RS 22/23 - Mavs vs Pistons (Mond. 8:30PM EST)

[Archx]

C'mon now. You can't pull that Kidd card every time. If Luka makes nice plays, he's a basketball savant. If he doesn't know how to play off ball, blame Kidd instead of the basketball savant child genius. You have to call it both ways. But I know there is no way to get through Luka fans to have him contribute and play off ball at times, so yeah you are probably right about it. I'd end my comments here just so it won't stretch out the conversation too much.

Luka fans? Is this another argument people make when they think they have it all figured out? If you want to use that argument against me, you better come up with something a lot better than just being scared of having an argument about the team.

But either way, something tells me you're not watching Mavs as close as you should have. When Luka is out or not playing, Dinwiddie and rest of the team have exact same plays, standing around and watching Dinwiddie dribble. How many picks and movement do you see from him? Probably not a lot, right?


You need to first get to the root of the problem then criticize everything else. Why do Nuggets have such amazing screen movements, etc.. It's because Jokic is super athletic dude who runs all over the floor like Iverson, setting up his team or because Nuggets have a lot of sets which involves player moving without the ball?

Why Kobe&Shaq couldn't figure it out before Phil came with his triangle offense which involved a lot of passing and players setting screens? Why Pistons won in 04? Was it because Brown figured out how to use Sheed' and Hamilton as a decoy and ran Lakers to the ground with screens or because Pistons were simply a juggernaut team who won 10 rings in a row?


A lot of it has to do with coaching and yes, i will blame Kidd 100% until i see any improvement in their overall game. But it's a lot to expect from a coach who can't even draw up a last second play, the very basics of any coaching.

It's the same thing Luka did in the Olympics with a different coach. Dont get me wrong, Kidd has his shortcomings for sure. But would it hurt to set a back pick to help your teammate get open? Luka cant play superman for 48 minutes. There is a reason why Josh Green has a medal ahead of him. An honest question is have you seen Luka set a pick this year? In the olympics, have you seen it? Would it hurt if he tried? It would help the team, I assume. Don't you agree? You think it's better if he plays superman for 48 mins or no?

The only thing they're doing is setting screens to get his favorite matchup. He set a ton of those screens vs Miami or Hawks, i honestly can't remember which game it was. But he's using that a lot lately. The thing is, they could be doing more, everyone agrees with that, but coach needs to be the one who sets the table for everyone else, what's the point of having a coach then?

Slovenian coach is beyond terrible, please don't use him as an example. Dude should be coaching in 2nd Slovenian league and not our national team Decided to take some players with him in the latest Euro cup and didn't even play them while important big guys stayed at home and were badly missed lol. Wish we still had Kokoskov who was fantastic in 18'.

[Bob8]

All Im saying is it wouldn't hurt the team if he were involved in the offense in another way. It would actually make things easier for him than playing point guard the whole game. It wouldn't hurt to get involved that way, you don't lose points by helping your teammate get open and it makes the team less predictable instead of just blitzing Luka on defense all game. Blitzing Luka on defense has been the answer to get the ball off his hands lately. In which case he passes it to Wood and watches from the three point line or he complains to the ref while Wood is doing iso. I've watched him off ball a lot of times and it is similar. I haven't seen him do it in the NBA and I haven't seen him do it in the olympics. Two different coaches. It would not hurt to set a back pick or two. Surely better than standing around the 3 point line and watching Wood going iso, don't you think? If Kobe can be the roller in a pick and roll, Luka can too. He just needs to learn the hard way. Ball travels faster than a human would.

Teams blitzing and doubling Luka very high means that his teammates are 4/3 with a lot of open space. Forcing teams to defend you like that is normally a win situation for you, there's no screens that can provide your team with that kind of advantage. If opponents are prepared to put 2 players on you to get the ball out of your hands, why would you do that by yourself and play off ball?

So your answer is for Luka to play point guard for 48 minutes because it is the most efficient? Doing the same things and expecting different results is crazy man. Playing superman wont change the fact that he will run out of gas eventually. It wont suddenly change because you want it to.

Mavs are not losing Luka's minutes, even though starting unit is not the best, they're losing, when his not playing. To change the result, you will need to change non Luka's minutes. Should he played more off-ball and making screens on the bench?

