This is OBVIOUSLY Steph's era- not Lebron's.

[Potential_64]

Curry's career almost mirrors Kobe's because people said the 3 titles the Lakers won was because of Shaq who won FMVP in all 3 Finals, and Shaq even made a rap mocking Kobe for being unable to win a championship without him. Then Kobe made all his critics eat crow by winning 2 straight titles without Shaq. I don't know if Curry will win a 5th ring but so far it's Kobe's era, he will always be greater than Lebron

[WargamesX]

This is like arguing was it’s Tim Duncan’s era or Kobe’s. Multiple players can be a dominant force in the NBA. The only guy who mostly shut it all down was Michael. Even then we can’t say it was immaculate because of the two years he missed that Dream ate.

This is the Curry & Lebron era

[Nate505]

Steph is a great player no doubt, but when I think of players in the 10s, Lebron is the first guy that will come to mind for me.

[Nate505]

It is possible to congratulate a player without lowering another player, especially when this player has nothing to do with this year

It's impossible to 'lower' Lebron. He's Lebron. But it's possible to talk objectively about an era. Curry has beat the guy 3x. His 4th time winning is alongside a guy that Lebron didn't think was worthy playing with.

Nobody takes those Durant titles seriously, do they?

[durden_tyler]

Curry is probably the biggest reason why Lebron won’t ever be considered the GOAT

This and that is his greatest accomplishment, stopping the what could have been GOAT and exposing LeBron

[OdomFan]

It is possible to congratulate a player without lowering another player, especially when this player has nothing to do with this year

It's impossible to 'lower' Lebron. He's Lebron. But it's possible to talk objectively about an era. Curry has beat the guy 3x. His 4th time winning is alongside a guy that Lebron didn't think was worthy playing with.

Nobody takes those Durant titles seriously, do they?

People (myself included) dislike the idea that he joined the Warriors in the first place, but there's no denying that he was a major factor on the court that sealed the deal for the 2017 and 2018 win. Especially 2018. He pretty much took over those later games. If he played like that anywhere else and won it all, it would get more recognition. But it is what it is.

[zimpy27]

If it were then we'd have a lot more Curry threads than LeBron ones wouldn't we?

[Nate505]

It's impossible to 'lower' Lebron. He's Lebron. But it's possible to talk objectively about an era. Curry has beat the guy 3x. His 4th time winning is alongside a guy that Lebron didn't think was worthy playing with.

Nobody takes those Durant titles seriously, do they?

People (myself included) dislike the idea that he joined the Warriors in the first place, but there's no denying that he was a major factor on the court that sealed the deal for the 2017 and 2018 win. Especially 2018. He pretty much took over those later games. If he played like that anywhere else and won it all, it would get more recognition. But it is what it is.

I would hope he was a major factor on the court. He was an MVP level player in his prime. He was the major part of the deck being stacked to a ridiculous levels...but are there people who take stacked deck wins seriously? Maybe there are.

[JordansBulls]

4 rings with the SAME franchise in 7 years.

Won rings with different sets of roles players whom he all made look better. Basically everyone 'fit in'.

Wiggins, who Lebron had traded away to get Kevin Love, FLOURISHED alongside a guy that beat Lebron 3x in the finals in Curry.

Literally gas made EVERY TEAMMATE better by merely just his presence on the floor. From superstars like KD, to players like McGee/Nick Young/Draymond/Zaza Pachulia, to players to Poole & Gary Payton Jr. Unlike Bron, he really makes teammates better and fundamental pieces to the team regardless of the level they're at.

And most of all - NO EXCUSES. This team had major injuries earlier in the season and mid season, but weathered the storm. Him, nor his teammates, aren't in ENDLESS trade rumors during those losing slumps unlike every team Lebron is on. Truly fosters a positive work environment.

The Steph Era. Happy to be a part of it.

