Trade Deadline Rumours & Discussion Thread IV (Thurs Feb 9 3pm)

alan_156 · Post #221 » by **alan_156** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:18 pm

WuTang_OG wrote:

Read on Twitter

Give me off the bench :nod:

anotherhomer · Post #222 » by **anotherhomer** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:18 pm

alan_156 wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:

Read on Twitter

Give me off the bench

He wants to be a starter

Gavin_TDThree · Post #223 » by **Gavin_TDThree** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:21 pm

I've started convincing myself that OG and FVV are 100% being traded. The deals are already in place, we are now just securing the ancillary deals that'll round out our roster. We are just waiting on that first domino

If I say it enough times I may begin to believe it

bboyskinnylegs · Post #224 » by **bboyskinnylegs** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:22 pm

I don't think Hyland would work out here, but I have no problem trading any of our small contracts (outside of Precious) for him

NinjaBro · Post #225 » by **NinjaBro** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:23 pm

Another day of nuthin guys

StopitLeo · Post #226 » by **StopitLeo** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:24 pm

TGM wrote:Honestly we need to consolidate assets as to add more these 7-8th guys on your roster. If I had to group we look something like this.

Tier 1 - we have zero (go to scorer alpha)

Tier 2 - Pascal ( second option)

Tier 3 - OG, Fred, Scottie ( glue guy and 3rd option)

Tier 4 - Trent, Precious ( fourth option)

Tier 5 - Thad, Boucher ( bench energy player 7-8th option)

Tier 6 - Banton, Koloko, Flynn. ( back-up guys when you have injuries or blow out minutes)

When we won a chip we had

Tier 1 - Kawhi

Tier 2 - Lowry and up coming pascal

Tier 3 - Gasol, Ibaka, Fred

Tier 4 - Norm

Tier 5 - OG

This is a very pyramid setup so it’s pretty simple to see why we aren’t winning.

I like this visual a lot. A few points I’d like to add:

1) A team’s realistic playoff ceiling is basically set by which tier their best player is in. For example, Tier 1 is Finals and Tier 2 Conference Finals.

2) There are very few Tier 1 players in the league.

3) The contribution of a player to winning is heavily weighted in the top 2 tiers of the pyramid.

4) There are rare instances where a team can be a legitimate title contender without a Tier 1 player. These teams have multiple Tier 2 players and perform where the sum is greater than the parts (e.g. the 2004 Pistons and the 2020 Heat).

douggood · Post #227 » by **douggood** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:26 pm

bboyskinnylegs wrote:I don't think Hyland would work out here, but I have no problem trading any of our small contracts (outside of Precious) for him

precious is who they would want, they are looking for a defensive minded front court player.

alpngso · Post #228 » by **alpngso** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:27 pm

Would you rather Bones or Cam Thomas?

TheWave · Post #229 » by **TheWave** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:28 pm

Lets do this. Lets do this today. Do it.

douggood · Post #230 » by **douggood** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:29 pm

alpngso wrote:Would you rather Bones or Cam Thomas?

cam
but we know bones is available, no such word on cam.

ishoy123 · Post #231 » by **ishoy123** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:29 pm

Whatever happens, it wouldn't be because "Masai is in love with his players". This is the man who traded Derozan. He clearly understands how to manage the team and cap in a way to position the team for maximum flexibility in the future.

TheWave · Post #232 » by **TheWave** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:31 pm

They need to make some moves but at the same time they gotta tell Nurse to stop cupping their nuts and make them D-uncomfortable. Let the offense flow.

gerrit4 · Post #233 » by **gerrit4** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:34 pm

TGM wrote:Honestly we need to consolidate assets as to add more these 7-8th guys on your roster. If I had to group we look something like this.

Tier 1 - we have zero (go to scorer alpha)

Tier 2 - Pascal ( second option)

Tier 3 - OG, Fred, Scottie ( glue guy and 3rd option)

Tier 4 - Trent, Precious ( fourth option)

Tier 5 - Thad, Boucher ( bench energy player 7-8th option)

Tier 6 - Banton, Koloko, Flynn. ( back-up guys when you have injuries or blow out minutes)

When we won a chip we had

Tier 1 - Kawhi

Tier 2 - Lowry and up coming pascal

Tier 3 - Gasol, Ibaka, Fred

Tier 4 - Norm

Tier 5 - OG

This is a very pyramid setup so it’s pretty simple to see why we aren’t winning.

It's a valid point (although personally, I'd put Trent in Tier 3).

That said, if you look at the year before the championship, it would probably be like this:
Tier 2: Demar/Kyle
Tier 3: JV/Serge/Fred
Tier 4: OG/Pascal/Jakob/Delon/CJ
Tier 5: Norm

That team won 60 games, and was so deep that Norm was our 11th man. For obvious reasons, that roster fell short in the playoffs. But by having so many tier 3/4 guys, we had an abundance of pieces to fix the roster and get Kawhi/Danny/Gasol for a championship run.

