2023 Trade Deadline Thread: Conley/VanVleet/Lowry/etc. (Updated thread)

[nickhx2]

you really think paul george is off the table? i've never thought he was a great fit with kawhi and i've never been more down on him than this season. i don't see him as a guy who's gonna get the job done when kawhi's off the court and i'd rather have someone who either does, and if they can't do that, at least they won't exacerbate the worst issues the team has with his fumbling and bad decisions.

like, not saying cavs would but darius garland would be a fantasy trade that fixes a lot of issues with this team (in my head).

[nickhx2]

hart coming back would be all kinds of nice. clips gambled on wall and lost but getting him back would right some wrongs. fvv would also be a huge get but unfortunately we are tight on assets.

deadline will be interesting

[madmaxmedia]

you really think paul george is off the table? i've never thought he was a great fit with kawhi and i've never been more down on him than this season. i don't see him as a guy who's gonna get the job done when kawhi's off the court and i'd rather have someone who either does, and if they can't do that, at least they won't exacerbate the worst issues the team has with his fumbling and bad decisions.

like, not saying cavs would but darius garland would be a fantasy trade that fixes a lot of issues with this team (in my head).

I think he’s effectively off the table, in the sense that I don’t think we want to trade him for 3 1st rounders or anything like that. Or for a younger but significantly lesser player. I like you Garland idea but I’m guessing a team doesn’t want to give up a younger star/potential star.

I would say he’s very low low key not off the table if you catch my drift. Our FO is super tight lipped, they’d be 10x so with PG.

[PeteyPablo]

Per Realgm wire tap

The Los Angeles Clippers have previously been linked with interest in Mike Conley, but sources tell Kevin O'Connor of The Ringer that they're also interested in Kyle Lowry and Fred VanVleet. The Clippers can only trade a first round pick in 2028, but they own all of their second round picks beyond 2027. They also have workable contracts for salary matching.

The point guard position has been an area of need for the Clippers as John Wall and Reggie Jackson have struggled.

Lowry makes $28.3 million this season and has been in evident decline since joining the Miami Heat in 2021.

VanVleet will be a free agent this offseason and figures to receive a raise on his $22.8 million salary.

Kawhi Leonard was previously teammates with both Lowry and VanVleet during his lone season with the Toronto Raptors.

[KL2]

I’d love Hart back.

I’m sure the Clippers turn every stone over but once I hear a name released I automatically start looking for names not mentioned.

[quote="nickhx2"]you really think paul george is off the table?/quote]

I do. I think they (Leonard) have until the arena opens. I think that’s when their current contracts expire. Of course they’d be up for extensions I believe before so that could be a telling sign.

[nickhx2]

you really think paul george is off the table? i've never thought he was a great fit with kawhi and i've never been more down on him than this season. i don't see him as a guy who's gonna get the job done when kawhi's off the court and i'd rather have someone who either does, and if they can't do that, at least they won't exacerbate the worst issues the team has with his fumbling and bad decisions.

like, not saying cavs would but darius garland would be a fantasy trade that fixes a lot of issues with this team (in my head).

I think he’s effectively off the table, in the sense that I don’t think we want to trade him for 3 1st rounders or anything like that. Or for a younger but significantly lesser player. I like you Garland idea but I’m guessing a team doesn’t want to give up a younger star/potential star.

I would say he’s very low low key not off the table if you catch my drift. Our FO is super tight lipped, they’d be 10x so with PG.

agree that he's effectively off the table, so i see what you are saying more now. you'd do it if it balanced the roster or brought a different type of star or better pieces for kawhi. but we wouldn't just sacrifice him as a pawn for first rounders or an up and coming star.

funny thing is while i would have retched at the idea of trading him for lillard earlier in the year (ignoring salaries of course) now i think that'd make all kinds of sense for us. if this season is showing us anything, it's that you can't just stack talent without a matching framework.

[Roscoe Sheed]

I guess post this here? Not sure we need a trade deadline type thread or not? Clippers are always rumored to be involved in lots.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2023/1/24/23568973/clippers-trade-rumors-fred-vanvleet-mike-conley

Says we’re not only interested in Conley but Lowry and VanFleet too.

Mann is off the table.

Looking for backup pg (duh) and big to back up Zu (another duh).

We’ve inquired about Naz Reid.

We’re likely priced out for guys like Turner and Collins. A cheaper option like Bamba is available in trade talks.

Also have interest in bringing back Hartenstein.