Curry who came in after Lebron has as many titles and beat Lebron head to head 3 times. Lebron has missed the playoffs as much as has titles. He stacked the deck multiple times and a guy in his era has as many titles as him who is a superstar. Lebron starting in 2011 started stacking the deck and Curry has as many titles as him. Lebron also couldn't even make the play in with prime Russell Westbrook who is the all time leader in Triple Doubles and won league MVP. Russell Westbrook made the playoffs with all other stars in his career when that star played at least half the season and Westbrook played with 2 stars in Lebron and Anthony Davis. Also had Melo and Dwight Howard as well. Lebron also won 2 bronze medals for America and also lost with HCA 3x in a row to guys who were known to be career losers in Dwight Howard, Dirk and KG. Lebron also only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him.
That's what Dirk did, Hakeem did better than that, as did Isiah Thomas who are lesser players.
Jordan never won bronze medal, never lost with HCA and turned a franchise that never won into a dynasty and 25 years later that franchise is still trash. Players who are GOATS in Sports dominate there era by stats and titles. And the titles more or less for franchises they were drafted to. These are facts not feelings. Despite that Lebron is still Mount Rushmore in NBA History.

Were 2nd in odds last year and missed the play in https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2022_preseason_odds.html

They also were ahead of Memphis and Dallas this year https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_preseason_odds.html

Utah was last in 2023 and still ahead of the Lakers.

[JordansBulls]

If it were then we'd have a lot more Curry threads than LeBron ones wouldn't we?

Not really just shows more are Lebron homers. But when proven wrong they disappear unless they prove the facts.

Curry who came in after Lebron has as many titles and beat Lebron head to head 3 times. Lebron has missed the playoffs as much as has titles. He stacked the deck multiple times and a guy in his era has as many titles as him who is a superstar. Lebron starting in 2011 started stacking the deck and Curry has as many titles as him. Lebron also couldn't even make the play in with prime Russell Westbrook who is the all time leader in Triple Doubles and won league MVP. Russell Westbrook made the playoffs with all other stars in his career when that star played at least half the season and Westbrook played with 2 stars in Lebron and Anthony Davis. Also had Melo and Dwight Howard as well. Lebron also won 2 bronze medals for America and also lost with HCA 3x in a row to guys who were known to be career losers in Dwight Howard, Dirk and KG. Lebron also only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him.
That's what Dirk did, Hakeem did better than that, as did Isiah Thomas who are lesser players.
Jordan never won bronze medal, never lost with HCA and turned a franchise that never won into a dynasty and 25 years later that franchise is still trash. Players who are GOATS in Sports dominate there era by stats and titles. And the titles more or less for franchises they were drafted to. These are facts not feelings. Despite that Lebron is still Mount Rushmore in NBA History.

Were 2nd in odds last year and missed the play in https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2022_preseason_odds.html

They also were ahead of Memphis and Dallas this year https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_preseason_odds.html

Utah was last in 2023 and still ahead of the Lakers.

[infinite11285]

If it were then we'd have a lot more Curry threads than LeBron ones wouldn't we?

Not really just shows more are Lebron homers. But when proven wrong they disappear unless they prove the facts.

Curry who came in after Lebron has as many titles and beat Lebron head to head 3 times. Lebron has missed the playoffs as much as has titles. He stacked the deck multiple times and a guy in his era has as many titles as him who is a superstar. Lebron starting in 2011 started stacking the deck and Curry has as many titles as him. Lebron also couldn't even make the play in with prime Russell Westbrook who is the all time leader in Triple Doubles and won league MVP. Russell Westbrook made the playoffs with all other stars in his career when that star played at least half the season and Westbrook played with 2 stars in Lebron and Anthony Davis. Also had Melo and Dwight Howard as well. Lebron also won 2 bronze medals for America and also lost with HCA 3x in a row to guys who were known to be career losers in Dwight Howard, Dirk and KG. Lebron also only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him.
That's what Dirk did, Hakeem did better than that, as did Isiah Thomas who are lesser players.
Jordan never won bronze medal, never lost with HCA and turned a franchise that never won into a dynasty and 25 years later that franchise is still trash. Players who are GOATS in Sports dominate there era by stats and titles. And the titles more or less for franchises they were drafted to. These are facts not feelings. Despite that Lebron is still Mount Rushmore in NBA History.

