Fred VanVleet Specifically Calls Out Referee Ben Taylor and NBA Reffing

[azcatz11]

Completely unacceptable IMO. First, it's totally unfair because the official will never have the platform to respond. Officials can't come back with "Damn FVV was awful tonight". Officials get calls wrong absolutely but they're pretty damn good at their jobs. Any of you thinking you know the rulebook better than even the worst official is just delusional.

Secondly, these players and coaches bitch and whine on every single play of the game. An officially finally saying that's enough and giving out a T is fine. There should be more Ts if we're being honest. 9 times out of 10 we at home have no idea if a T was warranted or not, we can't hear the conversation. No one knows what FVV said so none of our opinions of the T is really relevant at all. But if Fred is willing to say that **** in front of a camera, can you imagine what he said during the game?

Lastly, a T in the 3rd quarter doesn't change the game.

Who cares what he says to the refs, respectfully. As long as it’s not some psycho **** they absolutely should be allowed to criticize and curse at the refs, within reason. The refs make the games all about themselves and their ego gets in the way.

Why should the refs have to care about defending themselves anyways? These dudes are the definition of a commodity. Anyone can train and be a ref. Nothing special about these bums

[Phish Tank]

the 30k fine is worth it.

But Adam Silver can't then say he supports the refs and such.

[DTP]

Completely unacceptable IMO. First, it's totally unfair because the official will never have the platform to respond. Officials can't come back with "Damn FVV was awful tonight". Officials get calls wrong absolutely but they're pretty damn good at their jobs. Any of you thinking you know the rulebook better than even the worst official is just delusional.

Secondly, these players and coaches bitch and whine on every single play of the game. An officially finally saying that's enough and giving out a T is fine. There should be more Ts if we're being honest. 9 times out of 10 we at home have no idea if a T was warranted or not, we can't hear the conversation. No one knows what FVV said so none of our opinions of the T is really relevant at all. But if Fred is willing to say that **** in front of a camera, can you imagine what he said during the game?

Lastly, a T in the 3rd quarter doesn't change the game.

Who cares what he says to the refs, respectfully. As long as it’s not some psycho **** they absolutely should be allowed to criticize and curse at the refs, within reason. The refs make the games all about themselves and their ego gets in the way.

Why should the refs have to care about defending themselves anyways? These dudes are the definition of a commodity. Anyone can train and be a ref. Nothing special about these bums

So you think players should be able to say anything they want to officials (other humans) because they didn't get their way? lol that's not how any business works. And you're not serious if you think anyone can be an NBA referee.

But yet, NBA players want fans ejected for the things they say.....

[bakafool]

30k fine. Not bad. Refs will still have zero accountability just like Adam Silver likes it.

[sjballer03]

30k fine. Not bad. Refs will still have zero accountability just like Adam Silver likes it.

I feel like refs have always had zero accountability regardless of the commissioner and regardless of which sport it is.

[azcatz11]

Completely unacceptable IMO. First, it's totally unfair because the official will never have the platform to respond. Officials can't come back with "Damn FVV was awful tonight". Officials get calls wrong absolutely but they're pretty damn good at their jobs. Any of you thinking you know the rulebook better than even the worst official is just delusional.

Secondly, these players and coaches bitch and whine on every single play of the game. An officially finally saying that's enough and giving out a T is fine. There should be more Ts if we're being honest. 9 times out of 10 we at home have no idea if a T was warranted or not, we can't hear the conversation. No one knows what FVV said so none of our opinions of the T is really relevant at all. But if Fred is willing to say that **** in front of a camera, can you imagine what he said during the game?

Lastly, a T in the 3rd quarter doesn't change the game.

Who cares what he says to the refs, respectfully. As long as it’s not some psycho **** they absolutely should be allowed to criticize and curse at the refs, within reason. The refs make the games all about themselves and their ego gets in the way.

Why should the refs have to care about defending themselves anyways? These dudes are the definition of a commodity. Anyone can train and be a ref. Nothing special about these bums

So you think players should be able to say anything they want to officials (other humans) because they didn't get their way? lol that's not how any business works. And you're not serious if you think anyone can be an NBA referee.

But yet, NBA players want fans ejected for the things they say.....

My view is refs should never throw a player out for cursing at them…within reason. So yes, to answer your question. We pay good money to watch these games and not the refs take over games like they’ve done for 23+ years.

And yes, anyone can be an NBA ref.

[WolfAddict]

There's a bloke who lives in my home town who wears a green wig and runs up and down the main street screaming at the crows to get out of his head... Could he be an NBA ref?

[moderndarwin]

I’m really shocked at the lack of accountability people put on players on this board and in general.

