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2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions

Moderators: bwgood77, Qwigglez, lilfishi22

Initial thoughts on KD for Bridges, Cam, Crowder, plus picks?

Love it!
15
25%
Indifferent
3
5%
Hate it
24
39%
Wait and see...
19
31%
 
Total votes: 61

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1321 » by mademan » Fri Feb 3, 2023 12:26 am

sunskerr wrote:
sunsbum wrote:
mademan wrote:
You think the Raps want a 30+ mill C when theyve signalled theyre looking for young talent and picks. Dyson Daniels/Lakers picks/Warriors picks...etc, are what they got, and theyre more attractive to a team in the Raps position with a young strong prospect in Barnes
oh, I forgot Ayton was old and untalented. Dyson Daniels, of course.


But Dyson Daniels could be anything. He could even be another

OG Anunoby


aint that the troof. But Daniels is also cheaper and on a more controllable contract (6 years of control), which are big pluses.
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1322 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Feb 3, 2023 1:17 am

lilfishi22 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:The reality in finding another star to place next to Booker is quite simply through the draft and always has been. All stars have inevitably come from the draft and then been properly nurtured and developed in a solid environment. Other stars overcome poor environments and adversity to still reach their outlier outcomes. But the most cost effective and best odds of acquiring a star talent is still the draft. I mean how often do legitimate star players actually become available in trades or free agency?? Almost never because their teams just don't let them go! And even in the very miniscule outlier instances of them actually becoming available, You have to have an absurd cache of premium assets to even field a competitive offer for one! And even more so in today's NBA climate. And the sad reality is that we as a franchise simply don't have near enough premium assets (even with all of our picks) to field a competitive offer for a star player compared to many other current teams!

We blew those opportunities thanks to Jones aversion to the draft and recognizing value of young cost controlled upside assets. Ironically what you'll find as mandatory inclusionary pieces in the outgoing framework of any star trade currently! Teams with plenty of young rookie or 2nd and 3rd year upside talent will outbid us for available stars UNLESS we're actually willing to offload our core pieces in the trades. But IF we do that, then the trade outcome becomes (at best) maybe slightly better than a lateral move IF we're lucky??? :nonono:

lol virtually every player/star came through the draft....that's how the vast majority of NBA players (and busts) come into the NBA


Yeah! That's my point. It's a pretty safe argument...lol :lol:
But still, We stand much better odds of identifying that kind of talent and drafting them IF Ishbia brings in a top notch scouting team and talent evaluators than by trying to beat these other teams loaded to the hilt with assets that e simply can't match! Especially too from a cost control perspective seeing as how we also don't have any cap flexibility whatsoever beyond our taxpayer MLE to even try to land a high level impact player in free agency. So the best and most viable avenue left available to us would still be the draft. :nod:
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1323 » by Qwigglez » Fri Feb 3, 2023 1:18 am

Booker is even snubbed on the snub-list. :lol:

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1324 » by Blonde » Fri Feb 3, 2023 1:28 am

I don’t think it’s wild to say OG is worth 3 firsts. To land a true star it’s going to take at least 3 firsts plus pick swaps plus valuable rotation players and/or good prospects. He’s perhaps the best wing defender in the league on a good contract and is still growing offensively. I won’t beat myself up over it if he get’s traded elsewhere for 3 firsts and salary filler because I understand the injury concerns and next contract concerns. The value seems right though, and I like the fit of him and Mikal on the wings with DA at C and Cam off the bench. If the Raptors want valuable players and not just picks for him then I don’t think we’re good trading partners.

Someone like Collins is probably worth 1 first to me due to the length of contract and obvious dip in production this year. But he should still have value around the league and if on a new team he brings his production closer to where it was, he’s suddenly on a great contract. IDK if he’s a Suns type of guy but they have not shied away from starting another big next to Ayton in the past.
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1325 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Feb 3, 2023 1:35 am

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1326 » by KLEON » Fri Feb 3, 2023 1:37 am

Qwigglez wrote:Booker is even snubbed on the snub-list. :lol:

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1327 » by Qwigglez » Fri Feb 3, 2023 1:55 am

It'll just fuel the Suns even more I feel. No all-stars. A lot of all-stars this year, their team isn't even in the top 8 :lol:

Lebron, Zion, Lauri, SGA, Lillard, Derozan, Haliburton.
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1328 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:00 am

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Not surprising with Grant not extending yet. He obviously wants more and the blazers just don't want to pay what he's seeking. Still would suck though as I still really want V8 on this team!
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1329 » by NE1Care » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:08 am

Same as it ever was.

