2023 NBA Draft

[azcatz11]

Why does no one talk about isiah Wong??? I seriously don’t get it

i've mentioned him a few times in one of these sleepers threads last couple of seasons

Love his ability to get to the rim and he’s super strong. I wish he was a little taller. Reminds me of a slightly less athletic and less long Jordan clarkson

[CptCrunch]

am I the only one that thinks Ausar > Amen? still don't understand why almost everyone universally has Amen above him.

I'll say this. Ausar looks the easier of the two to integrate into a team. Defence is probably more fundamentally sound, he makes sensible decisions, the shot is clearly further distancing itself from Amens. He rebounds and blocks well. I mean, he's a lottery prospect for good reason.

Amen though has the ridiculous first step, but more so has court vision and speed of execution that Ausar can only dream of.

Above that, I know a fair few sets of twin boys and there seems to always be a leader and a follower. Amen is unquestionably the leader. Do I have reservations about how Amen will fare without Ausar beside him? I really don't. Would I be nervous about Ausar in a world with no Amen? That's one to ponder.

Amen takes too many risks with his prodigious talent and so maybe you're better off with the more submissive Ausar, who plays within himself more. But star upside apart, its Amens fire and focus and drive (while staying humble, polite, professional and hardworking) that excites me most.

And Ausar's second-fiddle-syndrome could be a blessing or cause him to drown in the alpha environment.

I agree with Ausar being an easier play to incorproate into a NBA role.

Doubly so given that I see the Thompsons as one of those Thabeet/Bennett type immediately bust after 15 games kind of prospects with at least 50% chance (and make people wonder how media manage to create such a smokescreen over these two pounding 16 old kids in sub-high school level basketball). Now in this scenario, Ausar is more salvageable as a NBA role player.

[Duke4life831]

This was my worry with Cason Wallace before the season. His handle is so basic and he has a really weak left hand when it comes to his dribble. In conference play he has just been eaten up alive in the half court. Throw in the horrific FT shooting. Add in its not too often we see guys make drastic improvements in their handle. Not sure I see him being anything more than a defensive specialist at the next level.

[Coeur]

Anton Watson Is a 1st round pick.

[BoyzNTheHood]

am I the only one that thinks Ausar > Amen? still don't understand why almost everyone universally has Amen above him.

You're not alone. I think Ausar will be the better winner, while Amen will make more highlight reels.

[clyde21]

these Kentucky and Duke teams are disasters, these programs actually need to go back to team building instead of just vacuuming up rando 5*s without a real plan to develop them or even put a decent team together. just patchwork team building.

[Duke4life831]

these Kentucky and Duke teams are disasters, these programs actually need to go back to team building instead of just vacuuming up rando 5*s without a real plan to develop them or even put a decent team together. just patchwork team building.

Yup. These teams are so reliant on having a NBA ready star come through. Like if you take Paolo off of Duke last year, that team would be a mess on offense (just like this year's team). That one superstar can really cover up a lot of warts on a team. Duke has gotten lucky that a good amount of the guys theyve gotten have hit. Just none of them this year has. Same for UK.

The ideal for programs like Duke and UK is to have just 1 OAD every year. Then load up on 3-4 year players. This way even if your stud top 5 recruit isnt great, you still have a quality experienced team and still and be a quality team.

I mean look at Kansas, they have essentially gotten out of the OAD game (Gradey Dick might be the exception this year). But what Kansas has basically done is replaced the idea of getting 1 OAD every year with getting 1 really good transfer. Then the rest of the team are these 3-4 year guys.

[clyde21]

not sure why we don't have a twins thread, but just watched more and they are just going to be an impossible eval imo. the tools and physical profiles are obvious, but feels like we're looking at two top level sophomores playing against D2 competition. lanes are wide open, zero force at the POA, no real rim protection, half the time it feels like a low-grade scrimmage.

i feel like downgrading them just for making the decision to play at OTE, robbing us of maybe two great seasons in college for the pair and a more clear eval.

