flexing nuts over this kid being a bust? Oh yea, I didn't forget. He looks hella solid now. Definitely getting Conley vibes from him. Elite defensively & a solid playmaker.

EvanZ · Post #203 » by **EvanZ** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:20 am

Big J wrote:Remember when dudes here were flexing nuts over this kid being a bust? Oh yea, I didn't forget. He looks hella solid now. Definitely getting Conley vibes from him. Elite defensively & a solid playmaker.

You might want to save the flex for when he gets above 50% TS.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Mr Peanut · Post #204 » by **Mr Peanut** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 11:30 am

EvanZ wrote:
Big J wrote:Remember when dudes here were flexing nuts over this kid being a bust? Oh yea, I didn't forget. He looks hella solid now. Definitely getting Conley vibes from him. Elite defensively & a solid playmaker.

You might want to save the flex for when he gets above 50% TS.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

I know it is cherry picking to a degree, but if you remove the first 11 games of the season where Killian was shooting historically bad and just look at the last 31 games (which still equates to almost 75% of the season) his TS is 50.7%. Yes, not quite at league average yet but along with his good playmaking and excellent defense I think Pistons fans are pretty happy with how he's progressing given how the season started.

EvanZ · Post #205 » by **EvanZ** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 2:50 pm

Mr Peanut wrote:
EvanZ wrote:
Big J wrote:Remember when dudes here were flexing nuts over this kid being a bust? Oh yea, I didn't forget. He looks hella solid now. Definitely getting Conley vibes from him. Elite defensively & a solid playmaker.

You might want to save the flex for when he gets above 50% TS.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

I know it is cherry picking to a degree, but if you remove the first 11 games of the season where Killian was shooting historically bad and just look at the last 31 games (which still equates to almost 75% of the season) his TS is 50.7%. Yes, not quite at league average yet but along with his good playmaking and excellent defense I think Pistons fans are pretty happy with how he's progressing given how the season started.

"Not quite at league average"....League average right now is 57.7% TS***. He's at 47%. Even if he was at 50%, that would be bad.

***Do people around here understand how much offense has risen the last few years?

reanimator · Post #206 » by **reanimator** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 2:56 pm

He is a "bust" for where he was picked but the sentiment he would be out of the league does not seem like it will come true. Once again, he didn't start flashing rotational guard ability until the end of November, so his full season TS% isn't really indicative of what fans are seeing. Nothing to beat your chest about, but its nice that he won't be a completely wasted pick.

Colbinii · Post #207 » by **Colbinii** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:47 pm

Mr Peanut wrote:
EvanZ wrote:
Big J wrote:Remember when dudes here were flexing nuts over this kid being a bust? Oh yea, I didn't forget. He looks hella solid now. Definitely getting Conley vibes from him. Elite defensively & a solid playmaker.

You might want to save the flex for when he gets above 50% TS.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

I know it is cherry picking to a degree, but if you remove the first 11 games of the season where Killian was shooting historically bad and just look at the last 31 games (which still equates to almost 75% of the season) his TS is 50.7%. Yes, not quite at league average yet but along with his good playmaking and excellent defense I think Pistons fans are pretty happy with how he's progressing given how the season started.

Most people are happy when dog **** becomes coco puffs.

clyde21 · Post #208 » by **clyde21** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 7:18 pm

Mr Peanut wrote:
EvanZ wrote:
Big J wrote:Remember when dudes here were flexing nuts over this kid being a bust? Oh yea, I didn't forget. He looks hella solid now. Definitely getting Conley vibes from him. Elite defensively & a solid playmaker.

You might want to save the flex for when he gets above 50% TS.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

I know it is cherry picking to a degree, but if you remove the first 11 games of the season where Killian was shooting historically bad and just look at the last 31 games (which still equates to almost 75% of the season) his TS is 50.7%. Yes, not quite at league average yet but along with his good playmaking and excellent defense I think Pistons fans are pretty happy with how he's progressing given how the season started.

50.7% 10 years ago would be decent, today it's pretty terrible, so even when you're filtering for his better games it's still terrible, he also still can't get to the line at all.

either way don't want to hate on the kid too much, glad he's finding ways to improve after a bad start to his career, and that draft honestly after a handful of players (Hali, Ant, Melo, Bane, Maxey) is just terrible altogether.

