michaelm wrote:bmurph128 wrote:WarriorGM wrote:
It's certainly an argument to put forward and people can evaluate it as they wish but I have seen enough NBA rejects put up Jordan numbers in foreign leagues to not be impressed by a single player monopolizing a team's numbers. I do not consider Westbrook's 2017 MVP season that high and I do not consider the 2018 display of heliocentric basketball that LeBron produced as high as his fans do. There is this concept in economics of crowding out and I see it in effect in LeBron's play in comparison to Curry's. That's why you never got the consistency of 20 points 20 points 20 points from each of LeBron, Wade and Bosh that you saw with Curry, KD and Klay.
Curry took a team that was last in the league two year's previously and performed better than LeBron's team that was champion two year's previously. That's the bottom line that makes the amassing of points and box score numbers a secondary concern.
The real problem that you aren't seeing is that it's not only "his fans" telling you how unbelievably wrong you are. There are a ton of neutrals on LeBron and they're all telling you that you're wrong. You should listen to that
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What none of you have addressed however was that the 2022 GSW team which was indeed a much better team than the 2018 Cavs team by the time of the play-offs in those years was rebuilt around Curry after the KD GSW team had cratered in 2019. That team also started the season not overly favored to be a contender as the OP said, without Klay Thompson who was still not his former self when he came back in the second half of the season after two and half years out of the game with 2 separate career threatening injuries, with Draymond Green who is great including being possibly the defensive player of his generation but in no way can carry a team without Curry and who was starting to wear out, but otherwise with the major building blocks being a player GSW drafted at 29 and patiently developed in Looney, a player they drafted at 28 who broke out next to Curry after spending significant time in the D league the previous season in Poole, the much derided Andrew Wiggins, and two vet minimum players. Imo Curry had something to do with all of the players not part of the previous core playing so well/pretty much the best they ever had played, while LeBron's choices since 2010 have pretty much precluded anything similar happening with any of his teams, in 2018 or any other year.
No one here denies how impressive 2022 was on Curry’s part. It was the season that ultimately led me to putting him in top ten all time status.
The problem is that you are comparing a really great title run (dare I say career defining) on Curry’s end to one of the greatest postseason runs of all time, bar none. You’d probably have to go back to Hakeem’s legendary title run where he dominated the MVP Robinson and led his team to a championship over the Knicks to find one as spectacular.
What I find hilarious however are his very desperate attempts to downplay Lebron’s competition. The Pacers were a really good team that season. People like the OP like to pretend that Oladipo isn’t all that great, but in 2018 he was third team all NBA and first team all defense. But there’s a lot more to it than that. They had a starting five consisting of players who could all shoot from three efficiently. Bodgan and Collison were both deadly shooters (Daren shot 46% from three that year, which is absurd). That was a huge matchup problem for the defensively challenged Cavaliers. On top of that, Lebron’s teammates just weren’t producing like they were during the regular season. And that was just the first round.
The Raptors were a 60 win team that season. Obviously they were a great team. The big difference in this series however were two things. One, the Raptors didn’t hold the same matchup advantage that the Pacers did. They were at least easier to contain and having DeRozan go DeFrozen never helps. Number two is Lebron’s teammates actually stepped up, more specifically Kevin Love, who actually had a good series. LeBron of course had a dominant series, but this is the point I want to stress: the difference between a dominant LeBron with terrible teammates vs a dominant LeBron with good teammates is on display here. In one case it goes to seven games. In the other, it’s a sweep. That’s important to keep in mind.
WarriorGM loves to bring up Tatum being a rookie, like that’s supposed to matter. Yeah he wasn’t anything close to the player he was in 2022, but one player doesn’t define a team. He was still a really good player in that series. But that’s besides the point, because that’s not the only issue here. He chooses to ignore the fact that the Celtics were a really great team that year. They were the best defensive team that season and had a great mix of young and extremely talented players, and great battle tested veterans. Morris and Horford were both fearless players who didn’t care who was in front of them. Baynes was also fearless and you couldn’t leave him alone at the perimeter. And remember what I just said about the Pacers having a starting five of players who could all pretty much shoot? Well so did the Celtics. So on top of being the best defensive team they faced, they also had the same offensive matchup advantages and were a much better team.
This is why I laugh at people who bring up Tatum being a rookie that season. It’s irrelevant. Boston was a better team on both ends of the floor and were far better coached. And Lebron’s teammates, just like against Indiana, struggled in this series. Add to the fact that Boston had homer court advantage, and you had a series that Cleveland, frankly, had no business winning.
The 2022 Warriors run was great. But they never had to go up against teams with a clear edge over them. They didn’t have to face teams that were clearly superior. The Grizzlies were probably the best team they faced before the Celtics and, while really great, their inexperience showed and the Warriors were just the better team. This isn’t me saying that Curry didn’t straight up dominate and carry his team to victory at times during that run. This is me saying that it really doesn’t matter that the warriors beat the Celtics in the finals that season, because Curry had the team needed to get the job done. There was no question that the Celtics were better than the cavaliers that season, and quite frankly, they over achieved that season.
There is no comparison here. None.
. 