[MemphisX]

not sure why we don't have a twins thread, but just watched more and they are just going to be an impossible eval imo. the tools and physical profiles are obvious, but feels like we're looking at two top level sophomores playing against D2 competition. lanes are wide open, zero force at the POA, no real rim protection, half the time it feels like a low-grade scrimmage.

i feel like downgrading them just for making the decision to play at OTE, robbing us of maybe two great seasons in college for the pair and a more clear eval.

Very hard eval and I just would not roll the dice in this draft if I were an NBA team. Too much talent in this draft.

[Duke4life831]

not sure why we don't have a twins thread, but just watched more and they are just going to be an impossible eval imo. the tools and physical profiles are obvious, but feels like we're looking at two top level sophomores playing against D2 competition. lanes are wide open, zero force at the POA, no real rim protection, half the time it feels like a low-grade scrimmage.

i feel like downgrading them just for making the decision to play at OTE, robbing us of maybe two great seasons in college for the pair and a more clear eval.

Ya it was like 3 weeks or so ago I went to try and watch some of their stuff. Lasted only a couple minutes. Cant take anything from those games. High level AAU tournaments have higher level defense than what goes on in OTE. I mean I guess good move by them because it doesnt seem like their draft stock is falling at all.

Its just a joke of a league though. You can get a better evaluation on a player playing for a blue blood when they go up against some horrible mid major during non conference play. Because even then you can at least say, "at least Im still watching him in a team environment". Like you said, OTE feels like a low grade scrimmage.

[BoyzNTheHood]

not sure why we don't have a twins thread, but just watched more and they are just going to be an impossible eval imo. the tools and physical profiles are obvious, but feels like we're looking at two top level sophomores playing against D2 competition. lanes are wide open, zero force at the POA, no real rim protection, half the time it feels like a low-grade scrimmage.

i feel like downgrading them just for making the decision to play at OTE, robbing us of maybe two great seasons in college for the pair and a more clear eval.

They should've went to the G-League.

[Duke4life831]

I will also add that I still think it was really dumb for GG to go to South Carolina. My guess is they offered a massive NIL deal and thats why he chose there. But damn talk about as bad of a situation as you can choose.

You play for a team no one cares about. No one cares about South Carolina hoops. The team is completely devoid of talent as well. So every team you go against gets to just focus 100% on you. And youre in the SEC, arguably the best conference in the country.

And with that combination you get games like tonight and 2 games ago where he just cant do anything and it becomes a blood bath of a game.

[clyde21]

I will also add that I still think it was really dumb for GG to go to South Carolina. My guess is they offered a massive NIL deal and thats why he chose there. But damn talk about as bad of a situation as you can choose.

You play for a team no one cares about. No one cares about South Carolina hoops. The team is completely devoid of talent as well. So every team you go against gets to just focus 100% on you. And youre in the SEC, arguably the best conference in the country.

And with that combination you get games like tonight and 2 games ago where he just cant do anything and it becomes a blood bath of a game.

i have way more respect for GG going to SC tho than the twins playing at OTE, and at the very least you can still get a feel for his strengths/weaknesses that you will never get watching OTE tape.

but yea, UNC had he stayed there would've probably been a better choice, SC is just outclassed and the SEC is top tier when it comes to athletes.

[Duke4life831]

I will also add that I still think it was really dumb for GG to go to South Carolina. My guess is they offered a massive NIL deal and thats why he chose there. But damn talk about as bad of a situation as you can choose.

You play for a team no one cares about. No one cares about South Carolina hoops. The team is completely devoid of talent as well. So every team you go against gets to just focus 100% on you. And youre in the SEC, arguably the best conference in the country.

And with that combination you get games like tonight and 2 games ago where he just cant do anything and it becomes a blood bath of a game.

i have way more respect for GG going to SC tho than the twins playing at OTE, and at the very least you can still get a feel for his strengths/weaknesses that you will never get watching OTE tape.

but yea, UNC had he stayed there would've probably been a better choice, SC is just outclassed and the SEC is top tier when it comes to athletes.

