Official Scottie Barnes Thread - Part 5

[YogurtProducer]

It's not homerism. It's different priorities.

If a trade won't push the team over the top, I'd rather take my chances on Scottie becoming that player who will push us over the top.

We don't need more Siakams and Freds on this team. We need a Kawhi.

Either we trade Scottie for a Kawhi or we hope he becomes one. Trading him for another top-20 player accomplishes nothing.

Scottie ain’t gonna be Kawhi man. That’s such a ridiculously high standard to hold for a dude who has not shown the shooting or defensive potential.

If you can cash Scottie in for a top 20 player you almost have to do it. Especially if he’s an offensive force as we have the secondary pieces already.

That's selling really low. At minimum the player you're trading for has to be a top 10 player. I would not trade him straight up for Siakam for example.

I think you're at a stage where you're underrating him.

Take that take to the general board and see what other fanbases think. Guys will rip you to shreds for that take.

Scottie Barnes is at minimum (MINIMUM?!?!) worth a top 10 player? That is **** outrageous.

I was against the KD trade for Scottie but KD was also a million years old and injury prone. But if you were to get offered an all-nba / all-star talent in his mid 20s how the hell can you seriously say no to that?

Progression is not linear, it is quite possible Scottie tops off as a Siakam level talent which is damn good but now we are stuck in the same situation where Scottie needs a co-star and we likely do not have a lucky Tampa Tank to acquire assets. Just imagining Donovan Mitchell / Siakam / OG / Poeltl together would be incredible. It is outrageous to say you would not trade Mitchell for Barnes (salaries aside obviously).

[Johnny Bball]

Scottie ain’t gonna be Kawhi man. That’s such a ridiculously high standard to hold for a dude who has not shown the shooting or defensive potential.

If you can cash Scottie in for a top 20 player you almost have to do it. Especially if he’s an offensive force as we have the secondary pieces already.

If Barnes can't be a top 20 player, which is bascially an allstar, then what are we even doing here. I think he's surely expetced by everyone to be that and more. And I don't think we have the secondary pieces yet.

And I wouldn't trade Barnes for Tatum either, unless it was a three way trade where I got the rest, because Tatum has 2 years left on his deal and everything about Tatum's personality just screams him going to LAL, Heat or NYK, to me.

An all-star is more like a top 30-35 player as 27 guys got the nod this year and there is another 5-10 guys who did not make it for various reasons (injuries, down year, etc.)

Top 20 is still a very high bar to hold a guy to, that is a guy who is gonna make some All-NBA teams (in past years, guys 20th or so in all-NBA voting have been Mitchell, Brown, Zion, Siakam, Adebayo, Trae, etc.

But not trading for Tatum is just... man a bad take. There is like a minuscule possibility Barnes ever touches Tatum. At Scotties age Tatum was at 23/7/3 on 56.7TS% whereas Scottie is 15/7/5 on 52.5TS% and the defensive area is not significantly in either's favor. For all we know even if Scottie becomes Tatum he could end up with a garbage supporting cast and then we are in the same place as we are right now with Siakam looking for running mates for Scottie.

Tatum/Siakam would just be Tatum/Brown 2.0 and Tatum/Brown is the best team (or close to) in the NBA.

Buddy, Boston is never trading Tatum for Barnes in real life, straight up or in any realitistic package.

And you would have him for one year prior to his free agency where you would be trading him again. And we aren't competing next year with Tatum anyway. He would be, in effect a one year rental, when we aren't ready for it. Trading him for picks then would be fantastic, but ... I'm saying I skip the year and just do it before if that were avaiable, in any crazy fantasy land. Hence the three way trade comment.

[YogurtProducer]

If Barnes can't be a top 20 player, which is bascially an allstar, then what are we even doing here. I think he's surely expetced by everyone to be that and more. And I don't think we have the secondary pieces yet.

And I wouldn't trade Barnes for Tatum either, unless it was a three way trade where I got the rest, because Tatum has 2 years left on his deal and everything about Tatum's personality just screams him going to LAL, Heat or NYK, to me.

An all-star is more like a top 30-35 player as 27 guys got the nod this year and there is another 5-10 guys who did not make it for various reasons (injuries, down year, etc.)

Top 20 is still a very high bar to hold a guy to, that is a guy who is gonna make some All-NBA teams (in past years, guys 20th or so in all-NBA voting have been Mitchell, Brown, Zion, Siakam, Adebayo, Trae, etc.

