Huge trades for Utah

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Celts17Pride
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#21 » by Celts17Pride » Thu Feb 2, 2023 7:45 pm

Mak wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
Mak wrote:
So you can point me to 2 good late first round picks in 18 years. I don't know how that would make me feel better about this as a Jazz fan. :lol:

Tony Allen, Payton Pritchard, Avery Bradley, Delonte West, Terry Rozier ............


James Young
J.R. Giddens
Fab Melo
Jared Sullinger
Guerschon Yabusele
JaJuan Johnson


This should be worrisome for Jazzz fans. They will be getting a lot of late picks from Cavs and Minny.

Any pick after the lottery is a crap shoot. Ainge has been fine.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#22 » by JN61 » Thu Feb 2, 2023 7:48 pm

Really happy for Jazz fans. Seeing them absolutely ball is great when you get rid of your twin stars.
Pennebaker wrote:And Bird did it while being a defensive liability. But he also made All-Defensive teams, which was another controversial issue regarding Bird and votes.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#23 » by JN61 » Thu Feb 2, 2023 7:49 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
Mak wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:Tony Allen, Payton Pritchard, Avery Bradley, Delonte West, Terry Rozier ............


James Young
J.R. Giddens
Fab Melo
Jared Sullinger
Guerschon Yabusele
JaJuan Johnson


This should be worrisome for Jazzz fans. They will be getting a lot of late picks from Cavs and Minny.

Any pick after the lottery is a crap shoot. Ainge has been fine.


Also he is no Presti who has track record of multiple big time players outside of the lottery.
Pennebaker wrote:And Bird did it while being a defensive liability. But he also made All-Defensive teams, which was another controversial issue regarding Bird and votes.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#24 » by Celts17Pride » Thu Feb 2, 2023 7:50 pm

JN61 wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
Mak wrote:
James Young
J.R. Giddens
Fab Melo
Jared Sullinger
Guerschon Yabusele
JaJuan Johnson


This should be worrisome for Jazzz fans. They will be getting a lot of late picks from Cavs and Minny.

Any pick after the lottery is a crap shoot. Ainge has been fine.


Also he is no Presti who has track record of multiple big time players outside of the lottery.

Didn't say Ainge was great, I said he was fine.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#25 » by OxAndFox » Thu Feb 2, 2023 7:59 pm

This is the reason your GM shouldn't be trading large pick hauls.
Yet people are still convinced OG should get you 3 picks, etc. The GMs that hold onto their picks are the smart ones, any team selling their future without a true #1 option coming back is crazy.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#26 » by KodiakBear » Thu Feb 2, 2023 8:02 pm

The Minnesota trade especially was incredible. Still can't believe how stupid Minnesota was. Did they watch Gobert in the playoffs the last few years? He was not a player worth giving up the farm for.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#27 » by dautjazz » Thu Feb 2, 2023 8:26 pm

I'm looking at Lauri and Mitchell's stats, and honestly, it's a wash, incredible that we also got Sexton, Agbaji (starting to show signs), 3 unprotected FRPs, and a swap. Massive haul.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#28 » by BlazersBroncos » Thu Feb 2, 2023 8:56 pm

I would say they are in the 2nd best long term position of any team right now after OKC.

Lauri looks like a legit top tier #2 option, Kessler likely is a top-5 rim protector for the foreseeable future, tons of draft capital (mostly unprotected), few youngsters that might be nice bench guys moving forward.

Will be fun watching how this plays out for them.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#29 » by Nate505 » Thu Feb 2, 2023 9:23 pm

While I won't say that Kessler is better than Gobert or Lauri is better than Mitchell, at least the trades gave the Jazz back two pretty good players and a ton of draft capital with it, not to mention serviceable to solid players like Sexton/Beasley/Vanderbilt and another promising rookie in Agbaji.

From the Jazz perspective at least, the Minnesota trade was nearly highway robbery and the Cavs trade was at least equal if not better for them.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#30 » by hauntedcomputer » Thu Feb 2, 2023 9:35 pm

You not only have to get a player that will and can develop, you have to develop them. A lot of guys never land in the right spot or land with awful franchises. Imagine Kawhi on the Kings.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#31 » by bisme37 » Thu Feb 2, 2023 9:49 pm

I complained about the Gobert trade a lot when it happened and have been trying to let it go lol, but damn that was a really bad trade. Even aside from the poor fit I just don't get giving up a decade of assets for a one dimensional player.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#32 » by Up-And-Coming » Thu Feb 2, 2023 9:58 pm

Mak wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
Mak wrote:
So you can point me to 2 good late first round picks in 18 years. I don't know how that would make me feel better about this as a Jazz fan. :lol:

Tony Allen, Payton Pritchard, Avery Bradley, Delonte West, Terry Rozier ............


James Young
J.R. Giddens
Fab Melo
Jared Sullinger
Guerschon Yabusele
JaJuan Johnson


This should be worrisome for Jazzz fans. They will be getting a lot of late picks from Cavs and Minny.