[arkuo]

Luka fans? Is this another argument people make when they think they have it all figured out? If you want to use that argument against me, you better come up with something a lot better than just being scared of having an argument about the team.

But either way, something tells me you're not watching Mavs as close as you should have. When Luka is out or not playing, Dinwiddie and rest of the team have exact same plays, standing around and watching Dinwiddie dribble. How many picks and movement do you see from him? Probably not a lot, right?


You need to first get to the root of the problem then criticize everything else. Why do Nuggets have such amazing screen movements, etc.. It's because Jokic is super athletic dude who runs all over the floor like Iverson, setting up his team or because Nuggets have a lot of sets which involves player moving without the ball?

Why Kobe&Shaq couldn't figure it out before Phil came with his triangle offense which involved a lot of passing and players setting screens? Why Pistons won in 04? Was it because Brown figured out how to use Sheed' and Hamilton as a decoy and ran Lakers to the ground with screens or because Pistons were simply a juggernaut team who won 10 rings in a row?


A lot of it has to do with coaching and yes, i will blame Kidd 100% until i see any improvement in their overall game. But it's a lot to expect from a coach who can't even draw up a last second play, the very basics of any coaching.

It's the same thing Luka did in the Olympics with a different coach. Dont get me wrong, Kidd has his shortcomings for sure. But would it hurt to set a back pick to help your teammate get open? Luka cant play superman for 48 minutes. There is a reason why Josh Green has a medal ahead of him. An honest question is have you seen Luka set a pick this year? In the olympics, have you seen it? Would it hurt if he tried? It would help the team, I assume. Don't you agree? You think it's better if he plays superman for 48 mins or no?

Because I would prefer if he saves all of his heroics for the 4th quarter. Let the others carry some of the load early on. it surely won't hurt to involve other people in the offense. You can only gain from it.

Josh Green was total non factor in the Olympics, benchwarmer par excellence. The reason is Australia having 23 millions bigger population.

That was sarcasm. I need to put the green font.

The question is if you can involve Luka in the offense by taking some of the point guard duties off him. He's surely proven he can do this and that. But it also proved it's not winning basketball. No one can play that much and still have enough left to finish the game or the playoffs. You can to contribute some other way. Would it hurt it he tries?

[arkuo]

Teams blitzing and doubling Luka very high means that his teammates are 4/3 with a lot of open space. Forcing teams to defend you like that is normally a win situation for you, there's no screens that can provide your team with that kind of advantage. If opponents are prepared to put 2 players on you to get the ball out of your hands, why would you do that by yourself and play off ball?

So your answer is for Luka to play point guard for 48 minutes because it is the most efficient? Doing the same things and expecting different results is crazy man. Playing superman wont change the fact that he will run out of gas eventually. It wont suddenly change because you want it to.

Mavs are not losing Luka's minutes, even though starting unit is not the best, they're losing, when his not playing. To change the result, you will need to change non Luka's minutes.

And to be able to change that, you need to add another facet to the offense. Because the bench unit is just mimicking what Luka has been employing with interchangeable parts. Just watching Dinwiddie go iso and kicking out to the open 3. You need more than that IMO. Run other plays. It's all connected. Mavs have people standing around waiting outside the 3 point line because that's how the starting unit plays. The bench comes in and runs the exact same thing with Luka on the bench. You need more than that IMO.

[Bob8]

It's the same thing Luka did in the Olympics with a different coach. Dont get me wrong, Kidd has his shortcomings for sure. But would it hurt to set a back pick to help your teammate get open? Luka cant play superman for 48 minutes. There is a reason why Josh Green has a medal ahead of him. An honest question is have you seen Luka set a pick this year? In the olympics, have you seen it? Would it hurt if he tried? It would help the team, I assume. Don't you agree? You think it's better if he plays superman for 48 mins or no?

Because I would prefer if he saves all of his heroics for the 4th quarter. Let the others carry some of the load early on. it surely won't hurt to involve other people in the offense. You can only gain from it.

Josh Green was total non factor in the Olympics, benchwarmer par excellence. The reason is Australia having 23 millions bigger population.

That was sarcasm. I need to put the green font.

The question is if you can involve Luka in the offense by taking some of the point guard duties off him. He's surely proven he can do this and that. But it also proved it's not winning basketball. No one can play that much and still have enough left to finish the game or the playoffs. You can to contribute some other way. Would it hurt it he tries?