Oh ya thats not even up for debate. But damn dude you just shot yourself in the foot by choosing them. No one is going to be watching, your stats are going to look horrible, your biggest flaws are going to have a spotlight on them and no chance for a deep tourney run where you can pick up a ton of eyes on you and rack in some good endorsement deals.

Im not as high on GG as others (still not low, still think hes for sure lotto). Just as a basketball fan I wouldve liked to have watched him on a competent team this year.

[SeattleJazzFan]

thoughts on taevion kinsey? of course the first negative that stands out is his lack of three point shooting, 2nd is his age, but otherwise he's a pretty special talent and an elite athlete. only player in the country averaging 20, 5 and 5. he's efficient, he defends, high bball iq, rebounds his position and is a hell of a passer. pretty good FT shooter, so there is some hope maybe he can figure out the long distance shooting.

kinda reminds me of evan turner at osu if evan turner were an elite vertical athlete.

Kinsey will continue to be slept on because he doesn’t shoot the three and he’s older, but outside of the three point shooting, he’s one of the most complete prospects in the country. Elite athlete, excellent length for his height, defends, handles, great passer, and might be be highest bball iq prospect I’ve seen. I’m convinced he’s worth at least late first round.

If you compare him to a guy like Agbaji (since both were seniors), he obviously doesn’t shoot the three like Ochai, but he has better ball skills, he’s a more skilled scorer, and is longer - both explosive athletes.

[Catchall]

I will also add that I still think it was really dumb for GG to go to South Carolina. My guess is they offered a massive NIL deal and thats why he chose there. But damn talk about as bad of a situation as you can choose.

You play for a team no one cares about. No one cares about South Carolina hoops. The team is completely devoid of talent as well. So every team you go against gets to just focus 100% on you. And youre in the SEC, arguably the best conference in the country.

And with that combination you get games like tonight and 2 games ago where he just cant do anything and it becomes a blood bath of a game.

This is becoming tough to factor in for me. Basically, SC knows some of their games are over in the first 5 mins. The score typically gets to something like 18-5 or 20-5, and both teams at that point know what the outcome is going to be. It's not just that the games are 40-pt blowouts, it's that they're over within 5 - 7 mins and that shows in players' body language and effort level.

The other thing is that teams know how to play against GG. They know he doesn't want to pass the ball, and if he does his teammates mostly suck. So they can press up on him on the perimeter, and if GG gets by the first guy, they can wall off the paint with another one or two defenders. So whatever GG does is under pressure and typically rushed.

Given all this, I'd like to see the SC coaches make an adjustment where they just give GG the ball at the top of the circle, set an elevator screen for him and let him go straight downhill like he's Giannis. Then see what happens. But SC passing the ball around the perimeter isn't going to accomplish anything when their team is overmatched.

[Hal14]

am I the only one that thinks Ausar > Amen? still don't understand why almost everyone universally has Amen above him.

I'll say this. Ausar looks the easier of the two to integrate into a team. Defence is probably more fundamentally sound, he makes sensible decisions, the shot is clearly further distancing itself from Amens. He rebounds and blocks well. I mean, he's a lottery prospect for good reason.

Amen though has the ridiculous first step, but more so has court vision and speed of execution that Ausar can only dream of.

Above that, I know a fair few sets of twin boys and there seems to always be a leader and a follower. Amen is unquestionably the leader. Do I have reservations about how Amen will fare without Ausar beside him? I really don't. Would I be nervous about Ausar in a world with no Amen? That's one to ponder.

Amen takes too many risks with his prodigious talent and so maybe you're better off with the more submissive Ausar, who plays within himself more. But star upside apart, its Amens fire and focus and drive (while staying humble, polite, professional and hardworking) that excites me most.

And Ausar's second-fiddle-syndrome could be a blessing or cause him to drown in the alpha environment.

I agree with Ausar being an easier play to incorproate into a NBA role.

Doubly so given that I see the Thompsons as one of those Thabeet/Bennett type immediately bust after 15 games kind of prospects with at least 50% chance (and make people wonder how media manage to create such a smokescreen over these two pounding 16 old kids in sub-high school level basketball). Now in this scenario, Ausar is more salvageable as a NBA role player.