Were 2nd in odds last year and missed the play in https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2022_preseason_odds.html

They also were ahead of Memphis and Dallas this year https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_preseason_odds.html

Utah was last in 2023 and still ahead of the Lakers.

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

[JordansBulls]

If it were then we'd have a lot more Curry threads than LeBron ones wouldn't we?

Not really just shows more are Lebron homers. But when proven wrong they disappear unless they prove the facts.

Curry who came in after Lebron has as many titles and beat Lebron head to head 3 times. Lebron has missed the playoffs as much as has titles. He stacked the deck multiple times and a guy in his era has as many titles as him who is a superstar. Lebron starting in 2011 started stacking the deck and Curry has as many titles as him. Lebron also couldn't even make the play in with prime Russell Westbrook who is the all time leader in Triple Doubles and won league MVP. Russell Westbrook made the playoffs with all other stars in his career when that star played at least half the season and Westbrook played with 2 stars in Lebron and Anthony Davis. Also had Melo and Dwight Howard as well. Lebron also won 2 bronze medals for America and also lost with HCA 3x in a row to guys who were known to be career losers in Dwight Howard, Dirk and KG. Lebron also only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him.
That's what Dirk did, Hakeem did better than that, as did Isiah Thomas who are lesser players.
Jordan never won bronze medal, never lost with HCA and turned a franchise that never won into a dynasty and 25 years later that franchise is still trash. Players who are GOATS in Sports dominate there era by stats and titles. And the titles more or less for franchises they were drafted to. These are facts not feelings. Despite that Lebron is still Mount Rushmore in NBA History.

Were 2nd in odds last year and missed the play in https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2022_preseason_odds.html

They also were ahead of Memphis and Dallas this year https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_preseason_odds.html

Utah was last in 2023 and still ahead of the Lakers.

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

[BostonCouchGM]

Lebron era was 2011-2016. Before that it was the Duncan era and Kobe era. After that it was the Steph era.

[infinite11285]

Not really just shows more are Lebron homers. But when proven wrong they disappear unless they prove the facts.

Curry who came in after Lebron has as many titles and beat Lebron head to head 3 times. Lebron has missed the playoffs as much as has titles. He stacked the deck multiple times and a guy in his era has as many titles as him who is a superstar. Lebron starting in 2011 started stacking the deck and Curry has as many titles as him. Lebron also couldn't even make the play in with prime Russell Westbrook who is the all time leader in Triple Doubles and won league MVP. Russell Westbrook made the playoffs with all other stars in his career when that star played at least half the season and Westbrook played with 2 stars in Lebron and Anthony Davis. Also had Melo and Dwight Howard as well. Lebron also won 2 bronze medals for America and also lost with HCA 3x in a row to guys who were known to be career losers in Dwight Howard, Dirk and KG. Lebron also only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him.
That's what Dirk did, Hakeem did better than that, as did Isiah Thomas who are lesser players.
Jordan never won bronze medal, never lost with HCA and turned a franchise that never won into a dynasty and 25 years later that franchise is still trash. Players who are GOATS in Sports dominate there era by stats and titles. And the titles more or less for franchises they were drafted to. These are facts not feelings. Despite that Lebron is still Mount Rushmore in NBA History.

Were 2nd in odds last year and missed the play in https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2022_preseason_odds.html

They also were ahead of Memphis and Dallas this year https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_preseason_odds.html

Utah was last in 2023 and still ahead of the Lakers.

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

I know you didn't say Curry was ahead of LeBron. I asked if the comparison between the two is so lopsided, as you imply, then why isn't Curry considered greater than James overall?

Actual trophies are awarded for MVP, FMVP, and titles (although the Larry O’Brien championship trophy goes to the team, not one person).

