NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2022-23 (pt 2)

[Mickey8]

He could average 30 ppg for the season with the high efficiency , every season easily but he's the head case, so much talent and yet he doesn't fully use that gift that he has.

[Mickey8]

There is generally a correlation between multi MVP level player and playoff success. By the time you get to 3, these players are in the top 15-20 of NBA history and all have won multiple chips. If the amazing lines don't translate to wins when it matters the most why should it be rewarded. And if he was so good in the regular season, why isn't he able to get those wins in the playoffs? He was able to in the regular season. Why is the planning so good in the playoffs that it can't carry over in the regular season to prevent the Nuggets from winning?

I get what you are saying, Jokic will need playoff success to get true respect. It has to happen or people won't care about his MVPs as much. But people need to just realize, especially in the modern NBA, that the regular season is the least like the post season it has ever been. From load management to refereeing to team efforts, the playoffs have never been more different.

If Jokic deserves the regular season MVP, give it to him. What we really need to do is to change the rules so that we get games more similar to the playoffs in terms of being allowed to actually play defense, get rid of b2bs so stars are playing more, etc.

I think Jokic will eventually get some post-season success so this talk will seem a bit silly, but the RS has become something I just care less about.

He already had, two time second round appearances and Conference finals appearance, while not playing alongside another all star teammate. He's doing best he can with the limited roster season after season. Also Denver was unlucky in the past two seasons with all the injuries. He signed a big contract instead of taking the less money to chase the rings like Lebron and Durant. I think he should have joined forces with some other superstar in the league. But stranger things have happened in the sport, we will see.

[76ciology]

What’s impressive about Jokic is he can go after the MVP in reg season while his game does not drop in the playoffs. A lot of players gets burned out after the chase of MVP in the reg season.

[LessEyeTest]

Jokic with the game winner, again. Is there anything this man cannot do?!

Average 30 points per game in a month.

Useless to do so. The meaning of scoring 30ppg isn’t looked at impressively as it was even 5 years ago. Even guys like Trae Young can do that, yet no one thinks of him as a superstar or even an all star these days. He’s not even the best player on his team.

He’d rather provide 55+ PPG while sharing the rock.

[CobraCommander]

Jokic with the game winner, again. Is there anything this man cannot do?!

Average 30 points per game in a month.

Why avg 30 ppg for a month When you can efficiently Lead the west In wins while dropping triple
Doubles and game winners.

Enjoy those gaudy inefficient numbers while taking a ton of shots and enjoy those close game Ls ….

[Johnny Firpo]

Jokic is closing in on the 25/11/10 on 70%TS average. That's his average. Absolutely mind-boggling.

[nomansland]

Arguably it is already happening with Jokić too. He is deferring and missing games, not sure if all of them are due to illness or some have been load management.

He missed some (4?) because of covid and the past 2 were load management. There's talk of his hamstring bothering him but looking at last night's game he just seems a bit tired.

[BelgradeNugget]

Jokic with the game winner, again. Is there anything this man cannot do?!

Average 30 points per game in a month.

Last year in 15 games for March, he averaged 29.9. Close enough?

No, it is not close enough. He did average 29.2 in December this year, but still not 30...only, drum drum, drum, he averaged 38 in April last year yeah

[antonac]

just looking at some stats and Jokic is just on pace to pass Lebron in triple doubles this season, in roughly 800 less games.

he's massively ahead of where Russ was at the same stage in his career (though it's impossible to have the the 5 year run that Russ had from that period of his career).

[Cubbies2120]

Good day for Jokic…. Tatum loses, Doncic loses. Marquee matchup tomorrow Jokic vs Giannis

Will be surprised if Jokic plays.

2nd night of b2b after he just missed two straight games due to hamstring... my guess is Nuggets will be down MPJ + Jokic at least.

[Doranku]

Jokic is closing in on the 25/11/10 on 70%TS average. That's his average. Absolutely mind-boggling.

He legitimately hasn't had a bad game since October. Not sure if I've ever seen anything like this tbh.

[AleksandarN]

Arguably it is already happening with Jokić too. He is deferring and missing games, not sure if all of them are due to illness or some have been load management.

He missed some (4?) because of covid and the past 2 were load management. There's talk of his hamstring bothering him but looking at last night's game he just seems a bit tired.

That's bull he missed the last two because of the hamstring not load management. If it was load management he would not have participating in shoot round the last two games. Both times it was a game time decision. Are they being overly cautious you damn right. Hamstrings are tricky.

[AleksandarN]

Jokic is closing in on the 25/11/10 on 70%TS average. That's his average. Absolutely mind-boggling.

He legitimately hasn't had a bad game since October. Not sure if I've ever seen anything like this tbh.

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[AleksandarN]

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[Exp0sed]

Good day for Jokic…. Tatum loses, Doncic loses. Marquee matchup tomorrow Jokic vs Giannis

Will be surprised if Jokic plays.