But not trading for Tatum is just... man a bad take. There is like a minuscule possibility Barnes ever touches Tatum. At Scotties age Tatum was at 23/7/3 on 56.7TS% whereas Scottie is 15/7/5 on 52.5TS% and the defensive area is not significantly in either's favor. For all we know even if Scottie becomes Tatum he could end up with a garbage supporting cast and then we are in the same place as we are right now with Siakam looking for running mates for Scottie.

Tatum/Siakam would just be Tatum/Brown 2.0 and Tatum/Brown is the best team (or close to) in the NBA.

Buddy, Boston is never trading Tatum for Barnes in real life, straight up or in any realitistic package.

Ok? Does that somehow justify you saying you would not trade Barnes for Tatum?

[Johnny Bball]

An all-star is more like a top 30-35 player as 27 guys got the nod this year and there is another 5-10 guys who did not make it for various reasons (injuries, down year, etc.)

Top 20 is still a very high bar to hold a guy to, that is a guy who is gonna make some All-NBA teams (in past years, guys 20th or so in all-NBA voting have been Mitchell, Brown, Zion, Siakam, Adebayo, Trae, etc.

But not trading for Tatum is just... man a bad take. There is like a minuscule possibility Barnes ever touches Tatum. At Scotties age Tatum was at 23/7/3 on 56.7TS% whereas Scottie is 15/7/5 on 52.5TS% and the defensive area is not significantly in either's favor. For all we know even if Scottie becomes Tatum he could end up with a garbage supporting cast and then we are in the same place as we are right now with Siakam looking for running mates for Scottie.

Tatum/Siakam would just be Tatum/Brown 2.0 and Tatum/Brown is the best team (or close to) in the NBA.

Buddy, Boston is never trading Tatum for Barnes in real life, straight up or in any realitistic package.

Ok? Does that somehow justify you saying you would not trade Barnes for Tatum?

Did you even read my first post? I'll revise above and expand on it so you get it!

[YogurtProducer]

Buddy, Boston is never trading Tatum for Barnes in real life, straight up or in any realitistic package.

Ok? Does that somehow justify you saying you would not trade Barnes for Tatum?

Did you even read my first post? I'll revise above and expand on it so you get it!

Nothing can justify that.

If Boston calls and says they’d trade Tatum for Barnes you accept

[Johnny Bball]

Ok? Does that somehow justify you saying you would not trade Barnes for Tatum?

Did you even read my first post? I'll revise above and expand on it so you get it!

Nothing can justify that.

If Boston calls and says they’d trade Tatum for Barnes you accept

Ok. I'm going to try one more time. I don't want Tatum for the reason stated. I make the trade to trade tatum to a third team for whatever they offer in your fanstasy land presuming it is better than just Barnes. This isn't hard to understand if you aren't even trying to understand. Smfh.

[HumbleRen]

Man, I really dislike that archetype for some reason. Mitchell is somehow making it work in Cleveland and looking less chuckerish and more efficient, but everything about him is his scoring. He's imo the 3rd most important player on that team behind Allen and Garland. It's a perfect fit for him though with how they're built. I just don't trust the way he scores. I'm still expecting him to fail in the playoffs and be a hot and cold player.

Must be looking at the wrong Mitchell then. He’s always been efficient and a driver of a top 10 offence in almost every season since he was a rookie.

I do agree though, he’s probably in the best situation to compliment his strengths and weaknesses.

The knock on Mitchell is that the bubble playoff really inflated his ego/game.
The Jazz were exposed because during clutch moments, he would press by slowing the pace, dribbling to nowhere, and taking really bad contested shots when the defenses are zeroed in.
His defense is also really bad and was picked on lots by the Mavs last year

Every player has flaws if you look deep enough.

30/5/5 in the playoffs over the span of 5 years is good enough for me. He’s still only 26 as well.

[YogurtProducer]

Did you even read my first post? I'll revise above and expand on it so you get it!

Nothing can justify that.

If Boston calls and says they’d trade Tatum for Barnes you accept

Ok. I'm going to try one more time. I don't want Tatum for the reason stated. I make the trade to trade tatum to a third team for whatever they offer in your fanstasy land presuming it is better than just Barnes. This isn't hard to understand if you aren't even trying to understand. Smfh.

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

[Johnny Bball]

Nothing can justify that.

If Boston calls and says they’d trade Tatum for Barnes you accept

Ok. I'm going to try one more time. I don't want Tatum for the reason stated. I make the trade to trade tatum to a third team for whatever they offer in your fanstasy land presuming it is better than just Barnes. This isn't hard to understand if you aren't even trying to understand. Smfh.

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

What's even worse then, if he's that good to you, is watching him walk away in free agency and getting nothing and winning nothing. Reasonable? There's not even an attempt here to be reasonable. You're pathetic trying to misinterpet this so badly.

