Who has the most "impact"? russ, bron, or cap? EDIT: RANK WILT TOO

[dygaction]

Relative to their environment? I'd probably go

Russell > (gap) > LeBron (> Jordan) > Kareem

no need to drag Jordan in with that tiny snab especially relative to their environment.

Jordan dominated the 90s and made several all-time greats ringless, Ewing, KMalone, Barkley... LeBron elevated many players legacies (Dirk, Duncan twice, Kawhi, Curry, KD...).

I don’t put stock into the higher level Jordan vs. James debate points, including this one.

I will say though, Jordan’s presence did quite some elevating for the legacies of Penny Hardaway, Shaq, Isiah & the late 80s Pistons, and Birds’ Celtics.

Indeed yes, they can all proudly say they once defeated young or rusted Jordan

[AEnigma]

no need to drag Jordan in with that tiny snab especially relative to their environment.

Jordan dominated the 90s and made several all-time greats ringless, Ewing, KMalone, Barkley... LeBron elevated many players legacies (Dirk, Duncan twice, Kawhi, Curry, KD...).

Eh I put Jordan in cause he is the only one missing from the usual GOAT contenders.

I know but maybe it would have not been a contest if Jordan was in the mix

True, why bother including someone who would never be the answer. After all, we are talking about Russell, Lebron, and Kareem, not Ewing, Malone, and Barkley. Competition is a lot stiffer.

[rk2023]

no need to drag Jordan in with that tiny snab especially relative to their environment.

Jordan dominated the 90s and made several all-time greats ringless, Ewing, KMalone, Barkley... LeBron elevated many players legacies (Dirk, Duncan twice, Kawhi, Curry, KD...).

I don’t put stock into the higher level Jordan vs. James debate points, including this one.

I will say though, Jordan’s presence did quite some elevating for the legacies of Penny Hardaway, Shaq, Isiah & the late 80s Pistons, and Birds’ Celtics.

Indeed yes, they can all proudly say they once defeated young or rusted Jordan

The same “young” Jordan that had his best sheer floor raising season, arguably his two best years (at the very least two-thirds of his three year peak), and was aged 23-27 years old through that time frame I am referring to.

[dygaction]

Eh I put Jordan in cause he is the only one missing from the usual GOAT contenders.

I know but maybe it would have not been a contest if Jordan was in the mix

True, why bother including someone who would never be the answer. After all, we are talking about Russell, Lebron, and Kareem, not Ewing, Malone, and Barkley. Competition is a lot stiffer.

Glad to see him not making the list, too toxic, and not me who put him ahead of Kareem

[dygaction]

I don’t put stock into the higher level Jordan vs. James debate points, including this one.

I will say though, Jordan’s presence did quite some elevating for the legacies of Penny Hardaway, Shaq, Isiah & the late 80s Pistons, and Birds’ Celtics.

Indeed yes, they can all proudly say they once defeated young or rusted Jordan

The same “young” Jordan that had his best sheer floor raising season, arguably his two best years (at the very least two-thirds of his three year peak), and was aged 23-27 years old through that time frame I am referring to.

No ATGs will use a losing year as best year, not LeBron 2009 either. Those would not have become goats/legends but stay as best-not-wins like Malone and CP3 if they could not come up with winning years. Sounds harsh but that's the reality.

[OhayoKD]

Indeed yes, they can all proudly say they once defeated young or rusted Jordan

The same “young” Jordan that had his best sheer floor raising season, arguably his two best years (at the very least two-thirds of his three year peak), and was aged 23-27 years old through that time frame I am referring to.

No ATGs will use a losing year as best year, not LeBron 2009 either. Those would not have become goats/legends but stay as best-not-wins like Malone and CP3 if they could not come up with winning years. Sounds harsh but that's the reality.

Don't think that filter neccesarily helps. At least via "impact" stuff, 2016, 1971, and 1969 all look better

[rk2023]

Indeed yes, they can all proudly say they once defeated young or rusted Jordan

The same “young” Jordan that had his best sheer floor raising season, arguably his two best years (at the very least two-thirds of his three year peak), and was aged 23-27 years old through that time frame I am referring to.

No ATGs will use a losing year as best year, not LeBron 2009 either. Those would not have become goats/legends but stay as best-not-wins like Malone and CP3 if they could not come up with winning years. Sounds harsh but that's the reality.

I see where you’re coming from, but respectfully disagree in that regard. And when looking at 89/90 Jordan or 09 Bron or 77 Kareem, it is a catastrophic difference than playoff Malone or CP3.

[dygaction]

The same “young” Jordan that had his best sheer floor raising season, arguably his two best years (at the very least two-thirds of his three year peak), and was aged 23-27 years old through that time frame I am referring to.

No ATGs will use a losing year as best year, not LeBron 2009 either. Those would not have become goats/legends but stay as best-not-wins like Malone and CP3 if they could not come up with winning years. Sounds harsh but that's the reality.

I see where you’re coming from, but respectfully disagree in that regard. And when looking at 89/90 Jordan or 09 Bron or 77 Kareem, it is a catastrophic difference than playoff Malone or CP3.

True, but I am saying those would not be discussed as their respective best seasons as they have winning seasons. Had they not have winning seasons to back it up, they would be on the other list ahead of Malone or CP3.

[LukaTheGOAT]

Relative to their environment? I'd probably go

Russell > (gap) > LeBron (> Jordan) > Kareem

If there is such a gap, how come Russell isn't your GOAT or at least higher than #4 on your list?

[Jaivl]

Relative to their environment? I'd probably go

Russell > (gap) > LeBron (> Jordan) > Kareem

If there is such a gap, how come Russell isn't your GOAT or at least higher than #4 on your list?

When making my all-time list I don't really adjust impact for era (Yes, +6 on 1960 is worth much more than +6 on 2020. Applying ElGee's logic of a +0 player having a CORP of 3.3%, it should be 12% for 1960...), or else yes, Russell would probably be my GOAT (Kareem's early peak or Jordan's late prime would downgrade due to the league's dillution, for example)

It's a subjective decision, but it just... doesn't feel like an accurate reflection of the evolution of the game.

[ShaqAttac]

KK I add Wilt. should i add mikan?

[Jaivl]

KK I add Wilt. should i add mikan?

I mean, you can add Wilt I guess, but he should probably be dead last by a margin (the movement of his teams' quality based on his arrival/departure is underwhelming).

Jordan is much more interesting.

[Gregoire]

Relative to their environment

Russell > Wilt > Jordan > LeBron > Kareem

[ShaqAttac]

KK I add Wilt. should i add mikan?

I mean, you can add Wilt I guess, but he should probably be dead last by a margin (the movement of his teams' quality based on his arrival/departure is underwhelming).

Jordan is much more interesting.

idk. seem from impact thread, mj case is just "pretend bron dont exist"

kd say there some boomer boost u gotta do for russ's "impact". how much that help wilt