NBA players are better than ever, despite what the legends say

[JayMKE]

Main difference now is that there is far more international talent, rules are completely different now so what skills work best are different but athletically they were the same. Chucking 3s isn't a special talent, guys back then could do the exact something but their asses would get stuck to the bench taking a desperate shot like that. Lets see these guys dance around the lane with somebody literally hanging on their hip. Defense basically doesn't exist now.

People who stan current players or were too young to see what came before need to stop being so defensive, its pathetic

[FluLikeSymptoms]

One thing rarely mentioned is how much basketball has grown within the US, too. The international growth is massive but basketball is attracting more US athletes than ever.

Basketball was well behind baseball for the first 50 years of the NBA, in terms of public opinion and the dreams of athletes. That changed under MJ’s watch, and even he had to double-check that basketball was cooler. You had dudes like Winfield, Strawberry, Bonds, Griffey Jr, Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders playing friggin baseball. Some of the best athletes in US history. Playing friggin baseball. If they all came along today Bo and Deion probably still play football but those other dudes are hooping no matter what their daddies did. Strawberry was pure NBA, basically the first NBA player to wear full-length tights but killing another sport. How many of the best basketball players withered playing baseball in the minors in the 90s? Nevermind the 80s, 70s, 60s.

West did his thing and he deserves respect for gaining his place in the game at the time, and if he were a kid today I’m sure he would be Kobe or whatever, but at a certain point it’s disingenuous to present 50-60 y/o basketball as the same thing players are doing now.

[druggas]

OP is a clown. Holy hot takes.

Amen.

[nikster]

Main difference now is that there is far more international talent, rules are completely different now so what skills work best are different but athletically they were the same. Chucking 3s isn't a special talent, guys back then could do the exact something but their asses would get stuck to the bench taking a desperate shot like that. Lets see these guys dance around the lane with somebody literally hanging on their hip. Defense basically doesn't exist now.

People who stan current players or were too young to see what came before need to stop being so defensive, its pathetic

Yeah thats the huge difference. Imagine the difference in talent in the league without Jokic, Giannis, Luka, Pascal, Embiid etc...Thats like 4 MVP candidates and an All NBA player

I do think the increase in talent pool has lead to more athleticism when it comes to role players and fringe guys

[Birth of the Cool]

Why can't we see that it's both? Yes players in the league today have a higher skill level then ever before as social media / Youtube and the general popularity of basketball has increased and much more kids are learning to play bball now. You can see pretty good players in even pickup games these days - however, can't we also say the NBA has gone too far in allowing these skill players to show off their skills by neutering defense.

I saw the Lakers game recently and Hachimura had a bunch of touch falls called on him for daring to play any kind of defense. What used to be no calls where defense and offense are in the same space, is now a foul on the defender. Moving screens have become normalized. Palming the ball has become normalized. It seems the only legitimate defense that is accepted by the NBA today is the charge call (and to even get this call players are forced to flop to ensure Refs see the charge).

These players are highly skilled and playing at the highest level, and they aren't allowed to be guarded too much - of course 40pt games become the norm and 50-60pt games start happening more often.

[G35]

Lot of great individual play...not a lot of great teams....

[Haldi]

There is no logical way to explain how the talent is not better now.
If anything there's been a giant talent infusion from

a) the whole world. Back then the Jokic/Doncic types would probably have stayed overseas until mid-late in their career (same way Arvydas Sabonis, Drazen, Kukoc, Manu etc stayed in Europe for a while for a variety of reasons), the Gobert/Vucevic types wouldn't even make it to the NBA at all (like Nick Galis or Oscar Schmidt didn't make it) and the Embiid/Siakam types probably wouldn't even know that basketball is a sport.

b) from the simple fact that the top talent starts in the NBA earlier instead of waiting to finish college.

People are maybe forgetting but there was *a lot* of super crap players in the NBA back then. A lot, especially bigs.

