Scoot Henderson

[Braggins]

Spoiler:

Here are Scoots per36 minute stats from the GLeague regular season + showcase vs the Thompson twins per36 stats from OTE regular season + playoffs and Jalen Green's per36 stats from his final season in the GLeague (regular season + playoffs).

I had to calc the Thompson's stats from their game logs, so if anyone else is willing to do that feel free to double check them.

Scoot Henderson - 19.1
21.5 pts ~ 5.8 reb ~ 7.5 ast ~ 1.5 stl ~ 0.4 blk ~ 4.0 tov
45.1% fg(17.7) ~ 34.5% 3pt(3.2) ~ 76.2% ft(3.4)

Jalen Green- 19.1
20.6 pts ~ 4.6 reb ~ 3.4 ast ~ 1.8 stl ~ 0.3 blk ~ 2.8 tov
46.9% fg(15.5) ~ 35.8% 3pt(6.6) ~ 78.6% ft(2.9)

Amen Thompson ~ 20.1
20.1 pts ~ 7.8 reb ~ 8.3 ast ~ 2.9 stl ~ 0.9 blk ~ 4.0 tov
54.2% fg(14.3) ~ 25.4% 3pt(3.6) ~ 68.1% ft(5.4)

Ausar Thompson ~ 20.1
20.6 pts ~ 8.3 reb ~ 7.5 ast ~ 3.0 stl ~ 1.4 blk ~ 4.1 tov
46.8% fg(16.7) ~ 32.2% 3pt(5.6) ~ 69.3% ft(5.5)

edit: I added Jalen Green's GLeague per36 stats from regular season and playoffs to add another point of reference.

Updated this and wanted to add that while I do think there are some fair criticisms to be made of Scoots game and there are maybe a few guys I would have a conversation about taking over him at #2 (not either Thompson twin), I think the nitpicking of his game has gone a little overboard.

His production is better than any previous GLeague prospect, including multiple top 10 picks and a #2 overall thats averaging 22 ppg in his second season. His production in terms of points, assists, and turnovers, is basically the same as the Thompson twins, despite them playing in a league that is a similar loose environment, but multiple tiers worse as far as talent, and them being a full year older (and they have red flags with 3pt%, ft%, and half court efficiency).

[SeattleJazzFan]

Just stop with this bad take, the worst G League team would go undefeated in college. Literally everyone playing in the G League was a great college player at one point pretty much.

not sure how you're continuing the double down here.

Gave York was also legit in college and would prob win the wooden award as a 29 year old so yeah…aweful take

Yeah, I don't think you guys are really getting the point. You think Keyonte George or Brandon Miller are struggling in the gleague because of the talent? I think the opposite. They would probably be averaging more ppg with the faster pace, more space on the floor.

Top to Bottom the talent is better in Gleague, sure. Doesn't mean it is a tougher league.

Brandon Miller is averaging 20 ppg for a team averaging 82 ppg.... teams in the gleague are dropping 125-135 points a game.

this is right. it's easier to score in the g league. the g league is better overall, the talent is definitely better, it is unquestionably easier to score in that league. you get more open looks and it's easier into the paint due to the spacing as opposed to college where everything is so jumbled.

it doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that it's easier for a guy to put up numbers in games where the scores are regularly in the 120s and 130s compared to games in the 60s and 70s. it's just a lot more wide open, up and down game - of course the scoring opportunities are more plentiful in that league. doesn't mean the players are better in college, it's a simple matter of pace and spacing.

[reanimator]

Gave York was also legit in college and would prob win the wooden award as a 29 year old so yeah…aweful take

Yeah, I don't think you guys are really getting the point. You think Keyonte George or Brandon Miller are struggling in the gleague because of the talent? I think the opposite. They would probably be averaging more ppg with the faster pace, more space on the floor.

Top to Bottom the talent is better in Gleague, sure. Doesn't mean it is a tougher league.

