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2022/23 Rotation Thread

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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#141 » by shrink » Mon Jan 9, 2023 2:38 pm

minimus wrote:
wolves_89 wrote:Watching the last 4 games where things are starting to come together, I've come away seeing two clear areas for improvement that should be achievable.

First, the easiest path to improving the rotation is to find someone better to take most of the Nowell/Rivers minutes. Adding a good point of attack defender to take those minutes would go a long way towards improving the Wolves defense.

Second, adjust how DLO is used. He is a poor fit as a PG, but I think he could be decent in a SG role. Have someone else bring the ball up (DLO is often incredibly slow at this) and initiate the offense. The Wolves also need to always have good defenders at the other guard spot and at small forward when DLO is on the court (Ant, McDaniels, and ???). Pairing DLO and Nowell is a disaster for the defense.

Basically, the ideal addition would be a bench PG that is good at the defending the point of attack and will push the ball up quickly, initiate the offense, and keep the ball moving. I'd be looking for a bigger version of Jordan McLaughlin or a return of Patrick Beverley.


I want Moore to take all Forbes minutes. I understand why Finch still gives a chance to Nowell, but Jaylen has been playing really bad.

I agree that Forbes is the 15th man, but 3P% is the most variable percentage. Back in preseason, Bryn was hitting 50% on 4 3PA, we were talking about him like Connely had gotten Beasley on the minimum. MIN is 20th in 3P% and 20th in 3PA, so it’s not like it’s not a need. I don’t mind having him as our 15th man, in the rare occasions we might need a 3 at the end of a game, especially at the end of games. But yeah, if we need a roster spot in a trade, Bryn Forbes is the one to go.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#142 » by Klomp » Mon Jan 9, 2023 8:14 pm

Everyone keeps talking about POA defenders. While that's important, I feel like a lot of our defensive issues come in transition defense or on the opponents' secondary breaks. POA defense doesn't really address that. What does is finding guys who will turn over the ball less (we are 28th in TOV%) and take fewer dumb shots.

This is where a potential Washington trade has me intrigued. Monte Morris is a rich man's Jordan McLaughlin, up there with Tyus Jones, Kyrie Irving and Fred VanVleet in lowest TOV%. He's also not usually taking dumb shots as he knows his role and does it well.

Look at that big lineup that's dominant recently for us. It's not due to an extra POA defender. It's because guys know their roles and stay in their lanes.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#143 » by Klomp » Mon Jan 9, 2023 10:21 pm

Big_Red1988 wrote:Watching the last 4 games, there is definitely 1 line up that I have loved. They either solidify leads, stop comebacks from other teams or in the game against the Rockets were instrumental in the comeback.

That lineup is:

Ant
Anderson
Prince
McDaniels
Gobert

I don't know the exact stats of this lineup together, but the eye test looks really good.

I called for this 5 months ago in the predictions thread...

Klomp wrote:Maybe not a prediction per se, but what are some lineup combinations you are excited to see?

I'm excited to see how Finch mixes and matches our length. I would see one package where Anderson, McDaniels and Prince are all out there with a guard and a center, for example. Tons of defensive switchability and probably lets McDaniels do a little more with the ball.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#144 » by life_saver » Mon Jan 9, 2023 11:23 pm

Nowell for me has been the biggest disappointment so far this season...I had lot of hopes on him taking the leap but it feels like he might have actually gotten slightly worse. His 3 point shot really lets him down...without a consistent 3 point shot and him not being a good defender/passer, it's hard to see him play significant role unless something changes
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#145 » by Big_Red1988 » Tue Jan 10, 2023 12:03 am

Klomp wrote:
Big_Red1988 wrote:Watching the last 4 games, there is definitely 1 line up that I have loved. They either solidify leads, stop comebacks from other teams or in the game against the Rockets were instrumental in the comeback.

That lineup is:

Ant
Anderson
Prince
McDaniels
Gobert

I don't know the exact stats of this lineup together, but the eye test looks really good.

I called for this 5 months ago in the predictions thread...

Klomp wrote:Maybe not a prediction per se, but what are some lineup combinations you are excited to see?

I'm excited to see how Finch mixes and matches our length. I would see one package where Anderson, McDaniels and Prince are all out there with a guard and a center, for example. Tons of defensive switchability and probably lets McDaniels do a little more with the ball.



Great foresight by you Klomp. In the 4 games they have played together, the have an OFFRTG 146.2 and a DEFRTG 69.2. Pretty impressive.
Only a small sample size, but if it they can keep it up many more wins will happen and as a fan I will feel at ease whenever they are on the court.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#146 » by shrink » Wed Jan 11, 2023 11:29 pm

I spent today catching up on some of the Wolves games I had on my DVR, which I’d only heard on the radio.

