Tank World Order (10.0) The Empire Strikes Back

[nikster]

LOL, laundry list of mediocrity. Harrington? Crawford??? Oh man. Maggette, undersized 3? Gimme a break, a roster doomed to failure.

Exactly, a laundry list of mediocrity. That's exactly what we are trying to say. They weren't going into those seasons with the intention of tanking.

Except players with clear flaws put together equals disaster record wise. Obvious attempt to just throw together whatever.

And what was the goal of throwing them together?? Competing!

[nikster]

Irrelevant to the question

Since you're ignoring that part of the post I'm gonna assume you've accepted the fact that the Warriors were trying to compete.

Hows it irrellevent? You want to use GSW as an example of the success of the tank ignoring the fact that it took them a decade plus of picking in the high end of the lottery to land their star.

I didn't ignore it, I'm stating it's irrelevant to the question at hand. In fact, you're ignoring the answer.

So what's irrelevant? The Warriors **** season being by design or not, or the fact that it took a decade of **** seasons to get a franchise player?

[Los_29]

LOL, laundry list of mediocrity. Harrington? Crawford??? Oh man. Maggette, undersized 3? Gimme a break, a roster doomed to failure.

Exactly, a laundry list of mediocrity. That's exactly what we are trying to say. They weren't going into those seasons with the intention of tanking.

Except players with clear flaws put together equals disaster record wise. Obvious attempt to just throw together whatever.

They won 48 games the year before with nearly the same roster. No one is saying they are a good team. We are saying they are mediocre which in itself would not fit the criteria of tanking. In fact, most people had them making the playoffs that year.

[ItsDanger]

LOL, laundry list of mediocrity. Harrington? Crawford??? Oh man. Maggette, undersized 3? Gimme a break, a roster doomed to failure.

In that off season the Warriors signed Maggete who was coming off a season as one of the best scorers in the league.

Yes that roster wasn't winning anything meaningful. Doesn't mean the intention of management wasn't to compete with it.

I'm sure you think the current Wizards roster is doomed to fail. Would you say they are competing or tanking?

So what? It failed, their season ended with lottery pick. You guys love your irrelevant points. Eventually GS embraced the reality, which is what Raps should have done in Tampa and following season

[nikster]

Exactly, a laundry list of mediocrity. That's exactly what we are trying to say. They weren't going into those seasons with the intention of tanking.

Except players with clear flaws put together equals disaster record wise. Obvious attempt to just throw together whatever.

They won 48 games the year before with nearly the same roster. No one is saying they are a good team. We are saying they are mediocre which in itself would not fit the criteria of tanking. In fact, most people had them making the playoffs that year.

These guys were freaking out about Poeltl ruining the tank this year but somehow signing Magette, who was coming off a season where he was 11th in the league in ppg on great efficiency, is not a competing move.

[ItsDanger]

Except players with clear flaws put together equals disaster record wise. Obvious attempt to just throw together whatever.

They won 48 games the year before with nearly the same roster. No one is saying they are a good team. We are saying they are mediocre which in itself would not fit the criteria of tanking. In fact, most people had them making the playoffs that year.

These guys were freaking out about Poeltl ruining the tank this year but somehow signing Magette, who was coming off a season where he was 11th in the league in ppg on great efficiency, is not a competing move.

I'm not saying that and it's really irrelevant. The end result yielded a high lottery pick. I got bad news for you, some GMs suck at their jobs at putting winning teams together. Wins and losses are a zero sum, understand that and you'll finally get it,

[nikster]

LOL, laundry list of mediocrity. Harrington? Crawford??? Oh man. Maggette, undersized 3? Gimme a break, a roster doomed to failure.

In that off season the Warriors signed Maggete who was coming off a season as one of the best scorers in the league.

Yes that roster wasn't winning anything meaningful. Doesn't mean the intention of management wasn't to compete with it.

I'm sure you think the current Wizards roster is doomed to fail. Would you say they are competing or tanking?