We teach kids the simple basics of leave the refs alone don’t talk to them. Yet we’re okay with grown men throwing tantrums because of perceived slights or incorrect calls. Should we give out monetary fines everytime a player complains and is wrong? I legit can’t believe anyone thinks it’s okay to be yelling at refs or acting with disrespect toward them. These are the absolute most highly trained refs we’ve ever had. If you actually learned about it you’d see how much review and training they do of their performances. Also, they have zero incentive to unfairly call a game. None. Why would a ref risk their livelihood that they spent years if not decades working toward by making up calls. They are each people and going to interpret events slightly differently but for the most part they do an outstanding job when you consider just how much basketball they have the ref. Rant over. This is bogus.

[DTP]

I’m really shocked at the lack of accountability people put on players on this board and in general.

We teach kids the simple basics of leave the refs alone don’t talk to them. Yet we’re okay with grown men throwing tantrums because of perceived slights or incorrect calls. Should we give out monetary fines everytime a player complains and is wrong? I legit can’t believe anyone thinks it’s okay to be yelling at refs or acting with disrespect toward them. These are the absolute most highly trained refs we’ve ever had. If you actually learned about it you’d see how much review and training they do of their performances. Also, they have zero incentive to unfairly call a game. None. Why would a ref risk their livelihood that they spent years if not decades working toward by making up calls. They are each people and going to interpret events slightly differently but for the most part they do an outstanding job when you consider just how much basketball they have the ref. Rant over. This is bogus.

It says a lot about where we are as a society.....the dude said NBA players should be able to say anything they want to officials and not be held accountable for any of it lol. I also think it's hilarious that people think there's no accountability to officials. Officials are literally graded every game and are graded by NBA teams. The officials that everyone hates are the officials that are highly graded by teams & the league....and its because the officiate the games exactly how the league wants them to.

[lakerz12]

Respect to FVV for keeping it real.

He’s right, the fans come to see the players.

I just wish the NBA had a good commissioner.

[ken6199]

If FVV sets up a GoFundMe for his fine I am going to chip in.

[moderndarwin]

Amazing^ multimillionaires getting funded by the middle class willingly. Edit: i laughed tho like the level of dedication to it. I’m all for watch the world burn anarchy like this. We should juz the players call their own fouls.

[TheAlchemist]

The raptors have historically been known to be screwed over by the refs. Tim donaghy had this to say about the 2014 series about the Nets vs the Raptors:

What they do is they actually send in a representative from the league office to sit down with the referees at an 11 o’clock meeting in the morning where they go over game film,” Donaghy said. “They will show the referees what they want called, what they want them to concentrate on, what they feel needs to be called or let go in a series to avoid any problems. With that, you would leave the room and say to yourself one team is put at an advantage or disadvantage.

“In this situation, Brooklyn would be put at an advantage. A Brooklyn-Miami matchup would bring great ratings and that’s what this is all about for the NBA and the league offices – bringing in as many dollars as they can.”

Here is a blog post where someone ran the analytics behind the referees being biased against the team:

https://maurice-kumalo.medium.com/are-the-toronto-raptors-being-called-for-more-fouls-than-their-opponents-by-referees-dceb3180600b

The analytics show that the Toronto Raptors are subject to more foul calls than their opponents on consistent basis. While this is not, causation, or correlation, it is a pattern. The instincts of the team’s fans and commentators were correct this time. The pattern holds true through the first quarter of the 2020–2021 season. The coaching staff and the Raptor’s analytics team can examine the evidence and seek some redress from the NBA. A fairer game is a better game for all.

During the 2019 run, the former Raptors now Lakers assistant coach, Phil Handy said this:

“I’ve never really been a part of a team or an organization that doesn’t get the respect that we deserve,” said Phil Handy, one of the team’s assistant coaches and Toronto’s head of player development, during a recent episode of ‘Inside the Green Room’ with Danny Green. “I watch and I’m like, man, we don’t get no calls!”

https://sports.yahoo.com/raptors-arent-getting-enough-respect-refs-012622986.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cucmVkZGl0LmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAALDCqt8IfM3Vfi5LPN60ljRyEyoG4EcmgStzwTZeuaPUwvpa2ppftuqolTByxQN26pNKp2acOyXrCCHfJck2dcVEt1gaDYKGDMjGgzlXKlaTE0_LqGBDL6JkVcbxznQpdj-rLQWBtXp9kp5HDzPC7Dz-e_m5dckWVKoPpZKb67kL

Not a fan of the tin foil conspiracy theory slant? Okay sure, but this is how the Raptors as a organization deal with referee's:

"I don't know where they get them from, but every day when I come into the area they would put one sheet of paper, a bio sheet of the refs and it was: Favorite movie? Shawshank Redemption. Favorite band? Prince. Favorite food? Pizza," Nurse said. "It really helped me because usually I didn't know anything about them and I'd be able to come out there and say, 'you like Prince? I went to the Prince concert myself in 1984!"

The organization has referee sheets where they do research on refs for their favorite pass time hobbies, lifestyle etc.

To me, its clearly evident that the only non American NBA franchise, with a non American TV deal, has been penalized a lot more by Refs. At this point, Freds words where 100% accurate but in my opinion, shouldn't be painted as " Player ranting".