One thing I noticed was whenever we make a good play, Luka Garza is always the first to jump up and cheer, with a giant grin on his face. He’s even Gobert’s biggest fan, when Rudy’s success hurts Garza’s minutes and his career.

I really like Luka. He always plays hard, and gives whatever he’s got. He’s highly skilled, so it shows he puts in the work. And he looks like he’s a great teammate. I would not be sad at all to see him on MIN’s roster next year, on a small guaranteed contract. These guys sometimes contribute on the floor, but their team-first attitude and always demonstrating a high work ethic in practice may help several others on the team contribute more as well.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#147 » by moss_is_1 » Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:49 am

Klomp wrote:Everyone keeps talking about POA defenders. While that's important, I feel like a lot of our defensive issues come in transition defense or on the opponents' secondary breaks. POA defense doesn't really address that. What does is finding guys who will turn over the ball less (we are 28th in TOV%) and take fewer dumb shots.

This is where a potential Washington trade has me intrigued. Monte Morris is a rich man's Jordan McLaughlin, up there with Tyus Jones, Kyrie Irving and Fred VanVleet in lowest TOV%. He's also not usually taking dumb shots as he knows his role and does it well.

Look at that big lineup that's dominant recently for us. It's not due to an extra POA defender. It's because guys know their roles and stay in their lanes.

Yeah when our defense is set its not bad at all, problem is the team is very low IQ. Make dumb passes, take dumb shots, that lead to easy transition opportunities for the other team.

Morris would be rock solid. However I don't really want Delon Wright. Just Morris costs 9m, it would take another salary for Washington to be able to take Russell. If we can move Russell with Nowell or Naz to get more value and get someone like Powell or Kennard from LAC as an upgrade for a bench scorer/shooter I think that would help out a ton. More spacing, less usage/lower turnover rate. Caruso is still a dream of mine, I'd be thrilled to get him but would be just fine if we were able to snag Morris.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#148 » by moss_is_1 » Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:50 am

shrink wrote:I spent today catching up on some of the Wolves games I had on my DVR, which I’d only heard on the radio.

One thing I noticed was whenever we make a good play, Luka Garza is always the first to jump up and cheer, with a giant grin on his face. He’s even Gobert’s biggest fan, when Rudy’s success hurts Garza’s minutes and his career.

I really like Luka. He always plays hard, and gives whatever he’s got. He’s highly skilled, so it shows he puts in the work. And he looks like he’s a great teammate. I would not be sad at all to see him on MIN’s roster next year, on a small guaranteed contract. These guys sometimes contribute on the floor, but their team-first attitude and always demonstrating a high work ethic in practice may help several others on the team contribute more as well.

Love Garza. Obviously he is limited on defense, but the dude can score almost at will and is a great teammate and plays really hard. Sucks that he's always going to be fighting an uphill battle to get minutes with us having 2 all NBA centers, plus Naz playing great. Garza really is just a center.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#149 » by wolves_89 » Tue Jan 24, 2023 2:15 pm

I think it's time for Finch to start making some real changes to the rotation.

The first and most obvious move is to bench Nowell. He has pretty much played himself out the rotation with terrible defense and poor 3pt shooting. I'd give Moore an opportunity to see if he is ready for a role. I also wouldn't mind giving Minott a few opportunities (that could be expanded if he plays well).

The second move I'd look at is to give Knight consistent PF minutes off the bench. This team rebounding has been beyond bad and Knight at least has size and gives consistent effort. Playing Anderson at SF for some of his minutes and cutting out McDaniels PF minutes should open up 10-15 minutes a night.

My final adjustment would be to waive Forbes and sign someone who can provide a perimeter defensive upgrade. I'd give Kris Dunn a 10 day contract and see how he fits. Giving a guy like Dunn some of the Nowell/Rivers minutes could be a significant upgrade.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#150 » by Mamba4Goat » Wed Jan 25, 2023 2:41 am

wolves_89 wrote:I think it's time for Finch to start making some real changes to the rotation.

The first and most obvious move is to bench Nowell. He has pretty much played himself out the rotation with terrible defense and poor 3pt shooting. I'd give Moore an opportunity to see if he is ready for a role. I also wouldn't mind giving Minott a few opportunities (that could be expanded if he plays well).

The second move I'd look at is to give Knight consistent PF minutes off the bench. This team rebounding has been beyond bad and Knight at least has size and gives consistent effort. Playing Anderson at SF for some of his minutes and cutting out McDaniels PF minutes should open up 10-15 minutes a night.

My final adjustment would be to waive Forbes and sign someone who can provide a perimeter defensive upgrade. I'd give Kris Dunn a 10 day contract and see how he fits. Giving a guy like Dunn some of the Nowell/Rivers minutes could be a significant upgrade.