I keep coming here for good news but....
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1330 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:09 am

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1331 » by BobbieL » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:17 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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Not surprising with Grant not extending yet. He obviously wants more and the blazers just don't want to pay what he's seeking. Still would suck though as I still really want V8 on this team!


Could the Suns get Grant for the stretch run perhaps

Might be able to do an S&T this summer if need be
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1332 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:24 am

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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Not surprising with Grant not extending yet. He obviously wants more and the blazers just don't want to pay what he's seeking. Still would suck though as I still really want V8 on this team!


Could the Suns get Grant for the stretch run perhaps

Might be able to do an S&T this summer if need be

He'll be an unrestricted free agent though this summer and looking for a max! IF it didn't cost too much with both the Pels and Grizz distracted with Anunoby, I'd like to quietly submit a trade offer at the deadline and see IF we could possibly steal him. Then we can make a deep run with him and reassess if we'd like to resign him (If we're intending to move Ayton anyways in the summer for a cheaper option?? :dontknow:
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1333 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:24 am

Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
BW, I'm just happy you haven't suggested we trade for Peotl again. Thank you for that.

In all seriousness they need to do something. I know you listen to Zach Lowe. Did you hear his podcast this week with Tim Mcmahon, where they both essentially said that JJ is GMing for his job?

That is VERY interesting. Both of those guys have sources and could be wild if true


I think it's common sense that he would be GMing for his job. I have never suggested we trade for Poeltl, just that it is probably around Ayton's value to get a cheaper quality C, a shooter or potentially young piece and a pick given they have 3 extra firsts from Atlanta.


Wait, what?

How can you say that it's common sense he's GMing for his job? I've been saying that for months and literally like virtually everyone, including yourself has told me that him and Monty are completely safe. Like it's me and Frank that have been the only guys in here complaining about those 2 for this season.

You can't seriously think that it's status quo to say that Monty and JJ are in jeopardy of losing their jobs?

Either way, hopefully JJ can make a good trade with Toronto. I think there's a lot there to be had.


Any time a new owner comes in he may make changes. I will be surprised if he moves on from Monty but I wouldn't be surprised at all if Jones is no longer the GM, though I think if we get a new one he might just move in to a new role. It's already been announced Ishbia will have some people that will be involved in decision making and one might be the GM. I do think it's probably kind of decided in Ishbia's head though...and that he's not going to base it on a move before the deadline.

I will be a little surprised if he just fires Jones outright instead of just having him do more of a different role, maybe in part right after Sarver largely got ousted due to racism (not saying he's racist or that it would be racist but that it might not be the best look). He already has more than one title anyway I think.
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1334 » by Slim Charless » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:26 am

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1335 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:29 am

The Toronto Raptors are receiving lots of interest in OG Anunoby. The New York Knicks have reportedly offered three first-round picks for Anunoby. The Memphis Grizzlies and New Orleans Pelicans are also interested in the Raptors forward.

There is an increasing belief that Anunoby is ready to move on from Toronto. The Raptors are considered the key team to watch a week from the trade deadline. It's unclear what Masai Ujiri's plan is for his underachieving team.

Both the Grizzlies and Pelicans have a host of young players and draft picks that they could offer to the Raptors in a trade for Anunoby. Also, both teams reportedly do not want to see the other land the talented two-way forward.


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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1336 » by lilfishi22 » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:31 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:The reality in finding another star to place next to Booker is quite simply through the draft and always has been. All stars have inevitably come from the draft and then been properly nurtured and developed in a solid environment. Other stars overcome poor environments and adversity to still reach their outlier outcomes. But the most cost effective and best odds of acquiring a star talent is still the draft. I mean how often do legitimate star players actually become available in trades or free agency?? Almost never because their teams just don't let them go! And even in the very miniscule outlier instances of them actually becoming available, You have to have an absurd cache of premium assets to even field a competitive offer for one! And even more so in today's NBA climate. And the sad reality is that we as a franchise simply don't have near enough premium assets (even with all of our picks) to field a competitive offer for a star player compared to many other current teams!