Lowry has looked washed up for most of this season. I would much rather have VV or Conley

[donemilio21]

you really think paul george is off the table? i've never thought he was a great fit with kawhi and i've never been more down on him than this season. i don't see him as a guy who's gonna get the job done when kawhi's off the court and i'd rather have someone who either does, and if they can't do that, at least they won't exacerbate the worst issues the team has with his fumbling and bad decisions.

like, not saying cavs would but darius garland would be a fantasy trade that fixes a lot of issues with this team (in my head).

I think he’s effectively off the table, in the sense that I don’t think we want to trade him for 3 1st rounders or anything like that. Or for a younger but significantly lesser player. I like you Garland idea but I’m guessing a team doesn’t want to give up a younger star/potential star.

I would say he’s very low low key not off the table if you catch my drift. Our FO is super tight lipped, they’d be 10x so with PG.

agree that he's effectively off the table, so i see what you are saying more now. you'd do it if it balanced the roster or brought a different type of star or better pieces for kawhi. but we wouldn't just sacrifice him as a pawn for first rounders or an up and coming star.

funny thing is while i would have retched at the idea of trading him for lillard earlier in the year (ignoring salaries of course) now i think that'd make all kinds of sense for us. if this season is showing us anything, it's that you can't just stack talent without a matching framework.

not sure if Lillard would be an upgrade over PG. and salary wise, would we really want to sign up to pay him $63M at his at 36 season ?

[nickhx2]

seems you ignored it when i said ignoring salaries

[donemilio21]

seems you ignored it when i said ignoring salaries

thought you meant current salaries, for matching.

[nickhx2]

yeah i did not intend that as talking about matching salaries for incoming/outgoing trade purposes, but rather the entire scheme because i'm trying to make a point about fit vs talent for the roster.

as for the two themselves, it's not about whether it's an upgrade or not in a vacuum because you could argue one impacts the game both ways while the other is a liability on one end but a very reliable player on the other. but from the stand point of overall team composition we have a million wings and not enough time for them, zero reliable point guards, one reliable ball-handler in kawhi, one reliable scorer in kawhi, major turnover issues/decision making issues that impact our entire gameplan (etc etc.)

so yeah i'd have zero issues with a swap for the two at the cost of our wing defense, if it improved the other things we're having gigantic problems with.

[Max Headrom]

yeah i did not intend that as talking about matching salaries for incoming/outgoing trade purposes, but rather the entire scheme because i'm trying to make a point about fit vs talent for the roster.

as for the two themselves, it's not about whether it's an upgrade or not in a vacuum because you could argue one impacts the game both ways while the other is a liability on one end but a very reliable player on the other. but from the stand point of overall team composition we have a million wings and not enough time for them, zero reliable point guards, one reliable ball-handler in kawhi, one reliable scorer in kawhi, major turnover issues/decision making issues that impact our entire gameplan (etc etc.)

so yeah i'd have zero issues with a swap for the two at the cost of our wing defense, if it improved the other things we're having gigantic problems with.

Dame is a SG in a PG body, fixes nothing and makes the defense worse. Swapping him for PG would make the Clippers smaller and not better. Dame is extremely overrated and when Kawhi went out in the playoffs thanks to Ingles dirty ass and it was Dame instead of PG, they're not beating Utah...

[esqtvd]

The Heat are primed to make a move at the trade deadline, if only to alleviate their payroll problems. If they do not make any move this season, they’ll be paying a hefty luxury tax penalty. That’s something that Pat Riley would want to avoid, and he’ll look at any potential trade to make sure that doesn’t happen.

https://clutchpoints.com/heat-news-kyle-lowrys-firm-stance-miami-future-trade-rumors

[Scoundreldays]

The Heat are primed to make a move at the trade deadline, if only to alleviate their payroll problems. If they do not make any move this season, they’ll be paying a hefty luxury tax penalty. That’s something that Pat Riley would want to avoid, and he’ll look at any potential trade to make sure that doesn’t happen.

https://clutchpoints.com/heat-news-kyle-lowrys-firm-stance-miami-future-trade-rumors

Not a fan of Lowry currently either. Be nice if we didn't go after a washed PG.

[PeteyPablo]

I can see this pick up being a move to have a battle tested veteran who can handle full press and help be a floor general and have some ability to hit an open shot.

Do not see this as being a move to get a guy we will lean on heavily for much more.

[MartinToVaught]

Lowry is washed and Heat fans can't wait for him to leave. No thanks.

[madmaxmedia]

I can see this pick up being a move to have a battle tested veteran who can handle full press and help be a floor general and have some ability to hit an open shot.

Do not see this as being a move to get a guy we will lean on heavily for much more.

I think he could be a nice pick up, but the problem is not having the right contracts to match his. If Marcus was expiring, then he could be the major piece in the trade, but he's got a year left just like Conley and so would be less attractive to Utah.