Counting the title trophy anyway, LeBron’s current total is 12. (4 titles, 4 MVPs, 4 FMVPs). Steph Curry’s current total is 7 (4 titles, 2 MVPs, 1 FMVP).

LeBron also has 3 Olympic medals to Curry's 0, and holds far, far more NBA records than Steph. On top of that, James leads Steph in All-NBA Team selections, All-Star appearances, All-Defensive Team selections, doubles Steph in total win shares, and has a higher career player efficiency rating.

[JordansBulls]

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

I know you didn't say Curry was ahead of LeBron. I asked if the comparison between the two is so lopsided, as you imply, then why isn't Curry considered greater than James overall?

Actual trophies are awarded for MVP, FMVP, and titles (although the Larry O’Brien championship trophy goes to the team, not one person).

Counting the title trophy anyway, LeBron’s current total is 12. (4 titles, 4 MVPs, 4 FMVPs). Steph Curry’s current total is 7 (4 titles, 2 MVPs, 1 FMVP).

LeBron also has 3 Olympic medals to Curry's 0, and holds far, far more NBA records than Steph. On top of that, James leads Steph in All-NBA Team selections, All-Star appearances, All-Defensive Team selections, doubles Steph in total win shares, and has a higher career player efficiency rating.

Because Lebron has more league and finals mvp's. But he doesn't have that over Jordan.

[zimpy27]

Not really just shows more are Lebron homers. But when proven wrong they disappear unless they prove the facts.

Curry who came in after Lebron has as many titles and beat Lebron head to head 3 times. Lebron has missed the playoffs as much as has titles. He stacked the deck multiple times and a guy in his era has as many titles as him who is a superstar. Lebron starting in 2011 started stacking the deck and Curry has as many titles as him. Lebron also couldn't even make the play in with prime Russell Westbrook who is the all time leader in Triple Doubles and won league MVP. Russell Westbrook made the playoffs with all other stars in his career when that star played at least half the season and Westbrook played with 2 stars in Lebron and Anthony Davis. Also had Melo and Dwight Howard as well. Lebron also won 2 bronze medals for America and also lost with HCA 3x in a row to guys who were known to be career losers in Dwight Howard, Dirk and KG. Lebron also only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him.
That's what Dirk did, Hakeem did better than that, as did Isiah Thomas who are lesser players.
Jordan never won bronze medal, never lost with HCA and turned a franchise that never won into a dynasty and 25 years later that franchise is still trash. Players who are GOATS in Sports dominate there era by stats and titles. And the titles more or less for franchises they were drafted to. These are facts not feelings. Despite that Lebron is still Mount Rushmore in NBA History.

Were 2nd in odds last year and missed the play in https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2022_preseason_odds.html

They also were ahead of Memphis and Dallas this year https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023_preseason_odds.html

Utah was last in 2023 and still ahead of the Lakers.

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

They are facts that don't really mean anything since they aren't balanced.

Here's an example of your facts about Jordan:
- never won a playoff series without Pippen. Pippen won them without Jordan.
- never won a playoff series without Phil Jackson. Phil won them without Jordan.
- Jordan was shot 30% from 3 when you take out seasons that the 3 line was moved in a couple feet.
- Jordan went to the playoffs as many times as Bill Russell but has about half the championships
- Jordan"s missed 26 game winning shots

It's not telling the full story of the player is it?

[michaelm]

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

They are facts that don't really mean anything since they aren't balanced.

Here's an example of your facts about Jordan:
- never won a playoff series without Pippen. Pippen won them without Jordan.
- never won a playoff series without Phil Jackson. Phil won them without Jordan.
- Jordan was shot 30% from 3 when you take out seasons that the 3 line was moved in a couple feet.
- Jordan went to the playoffs as many times as Bill Russell but has about half the championships
- Jordan"s missed 26 game winning shots

It's not telling the full story of the player is it?