EvanZ · Post #209 » by **EvanZ** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 7:33 pm

Dwyane Wade's career best TS% was 58.8%, which is now barely above league average.

Big J · Post #210 » by **Big J** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 9:19 pm

No one talks about Draymond's TS%.

clyde21 · Post #211 » by **clyde21** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 9:37 pm

Big J wrote:No one talks about Draymond's TS%.

or Ariana Grande's

EvanZ · Post #212 » by **EvanZ** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 9:45 pm

Big J wrote:No one talks about Draymond's TS%.

It's hilarious that you didn't bother to look up the fact that Draymond's TS% right now is 57% and for his career it's 53.6%. :lol:

Big J · Post #213 » by **Big J** » Thu Jan 12, 2023 11:00 pm

clyde21 wrote:
Big J wrote:No one talks about Draymond's TS%.

or Ariana Grande's

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

EvanZ · Post #214 » by **EvanZ** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 3:56 am

Big J wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
Big J wrote:No one talks about Draymond's TS%.

or Ariana Grande's

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

Exactly his point man :lol:

Mr Peanut · Post #215 » by **Mr Peanut** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 2:36 pm

EvanZ wrote:
Mr Peanut wrote:
EvanZ wrote:You might want to save the flex for when he gets above 50% TS.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

I know it is cherry picking to a degree, but if you remove the first 11 games of the season where Killian was shooting historically bad and just look at the last 31 games (which still equates to almost 75% of the season) his TS is 50.7%. Yes, not quite at league average yet but along with his good playmaking and excellent defense I think Pistons fans are pretty happy with how he's progressing given how the season started.

"Not quite at league average"....League average right now is 57.7% TS***. He's at 47%. Even if he was at 50%, that would be bad.

***Do people around here understand how much offense has risen the last few years?

Granted, I was using the oft-quoted 55% TS as being my league average metric but obviously using 57.7 shows Killian has a long way to go in terms of shooting efficiency.

I think the point some were trying to make is that he is currently looking significantly better than earlier in the thread when most were crapping on him for being a bust. And a large part of his improved play is attributed to his playmaking/defense, and posters coming along with TS% one-liners doesn't negate all of the good parts of his game he has shown.

Colbinii wrote:Most people are happy when dog **** becomes coco puffs.

Thanks for your enlightening contribution to the discussion.

Big J · Post #216 » by **Big J** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 3:00 pm

What about Marcus Smart? Look at his TS% the first 4 years in the league. Does anyone ever mention Marcus Smarts TS%? Also Rondo has had many years of sub par shooting. Dude was the best player in a series that included Lebron.

EvanZ · Post #217 » by **EvanZ** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 3:37 pm

Big J wrote:What about Marcus Smart? Look at his TS% the first 4 years in the league. Does anyone ever mention Marcus Smarts TS%?

At the time? Absolutely people talked about it. You were in diapers I guess. :lol:

You do realize Marcus Smart actually had to get a lot better right? The league average was also 4 points lower back then.

Big J · Post #218 » by **Big J** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 3:44 pm

EvanZ wrote:
Big J wrote:What about Marcus Smart? Look at his TS% the first 4 years in the league. Does anyone ever mention Marcus Smarts TS%?

At the time? Absolutely people talked about it. You were in diapers I guess.

You do realize Marcus Smart actually had to get a lot better right? The league average was also 4 points lower back then.

Sooo, prime Rondo would be unplayable in today’s league then?

clyde21 · Post #219 » by **clyde21** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 3:58 pm

would Lizzo be unplayable in yesterday's league?

Colbinii · Post #220 » by **Colbinii** » Fri Jan 13, 2023 4:25 pm

Big J wrote:
EvanZ wrote:
Big J wrote:What about Marcus Smart? Look at his TS% the first 4 years in the league. Does anyone ever mention Marcus Smarts TS%?

At the time? Absolutely people talked about it. You were in diapers I guess.

You do realize Marcus Smart actually had to get a lot better right? The league average was also 4 points lower back then.

Sooo, prime Rondo would be unplayable in today’s league then?

Yeah, probably.

Teams would sag off him even more now than they did back then, his pick and roll game would be easy to defend with a simple drop-coverage scheme.