Brandon Miller is averaging 20 ppg for a team averaging 82 ppg.... teams in the gleague are dropping 125-135 points a game.

this is right. it's easier to score in the g league. the g league is better overall, the talent is definitely better, it is unquestionably easier to score in that league. you get more open looks and it's easier into the paint due to the spacing as opposed to college where everything is so jumbled.

it doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that it's easier for a guy to put up numbers in games where the scores are regularly in the 120s and 130s compared to games in the 60s and 70s. it's just a lot more wide open, up and down game - of course the scoring opportunities are more plentiful in that league. doesn't mean the players are better in college, it's a simple matter of pace and spacing.

Not to discount the spacing but a large part of this is guys are simply way better shotmakers. In any single college game, you will see dozens of shots missed by guys that simply not occur at the G league. If its easier, its in part because the players make it appear so.

[MasterIchiro]

Only a Hornets fan could pull us all into a hyperbolic chamber where the Scoot Henderson thread turns into the Josh Minnott - Bryce McGowens thread and where the NCAA is somehow superior due to ease of scoring in the Gleague.

These scrubs still haven't adjusted to the pace of fringe NBA talent even after getting beat up by NBA talent.

So mark me down for Scoot running an offense at a pace adjusted to NBA offense and space, creating for himself and others in a pro league and he makes Aussie league LaMelo Ball look outright bad ever entering in the conversation to go #1 overall. The audacity of those scouts. They really really overhyped LaMelo.

I've seen this Hornets fan comp Scoot to Terry Rozier like it's some lateral move. We all see Terry in his role as primary playmaker running the offense would lead us to a bottom 3 record in the NBA, at best, worst overall at worst. Now that LaMelo is not running offense Rozier is chucking, committing turnovers, and playing inefficient, losing basketball.

Terry Rozier can't be your second best playmaker running NBA offense. Maybe in the SEC. Maybe.

He lacks the burst, strength, athleticism and handles of Scoot. Never mind the court vision, feel, IQ and 3-level scoring potential.

Scoot would outplay Freshmen James Harden and Ja Morant. His Gleague stats comp with theirs. And once again, friendly public service announcement...

Gleague > NCAA

[SeattleJazzFan]

Yeah, I don't think you guys are really getting the point. You think Keyonte George or Brandon Miller are struggling in the gleague because of the talent? I think the opposite. They would probably be averaging more ppg with the faster pace, more space on the floor.

Top to Bottom the talent is better in Gleague, sure. Doesn't mean it is a tougher league.

Brandon Miller is averaging 20 ppg for a team averaging 82 ppg.... teams in the gleague are dropping 125-135 points a game.

this is right. it's easier to score in the g league. the g league is better overall, the talent is definitely better, it is unquestionably easier to score in that league. you get more open looks and it's easier into the paint due to the spacing as opposed to college where everything is so jumbled.

it doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that it's easier for a guy to put up numbers in games where the scores are regularly in the 120s and 130s compared to games in the 60s and 70s. it's just a lot more wide open, up and down game - of course the scoring opportunities are more plentiful in that league. doesn't mean the players are better in college, it's a simple matter of pace and spacing.

Not to discount the spacing but a large part of this is guys are simply way better shotmakers. In any single college game, you will see dozens of shots missed by guys that simply not occur at the G league. If its easier, its in part because the players make it appear so.

that is true. that is what creates the spacing and in turn it helps each individual player on that end of the floor.

[SeattleJazzFan]

Only a Hornets fan could pull us all into a hyperbolic chamber where the Scoot Henderson thread turns into the Josh Minnott - Bryce McGowens thread and where the NCAA is somehow superior due to ease of scoring in the Gleague.

These scrubs still haven't adjusted to the pace of fringe NBA talent even after getting beat up by NBA talent.

So mark me down for Scoot running an offense at a pace adjusted to NBA offense and space, creating for himself and others in a pro league and he makes Aussie league LaMelo Ball look outright bad ever entering in the conversation to go #1 overall. The audacity of those scouts. They really really overhyped LaMelo.