It would hurt Mavs. That's what offrtg is clearly saying. Mavs had elite offense with Luka and 1 of the worst without him.

Yes he could lower his usage, if you pair him with another elite Pg, like he had in 2017 in prime Goran.

[Bob8]

So your answer is for Luka to play point guard for 48 minutes because it is the most efficient? Doing the same things and expecting different results is crazy man. Playing superman wont change the fact that he will run out of gas eventually. It wont suddenly change because you want it to.

Mavs are not losing Luka's minutes, even though starting unit is not the best, they're losing, when his not playing. To change the result, you will need to change non Luka's minutes.

And to be able to change that, you need to add another facet to the offense. Because the bench unit is just mimicking what Luka has been employing with interchangeable parts. Just watching Dinwiddie go iso and kicking out to the open 3. You need more than that IMO. Run other plays. It's all connected. Mavs have people standing around waiting outside the 3 point line because that's how the starting unit plays. The bench comes in and runs the exact same thing with Luka on the bench. You need more than that IMO.

You need different roster to do that. If you put the ball more in Frank's, THJ's...hands, result will be only worse.

[arkuo]

Josh Green was total non factor in the Olympics, benchwarmer par excellence. The reason is Australia having 23 millions bigger population.

That was sarcasm. I need to put the green font.

The question is if you can involve Luka in the offense by taking some of the point guard duties off him. He's surely proven he can do this and that. But it also proved it's not winning basketball. No one can play that much and still have enough left to finish the game or the playoffs. You can to contribute some other way. Would it hurt it he tries?

It would hurt Mavs. That's what offrtg is clearly saying. Mavs had elite offense with Luka and 1 of the worst without him.

Yes he could lower his usage, if you pair him with another elite Pg, like he had in 2017 in prime Goran.

Involving other players would help you go further. Mavs were number 1 in offensive rating just a few years ago only to get bounced in the playoffs. You dont get a ring for being number 1 in offensive rating. I prefer to win with 5 players on court.

[arkuo]

Mavs are not losing Luka's minutes, even though starting unit is not the best, they're losing, when his not playing. To change the result, you will need to change non Luka's minutes.

And to be able to change that, you need to add another facet to the offense. Because the bench unit is just mimicking what Luka has been employing with interchangeable parts. Just watching Dinwiddie go iso and kicking out to the open 3. You need more than that IMO. Run other plays. It's all connected. Mavs have people standing around waiting outside the 3 point line because that's how the starting unit plays. The bench comes in and runs the exact same thing with Luka on the bench. You need more than that IMO.

You need different roster to do that. If you put the ball more in Frank's, THJ's...hands, result will be only worse.

I think Dinwiddie needs to come off the bench and with THJ starting.

C- Wood / Powell
PF- Kleber / Bertans
SF- DFS / Bullock
SG- Doncic / Green
PG - THJ / Dinwiddie

I think that will have a better dynamic. Dinwiddie's PG skills are not used when Luka is primarily handling the ball anyway. I think it would work better if he comes off the bench ala Jason Terry. He can handle the ball then to give Luka a break. If they can swing a deal with DFS for Jerami Grant, that would be even better for the starting unit. Grant can also bring down the ball sometimes. Lillard allows him to do that when Lillard pops off a screen for a three with Grant or Simmons playing point.

[Bob8]

That was sarcasm. I need to put the green font.

The question is if you can involve Luka in the offense by taking some of the point guard duties off him. He's surely proven he can do this and that. But it also proved it's not winning basketball. No one can play that much and still have enough left to finish the game or the playoffs. You can to contribute some other way. Would it hurt it he tries?

It would hurt Mavs. That's what offrtg is clearly saying. Mavs had elite offense with Luka and 1 of the worst without him.

Yes he could lower his usage, if you pair him with another elite Pg, like he had in 2017 in prime Goran.

Involving other players would help you go further. Mavs were number 1 in offensive rating just a few years ago only to get bounced in the playoffs. You dont get a ring for being number 1 in offensive rating. I prefer to win with 5 players on court.

First you need to have players able to do that. You don't want anything else then shooting from players like Bullock, DFS, THJ, Kleber...because they're not capable of much more. RC rescued THJ's career by demanding to shoot with as little dribbles possible.

