Re: 2023 Draft Prospect discussion Part II

WuTang_CMB · Post #1681 » by **WuTang_CMB** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:00 pm

GG Jackson needs to mature. Needs polish mentally and in his game. Kid should stay in school and come back in a soft draft year next yr.

WuTang_CMB · Post #1682 » by **WuTang_CMB** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:02 pm

God Squad wrote:
Rapsfan07 wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Not for long. KOC already has him 10th. The talent and floor is already there and media are seeing it and adjusting. GM’s already going to love his 3 and D skillset at that height with upside to possibly do more. No chance he falls out lottery imo.

Who is KOC?

Kevin O'Connor. TBH he's not a good analyst and "the ringer" in general is hit or miss.

Sam V is the best right now but KOC has always been good NBA wise. Last year was the first yr for draftringer and it's done well for the most part.

God Squad · Post #1683 » by **God Squad** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:14 pm

So it's looking like Hendricks (IMO) will be out of reach, and likely same with Wallace (maybe). It sucks because those were the two I liked most and they likely played themselves out of reach. So which prospects would be the most likely to fall?

Probably
NSJ - Hasn't been good all year, living off HS rep. Struggling against increased size/speed
Black - Offense is rough, very bad for a guard. But defense and IQ has been elite.

Currently tankathon has us taking Brice Sensabaugh. While I love his offensive repertoire, I hate his defence and playmaking. Do we have the roster that could potentially hide his deficiencies(playmaking/defense), and utilize his offensive traits? TBH I'm just trying to be more open to other prospects as it's likely the two I liked will be out of range.

Rapsfan07 · Post #1684 » by **Rapsfan07** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:25 pm

God Squad wrote:
Rapsfan07 wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Not for long. KOC already has him 10th. The talent and floor is already there and media are seeing it and adjusting. GM’s already going to love his 3 and D skillset at that height with upside to possibly do more. No chance he falls out lottery imo.

Who is KOC?

Kevin O'Connor. TBH he's not a good analyst and "the ringer" in general is hit or miss.

Ah, thanks.

God Squad · Post #1685 » by **God Squad** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:25 pm

WuTang_OG wrote:
God Squad wrote:
Rapsfan07 wrote:
Who is KOC?

Kevin O'Connor. TBH he's not a good analyst and "the ringer" in general is hit or miss.

Sam V is the best right now but KOC has always been good NBA wise. Last year was the first yr for draftringer and it's done well for the most part.

The site looks good. But their takes/comps I could do without. TBH I'm not a fan of most of the general "draft media". Youtube is ripe with some good draft content. You just have to find the right channel. But I treat the ringer like I do tankathon. I take a look and see where guys are mocked, but never take their opinion too seriously.

I do like Sam more than KOC (mid) and Chris Vernon (awful)

ATLTimekeeper · Post #1686 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:26 pm

Looks to me like the NCAA prospects are super thin this year and it might be the time that Masai finally goes overseas or Gleague to draft someone. Wouldn't shock me if a bunch of these flimsy one and doners defer to next draft because it's so weak and more upper classmen rise towards the draft.

Rapsfan07 · Post #1687 » by **Rapsfan07** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:27 pm

God Squad wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
God Squad wrote:Kevin O'Connor. TBH he's not a good analyst and "the ringer" in general is hit or miss.

Sam V is the best right now but KOC has always been good NBA wise. Last year was the first yr for draftringer and it's done well for the most part.

The site looks good. But their takes/comps I could do without. TBH I'm not a fan of most of the general "draft media". Youtube is ripe with some good draft content. You just have to find the right channel. But I treat the ringer like I do tankathon. I take a look and see where guys are mocked, but never take their opinion too seriously.

I do like Sam more than KOC (mid) and Chris Vernon (awful)

I take a look at the more common draft media but I too have found that the content on YouTube is a lot more in depth and more accurate.

Rapsfan07 · Post #1688 » by **Rapsfan07** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:32 pm

God Squad wrote:So it's looking like Hendricks (IMO) will be out of reach, and likely same with Wallace (maybe). It sucks because those were the two I liked most and they likely played themselves out of reach. So which prospects would be the most likely to fall?

Probably
NSJ - Hasn't been good all year, living off HS rep. Struggling against increased size/speed
Black - Offense is rough, very bad for a guard. But defense and IQ has been elite.

Currently tankathon has us taking Brice Sensabaugh. While I love his offensive repertoire, I hate his defence and playmaking. Do we have the roster that could potentially hide his deficiencies(playmaking/defense), and utilize his offensive traits? TBH I'm just trying to be more open to other prospects as it's likely the two I liked will be out of range.

I'm a lot less worried about who they have us taking than I am about where in the draft they have us. Tankathon is good for that because it's updated regularly with wins and losses, adjusting the team's draft position as the season goes on.

#12 is....okay but not good enough if we're serious about Wallace or Hendricks. This is mostly because I think Nick Smith, Keyonte George and Brice Sensabaugh will not be taken that high. I do think Tankathon is accurate from picks 1-7 but I could see Black, Hendricks and Wallace rounding out the Top 10, leaving us to pick from Dick, Sensabaugh, George & Smith.

HumbleRen · Post #1689 » by **HumbleRen** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:35 pm

KOC’s template for his mocks are beautiful and very pleasing to the eye. This actual analysis though ? Pretty terrible lol. He admits it on his podcast that he didn’t really do any thorough research on these prospects until like March. Any articles before that is just more so laymen levels of analysis.

The best people to listen to about the draft are generally on YouTube.

Adam Spinella, Hoop Intellect, Sam Vecenie, etc etc of the worlds.