I've seen this Hornets fan comp Scoot to Terry Rozier like it's some lateral move. We all see Terry in his role as primary playmaker running the offense would lead us to a bottom 3 record in the NBA, at best, worst overall at worst. Now that LaMelo is not running offense Rozier is chucking, committing turnovers, and playing inefficient, losing basketball.

Terry Rozier can't be your second best playmaker running NBA offense. Maybe in the SEC. Maybe.

He lacks the burst, strength, athleticism and handles of Scoot. Never mind the court vision, feel, IQ and 3-level scoring potential.

Scoot would outplay Freshmen James Harden and Ja Morant. His Gleague stats comp with theirs. And once again, friendly public service announcement...

Gleague > NCAA

is anybody in this thread arguing otherwise?

[MasterIchiro]

Only a Hornets fan could pull us all into a hyperbolic chamber where the Scoot Henderson thread turns into the Josh Minnott - Bryce McGowens thread and where the NCAA is somehow superior due to ease of scoring in the Gleague.

These scrubs still haven't adjusted to the pace of fringe NBA talent even after getting beat up by NBA talent.

So mark me down for Scoot running an offense at a pace adjusted to NBA offense and space, creating for himself and others in a pro league and he makes Aussie league LaMelo Ball look outright bad ever entering in the conversation to go #1 overall. The audacity of those scouts. They really really overhyped LaMelo.

I've seen this Hornets fan comp Scoot to Terry Rozier like it's some lateral move. We all see Terry in his role as primary playmaker running the offense would lead us to a bottom 3 record in the NBA, at best, worst overall at worst. Now that LaMelo is not running offense Rozier is chucking, committing turnovers, and playing inefficient, losing basketball.

Terry Rozier can't be your second best playmaker running NBA offense. Maybe in the SEC. Maybe.

He lacks the burst, strength, athleticism and handles of Scoot. Never mind the court vision, feel, IQ and 3-level scoring potential.

Scoot would outplay Freshmen James Harden and Ja Morant. His Gleague stats comp with theirs. And once again, friendly public service announcement...

Gleague > NCAA

is anybody in this thread arguing otherwise?

Have you read the **** thread?

[SeattleJazzFan]

Only a Hornets fan could pull us all into a hyperbolic chamber where the Scoot Henderson thread turns into the Josh Minnott - Bryce McGowens thread and where the NCAA is somehow superior due to ease of scoring in the Gleague.

These scrubs still haven't adjusted to the pace of fringe NBA talent even after getting beat up by NBA talent.

So mark me down for Scoot running an offense at a pace adjusted to NBA offense and space, creating for himself and others in a pro league and he makes Aussie league LaMelo Ball look outright bad ever entering in the conversation to go #1 overall. The audacity of those scouts. They really really overhyped LaMelo.

I've seen this Hornets fan comp Scoot to Terry Rozier like it's some lateral move. We all see Terry in his role as primary playmaker running the offense would lead us to a bottom 3 record in the NBA, at best, worst overall at worst. Now that LaMelo is not running offense Rozier is chucking, committing turnovers, and playing inefficient, losing basketball.

Terry Rozier can't be your second best playmaker running NBA offense. Maybe in the SEC. Maybe.

He lacks the burst, strength, athleticism and handles of Scoot. Never mind the court vision, feel, IQ and 3-level scoring potential.

Scoot would outplay Freshmen James Harden and Ja Morant. His Gleague stats comp with theirs. And once again, friendly public service announcement...

Gleague > NCAA

is anybody in this thread arguing otherwise?

Have you read the **** thread?

yes, and i haven't seen anybody say college basketball is superior to the g league. you make it sound like it's littered throughout the thread - can you find one post saying that?

[Braggins]

this is right. it's easier to score in the g league. the g league is better overall, the talent is definitely better, it is unquestionably easier to score in that league. you get more open looks and it's easier into the paint due to the spacing as opposed to college where everything is so jumbled.