[HiJiNX]

Nothing can justify that.

If Boston calls and says they’d trade Tatum for Barnes you accept

Ok. I'm going to try one more time. I don't want Tatum for the reason stated. I make the trade to trade tatum to a third team for whatever they offer in your fanstasy land presuming it is better than just Barnes. This isn't hard to understand if you aren't even trying to understand. Smfh.

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

I think you’re overrating Tatum a bit. He’s a great shot maker and a great player but he’s not matchup proof, as we learned in the finals last year.

The only guys I’d consider moving Barnes for are guy who are matchup proof. Why? Because I think Barnes in his prime will be a matchup proof player.

I’ll also be clear—I don’t expect Barnes to turn into some prolific scorer. I think he will be a guy who will score in the flow of the game like he does now, but someone who will also take over the game when needed, a quality he’s already displayed. I also see him as a guy who will dominate a game by impacting every facet of it. He has this thing where he can make the game completely bend around him. That’s an extremely rare quality. He just obviously needs considerable refinement and the benefits that come with experience. But again, he may never score 50 points in an NBA game but I don’t think he’s the kind of player who will need to. Instead, he will be a guy who makes winning plays all over the court and provide timely scoring. The scoring numbers wont wow you but he’s going to fill up every category of the stat sheet—and win.

Anyway, there’s really no point in me defending my position since none of us can predict the future. I’ll either be wrong or I’ll be right. Time will tell. I’m not going to continue to go back and forth on it. Going back and forth on the internet is largely a waste of time and something I don’t often engage in since opinions on the web are rarely swayed by debate. I’ve expressed my position. Disagree if you like. That’s fine. For the sake of this squad, though, I hope I’m correct.

[TorontoBarneys]

Ok. I'm going to try one more time. I don't want Tatum for the reason stated. I make the trade to trade tatum to a third team for whatever they offer in your fanstasy land presuming it is better than just Barnes. This isn't hard to understand if you aren't even trying to understand. Smfh.

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

What's even worse then, if he's that good to you, is watching him walk away in free agency and getting nothing and winning nothing. Reasonable? There's not even an attempt here to be reasonable.

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

[Johnny Bball]

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

What's even worse then, if he's that good to you, is watching him walk away in free agency and getting nothing and winning nothing. Reasonable? There's not even an attempt here to be reasonable.

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

Yet here you are hypocritically constantly complaining that every raptor wants more money and they might leave.

Terrifed? Cuckoldry? You must be having one real rough time to have to project this stuff onto other people and to even think of it.

And Vince Carter didn't leave in free agency, raptors fan.

[Tha Cynic]

What's even worse then, if he's that good to you, is watching him walk away in free agency and getting nothing and winning nothing. Reasonable? There's not even an attempt here to be reasonable.

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

Yet here you are hypocritically constantly complaining that every raptor wants more money and they might leave.

Terrifed? Cuckoldry? You must be having one real rough time to have to project this stuff onto other people and to even think of it.

And Vince Carter didn't leave in free agency, raptors fan.

I get your point. Look no further than what the trades for the championship has now done to this team. They basically sold their soul for it.

Since that time, Leonard walked away and the Raptors had a great second season, before ending up in the lottery and now treadmill status in the next 3 years.

You give up one of your major assets and you better hope you can win a championship or retain that other player.

For what it's worth I think this team is vastly overrated by a faction of this fanbase and they feel one player will put them over the top. Tatum isn't doing that with this team.

[YogurtProducer]

Ok. I'm going to try one more time. I don't want Tatum for the reason stated. I make the trade to trade tatum to a third team for whatever they offer in your fanstasy land presuming it is better than just Barnes. This isn't hard to understand if you aren't even trying to understand. Smfh.

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

I think you’re overrating Tatum a bit. He’s a great shot maker and a great player but he’s not matchup proof, as we learned in the finals last year.

The only guys I’d consider moving Barnes for are guy who are matchup proof. Why? Because I think Barnes in his prime will be a matchup proof player.

I’ll also be clear—I don’t expect Barnes to turn into some prolific scorer. I think he will be a guy who will score in the flow of the game like he does now, but someone who will also take over the game when needed, a quality he’s already displayed. I also see him as a guy who will dominate a game by impacting every facet of it. He has this thing where he can make the game completely bend around him. That’s an extremely rare quality. He just obviously needs considerable refinement and the benefits that come with experience. But again, he may never score 50 points in an NBA game but I don’t think he’s the kind of player who will need to. Instead, he will be a guy who makes winning plays all over the court and provide timely scoring. The scoring numbers wont wow you but he’s going to fill up every category of the stat sheet—and win.