Syd-TK3 · Post #1690 » by **Syd-TK3** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:37 pm

Brice looks like the type of guy who's great in college but can't do half the stuff in the league.
I have no actually facts behind this just the vibes I get

God Squad · Post #1691 » by **God Squad** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:40 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:Looks to me like the NCAA prospects are super thin this year and it might be the time that Masai finally goes overseas or Gleague to draft someone. Wouldn't shock me if a bunch of these flimsy one and doners defer to next draft because it's so weak and more upper classmen rise towards the draft.

Yeah, it's not a great class IMO. There's not much separating picks 4-14 and they all have warts. IMO it's going to take a lot of projecting, meaning can the Raptors fix or hide their deficiencies and turn them into quality players. Who's deficiencies are easier to workout or fix?

IMO The Raptors have a track record of believing shooting and handle can be fixed or worked on. But defense is something they seem to pride, and make sure their prospects put maximum effort into.

I don't think they even look at NSJ or Keyonte, although KG tries more than NS. I'm guessing their board looks something like (in no order)

Cason Wallace
Taylor Hendricks
Ant Black
Dick
Rayan Rupert

WuTang_CMB · Post #1692 » by **WuTang_CMB** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:45 pm

God Squad wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
God Squad wrote:Kevin O'Connor. TBH he's not a good analyst and "the ringer" in general is hit or miss.

Sam V is the best right now but KOC has always been good NBA wise. Last year was the first yr for draftringer and it's done well for the most part.

The site looks good. But their takes/comps I could do without. TBH I'm not a fan of most of the general "draft media". Youtube is ripe with some good draft content. You just have to find the right channel. But I treat the ringer like I do tankathon. I take a look and see where guys are mocked, but never take their opinion too seriously.

I do like Sam more than KOC (mid) and Chris Vernon (awful)

The athletic with Sam is tops right now. His detail is crazy, especially on his annual draft guide of 1000 pages. Coach spins does a good job. The podcasts when both of them go head to head are insightful. KOC is above the rest of the media guys but below Sam/Spins.

Rapsfan07 · Post #1693 » by **Rapsfan07** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:48 pm

HumbleRen wrote:KOC’s template for his mocks are beautiful and very pleasing to the eye. This actual analysis though ? Pretty terrible lol. He admits it on his podcast that he didn’t really do any thorough research on these prospects until like March. Any articles before that is just more so laymen levels of analysis.

The best people to listen to about the draft are generally on YouTube.

Adam Spinella, Hoop Intellect, Sam Vecenie, etc etc of the worlds.

These are my go to's. I like Adam Spinella and Hoop Intellect a lot.

WuTang_CMB · Post #1694 » by **WuTang_CMB** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:50 pm

Watch on YouTube

ATLTimekeeper · Post #1695 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:51 pm

The Raptors just won't draft a player that doesn't defend. Can't see it.

DBPMs > 2.5 for pretty much every Masai pick and current Raptor. This is like the litmus test of competitiveness. Anyone that gets buckets is going to have to have at least that marker or some serious injury excuse.

OakleyDokely · Post #1696 » by **OakleyDokely** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:18 pm

Riley Kugel as a starter this year (17 games):

29.6 MIN, 13.4 PPG, 3.2 REB, 1.4 AST, 1.0 STL, .463 FG, .364 3PT, .635 FT, .557 TS

Last 10 games:

32.0 MIN, 17.3 PPG, 3.7 REB, 1.3 AST, 0.8 STL, .496 FG, .396 3PT, .667 FT, .589 TS

BoyzNTheHood · Post #1697 » by **BoyzNTheHood** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:23 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:The Raptors just won't draft a player that doesn't defend. Can't see it.

DBPMs > 2.5 for pretty much every Masai pick and current Raptor. This is like the litmus test of competitiveness. Anyone that gets buckets is going to have to have at least that marker or some serious injury excuse.

I don’t think a DBPM of 2.5 is much to ask either. Guys like Dick, Hendricks, Wallace, Filipowski, Lively, Podz, and Sasser are all around that.

And then if you filter it further to include only BPM’s at 8 or higher you’re down to Lively, Sasser, and Podz.

alpngso · Post #1698 » by **alpngso** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:33 pm

Read on Twitter

I thought Jalen Suggs was the next Jrue?

Jrue Holiday (Pac12, 6’3”)
BPM 6.7
TS 53.1
3Pt% 30.7
FT% 72.6
Ast% 23.8
TO% 23.4
Stl% 3.5
Blk% 2.1

Cason Wallace (SEC, 6’4”)
BPM 7.0
TS 54.3
3Pt% 34.6
FT% 75.6
Ast% 24.4
TO% 19.3
Stl% 3.7
Blk% 1.6

Yallbecrazy · Post #1699 » by **Yallbecrazy** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:35 pm

WuTang_OG wrote:GG Jackson needs to mature. Needs polish mentally and in his game. Kid should stay in school and come back in a soft draft year next yr.

It would be best for NBA teams for him to stay in school as well as him reaching his potential, but if he can con a team into drafting him in the top 20 then he should absolutely declare right now as another year of film and he could become an undrafted player hurting himself financially.

Rapsfan07 · Post #1700 » by **Rapsfan07** » Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:42 pm

Ideally, I would like to move OG for some picks.

Indiana has 7, 25 and 29 and Utah has 14, 16 & 28. Either one of those would be good targets as our payroll will be going up significantly in the coming year. This offseason we have to pay FVV, Trent and Poeltl. Next offseason we have to pay OG and Siakam and the year after that we have to pay Scottie.... and that's just to maintain the current roster, not to get better.

If the FO does decide to continue to build around this core (which I would not recommend), we will need to start prioritizing cheap, quality labour.

Another option I'd consider, for the first time this year, is to move down in the draft. There are some interesting prospects in the later part of the first round. Brooklyn has 21 & 22 for example.