I think we've seen our lack of first round picks really come back to haunt us. I think it's a big part of why we couldn't (and can't) put together a realistic offer for a guy like KD without killing our roster.

TheWave · Post #234 » by **TheWave** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:37 pm

gerrit4 wrote:
TGM wrote:Honestly we need to consolidate assets as to add more these 7-8th guys on your roster. If I had to group we look something like this.

Tier 1 - we have zero (go to scorer alpha)

Tier 2 - Pascal ( second option)

Tier 3 - OG, Fred, Scottie ( glue guy and 3rd option)

Tier 4 - Trent, Precious ( fourth option)

Tier 5 - Thad, Boucher ( bench energy player 7-8th option)

Tier 6 - Banton, Koloko, Flynn. ( back-up guys when you have injuries or blow out minutes)

When we won a chip we had

Tier 1 - Kawhi

Tier 2 - Lowry and up coming pascal

Tier 3 - Gasol, Ibaka, Fred

Tier 4 - Norm

Tier 5 - OG

This is a very pyramid setup so it’s pretty simple to see why we aren’t winning.

It's a valid point (although personally, I'd put Trent in Tier 3).

That said, if you look at the year before the championship, it would probably be like this:
Tier 2: Demar/Kyle
Tier 3: JV/Serge/Fred
Tier 4: OG/Pascal/Jakob/Delon/CJ
Tier 5: Norm

That team won 60 games, and was so deep that Norm was our 11th man. For obvious reasons, that roster fell short in the playoffs. But by having so many tier 3/4 guys, we had an abundance of pieces to fix the roster and get Kawhi/Danny/Gasol for a championship run.

I think we've seen our lack of first round picks really come back to haunt us. I think it's a big part of why we couldn't (and can't) put together a realistic offer for a guy like KD without killing our roster.

For real, sane take.

_MidNight_ · Post #235 » by **_MidNight_** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:38 pm

raptor jesus wrote:
Tor_Raps wrote:Where's all the Ayton love? 31 13 against everyone's fan fav Claxton lol

Whenever I watch Ayton, dating back to his days at Arizona, I see a ton of stuff like this:

Read on Twitter

And on the offensive end, he's pretty soft as well. Factor in his contract, I'm just not a fan.

Nurse would have an aneurism watching this from the bench :lol:

Lord_Zedd · Post #236 » by **Lord_Zedd** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:39 pm

bboyskinnylegs wrote:I don't think Hyland would work out here, but I have no problem trading any of our small contracts (outside of Precious) for him

Surprised we're interested in him.

Goes against the Raptors mantra of "defensive role player who can't score" type

bboyskinnylegs · Post #237 » by **bboyskinnylegs** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:41 pm

Lord_Zedd wrote:
bboyskinnylegs wrote:I don't think Hyland would work out here, but I have no problem trading any of our small contracts (outside of Precious) for him

Surprised we're interested in him.

Goes against the Raptors mantra of "defensive role player who can't score" type

maybe we've finally decided to break out of that archetype after seeing the stellar results this season.

TheWave · Post #238 » by **TheWave** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:41 pm

_MidNight_ wrote:
raptor jesus wrote:
Tor_Raps wrote:Where's all the Ayton love? 31 13 against everyone's fan fav Claxton lol

Whenever I watch Ayton, dating back to his days at Arizona, I see a ton of stuff like this:

Read on Twitter

And on the offensive end, he's pretty soft as well. Factor in his contract, I'm just not a fan.

Nurse would have an aneurism watching this from the bench

Nurse has been smoking his own chit too long now. He needs let the offense loose somewhat.

HumbleRen · Post #239 » by **HumbleRen** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:43 pm

TheWave wrote:
_MidNight_ wrote:
raptor jesus wrote:
Whenever I watch Ayton, dating back to his days at Arizona, I see a ton of stuff like this:

Read on Twitter

And on the offensive end, he's pretty soft as well. Factor in his contract, I'm just not a fan.

Nurse would have an aneurism watching this from the bench

Nurse has been smoking his own chit too long now. He needs let the offense loose somewhat.

His offence is loose, that’s the problem.

It’s so loose that we don’t have any semblance of an offensive system in place outside of isos and dribble hand off merchanting.

:lol:

Purple Forever · Post #240 » by **Purple Forever** » Wed Feb 8, 2023 2:45 pm

I think the thing we are missing here is the goal is to develop Scottie to be the Tier 1 player on this team. I think management thought he would step up to it faster but growth is not linear. So if we still think he can get there then the question becomes when. If its in the next two years then you stay the course with OG and Fred and add depth and a Centre. If its more then you trade OG to cash in chips and add pieces that can replace him over the next two years. You also look at trading Fred since he will be off the timeline now.

But if you think Scottie is not the Tier 1 and can't ever be then you go nuclear and blow it up - cash in for picks and try to find the Tier 1 through the draft or a future trade, all of which needs draft capital.