NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2022-23 (pt 3)

[HotRocks34]

I think tonight was the 7th or 8th game this year where Jokic was 1 assist shy of a triple double.

Nuggets beat Raptors in Denver.

[dygaction]

Felt Jokic got more than a couple of blocks but only 1 on the box score

[dygaction]

Embiid hanging in. Tatum fading.

Embiid is barely hanging in. Straight negative +/- four games in a row, and in the past two wins he was consuming the cushions built by the small lineup in the 4th quarter.

[Kurtz]

I don't think it's been mentioned much, but Denver has had by far the easiest schedule in the league to date:

http://powerrankingsguru.com/nba/strength-of-schedule.php

[Mickey8]

Its like Jokic trying on purpose to lower down his scoring average by not taking the shots . Since he became number one player for Denver , every season before he won those two MVP titles , he always had periods when he refused to take the shots, usually early in the season, few weeks then he picks up his aggressiveness . This season have been abysmal from the start , tonight games was like about 20 other crappy games he had this season, where he wasn't dominant at all but he still managed to put up decent numbers. Its shame that he's not showcasing his talent like he did in the past two regular seasons,when he puts up everything together he's one of the top players who's games are the most enjoyable to watch. I know this season he has more help, healthier team but that's not the reason for him to take 2,3, shots in one half of the game . His averages should be at least 5 shots per quarter. He's still the most talented scorer on the team . You can place him in any situation, post ups, pick and roll and pop , driving the basketball , I mean everything. We barely see him taking jump shots this season and he has one of the best mid range games in the league. He had some games this season when he reminds people what he can do but they are fewer and fewer this season. I have been saying from the start of the season that he's not playing like the MVP candidate. He's still very important player for Denver , their best player but not the MVP of the league this season. In order for Denver to have any kind of success in the play off's he will have to raise the level of aggressiveness on the offense, he always does that but we will see how it goes in these upcoming play off's.

[MavsDirk41]

Its like Jokic trying on purpose to lower down his scoring average by not taking the shots . Since he became number one player for Denver , every season before he won those two MVP titles , he always had periods when he refused to take the shots, usually early in the season, few weeks then he picks up his aggressiveness . This season have been abysmal from the start , tonight games was like about 20 other crappy games he had this season, where he wasn't dominant at all but he still managed to put up decent numbers. Its shame that he's not showcasing his talent like he did in the past two regular seasons,when he puts up everything together he's one of the top players who's games are the most enjoyable to watch. I know this season he has more help, healthier team but that's not the reason for him to take 2,3, shots in one half of the game . His averages should be at least 5 shots per quarter. He's still the most talented scorer on the team . You can place him in any situation, post ups, pick and roll and pop , driving the basketball , I mean everything. We barely see him taking jump shots this season and he has one of the best mid range games in the league. He had some games this season when he reminds people what he can do but they are fewer and fewer this season. I have been saying from the start of the season that he's not playing like the MVP candidate. He's still very important player for Denver , their best player but not the MVP of the league this season. In order for Denver to have any kind of success in the play off's he will have to raise the level of aggressiveness on the offense, he always does that but we will see how it goes in these upcoming play off's.

For whatever reason Jokic gets blasted by ignorant media people like Perkins and Nick Wright and all the guy does is help his team win. Last year he carried that team to 48 wins. This year he got Porter Jr. and Murray back so his shot attempts are down a little but his contributions in rebounding and passing are still there. Denver has been the best team in the west all year and outside of Giannis, i dont see any other player who deserves the mvp over Jokic.

[AleksandarN]

I don't think it's been mentioned much, but Denver has had by far the easiest schedule in the league to date:

http://powerrankingsguru.com/nba/strength-of-schedule.php

That makes no sense in the next table they have 14th toughest remaining schedule. How can they have by far the easiest schedule to date yet only have the 14th toughest remaining schedule

[deneem4]

Zion had the pels in 1st place…

[BoatsNZones]

I don't think it's been mentioned much, but Denver has had by far the easiest schedule in the league to date:

http://powerrankingsguru.com/nba/strength-of-schedule.php

That makes no sense in the next table they have 14th toughest remaining schedule. How can they have by far the easiest schedule to date yet only have the 14th toughest remaining schedule

Yeah I checked 3 to 4 other SOS lists and none had Denver as the easiest schedule (I don't think any even had them bottom 5, but not sure). Bear in mind that this is the NBA not the NFL, so SOS is not really a thing (it's all relatively close), and much of it is going to be based on injury/rest luck depending on when other teams face them (something not factored in).

I will say though that Denver has arguably the best home court advantage in the league, and it's probably worth a few games a year over your average team (tough to quantify exactly).

[Kurtz]

I don't think it's been mentioned much, but Denver has had by far the easiest schedule in the league to date:

http://powerrankingsguru.com/nba/strength-of-schedule.php

That makes no sense in the next table they have 14th toughest remaining schedule. How can they have by far the easiest schedule to date yet only have the 14th toughest remaining schedule

The two primary factors that explain this are:

1. They play in the much weaker conference.
2. They don't have to play themselves (hard to fault them for this one, in fairness).