2nd night of b2b after he just missed two straight games due to hamstring... my guess is Nuggets will be down MPJ + Jokic at least.

idk where ur getting this from

When has Jokic been load-managed? when has he sat out on back to backs?

he was injured last couple of games. obviously it was a relatively minor injury and if it were the playoffs he would have played (and taken the risk of aggravaiting the injury) but since it wasn't, they played it safe (as they should)

assuming his hamstring was ok yesterday and will still feel good tonight - he will play

game went down to the wire yesterday, the Bucks at home with Middelton back and Giannis finally healthy - The Nuggets on a b2b, away without MPJ they're probably gonna lose by 15...but Jokic will play imo

he's not sitting out if he's healthy just because of caution or rest - that was my point

[Cubbies2120]

Good day for Jokic…. Tatum loses, Doncic loses. Marquee matchup tomorrow Jokic vs Giannis

Will be surprised if Jokic plays.

2nd night of b2b after he just missed two straight games due to hamstring... my guess is Nuggets will be down MPJ + Jokic at least.

idk where ur getting this from

When has Jokic been load-managed? when has he sat out on back to backs?

he was injured last couple of games. obviously it was a relatively minor injury and if it were the playoffs he would have played (and taken the risk of aggravaiting the injury) but since it wasn't, they played it safe (as they should)

assuming his hamstring was ok yesterday and will still feel good tonight - he will play

game went down to the wire yesterday, the Bucks at home with Middelton back and Giannis finally healthy - The Nuggets on a b2b, away without MPJ they're probably gonna lose by 15...but Jokic will play imo

he's not sitting out if he's healthy just because of caution or rest - that was my point

He doesn't load manage, but if he was sat out for 2 games due to an injury bothering him, I doubt they push him on a B2B after a game that came down to the wire.

Also, the spread is 7.5 points. The Nuggets have been 4+ point underdogs only in the following games:
4 point underdogs - Celtics
5 point underdogs - Clippers (Jokic out)
5.5 point underdogs - Warriors (2nd game of season)
10 point underdogs - Mavericks (Jokic out)
10.5 point underdogs - Mavericks (Jokic out)


So the line to me implies the books have Jokic out (or are anticipating Murray out maybe).

[Exp0sed]

So the line to me implies the books have Jokic out (or are anticipating Murray out maybe).

Denver was even money away at Nola (without BI and Zion obviously) yesterday
that's without MPJ and by ur logic - with the bookies expecting Jokic to play

Murray perhaps, but you do realize that playing the Bucks at full strength on their home floor is one of the toughest games of the season for any team and on a back to back at that? 7.5 spread seems reasonable with Jokic

without Jokic and MPJ on a back to back at Bucks it'd be -15

more to the point, Denver wasn't in some huge rush to play Jokic yesterday
If he was healthy enough to play yesterday and everything went fine he should be ready to go again today

we'll wait and see, imo he'll play

it's awesome actually, because every coddled star would take his rest, trying to avoid playing a tough game like the Bucks , try protect their stats, their bodies and get much needed rest in the process but I suspect the Joker is different

the Joker will play and take the beating and most likely take the L too - but he'll compete if healthy
he's an oldschool ball player, if it's game night and he's healthy he'd always prefer to play

[cam24thomas]

Jokic is in a league of his own!
Plus he's so skilled (while also being very big) he'd do very well in other decades too, a true all-time legend!
Jokic is the first player we've seen reach Michael Jordan's level offensively.

[BelgradeNugget]

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And in only game he didn't have triple double, he played 28 minutes and set the whole 4 quarter because the game was a blowout against Suns.

[CharityStripe34]

They have 2 months to catch him- but if he doesn’t get hurt I don’t see how they catch him. He is simply playing boringly efficient Tim Duncan/CP3 type ball… makea the right play look routine and makes the amazing play look routine - it’s just boring as hell but effective

If he stays healthy and stops load-managing/missing games, I give Gianni a fair chance at going on a big-time tear. Especially if Middleton stays on the court, looks solid and the Bucks start going on some winning streaks. He's the only other player in the last few seasons who's statistically similar to Jokic and has an incredibly high defensive ceiling to boot.

I'm not predicting that will happen, as it seems that he's been clearly trying to pace himself and the Bucks have been sitting him more often. Just that he's capable and it would make for an incredible MVP race given that both he and Jokic are considered by many the two best players alive.

Fair- but I think Giannis is over the MVP thing- I think he only cares about rings at this point -

and if you think about it, Giannis is right. If Giannis gets 3 or 4 rings and only 2 MVPs he can make a top 10
All time case. If jokic gets 4 MVPs in a row and no rings he is going to be considered less favorable long term than Giannis. Man but we talking about a new golden age with the potential of two (maybe more)all time greats approaching their prime.:. !

As much as both Gianni and Nikola say they don't care anymore about MVP, I bet they absolutely do. They just care more about winning titles. These guys understand they're in rarified air already (only 13 other players have ever won 2x MVPs or more) and gaining a third MVP would mean a lot for their own historical legacies. It's just that they would hope to get the trophy as a byproduct of them just being dominant and winning games. With these two specifically, they're both friendly and love competing with each other (i.e. the Greece/Serbia WC quali game) so I'm sure they pay attention.

As for this season, if Middleton comes back and is at least 85% of himself it'll help Freak minimize his usage and his efficiency should start improving, while he simultaneously puts up his 31-12-5. I wouldn't rule him out of MVP contention just yet with about 35ish games left. Should be a fascinating second half of the season.

I wonder if Gianni as East captain will draft Jokic lol.