There is more space in the paint in to operate with in the GLeague IF you are a high enough level offensive creator to get into the paint in the first place against the level of athletes that play in the GLeague. That doesn't mean it is easier to score in the GLeague or that any player from the NCAA would put up better numbers in the GLeague.

The GLeague has significantly better athletes and players playing a style that is more conducive to pace, space, and high scoring. Guys from the NCAA that are legitimately at least borderline NBA talents will very often will put up better GLeague numbers than they did in college, but also after a year or more of continued very important physical and skill development.

If this years version of Keyonte George was playing in the GLeague, it is possible, but far from a given, that he would average as many or more raw ppg as he currently is in college. Hes at 16 ppg in the NCAA, which would put him as the 3rd highest scoring GLeague Ignite prospect in the teams history if he matched that. If he did manage that, he would likely look worse doing it than he does in the NCAA and his physical limitations would probably stand out a lot more on tape than they currently are against NCAA competition (if people are questioning Scoots athleticism, imagine what they would be saying about Keyonte George...). In a couple years, though, it would not be difficult to imagine George lighting up the GLeague.

[JMAC3]

this is right. it's easier to score in the g league. the g league is better overall, the talent is definitely better, it is unquestionably easier to score in that league. you get more open looks and it's easier into the paint due to the spacing as opposed to college where everything is so jumbled.

There is more space in the paint in to operate with in the GLeague IF you are a high enough level offensive creator to get into the paint in the first place against the level of athletes that play in the GLeague. That doesn't mean it is easier to score in the GLeague or that any player from the NCAA would put up better numbers in the GLeague.

The GLeague has significantly better athletes and players playing a style that is more conducive to pace, space, and high scoring. Guys from the NCAA that are legitimately at least borderline NBA talents will very often will put up better GLeague numbers than they did in college, but also after a year or more of continued very important physical and skill development.

If this years version of Keyonte George was playing in the GLeague, it is possible, but far from a given, that he would average as many or more raw ppg as he currently is in college. Hes at 16 ppg in the NCAA, which would put him as the 3rd highest scoring GLeague Ignite prospect in the teams history if he matched that. If he did manage that, he would likely look worse doing it than he does in the NCAA and his physical limitations would probably stand out a lot more on tape than they currently are against NCAA competition (if people are questioning Scoots athleticism, imagine what they would be saying about Keyonte George...). In a couple years, though, it would not be difficult to imagine George lighting up the GLeague.

Can we stop acting like the guys that went through the Gleague program turned into good players? I really don't care how Scoot numbers compare to them.

1. He should be the unquestioned go to guy. Sidy and Leonard are borderline 1st rounders.
Whereas Green played with another top 10 prospect Kuminga, Todd and Nix.
Scoot played with Hardy, Daniels, Beauchamp and Foster last year. That team was better than this years.
Scoot has barely increased his scoring average after all those guys left.

2. The players before Scoot haven't been successful. Green is the only guy that has really been good so far. Kuminga has been a disappointment for the 7th pick. Daniels has barely played this year.

It is not like Scoot matched/exceeded their production and those guys went on to destroy the league, so it is a good predictor.

3. Also, idk how many more examples I have to give before people will admit that scoring is easier in the gleague. The teams score more, I have listed 10+ rookies that their averages are higher in the gleague. It doesn't matter what we think the competition level difference is... the data speaks for itself.

[clyde21]

Yeah, I guess we will never know then, because anyone who played in college and then went to gleague might have just improved that year right?

you're all over the place, you're not even using rooks (Garza's 2nd year in the GL for example) and you're basing everything on raw PPG as if that's an indicator for success.

we know the GL plays at a faster pace than college basketball. that doesn't mean it's easier basketball. again, the worst GL team will route the best college team. that's just facts whether you want to admit it or not.

I agree lol, because they are deeper and more skilled offensively. Congrats they can beat a college team.

They still are obviously outclassed by real NBA talent majority of the time it plays in the Gleague.