We blew those opportunities thanks to Jones aversion to the draft and recognizing value of young cost controlled upside assets. Ironically what you'll find as mandatory inclusionary pieces in the outgoing framework of any star trade currently! Teams with plenty of young rookie or 2nd and 3rd year upside talent will outbid us for available stars UNLESS we're actually willing to offload our core pieces in the trades. But IF we do that, then the trade outcome becomes (at best) maybe slightly better than a lateral move IF we're lucky??? :nonono:

lol virtually every player/star came through the draft....that's how the vast majority of NBA players (and busts) come into the NBA


Yeah! That's my point. It's a pretty safe argument...lol :lol:
But still, We stand much better odds of identifying that kind of talent and drafting them IF Ishbia brings in a top notch scouting team and talent evaluators than by trying to beat these other teams loaded to the hilt with assets that e simply can't match! Especially too from a cost control perspective seeing as how we also don't have any cap flexibility whatsoever beyond our taxpayer MLE to even try to land a high level impact player in free agency. So the best and most viable avenue left available to us would still be the draft. :nod:

Regardless if we're building through the draft or through trades, every team should aim to have the best scouting team and talent evaluators as possible. But finding the best is difficult because more of than not, they are already employed by other teams.

And just because the draft is one avenue to getting a star, it's by no means the only avenue to bring one to Phoenix. Great if you can find one in late lottery and be cost controlled for years to come but again, easier said than done.
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1337 » by lilfishi22 » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:33 am

Qwigglez wrote:Booker is even snubbed on the snub-list. :lol:

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Maybe he's not a starter but he could still make the reserves on the snub list 8-)

Or could still make it as an injury replacement...never know with AD :lol:
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1338 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:33 am

Seems like Booker was a lot higher on player rankings last year.

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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1339 » by lilfishi22 » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:40 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
I think it's common sense that he would be GMing for his job. I have never suggested we trade for Poeltl, just that it is probably around Ayton's value to get a cheaper quality C, a shooter or potentially young piece and a pick given they have 3 extra firsts from Atlanta.


Wait, what?

How can you say that it's common sense he's GMing for his job? I've been saying that for months and literally like virtually everyone, including yourself has told me that him and Monty are completely safe. Like it's me and Frank that have been the only guys in here complaining about those 2 for this season.

You can't seriously think that it's status quo to say that Monty and JJ are in jeopardy of losing their jobs?

Either way, hopefully JJ can make a good trade with Toronto. I think there's a lot there to be had.


Any time a new owner comes in he may make changes. I will be surprised if he moves on from Monty but I wouldn't be surprised at all if Jones is no longer the GM, though I think if we get a new one he might just move in to a new role. It's already been announced Ishbia will have some people that will be involved in decision making and one might be the GM. I do think it's probably kind of decided in Ishbia's head though...and that he's not going to base it on a move before the deadline.

I will be a little surprised if he just fires Jones outright instead of just having him do more of a different role, maybe in part right after Sarver largely got ousted due to racism (not saying he's racist or that it would be racist but that it might not be the best look). He already has more than one title anyway I think.

Personally think JJ is safer than Monty. Coaches are generally the first to go when a team is underachieving. But neither are safe safe when new management comes in. I see it in business all the time. Even if you already have a good CEO or a good group of execs, they will always be one of the first on the firing line as new owners generally have their own guys or just want to run things differently. Neither JJ nor Monty are on that Coach Spo or RC Buford tier.
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Re: 2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions 

Post#1340 » by Qwigglez » Fri Feb 3, 2023 2:41 am

NE1Care wrote:Same as it ever was.

I keep coming here for good news but....


The good news is... don't expect the Suns to make any moves until Ishbia is officially the owner on the 8th. It is likely there have been soft agreements already but they can't happen until he transitions as the owner. Other owners are aware of the situation.

The bad news about that is... he could easily get fleeced because other owners know he probably wants to make a splashy entrance so I fully don't expect the Suns to have 2 or 3 future 1st round picks in the next 6 years. But hey, enjoy the ride the next two seasons at the very least.

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