Anyway, there’s really no point in me defending my position since none of us can predict the future. I’ll either be wrong or I’ll be right. Time will tell. I’m not going to continue to go back and forth on it. Going back and forth on the internet is largely a waste of time and something I don’t often engage in since opinions on the web are rarely swayed by debate. I’ve expressed my position. Disagree if you like. That’s fine. For the sake of this squad, though, I hope I’m correct.

Why I hope you are right there is next to evidence that Barnes will be matchup proof if you don't think Tatum is.

Tatum had an underwhelming finals but man, the dude put up 26/6/6 in the finals run and is still only just turned 25. Barnes would have to be making significant leaps in 3 years to even sniff that type of production

[YogurtProducer]

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

Yet here you are hypocritically constantly complaining that every raptor wants more money and they might leave.

Terrifed? Cuckoldry? You must be having one real rough time to have to project this stuff onto other people and to even think of it.

And Vince Carter didn't leave in free agency, raptors fan.

I get your point. Look no further than what the trades for the championship has now done to this team. They basically sold their soul for it.

Since that time, Leonard walked away and the Raptors had a great second season, before ending up in the lottery and now treadmill status in the next 3 years.

You give up one of your major assets and you better hope you can win a championship or retain that other player.

For what it's worth I think this team is vastly overrated by a faction of this fanbase and they feel one player will put them over the top. Tatum isn't doing that with this team.

No, they really didn't. We gave up a total of 1 first round pick, 1 rookie contract player, and 2 starters.

Compare that to Phoenix who gave up like 4 firsts, 4 swaps, and 2 starters or the Lakers or the Nets, etc.

If we gave up our soul like those franchises did we would be in purgatory for a decade

[YogurtProducer]

It isn’t hard to understand, but it’s doesn’t make it any more reasonable.

Not trading for Tatum is equally as insensible as trading him away. He’s arguably the best asset in the league after Doncic and Giannis?

What's even worse then, if he's that good to you, is watching him walk away in free agency and getting nothing and winning nothing. Reasonable? There's not even an attempt here to be reasonable.

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

Nah, it is just pure homer-ism.

[Johnny Bball]

What's even worse then, if he's that good to you, is watching him walk away in free agency and getting nothing and winning nothing. Reasonable? There's not even an attempt here to be reasonable.

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

Nah, it is just pure homer-ism.

What the actual **** is wrong with you.

I'm agreeeing with you that Tatum is the better player and yes you trade Barnes if anyone was so stupid to make this idiotic fantasy trade, which nobody would. There's people that don't agree with that and flat out wouldn't trade Barnes for Tatum. You mostly ignore that.

So ... just because I would build differently and want to ship Tatum out (for what would be a fair return) to a third team instead of keeping Tatum? You lose your mind over it for 6 posts? I have no idea wtf your problem is today, or how that makes me a homer. when I'm literally saying Barnes isn't as good so you trade him, and the Raptors arent good enough to compete yet so you don't keep Tatum. Homerism?

I'm not seeing your posts again. This isn't the first time that we fundamentally agreed and you just were a _____ about it for no reason. What the ****.

[tripa]

Now I finally get the psychology behind the Siakam and FVV stanning. These posters are terrified of anyone better being here because they are still feeling the psychological impact of the emotional cuckoldry that was Vince leaving.

Nah, it is just pure homer-ism.

What the actual **** is wrong with you.

I'm agreeeing with you that Tatum is the better player and yes you trade Barnes if anyone was so stupid to make this idiotic fantasy trade, which nobody would. There's people that don't agree with that and flat out wouldn't trade Barnes for Tatum. You mostly ignore that.

So ... just because I would build differently and want to ship Tatum out (for what would be a fair return) to a third team instead of keeping Tatum? You lose your mind over it for 6 posts? I have no idea wtf your problem is today, or how that makes me a homer. when I'm literally saying Barnes isn't as good so you trade him, and the Raptors arent good enough to compete yet so you don't keep Tatum. Homerism?

I'm not seeing your posts again. This isn't the first time that we fundamentally agreed and you just were a _____ about it for no reason. What the ****.

Youre always pulling a temper tantrum when people disagree with you.

Its a message board used for debate, time to grow thicker skin. Its been 8 years now.

[dTox]

You guys are fighting over a hypothetical Tatum trade scenario

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

[WuTang_CMB]

I think we got ahead of ourselves with Scottie this year. Expectations through the roof (myself included) but all in all, I thought after a tough november, he bounced back and has had a good 2nd year. Teams adjusted on him but i love the scoring inside and the defense has improved.

This off-season will be a big summer for him. He needs to continue his midrange game. That will open up his drive a lot more.

Read on Twitter