I don’t know why this post wasn’t on the other thread in the first place, and I don’t see much relevance to this thread.

That both the Cavs and the Bulls are Cinderella franchises without LeBron and Jordan respectively, and that while LeBron led the Cavs to 1 title Jordan led the Bulls to 6 is fairly factual as far as I can see. Sure other factors are involved, but the fact remains that the only 6 titles won by a franchise were won by teams built around Jordan. Even winning the 6 titles with the same leading player is exceedingly rare obviously. Bill Russell is my favourite player btw.

[infinite11285]

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

They are facts that don't really mean anything since they aren't balanced.

Here's an example of your facts about Jordan:
- never won a playoff series without Pippen. Pippen won them without Jordan.
- never won a playoff series without Phil Jackson. Phil won them without Jordan.
- Jordan was shot 30% from 3 when you take out seasons that the 3 line was moved in a couple feet.
- Jordan went to the playoffs as many times as Bill Russell but has about half the championships
- Jordan"s missed 26 game winning shots

It's not telling the full story of the player is it?

This is why context is so important; otherwise, those same facts are half-truths, whereas facts are absolute. JB argued that Curry is better than James but ultimately backtracked and acknowledged that he isn't on the NBA's Mount Rushmore. Personally, it's why I found his argument somewhat confusing as it was presented.

[infinite11285]

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

They are facts that don't really mean anything since they aren't balanced.

Here's an example of your facts about Jordan:
- never won a playoff series without Pippen. Pippen won them without Jordan.
- never won a playoff series without Phil Jackson. Phil won them without Jordan.
- Jordan was shot 30% from 3 when you take out seasons that the 3 line was moved in a couple feet.
- Jordan went to the playoffs as many times as Bill Russell but has about half the championships
- Jordan"s missed 26 game winning shots

It's not telling the full story of the player is it?

That both the Cavs and the Bulls are Cinderella franchises without LeBron and Jordan respectively, and that while LeBron led the Cavs to 1 title Jordan led the Bulls to 6 is fairly factual as far as so can see. Sure other factors are involved, but the fact remains that 6 titles were won by teams built around Jordan, something which has happened with very few other players in history and none which are not favoured FA destinations.

Golden State is a Cinderalla franchise as well. There are a lot of variables that are outside a player's control regarding how teams are built to win. Is it fair to say that James was in the worst situation being drafted by the Cavs? Even still, James ultimately went back to Cleveland and won one a championship for them. In fact, he's won a title for every franchise he's played for. Shouldn't that be as impressive as winning all of one's titles for the same team they were drafted by? For me, it's an apples-to-oranges comparison.

[JordansBulls]

Your entire argument is qualitative, riddled with your opinions, and lacks context. Nearly every word is based on your feelings, yet you ultimately acknowledged that James is on Mount Rushmore while Curry is not. If you have to inject NINE other players into your argument in an attempt to propel Curry on James, then it's a weak argument.

If Curry is so far ahead of LeBron, why isn't he higher than James on the all-time list? Why isn't Curry on NBA's Mount Rushmore?

I didn't say Curry was ahead of Lebron. I said Lebron is till Mount Rushmore. I just presented facts for titles for the franchise that drafted them having to win 4 series for a title.

They are facts that don't really mean anything since they aren't balanced.

Here's an example of your facts about Jordan:
- never won a playoff series without Pippen. Pippen won them without Jordan.
- never won a playoff series without Phil Jackson. Phil won them without Jordan.
- Jordan was shot 30% from 3 when you take out seasons that the 3 line was moved in a couple feet.
- Jordan went to the playoffs as many times as Bill Russell but has about half the championships
- Jordan"s missed 26 game winning shots

It's not telling the full story of the player is it?

Actually not facts. Bulls won in 1988 and 1989 without Phil. Where was Phil before Chicago if such a great coach? Never won anything before Chicago. Won Game 4 1990 at Philly without Scottie as well. Russell won titles having to win 2 series a year and had league mvp and roy as well when he joined.