[41Dirk41]

And to be able to change that, you need to add another facet to the offense. Because the bench unit is just mimicking what Luka has been employing with interchangeable parts. Just watching Dinwiddie go iso and kicking out to the open 3. You need more than that IMO. Run other plays. It's all connected. Mavs have people standing around waiting outside the 3 point line because that's how the starting unit plays. The bench comes in and runs the exact same thing with Luka on the bench. You need more than that IMO.

You need different roster to do that. If you put the ball more in Frank's, THJ's...hands, result will be only worse.

I think Dinwiddie needs to come off the bench and with THJ starting.

C- Wood / Powell
PF- Kleber / Bertans
SF- DFS / Bullock
SG- Doncic / Green
PG - THJ / Dinwiddie

I think that will have a better dynamic. Dinwiddie's PG skills are not used when Luka is primarily handling the ball anyway. I think it would work better if he comes off the bench ala Jason Terry. He can handle the ball then to give Luka a break. If they can swing a deal with DFS for Jerami Grant, that would be even better for the starting unit. Grant can also bring down the ball sometimes. Lillard allows him to do that when Lillard pops off a screen for a three with Grant or Simmons playing point.

I don't think this S5 works, need another ballhandler.... They will double Luka and it's over. No more offensive options.

[Bob8]

And to be able to change that, you need to add another facet to the offense. Because the bench unit is just mimicking what Luka has been employing with interchangeable parts. Just watching Dinwiddie go iso and kicking out to the open 3. You need more than that IMO. Run other plays. It's all connected. Mavs have people standing around waiting outside the 3 point line because that's how the starting unit plays. The bench comes in and runs the exact same thing with Luka on the bench. You need more than that IMO.

You need different roster to do that. If you put the ball more in Frank's, THJ's...hands, result will be only worse.

I think Dinwiddie needs to come off the bench and with THJ starting.

C- Wood / Powell
PF- Kleber / Bertans
SF- DFS / Bullock
SG- Doncic / Green
PG - THJ / Dinwiddie

I think that will have a better dynamic. Dinwiddie's PG skills are not used when Luka is primarily handling the ball anyway. I think it would work better if he comes off the bench ala Jason Terry. He can handle the ball then to give Luka a break. If they can swing a deal with DFS for Jerami Grant, that would be even better for the starting unit. Grant can also bring down the ball sometimes. Lillard allows him to do that when Lillard pops off a screen for a three with Grant or Simmons playing point.

The problem with lineup like that is, what will you do, when Luka is blitzed/doubled? You need second ball handler desperately in situations like that. That's why Mavs were great with 3 ball handlers in the court together last year. Losing Brunson was just huge.

[Mavrelous]

Luka deferred a lot to Brunson, and Luka standing in the post is enough gravity for others to operate.
Mavs miss Brunson and need to replace him with another scorer.

[arkuo]

Luka deferred a lot to Brunson, and Luka standing in the post is enough gravity for others to operate.
Mavs miss Brunson and need to replace him with another scorer.

Another two way player to replace Brunson IMO. Getting Grant would be ideal.

Because playoff Brunson with T-rex arms means that if Steph Curry or Kawhi gets switched on to him, Mavs will be playing catchup all game.

[Bob8]

We can talk all day, how Mavs can be better, but unfortunately this roster has clear limitations. The only thing, which can be better in short run, is D. But even there, we have a problem, which can't be solved. Rim protection.

[arkuo]

We can talk all day, how Mavs can be better, but unfortunately this roster has clear limitations. The only thing, which can be better in short run is D.

I can agree with that. If the Mavs are able to stop opponents from scoring 130 against them every game, that would be great. Bullock and DFS aren't helping much in that category. They hustle a lot, hard workers, but great defenders they are not.

[Bob8]

We can talk all day, how Mavs can be better, but unfortunately this roster has clear limitations. The only thing, which can be better in short run is D.

I can agree with that. If the Mavs are able to stop opponents from scoring 130 against them every game, that would be great. Bullock and DFS aren't helping much in that category. They hustle a lot, hard workers, but great defenders they are not.

Mavs need similar roster that Bucks have built around Giannis. Luka with Jrue, Middleton and Lopez would have been difficult to beat. Guard/defender, scorer and rim protector, who can shoot.

[arkuo]

We can talk all day, how Mavs can be better, but unfortunately this roster has clear limitations. The only thing, which can be better in short run is D.