[eyeatoma]

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[Kurtz]

I don't think it's been mentioned much, but Denver has had by far the easiest schedule in the league to date:

http://powerrankingsguru.com/nba/strength-of-schedule.php

That makes no sense in the next table they have 14th toughest remaining schedule. How can they have by far the easiest schedule to date yet only have the 14th toughest remaining schedule

Yeah I checked 3 to 4 other SOS lists and none had Denver as the easiest schedule (I don't think any even had them bottom 5, but not sure). Bear in mind that this is the NBA not the NFL, so SOS is not really a thing (it's all relatively close), and much of it is going to be based on injury/rest luck depending on when other teams face them (something not factored in).

I will say though that Denver has arguably the best home court advantage in the league, and it's probably worth a few games a year over your average team (tough to quantify exactly).

Can you link a few sites that you looked at? Because I've seen a couple that point to Denver as having the easiest sched. I did see ESPN rank them at around 5th easiest though. Here's another site that ranks Denver as easiest:

https://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nba/news/nba-strength-of-schedule-nuggets-lakers-breakdown/c5g4dld735ofxr7natife5ur

basketball reference has Denver at 3rd easiest: https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023.html

[BoatsNZones]

That makes no sense in the next table they have 14th toughest remaining schedule. How can they have by far the easiest schedule to date yet only have the 14th toughest remaining schedule

Yeah I checked 3 to 4 other SOS lists and none had Denver as the easiest schedule (I don't think any even had them bottom 5, but not sure). Bear in mind that this is the NBA not the NFL, so SOS is not really a thing (it's all relatively close), and much of it is going to be based on injury/rest luck depending on when other teams face them (something not factored in).

I will say though that Denver has arguably the best home court advantage in the league, and it's probably worth a few games a year over your average team (tough to quantify exactly).

Can you link a few sites that you looked at? Because I've seen a couple that point to Denver as having the easiest sched. I did see ESPN rank them at around 5th easiest though. Here's another site that ranks Denver as easiest:

https://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nba/news/nba-strength-of-schedule-nuggets-lakers-breakdown/c5g4dld735ofxr7natife5ur

basketball reference has Denver at 3rd easiest: https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2023.html

ESPN has them tied 7th/8th: http://www.espn.com/nba/stats/rpi/_/sort/SOS

Odds shark has them dead in the middle: https://www.oddsshark.com/nba/power-rankings

Looks like crafted NBA has them tied 3rd-5th easiest with Philly and Boston: https://craftednba.com/team-traits/net-rating

But again, I really don't think SOS has much meaningful relevance in the NBA (generally I suppose it favors the Eastern Conference teams as the West beats them in h2h virtually every year... though this year I'm not sure?). I don't even hear it brought up in the NFL MVP debates much, where it actually does matter. Home court is their biggest advantage and worth bringing up when team wins are discussed I suppose, but the most fortunate teams each year are going to be the ones who played the most teams with missing stars/starters (I don't know any public site that tracks this).

[Ryoga Hibiki]

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[Sharkboy242]

Jokic? More like Coastic

[AussieCeltic]

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Teams intentionally fouled Shaq has he was a poor free throw shooter. Embiid to his credit is a fantastic free throw shooter.

[RB34]

At this point, anyone but Jokic. This season he really don't deserve it, the last two he rightfully won it.

Can you explain your reasoning? Without using anything narrative based?

[LessEyeTest]

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Teams intentionally fouled Shaq has he was a poor free throw shooter. Embiid to his credit is a fantastic free throw shooter.

That and the fact that Shaq never flopped. Embiid could be guarded by Van Fleet and you'd still see him post up, drive towards the rim and find a way to take the shot falling down and being rewarded with free throws on his way to a standard 12+ FTA game.

Meanwhile Jokic has a dozen new scratches on his right arm after every game and gets rewarded with 5 free throws a game.

[Cubbies2120]

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Now what’s that list for “40+ points created by a Center”? So points + assist points?

Also, there was a reason Shaq had a higher FT rate…https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hack-a-Shaq

Finally, out of all players to average 20ppg for their career, Embiid has the highest % of his points from the line in…NBA history. Yes, all time.

[eyeatoma]

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Now what’s that list for “40+ points created by a Center”? So points + assist points?

Also, there was a reason Shaq had a higher FT rate…https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hack-a-Shaq

Finally, out of all players to average 20ppg for their career, Embiid has the highest % of his points from the line in…NBA history. Yes, all time.

You guys don't give up do you. Embiid is a bull in a china shop. He initiates contact, and he gets mauled, for every time you guys say he flops, there are about 5 times as many times that there's a non call, or he gets hammered. He earns the majority of his free throw attempts fairly. There is the occasional time he flops, and he shouldn't be penalized for it. You can complain all you want that it can be hard to look at, but that's what the refs allow, and they haven't changed that. More importantly players like Giannis, who average more free throws, flop too, but we don't here anything. There are so many times that he just rams into a player, and what should be a charge turns into a foul. Are you guys saying you don't mind Giannis doing it because he's a terrible shooter. Or is it pure jealousy that someone like Jokic doesn't get these calls. It really is one of the funniest things I've seen on the internet, people bitching about this. Fact of the matter is, Embiid isn't nearly as bad as Chris Paul, Kyle Lowry, Marcus Smart, James Harden, some of the biggest floppers of all time. W/e anyway to break a person down I guess.