Here are more examples of just rookies this year.
Josh Minott averaged 6.6 ppg in college, averaging 20 ppg in the gleague
Peyton Watson averaged 3.3 ppg in college, averaging 19.3 ppg in gleague
Wendell Moore averaged 13.4 ppg in college, averaging 18.8 ppg in gleague
Blake Wesley averaged 14.4 ppg in college, averaging 18.8 ppg in gleague
TyTy Washington averaged 12.5 ppg in colleges averaging 23.2 ppg in gleague
Kenny Lofton Jr averaged 16.5 ppg in college, averaging 22.3 ppg in gleague
Johnny Juzang averaged 15.6 ppg in college, averaging 19.5 ppg in the gleague

These guys are end of the rotation guys at best that are pretty much dominating the Gleague as rookies.
I am sure I can find another 20 pretty easy if you need me to do that too....

If the competition is better in the gleague then why does everyone of their averages go up?

Hence why I am saying Scoot getting 14/15 ppg outings is really not impressive regardless if we want to sell the story that Gleague is so good and tough etc....

what do you not understand about the concept of pace? we already know the GL plays at a higher pace than college basketball. that's not the argument. the argument YOU are making is that GL basketball is easier because the pace is faster and using raw PPG as your proof. that's just a ridiculous take on every level.

if we adjust for pace for college:

GG is averaging 29/12 per 100 as a 17 yr old in the SEC
Miller is at 32/13 per 100 in the same conference
Hendricks is at 28/12
Keyonte is at 33/8/6

you get the idea, right?

unless you think Keyonte is gonna drop 33/8/6 in the GL as an 18 yr old any notion that it's easier to play basketball in the GL than it is in college playing **** Tartleton State is just an absurd argument to make.

[clyde21]

TJD is averaging 35/19/7 with 5 blocks per 100 in college right now

this is how ridiculous it is to comp across pace - and any assumption that it's easier because it's higher pace is again a bad premise to begin with.

no, playing against grown ass men in the GL isn't easier than playing Tartleton and Jackson State. it's insane that we're even having this conversation.

[JMAC3]

Seems like a pointless conversation at this point.

pace adjusted per 40 stats Scoot is averaging less Dunks than Dennis Smith Jr, Fultz, Fox, Wall and Morant did in college.

Concerning considering we all agree there is more space in the halfcourt in gleague then pack in the paint college teams.

Scoot is just 11/17 on dunk attempts this season.

His freethrows, steals and 2pt % is lower than all those players listed above as well.

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/w_1456,c_limit,f_webp,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F0674240b-eabc-4c3e-9212-24f006ae011f_762x170.png

[ItsDanger]

The defense in the g league is terrible. Adjust the stats accordingly

[MasterIchiro]

is anybody in this thread arguing otherwise?

Have you read the **** thread?

yes, and i haven't seen anybody say college basketball is superior to the g league. you make it sound like it's littered throughout the thread - can you find one post saying that?

Fair enough, so everyone concedes Gleague > NCAA so we should all be comping Scoot to freshman year Harden and Ja and considering what Scoot would do to the NCAA as a sophomore after running an offense that more closely simulates NBA pace, space and physicality, instead of comping him to Josh Minott and Bryce McGowens who only run offense for their own stat lines.

How did you escape the hyperbolic chamber so quickly? Impressive.

[clyde21]

Seems like a pointless conversation at this point.

pace adjusted per 40 stats Scoot is averaging less Dunks than Dennis Smith Jr, Fultz, Fox, Wall and Morant did in college.

Concerning considering we all agree there is more space in the halfcourt in gleague then pack in the paint college teams.

Scoot is just 11/17 on dunk attempts this season.

His freethrows, steals and 2pt % is lower than all those players listed above as well.

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/w_1456,c_limit,f_webp,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F0674240b-eabc-4c3e-9212-24f006ae011f_762x170.png

now you're going per minute instead of pace, you're all over the place.

hopefully any idea that it's easier to play in the G League vs. college is put to bed at this point. just a ridiculous premise to begin with can't believe we went thru 3 pages of this nonsense.

playing professionals is apparently easier than playing Tartleton State...