If we have to give up 2 rotation players to get Conley, then Conley is going to have to be a significant contributor to our team for the trade to be worth it.

[nickhx2]

I can see this pick up being a move to have a battle tested veteran who can handle full press and help be a floor general and have some ability to hit an open shot.

Do not see this as being a move to get a guy we will lean on heavily for much more.

I think he could be a nice pick up, but the problem is not having the right contracts to match his. If Marcus was expiring, then he could be the major piece in the trade, but he's got a year left just like Conley and so would be less attractive to Utah.

If we have to give up 2 rotation players to get Conley, then Conley is going to have to be a significant contributor to our team for the trade to be worth it.

agree. i mean i'd like to acquire him for sure but the cost might just be too high, given his age. and yeah maybe if we wanna go all-in, sure, but are we at that point yet? are we good enough? i'm not sold.

and as mentioned before, if we bring him in what happens to mann? right now mann is an integral starter and player in our lineup. it's one thing if he keeps doing more of the same off the bench, but i'm not so sure that'll be the case. i mean his impact on the team and games is a night and day difference as a starter.

now, if you said we bring in conley to come off the bench, then ok sure. or if we can guarantee mann is the de facto PG off the bench, whether reggie plays alongside him as a pseudo-2 or not, then ok. but given lue's propensity to over-rely on morris/reggie despite them not being as good as the alternatives, AND the fact that we have powell whom you really want to be touching the ball quite often, i'm very skeptical of mann being our PG off the bench.

reggie's the goat clipper shot maker but, you would think the organization should have learned its lesson by now that small guards who mostly shoot and don't do much of anything else cause these insane ripple effects that are very difficult to overcome. at least with lou williams, he was a solid and willing passer. reggie gaining even two more notches of defensive awareness would render all this moot, but what can you do? you work with what you've got.

[esqtvd]

I can see this pick up being a move to have a battle tested veteran who can handle full press and help be a floor general and have some ability to hit an open shot.

Do not see this as being a move to get a guy we will lean on heavily for much more.

I think he could be a nice pick up, but the problem is not having the right contracts to match his. If Marcus was expiring, then he could be the major piece in the trade, but he's got a year left just like Conley and so would be less attractive to Utah.

If we have to give up 2 rotation players to get Conley, then Conley is going to have to be a significant contributor to our team for the trade to be worth it.

agree. i mean i'd like to acquire him for sure but the cost might just be too high, given his age. and yeah maybe if we wanna go all-in, sure, but are we at that point yet? are we good enough? i'm not sold.

and as mentioned before, if we bring him in what happens to mann? right now mann is an integral starter and player in our lineup. it's one thing if he keeps doing more of the same off the bench, but i'm not so sure that'll be the case. i mean his impact on the team and games is a night and day difference as a starter.

now, if you said we bring in conley to come off the bench, then ok sure. or if we can guarantee mann is the de facto PG off the bench, whether reggie plays alongside him as a pseudo-2 or not, then ok. but given lue's propensity to over-rely on morris/reggie despite them not being as good as the alternatives, AND the fact that we have powell whom you really want to be touching the ball quite often, i'm very skeptical of mann being our PG off the bench.

reggie's the goat clipper shot maker but, you would think the organization should have learned its lesson by now that small guards who mostly shoot and don't do much of anything else cause these insane ripple effects that are very difficult to overcome. at least with lou williams, he was a solid and willing passer. reggie gaining even two more notches of defensive awareness would render all this moot, but what can you do? you work with what you've got.

Mann, last 6 games: 25 mpg 7 ppg @ 43%/33% shooting—minus-1.3
Reggie last 6 games: 20 mpg 14 ppg @ 52%/44% shooting—plus+5.8


Reggie is doing fine off the bench but Mann is not killin' it as the starter
that's why the Clippers are still shopping for a #1

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?LastNGames=6&TeamID=1610612746&dir=A&sort=PLUS_MINUS

[madmaxmedia]

Damn your plus/minus I still think we look better with Mann on the floor for 30+ MPG

Mann does provide juice for us (juicy glue?) but doesn't score consistently, and in the end reasonably efficient scoring is still the biggest thing a player can contribute. At point guard Mann is still playing out of position, but it's the best position to give him 30 MPG which I still think is a net positive all things considered (keep Reggie fresh, add some muscle and hustle, keep Wall off the floor, etc.)

OTOH, if there was a hypothetical scenario where we had the expiring contracts to get Conley for cheap AND traded Mann in a package to land John Collins, that would be the clearer win IMO.