So what? It failed, their season ended with lottery pick. You guys love your irrelevant points. Eventually GS embraced the reality, which is what Raps should have done in Tampa and following season

They made moves to try to improve their roster by signing a guy like magette. He was top 11 in scoring well above league average efficiency. TWO is complaining Poeltl is ruining our tank this year.

They didnt intentionally sit any players to tank games. They weren't overplaying **** young players.

So please tell us what the Warriors did as a franchise that signals they "embraced the reality' that they needed to tank?

[ItsDanger]

In that off season the Warriors signed Maggete who was coming off a season as one of the best scorers in the league.

Yes that roster wasn't winning anything meaningful. Doesn't mean the intention of management wasn't to compete with it.

I'm sure you think the current Wizards roster is doomed to fail. Would you say they are competing or tanking?

So what? It failed, their season ended with lottery pick. You guys love your irrelevant points. Eventually GS embraced the reality, which is what Raps should have done in Tampa and following season

They made moves to try to improve their roster by signing a guy like magette. He was top 11 in scoring well above league average efficiency. TWO is complaining Poeltl is ruining our tank this year.

They didnt intentionally sit any players to tank games. They weren't overplaying **** young players.

So please tell us what the Warriors did as a franchise that signals they "embraced the reality' that they needed to tank?

You realize they dumped Maggette a season after getting Curry right, the rebuild was underway. Don't think in absolutes and binary terms, you'll miss the important aspects.

[nikster]

They won 48 games the year before with nearly the same roster. No one is saying they are a good team. We are saying they are mediocre which in itself would not fit the criteria of tanking. In fact, most people had them making the playoffs that year.

These guys were freaking out about Poeltl ruining the tank this year but somehow signing Magette, who was coming off a season where he was 11th in the league in ppg on great efficiency, is not a competing move.

I'm not saying that and it's really irrelevant. The end result yielded a high lottery pick. I got bad news for you, some GMs suck at their jobs at putting winning teams together. Wins and losses are a zero sum, understand that and you'll finally get it,

"Tanking works, just look at this one season from the Warriors and ignore the other 10"

[ItsDanger]

These guys were freaking out about Poeltl ruining the tank this year but somehow signing Magette, who was coming off a season where he was 11th in the league in ppg on great efficiency, is not a competing move.

I'm not saying that and it's really irrelevant. The end result yielded a high lottery pick. I got bad news for you, some GMs suck at their jobs at putting winning teams together. Wins and losses are a zero sum, understand that and you'll finally get it,

"Tanking works, just look at this one season from the Warriors and ignore the other 10"

I selected 4 seasons.

[nikster]

So what? It failed, their season ended with lottery pick. You guys love your irrelevant points. Eventually GS embraced the reality, which is what Raps should have done in Tampa and following season

They made moves to try to improve their roster by signing a guy like magette. He was top 11 in scoring well above league average efficiency. TWO is complaining Poeltl is ruining our tank this year.

They didnt intentionally sit any players to tank games. They weren't overplaying **** young players.

So please tell us what the Warriors did as a franchise that signals they "embraced the reality' that they needed to tank?

You realize they dumped Maggette a season after getting Curry right, the rebuild was underway. Don't think in absolutes and binary terms, you'll miss the important aspects.

So they did nothing preceding the Curry selection to try to tank other than watch several players go down with injury. That team was pushing 0.500 if healthy

[nikster]

I'm not saying that and it's really irrelevant. The end result yielded a high lottery pick. I got bad news for you, some GMs suck at their jobs at putting winning teams together. Wins and losses are a zero sum, understand that and you'll finally get it,

"Tanking works, just look at this one season from the Warriors and ignore the other 10"

I selected 4 seasons.

All they had to was pick in the lottery 16 times since 95 and finally end up with a championship Core.

And it only works because of the one season they drafted Curry. Also Dray was a 2nd round pick and irrelevant to the tanking aspect.