I do agree that Knight should get some consistent minutes and that Nowell should get his playing time cut and that Forbes needs to be waived but…you made one mistake. The Wolves don’t need to go into the free agent bin to go find a playable perimeter defender. Wendell Moore deserves an opportunity. Especially once J-Mac is back and Nowell’s creation wouldn’t be as sorely missed.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#151 » by wolves_89 » Wed Jan 25, 2023 2:45 pm

Mamba4Goat wrote:
wolves_89 wrote:I think it's time for Finch to start making some real changes to the rotation.

The first and most obvious move is to bench Nowell. He has pretty much played himself out the rotation with terrible defense and poor 3pt shooting. I'd give Moore an opportunity to see if he is ready for a role. I also wouldn't mind giving Minott a few opportunities (that could be expanded if he plays well).

The second move I'd look at is to give Knight consistent PF minutes off the bench. This team rebounding has been beyond bad and Knight at least has size and gives consistent effort. Playing Anderson at SF for some of his minutes and cutting out McDaniels PF minutes should open up 10-15 minutes a night.

My final adjustment would be to waive Forbes and sign someone who can provide a perimeter defensive upgrade. I'd give Kris Dunn a 10 day contract and see how he fits. Giving a guy like Dunn some of the Nowell/Rivers minutes could be a significant upgrade.


I do agree that Knight should get some consistent minutes and that Nowell should get his playing time cut and that Forbes needs to be waived but…you made one mistake. The Wolves don’t need to go into the free agent bin to go find a playable perimeter defender. Wendell Moore deserves an opportunity. Especially once J-Mac is back and Nowell’s creation wouldn’t be as sorely missed.


While I agree that the Wolves should give Moore a chance (as I said in my post), I think Minnesota needs someone who has already proven to be a plus perimeter defender in the NBA (like Dunn). I hope Finch changes his mind set a bit going forward. It's been pretty clear up to this point that Finch values offense over defense and/or rebounding, thus leading to Nowell staying in the rotation.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#152 » by wolves_89 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:21 pm

Leading up to the trade deadline it might be a good idea to give Moore and Knight a bit of playing time to see how they perform. I'd take Nowell's minutes and redistribute them. It would be nice to have a little better idea if those guys are ready for a real role.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#153 » by moss_is_1 » Sun Feb 5, 2023 4:11 am

Jmac officially questionable for tomorrow's game. Thank God.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#154 » by minimus » Fri Feb 10, 2023 11:00 am

Gobert/Towns/Reid + Garza
Towns/Anderson/Knight
MCD/TP/Ryan + Minott
Edwards/Nowell/NAW + Moore
Conley/JMac/Rivers

But we will see complete shift of paradigma:

DLo averages 83.5 touches per game, but with short time per touch 4.05 sec, and 3.37 dribbles per touch. USG% 22.7.
Conley averages 69.5 touches per game, but with time per touch 5.32 sec, and 4.87 dribbles per touch. USG% 16.7.

DLo has been successful as a scoring comboguard, playing off the ball.
Conley has been successful as a traditional PG

DLo shots elite 51.1% from midrange, and elite 70% at rim, 12-29 41.4% from left corner, but only 4-17 23.5% from right corner.
Conley shots only 29.4% from midrange, but 16-25 3pt shots from right corner, 3-6 from left corner.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/shooting?CF=PLAYER_NAME*E*conl&DistanceRange=By%20Zone&PerMode=Totals&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&dir=1&sort=Corner%203%20FGM
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#155 » by wolves_89 » Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:32 pm

One lineup combination that I'd really like to see is:

Ant (0.6 DEPM)
NWA (2.0 DEPM)
McDaniels (1.9 DEPM)
Anderson (3.2 DEPM)
Gobert (1.9 DEPM)

That group combines for an impressive 9.6 of defensive EPM. Ant can carry the offense with the shooting of NWA, McDaniels, and Anderson spreading the floor. I think that lineup could be better than the Ant/McDaniels/Prince/Anderson/Gobert group.
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Re: 2022/23 Rotation Thread 

Post#156 » by minimus » Sat Feb 11, 2023 8:30 am

wolves_89 wrote:One lineup combination that I'd really like to see is:

Ant (0.6 DEPM)
NWA (2.0 DEPM)
McDaniels (1.9 DEPM)
Anderson (3.2 DEPM)
Gobert (1.9 DEPM)

That group combines for an impressive 9.6 of defensive EPM. Ant can carry the offense with the shooting of NWA, McDaniels, and Anderson spreading the floor. I think that lineup could be better than the Ant/McDaniels/Prince/Anderson/Gobert group.


We really should not play small anymore. Two PG lineups haven been annoying since Ryan Saunders days

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