Which PG/PF Combination would you take? All Peaks

[dygaction]

Want to go with Giannis/Rose, but the fit and spacing are not great. Peak Rose is a lot better than Holiday though.

[mcfly1204]

Thank you for walking back your original, nonsensical statement of Rose having a better peak than CP3. There is no rationale possibility that Rose peaked higher than CP3.

CP3 was significantly better than Rose at their peaks.

Oh, I'm not walking that back. That was just to shut you up and get things back on topic.

We are on topic

2008 CP3 PS: 32.9 Points on 56.5 TS% against an average Drtg of 103.9

2011 Rose PS: 36.9 Points on 49.9 TS% against an average Drtg of 105.6

As for players as a whole, CP3 was better defensively and he was a significantly better playmaker/passer. I really don't see an argument for Rose > CP3 unless you are a--checks post history--Bulls Fan.

Check your stats.

[Colbinii]

Oh, I'm not walking that back. That was just to shut you up and get things back on topic.

We are on topic

2008 CP3 PS: 32.9 Points on 56.5 TS% against an average Drtg of 103.9

2011 Rose PS: 36.9 Points on 49.9 TS% against an average Drtg of 105.6

As for players as a whole, CP3 was better defensively and he was a significantly better playmaker/passer. I really don't see an argument for Rose > CP3 unless you are a--checks post history--Bulls Fan.

Check your stats.

I already did Marty. Time to fly away

[mcfly1204]

We are on topic

2008 CP3 PS: 32.9 Points on 56.5 TS% against an average Drtg of 103.9

2011 Rose PS: 36.9 Points on 49.9 TS% against an average Drtg of 105.6

As for players as a whole, CP3 was better defensively and he was a significantly better playmaker/passer. I really don't see an argument for Rose > CP3 unless you are a--checks post history--Bulls Fan.

Check your stats.

I already did Marty. Time to fly away

There has never been a series, let alone playoff run, where either averaged 30ppg.

[Cavsfansince84]

While I agree that the Deron and CP3 pairings would likely be the best to build a team around, Rose and Giannis have higher individual peaks than the others.

I don't see any argument for Rose peaking higher than CP3.

Rose was unguardable in his MVP season.

Unguardable for Rose that year translated into 35.6pp100 on ts+ of 102 which is 1% above league average. CP3 in 09 was at 32.4pp100 but on ts+ of 110. That's not getting much into passing or defense either where I'd say CP3 is again clearly better.

[Proxy]

There has never been a series, let alone playoff run, where either averaged 30ppg.

That is pts/100 posessions

[Jaivl]

I don't see any argument for Rose peaking higher than CP3.

Rose was unguardable in his MVP season.

So unguardable he put up 23 ppg on 35% shooting against the Heat in the playoffs.

Ouch.

[kendogg]

option D. magic bird.

but of the given options, cp3/malone i think is the pretty clear winner. cp3 has a clearly higher peak than the other 2 pg's here (funny enough he's basically stockton 2.0 with better iso capability). and KG has a massively overrated peak. he's basically draymond with a midrange jumper. good player but ain't no mvp level player. so we're left with the giannis/malone comparison.

DEFENSE: while giannis is a better rim protector than malone, playing the 4 instead of the 5 means his rim protection opportunities are a lot lower. both are excellent post defenders...i'd say a wash here as while giannis has more length, malone has better hands. karl has one of the best swipe downs in nba history. both are strong can can hold their position well. malone is also equal to giannis as a perimeter defender. he had good footwork and again very good hands. very underrated as I think most people feel like since he couldnt block shots like a 7ft center he wasnt a great defender, and that couldn't be further from the truth. if giannis played center full time, he'd certainly have more defensive impact, and i'd give giannis the nod as a help defender because of his length, but I think his defense is actually a bit overrated considering how much PF he plays. centers simply have more defensive impact...always have and always will.

OFFENSE: giannis is a better finisher than malone as well with his length, but malone was still a very skilled finisher for his size and with his strength he could keep his balance in contested shots. karl's strength allowed him to freight train dunks similar to giannis, lebron or barkley. from the perimeter, its no contest. karl is the best midrange shooter of the bunch and its not close. karl was a better midrange shooter than jordan. he was a better midrange shooter than dirk. his mvp seasons he had a 53% 16-3P range clip which may be the best in NBA history. so karl can fit along side anyone and still dominate. while giannis is very shaq-like in the 0-3 foot range, his only move outside of the paint is to get a head of steam and slash to the basket. its a very good move to be sure, and giannis has gotten better at the kickouts when the defense inevitably collapses on him to take away the layup. but this move can be less reliable in the playoffs against good defenses. it just so happens that few teams have a defender that can physically match giannis, but these matchups are more likely to happen in the playoffs. meanwhile, malone would feast in the paint more so in this era than his own. while in his era he was undersized, that's not the case today. very few teams have a PF bigger than 6'9 250. so he'd have more success as a paint iso scorer in this era. plus the jazz generally had 2 guys who were dead weight on offense, which means karl was constantly doubled and almost never had iso opportunities. wouldn't be a problem in an era stacked with shooting talent.

[Proxy]

KG has a massively overrated peak. he's basically draymond with a midrange jumper. good player but ain't no mvp level player.

Via https://thinkingbasketball.net/2018/03/19/backpicks-goat-8-kevin-garnett/: "I tracked 151 Garnett on-ball scoring possessions in his sample, and he averaged a stellar 1.08 points per play on such attacks. It’s a small sample, but nearly identical to Tim Duncan’s 1.07 points per play in my tracking, mirroring Synergy’s “post up” similarities between both players."


Pretty good for Draymond with a midrange jumper