[ItsDanger]

3 outcomes in the season (according to some)

Championship
Competing
Tanking


Which category has the most each season and hence fails the most?

Kind of buries your weak ass arguments 6 feet under.

[Basketball_Jones]

This tanking debate is boring. Same old stuff. Who cares about history of the NBA. We're talking this season in a vacuum, no chance against Boston and Milwaukee and guys like Fred/Gary/OG likely shouldn't be in the long term picture. There is not much to gain here and it would have made more sense to acquire a lotto talent in the top 10 for next season and beyond.

[2019nbachamps]

I don’t understand why we’re so desperate to get swept in the first round

[Duffman100]

I don’t understand why we’re so desperate to get swept in the first round

No one is desperate to get swept in the first round. There is just not tangible proof that getting higher picks at the expense of selling off assets at a fraction of the value leads title. It just... hasn't happened.

So the attitude that people are dumb and ignorant because they want to go down that road is ... weird.

Is it possible that as we see more teams go that path, we'll see more tangible results? Sure... I'm open to that being the case. But so far, no evidence.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

I view tanking/rebuilding in similar terms. Too many posters just don't get it no matter how many times it's explained. As example, Raps own championship was built via assets created via tank/rebuild seasons. Those are facts

Dude these guys know what we're talking about. They just ask the same questions or act dumb because they can't handle a season or two of maybe not getting killed in the first round and instead accumulate assets through the draft and a trade or two.

Or maybe there are few to no examples of tanking teams winning the title in recent memory.

That's what I can see so far, but maybe TWO is using a different metric that we are not aware of. All I'm asking is to take 30 seasons and show how many teams in those 30 seasons were successful with tanking as a strategy. That's all, very basic research method. You must have a basis for an argument to have an argument. Right now this whole thread is a baseless claim.

[Duffman100]

Dude these guys know what we're talking about. They just ask the same questions or act dumb because they can't handle a season or two of maybe not getting killed in the first round and instead accumulate assets through the draft and a trade or two.

Or maybe there are few to no examples of tanking teams winning the title in recent memory.

That's what I can see so far, but maybe TWO is using a different metric that we are not aware of. All I'm asking is to take 30 seasons and show how many teams in those 30 seasons were successful with tanking as a strategy. That's all, very basic research method. You must have a basis for an argument to have an argument. Right now this whole thread is a baseless claim.

The fact is there is no playbook or recipe to win a title. There are many different journeys that get you there.

[2019nbachamps]

I don’t understand why we’re so desperate to get swept in the first round

No one is desperate to get swept in the first round. There is just not tangible proof that getting higher picks at the expense of selling off assets at a fraction of the value leads title. It just... hasn't happened.

So the attitude that people are dumb and ignorant because they want to go down that road is ... weird.

Is it possible that as we see more teams go that path, we'll see more tangible results? Sure... I'm open to that being the case. But so far, no evidence.

My view is I would've preferred to tank this year to finish with the 6th highest lottery odds vs our current path which appears to be a pick in the 15-17 range. Then come back next season with another lottery pick on the roster and retool by signings and trading one of our UFAs.

[Duffman100]

I don’t understand why we’re so desperate to get swept in the first round

No one is desperate to get swept in the first round. There is just not tangible proof that getting higher picks at the expense of selling off assets at a fraction of the value leads title. It just... hasn't happened.

So the attitude that people are dumb and ignorant because they want to go down that road is ... weird.

Is it possible that as we see more teams go that path, we'll see more tangible results? Sure... I'm open to that being the case. But so far, no evidence.

My view is I would've preferred to tank this year to finish with the 6th highest lottery odds vs our current path which appears to be a pick in the 15-17 range. Then come back next season with another lottery pick on the roster and retool by signings and trading one of our UFAs.

And I think it's a valid strategy. It may work, it may not for long term success.

Just like making the playoffs, resigning some players and retooling in the offseason and drafting someone in the 15-18 range. That may work, it may not work also.