Are they saying that Doncic wouldn't be as effective if you hand check him and then elbow him in the ribs and punch him in the face? Sure. But that has nothing to do with his talent and nobody wants to watch that crap anyway, we moved away from it for a reason: there are other sports that do that better.

I couldn’t agree more with this. People overrate so much how many flying elbow smashes from the top rope and rib punches and eye gouges there was back then, and yes Rodman used to get away with most of it probably along with a few other names always mentionned… but why the hell does anybody want to see that crap in a sport like basketball.

Watching “hockey goons” type players in the NBA was always the worst thing about the NBA and I couldn’t be happier that these types of players are almost fully phased out(almost, yes I know PJ Tucker still doing this, and people still call this good defense lol). Watch Giannis and Rodman play defense and see the difference between a PF thats an amazing defender and a PF that’s amazing at being a goon. Watch Jrue and Pat Bev and see the same difference but with guards. That’s amazing defense, you don’t need to always be fouling your opponent to play great defense, and if you can’t play defense without constantly fouling your opponent, its cause you’re not a great defender.

[CharityStripe34]

For me it's simple. The true greats from each era would be great in any era (perhaps with some exceptions). It's a nice general rule for not overly propping up or denigrating a specific era.

[mademan]

NBA might be one of the only sports where the fans cant admit that the players have become more talented and better. As if globalization and vasts amount of resources being poured into the game wouldnt increase the talent level. Its crazy. We also have some ridiculous revisionist history of how 'violent' the game was.

I watch full games from the 90's and see guys constantly with hands on hips or knees off ball (both offense and defense) doing absolutely nothing. It's honestly wild to watch

[bovice]

the NBA is very similar to the WWE.

the players/wrestlers are more athletic and skilled than they've ever been but their personalities aren't as charismatic and as a result the product isn't as entertaining. I think it's just what happens when the product is overly commercialized

they're both rigged too but that's another topic

[Yuri Vaultin]

Wow!! Whole playoff series? Tell me more ye wise sage and graduate of YouTube University. You're basically mansplaining - I've watched NBA basketball from the 80's through to today.

Not to diminish your contributions but your post and subsequent posts in this thread are basically code for "how to say you're young and haven't seen much ball from the era you're ripping without saying it".

Yes, entire playoff series. I’ve watched every NBA Finals game Jordan played in, as well as multiple Conference Finals series, first round series, regular season games. I watched every Bird-Magic Finals matchup, as well as playoff series involving Hakeem, Drexler, Robinson, Shaq, Malone, etc.

And stop with this “young kid” nonsense. I’m a grown man in my 30’s with a wife and kid. I’m not some 12 year old who just started watching

Your memories of what you’ve seen 30 years ago doesn’t compare to someone actually watching it today.

It's shocking how many people trust their 30 year old memories of a game they were likely watching with a beer in hand. Fully knowing they couldn't tell you their last 15 meals. But we should trust their insanely old memories.

It's shocking how many people don't realize that everyone has access to YouTube...

It's also shocking how poor reading comprehension is these days. The game is officiated different these days. The rules are different these days. Players will always get faster and stronger. Not necessarily smarter though, despite access to better tools. Case in point: throughout the 2000's teams were over-enamoured with athleticism and routinely drafted the lowest bball IQ guys ever to lace up shoes.

Downplaying the impact of hand checking and the inclusion of zone defense as allowable is weird - but expected when trying to drive a narrative.

Fact is the generation playing now willl downplay the next one and so on and so forth. It's the one constant in the NBA. Some fans have been lucky enough to watch the game grow and develop. They don't cling to the past as some allude, but can talk about the goonish ways of bygone eras and how clunky some offences used to be back when zone was only allowed in college.

[SeattleJazzFan]

with the influx of foreign players, of course the talent is a lot better and deeper in today's league. it's like trying to argue the nba/nfl and mlb had more talent before blacks were allowed. when there is a bigger pool of talent to draw from the talent will be better - this isn't rocket science. OP is absolutely right.