I can agree with that. If the Mavs are able to stop opponents from scoring 130 against them every game, that would be great. Bullock and DFS aren't helping much in that category. They hustle a lot, hard workers, but great defenders they are not.

Mavs need similar roster that Bucks has built around Giannis. Luka with Jrue, Middleton and Lopez would have been difficult to beat. Guard/defender, scorer and rim protector, who can shoot.

Mavs need to make it work with Wood IMO. Have him sign for 2 year contract similar to Myles Turner one now. Luka said it himself that he sometimes is hard on Wood because he screams at him but he doesn't answer back. That is a good sign because not a lot of American all stars would take that from a 24 year old foreigner. If Wood can be the Lopez in that equation, then that would be great. Dinwiddie needs to play more D as an off ball guard to Luka. Then he needs to find his own Middleton somewhere because THJ isn't it.

[Bob8]

I can agree with that. If the Mavs are able to stop opponents from scoring 130 against them every game, that would be great. Bullock and DFS aren't helping much in that category. They hustle a lot, hard workers, but great defenders they are not.

Mavs need similar roster that Bucks has built around Giannis. Luka with Jrue, Middleton and Lopez would have been difficult to beat. Guard/defender, scorer and rim protector, who can shoot.

Mavs need to make it work with Wood IMO. Have him sign for 2 year contract similar to Myles Turner one now. Luka said it himself that he sometimes is hard on Wood because he screams at him but he doesn't answer back. That is a good sign because not a lot of American all stars would take that from a 24 year old foreigner. If Wood can be the Lopez in that equation, then that would be great. Dinwiddie needs to play more D as an off ball guard to Luka. Then he needs to find his own Middleton somewhere because THJ isn't it.

Lopez is second in blocks in Nba and Dinwiddie is a very bad defender.

[arkuo]

Mavs need similar roster that Bucks has built around Giannis. Luka with Jrue, Middleton and Lopez would have been difficult to beat. Guard/defender, scorer and rim protector, who can shoot.

Mavs need to make it work with Wood IMO. Have him sign for 2 year contract similar to Myles Turner one now. Luka said it himself that he sometimes is hard on Wood because he screams at him but he doesn't answer back. That is a good sign because not a lot of American all stars would take that from a 24 year old foreigner. If Wood can be the Lopez in that equation, then that would be great. Dinwiddie needs to play more D as an off ball guard to Luka. Then he needs to find his own Middleton somewhere because THJ isn't it.

Lopez is second in blocks in Nba and Dinwiddie is a very bad defender.

It will surely be a challenge to find players that fit around Luka. Both considering PRICE and FIT. Ideally you need high level role players around Luka because using an all star and turning him into a spot up shooter in Dallas is like taking money and flushing it down the toilet. Luka handling the ball 90% of the possessions is a given. No one is changing that anytime soon. So they will attract high level role players and maybe the need to overpay a bit for some. But that is the reality Dallas is in right now. No all star will agree to be a spot up shooter for 90% of the game. Find me one and I will help Cuban pay the bill

[Bob8]

Mavs need to make it work with Wood IMO. Have him sign for 2 year contract similar to Myles Turner one now. Luka said it himself that he sometimes is hard on Wood because he screams at him but he doesn't answer back. That is a good sign because not a lot of American all stars would take that from a 24 year old foreigner. If Wood can be the Lopez in that equation, then that would be great. Dinwiddie needs to play more D as an off ball guard to Luka. Then he needs to find his own Middleton somewhere because THJ isn't it.

Lopez is second in blocks in Nba and Dinwiddie is a very bad defender.

It will surely be a challenge to find players that fit around Luka. Both considering PRICE and FIT. Ideally you need high level role players around Luka because using an all star and turning him into a spot up shooter in Dallas is like taking money and flushing it down the toilet. Luka handling the ball 90% of the possessions is a given. No one is changing that anytime soon. So they will attract high level role players and maybe the need to overpay a bit for some. But that is the reality Dallas is in right now. No all star will agree to be a spot up shooter for 90% of the game. Find me one and I will help Cuban pay the bill

Players like Jrue, Middleton and Lopez. And then you have Ayton, Bridges, Markkanen, Turner, Siakam and many others. I don't believe that's very difficult to upgrade starters as Bullock, Powell, DFS, THJ, Dinwiddie...