[DonaldSanders]

So you think players should be able to say anything they want to officials (other humans) because they didn't get their way? lol that's not how any business works. And you're not serious if you think anyone can be an NBA referee.

But yet, NBA players want fans ejected for the things they say.....

Not anything any time, but when refs are out of line they should be called out. Nobody should be above criticism, and that's what refs are in the NBA. Tell the truth and you get a fine.

Jordan Poole passes the ball back to the ref and gets an absurd T -- but he can't even answer a question about it or risk a fine. That's stupid.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Completely unacceptable IMO. First, it's totally unfair because the official will never have the platform to respond. Officials can't come back with "Damn FVV was awful tonight". Officials get calls wrong absolutely but they're pretty damn good at their jobs. Any of you thinking you know the rulebook better than even the worst official is just delusional.

Secondly, these players and coaches bitch and whine on every single play of the game. An officially finally saying that's enough and giving out a T is fine. There should be more Ts if we're being honest. 9 times out of 10 we at home have no idea if a T was warranted or not, we can't hear the conversation. No one knows what FVV said so none of our opinions of the T is really relevant at all. But if Fred is willing to say that **** in front of a camera, can you imagine what he said during the game?

Lastly, a T in the 3rd quarter doesn't change the game.

Who cares what he says to the refs, respectfully. As long as it’s not some psycho **** they absolutely should be allowed to criticize and curse at the refs, within reason. The refs make the games all about themselves and their ego gets in the way.

Why should the refs have to care about defending themselves anyways? These dudes are the definition of a commodity. Anyone can train and be a ref. Nothing special about these bums

Fred said, "just play through this bull****" to a teammate and Taylor T'd him up. It wasn't even that bad. Basically if a comment or look hurts their feelings they can take money out of their pockets. If a player or coach makes a comment post-game, it also costs them money. Doesn't seem like a two-way street.

[Childs]

If FVV sets up a GoFundMe for his fine I am going to chip in.

I really would question his integrity since he’s a millionaire if he were to set up a go fund me.

[DTP]

So you think players should be able to say anything they want to officials (other humans) because they didn't get their way? lol that's not how any business works. And you're not serious if you think anyone can be an NBA referee.

But yet, NBA players want fans ejected for the things they say.....

Not anything any time, but when refs are out of line they should be called out. Nobody should be above criticism, and that's what refs are in the NBA. Tell the truth and you get a fine.

Jordan Poole passes the ball back to the ref and gets an absurd T -- but he can't even answer a question about it or risk a fine. That's stupid.

Officials make bad calls, just like players make bad decisions and coaches too. It doesn't give you the right to berate them. There's not an official in this league that doesn't converse with coaches and players throughout the game. Sometimes it's too much...and the league has allowed it to get to this point where it is too much, way too often.

In regard to Poole, it's pretty obvious when someone is being an ass or not. I wasn't watching the game, I wasn't sitting courtside...so I don't actually know, but I give the benefit of the doubt to officials there. I'm pretty sure every technical foul is reviewed by the league....they could easily rescind it but they have not.

[DonaldSanders]

So you think players should be able to say anything they want to officials (other humans) because they didn't get their way? lol that's not how any business works. And you're not serious if you think anyone can be an NBA referee.

But yet, NBA players want fans ejected for the things they say.....

Not anything any time, but when refs are out of line they should be called out. Nobody should be above criticism, and that's what refs are in the NBA. Tell the truth and you get a fine.

Jordan Poole passes the ball back to the ref and gets an absurd T -- but he can't even answer a question about it or risk a fine. That's stupid.

Officials make bad calls, just like players make bad decisions and coaches too. It doesn't give you the right to berate them. There's not an official in this league that doesn't converse with coaches and players throughout the game. Sometimes it's too much...and the league has allowed it to get to this point where it is too much, way too often.

In regard to Poole, it's pretty obvious when someone is being an ass or not. I wasn't watching the game, I wasn't sitting courtside...so I don't actually know, but I give the benefit of the doubt to officials there. I'm pretty sure every technical foul is reviewed by the league....they could easily rescind it but they have not.

I'm not saying berate, you should be able to criticize without a fine. If you say anything negative/disagreeing with the call you get a fine. Players shouldn't have to be bootlickers.

Poole's tech should have been rescinded, go watch it on youtube.

[moderndarwin]

I’m a Dubs fan and no it shouldn’t. It’s disrespectful. We all know it was meant that way. Like here’s the ball. He can choose to do anything else with it besides throw it to the ref. Everyone knows that means i’m frustrated with you when the ball is thrown back to the ref. It’s just more passive aggressive than Draymond yelling at 100 decibels.

[ken6199]

If FVV sets up a GoFundMe for his fine I am going to chip in.

I really would question his integrity since he’s a millionaire if he were to set up a go fund me.

I was obviously joking, just to show my support for FVV's grand slam on the ref.