Stop saying this. It's literally false. It's not sub-high school level basketball. They're not playing against middle schoolers.

They just played against the Dreamerz, which has Jazian Gortman (could go 2nd round this year), Nathan Missia-Dio (also draft eligible this year). As well as a bunch of guys who are high major level recruits (Ivan Almansa, Alex Sarr, Bryson Warren, Jahki Howard, etc).

Go and watch the game on Amazon prime. The Thompson twins were playing against a team that had more size than them, a team that had some crazy athletes and a bunch of talent.

[Hal14]

not sure why we don't have a twins thread, but just watched more and they are just going to be an impossible eval imo. the tools and physical profiles are obvious, but feels like we're looking at two top level sophomores playing against D2 competition. lanes are wide open, zero force at the POA, no real rim protection, half the time it feels like a low-grade scrimmage.

i feel like downgrading them just for making the decision to play at OTE, robbing us of maybe two great seasons in college for the pair and a more clear eval.

Ya it was like 3 weeks or so ago I went to try and watch some of their stuff. Lasted only a couple minutes. Cant take anything from those games. High level AAU tournaments have higher level defense than what goes on in OTE. I mean I guess good move by them because it doesnt seem like their draft stock is falling at all.

Its just a joke of a league though. You can get a better evaluation on a player playing for a blue blood when they go up against some horrible mid major during non conference play. Because even then you can at least say, "at least Im still watching him in a team environment". Like you said, OTE feels like a low grade scrimmage.

You were able to gather all of that after watching for only "a couple minutes" ?

[Duke4life831]

not sure why we don't have a twins thread, but just watched more and they are just going to be an impossible eval imo. the tools and physical profiles are obvious, but feels like we're looking at two top level sophomores playing against D2 competition. lanes are wide open, zero force at the POA, no real rim protection, half the time it feels like a low-grade scrimmage.

i feel like downgrading them just for making the decision to play at OTE, robbing us of maybe two great seasons in college for the pair and a more clear eval.

Ya it was like 3 weeks or so ago I went to try and watch some of their stuff. Lasted only a couple minutes. Cant take anything from those games. High level AAU tournaments have higher level defense than what goes on in OTE. I mean I guess good move by them because it doesnt seem like their draft stock is falling at all.

Its just a joke of a league though. You can get a better evaluation on a player playing for a blue blood when they go up against some horrible mid major during non conference play. Because even then you can at least say, "at least Im still watching him in a team environment". Like you said, OTE feels like a low grade scrimmage.

You were able to gather all of that after watching for only "a couple minutes" ?

Ya I tried watching about 5 minutes of game time and have seen plenty of highlights and have read plenty of write ups. All of that combined I think I have a pretty good understanding. If you feel different, I would love to be proven wrong. If you have a game in mind where you think the level of play is high, I would love to see it and Ill watch it.

[Hal14]

Ya it was like 3 weeks or so ago I went to try and watch some of their stuff. Lasted only a couple minutes. Cant take anything from those games. High level AAU tournaments have higher level defense than what goes on in OTE. I mean I guess good move by them because it doesnt seem like their draft stock is falling at all.

Its just a joke of a league though. You can get a better evaluation on a player playing for a blue blood when they go up against some horrible mid major during non conference play. Because even then you can at least say, "at least Im still watching him in a team environment". Like you said, OTE feels like a low grade scrimmage.

You were able to gather all of that after watching for only "a couple minutes" ?

Ya I tried watching about 5 minutes of game time and have seen plenty of highlights and have read plenty of write ups. All of that combined I think I have a pretty good understanding. If you feel different, I would love to be proven wrong. If you have a game in mind where you think the level of play is high, I would love to see it and Ill watch it.

I'd recommend watching the game from the other night that's on amazon prime (City Reapers vs YNG Dreamerz). Also, the 3 games from the OTE finals last year are pretty good, competitive games too.