Yes, Ainge doesn't have a great track record with picks outside the lottery but as far as I know, isn't the Jazz's General Manager Justin Zanik and wasn't he the one who drafted Walker Kessler?
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#33 » by bstein14 » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:07 pm

Pelicans, Jazz, and OKC all set up for nice futures after collecting assets from trading away their star players. No reason that all three of them shouldn't be in the playoffs for a long time moving forward with the assets and young talent they have.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#34 » by GreatWhiteStiff » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:32 pm

Gobert for Kessler straight up is a steal for Utah.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#35 » by lonzo_pelota » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:37 pm

In todays modern era of basketball of needing shooting and floor spacing , i question a GM's intellect for even wanting gobert on there team let along giving up the farm for him
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#36 » by TheLand13 » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:42 pm

Sunlight wrote:Return was in total 7x1st-round draft picks. :o

Read on Twitter


Lauri having more points than Mitchell is very misleading as Mitchell has played in less games due injury. I would fully expect Lauri to have more points at this time during the season. But one's an all star starter and the other one isn't. I'll let you figure out which one that is.

facothomas22 wrote:Looking back at it, the Timberwolves made a really bad decision at giving up all of those future assets for guy who doesn't fit with their team. That was always a major concern since the beginning and now given Gobert value is down and likely would have to sell relatively low on him compared to what they have given up, there's not not much can do to reverse the Gobert trade, unless they can flip D'Angelo Russell for something good or trade KAT in the off season. Not only that, but they are pace of having a worse record this year than last year.

The Cavaliers on the other hand, while does seem like in hindsight that they give up a ton for Donovan Mitchell, no one could have predicted that Lauri Markkanen would blossom into a 25 point per game scorer and a all star candidate. He was a disappointment with the Bulls. Looked decent with the Cavaliers, but was clearly out of position and likely would've been traded at some point regardless. Also the Cavaliers can still trade Darius Garland for a very significant return down the road if the Mitchell/Garland pairing turns out to be poor fit come playoff time.


Cleveland's not trading Garland, especially after they just signed him to a five year deal. Mitchell will get them a lot more in return and they're better off with Garland leading the offense anyways.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#37 » by Hoop Heavy » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:43 pm

Capn'O wrote:I still can't believe those trades. Particularly the Gobert trade. What on earth.

whatisacenter wrote:Robert Williams and Grant Williams have done alright...


So, stick to Williams.



It was Minnesota. They haven't been that bad for that long without doing lots (like assess trade value and fit) of things poorly. :banghead:
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#38 » by DonaldSanders » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:47 pm

lonzo_pelota wrote:In todays modern era of basketball of needing shooting and floor spacing , i question a GM's intellect for even wanting gobert on there team let along giving up the farm for him


Agreed, it's questionable to want him based on how much salary he ties up. He's not worth his salary now much less as he ages. We talk about the picks given up for him which was bad, but his salary also ties up too much relative to his worth:

22-23: 38M - 30yr
23-24: 41M - 31yr
24-25: 43.8M - 32yr
25-26: 46.6 - 33yr

The cap is going to go up but so is Gobert's age. He's a good player but I would not want to be paying him #1 player money into his 30s. Utah just totally dominated this trade.
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#39 » by Dan Z » Thu Feb 2, 2023 10:58 pm

JN61 wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
Mak wrote:
James Young
J.R. Giddens
Fab Melo
Jared Sullinger
Guerschon Yabusele
JaJuan Johnson


This should be worrisome for Jazzz fans. They will be getting a lot of late picks from Cavs and Minny.

Any pick after the lottery is a crap shoot. Ainge has been fine.


Also he is no Presti who has track record of multiple big time players outside of the lottery.


How many big time players did Presti pick outside the lottery? Ibaka, Reggie Jackson and...?
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Re: Huge trades for Utah 

Post#40 » by lonzo_pelota » Thu Feb 2, 2023 11:00 pm

DonaldSanders wrote:
lonzo_pelota wrote:In todays modern era of basketball of needing shooting and floor spacing , i question a GM's intellect for even wanting gobert on there team let along giving up the farm for him


Agreed, it's questionable to want him based on how much salary he ties up. He's not worth his salary now much less as he ages. We talk about the picks given up for him which was bad, but his salary also ties up too much relative to his worth:

22-23: 38M - 30yr
23-24: 41M - 31yr
24-25: 43.8M - 32yr
25-26: 46.6 - 33yr

The cap is going to go up but so is Gobert's age. He's a good player but I would not want to be paying him #1 player money into his 30s. Utah just totally dominated this trade.



I agree He's a talented player but adding him to your team for a huge assortment of picks on a max contract in todays age when your team doesnt need a offensively limited defensive stallworth non floor spacing center seems a bit asinine. they should went after christian wood he was available & for far far cheaper plus he's more versatile on the offensive end.

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