[The Explorer]

Defense and rim protection is also at some of the worst level ever seen.

This year, all 30 teams are shooting at a ridiculous clip in the restricted area. Denver is at the top at 72% and OKC is at the bottom at 62%

Compare that to 1997 where the best team was 61% and the worst team was 44% at the rim. The best team at the rim back then would be the worst in the league today.

Its easy to get high percentage buckets when there is no resistance at the rim.

[SeattleJazzFan]

Defense and rim protection is also at some of the worst level ever seen.

This year, all 30 teams are shooting at a ridiculous clip in the restricted area. Denver is at the top at 72% and OKC is at the bottom at 62%

Compare that to 1997 where the best team was 61% and the worst team was 44% at the rim. The best team at the rim back then would be the worst in the league today.

Its easy to get high percentage buckets when there is no resistance at the rim.

and the reason there isn't much resistance at the rim is because guys can score from everywhere at crazy efficient rates with insane volume. you have to guard the entire court which opens up the rim. the overall skill level of players has made defense nearly impossible from all over the court - not just at the rim.

in those days, if you protected the paint, you won. period. simply doesn't work that way today - you have to defend the entire court.

[FrobeBryant]

Forget what the old heads say..surely OP knows more about basketball than those guys

[MavsDirk41]

I agree with the OP, the talent level is unreal today. The athleticism, the shooting, the versatility, the creativity. This league is full of current and future all time greats.

And there was none of that in the 80s and 90s?

[MavsDirk41]

NBA might be one of the only sports where the fans cant admit that the players have become more talented and better. As if globalization and vasts amount of resources being poured into the game wouldnt increase the talent level. Its crazy. We also have some ridiculous revisionist history of how 'violent' the game was.

I watch full games from the 90's and see guys constantly with hands on hips or knees off ball (both offense and defense) doing absolutely nothing. It's honestly wild to watch

And i watch games today where offense will have a 3 on 1 fast break opportunity and a player will shoot a 3….thats good basketball?

[The Explorer]

It all depends on how you view things. Arguments can be made in favor of today's player being more skilled in terms of shooting and ball handling.

Arguments could also be made against today's players being less skilled:
- lack of post skills
- poor footwork
- poor passing into the post (ineffective lob passes instead of bounce passes)
- poor knowledge of knowing how to get to preferred spots on the court
- poor ball screens from guards (Stockton, hornecek, others were very good at this)
- lack of ability to hit contested perimeter shots
- lack of boxing out and physicality
- durability, availability (consistency is a skill)


Note this is for the average player today and where the league is trending. Speaking in generalities here, we know there are some exceptions.

[PedroFlu]

Defense and rim protection is also at some of the worst level ever seen.

This year, all 30 teams are shooting at a ridiculous clip in the restricted area. Denver is at the top at 72% and OKC is at the bottom at 62%

Compare that to 1997 where the best team was 61% and the worst team was 44% at the rim. The best team at the rim back then would be the worst in the league today.

Its easy to get high percentage buckets when there is no resistance at the rim.

Come on.. paint was packed cause people couldn't shoot.

I see a lot of Chicago fans among the "conservative" fans who really miss the era when real basketball was played... wonder why would that be lol.

Not that the current game isn't getting too washed. It is. But it's still not only better, it's much better than before. The NBA just needs to go back at giving defense a chance again and balance things a bit, and push against all the whining and flopping that is indeed plaguing the game.

[mademan]

NBA might be one of the only sports where the fans cant admit that the players have become more talented and better. As if globalization and vasts amount of resources being poured into the game wouldnt increase the talent level. Its crazy. We also have some ridiculous revisionist history of how 'violent' the game was.

I watch full games from the 90's and see guys constantly with hands on hips or knees off ball (both offense and defense) doing absolutely nothing. It's honestly wild to watch

And i watch games today where offense will have a 3 on 1 fast break opportunity and a player will shoot a 3….thats good basketball?

Ya? Guys are good enough shooters where thats a +EV play.