[jezzerinho]

Seems like a pointless conversation at this point.

pace adjusted per 40 stats Scoot is averaging less Dunks than Dennis Smith Jr, Fultz, Fox, Wall and Morant did in college.

Concerning considering we all agree there is more space in the halfcourt in gleague then pack in the paint college teams.

Scoot is just 11/17 on dunk attempts this season.

His freethrows, steals and 2pt % is lower than all those players listed above as well.

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/w_1456,c_limit,f_webp,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F0674240b-eabc-4c3e-9212-24f006ae011f_762x170.png

now you're going per minute instead of pace, you're all over the place.

hopefully any idea that it's easier to play in the G League vs. college is put to bed at this point. just a ridiculous premise to begin with can't believe we went thru 3 pages of this nonsense.

playing professionals is apparently easier than playing Tartleton State...

I'm not sure the answer is as straight-line as you're asserting here. All your points are valid, but there's the layer of competitiveness and the media focus that goes with the NCAA, that the G League wishes it had.

There's not the same intensity, games are played in front of small and largely disengaged "fans". On an 8 or 9 man G League roster, 3 or 4 probably feel they shouldn't be there or wish they weren't.

That's not the case for everybody and so overall I'd agree the level of talent is higher, but there's way more at stake in most NCAA games - even the ones against Tarleton St.

That is its own trial by fire and evaluation point for FOs.

So I'd say a poll of scouts or GMs would yield less than universal results as to which provides the sterner test. Though I get your point on player standard absolutely.

[TheSuzerain]

There is a gigantic gap between league-wide O-Rating in the G-League compared to college.

Some of that reflects a higher skill level in the G-League. But some of it definitely does reflect a weak defensive environment.

[clyde21]

Seems like a pointless conversation at this point.

pace adjusted per 40 stats Scoot is averaging less Dunks than Dennis Smith Jr, Fultz, Fox, Wall and Morant did in college.

Concerning considering we all agree there is more space in the halfcourt in gleague then pack in the paint college teams.

Scoot is just 11/17 on dunk attempts this season.

His freethrows, steals and 2pt % is lower than all those players listed above as well.

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/w_1456,c_limit,f_webp,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F0674240b-eabc-4c3e-9212-24f006ae011f_762x170.png

now you're going per minute instead of pace, you're all over the place.

hopefully any idea that it's easier to play in the G League vs. college is put to bed at this point. just a ridiculous premise to begin with can't believe we went thru 3 pages of this nonsense.

playing professionals is apparently easier than playing Tartleton State...

I'm not sure the answer is as straight-line as you're asserting here. All your points are valid, but there's the layer of competitiveness and the media focus that goes with the NCAA, that the G League wishes it had.

There's not the same intensity, games are played in front of small and largely disengaged "fans". On an 8 or 9 man G League roster, 3 or 4 probably feel they shouldn't be there or wish they weren't.

That's not the case for everybody and so overall I'd agree the level of talent is higher, but there's way more at stake in most NCAA games - even the ones against Tarleton St.

That is its own trial by fire and evaluation point for FOs.

So I'd say a poll of scouts or GMs would yield less than universal results as to which provides the sterner test. Though I get your point on player standard absolutely.

it boils down to this: if you agree that the worst GL team beats the best college team, there is no conversation to be had. it's that simple.

mental gymnastics to pretend otherwise and try to pass off college being more difficult than the GL where you're talking about professionals focusing 100% on basketball instead of college where half the time theyre taking swahili classes and going to frat parties.

put Scoot in the NCAA tomorrow and he goes from playing against guys like Tony Snell, JD Davison, Mfiondu Kabengele and Denzel Valentine (Maine Celtics) and instead plays against Eastern Shore. what do you think happens?

[reanimator]

Attributing the inability to score in NCAA to intensity and defense while ignoring the longer shot clocker, the inability of less talented players to generate quality shots without eating up said shot clock, and the overall dearth of shotmakers just seems wild to me.