Official Trade Thread Part XLV

[nate33]

Poole had an ok year last year, but he's not even close to good this year.

"But look how many points he scores."
Riiight....

He strengthens the tank. Ensures we aren't competing for anything next year and maybe it finally forces Beal to ask out.

We could also just let KP sign elsewhere if he opts out to accomplish the same goal and save ourselves from paying Poole.

Porzingis for Poole is beyond awful. Poole is a massively negative contract. Porzingis is a top 25-ish player by all the metrics.

[payitforward]

nate & I differ in our assessment of Porzingis, but he doesn't have to be top 25 to be better than Jordan Poole -- top 250 suffices for that!

[Kanyewest]

Jaylen Brown non-committal to staying with the Celtics

“I don’t know. As long as I’m needed. It’s not up to me,” he says. “We’ll see how they feel about me over time and I feel about them over time. Hopefully, whatever it is, it makes sense. But I will stay where I’m wanted. I will stay where I’m needed and treated correct.”

When asked how long he wants to play with Tatum, Brown keeps his focus on the immediate future.

“I just enjoy the time that you have now,” he says. “If it’s your whole career, it’s your whole career. If it’s not, it’s not. Some of the greatest players of all time haven’t finished with their organization. Michael Jordan retired a Wizard. As much as we like it here and enjoy being here, you see where life takes you. You see how the process goes. All you do is really focus on what’s in front of you right now, to be honest. But I don’t really know or want to answer that question because that type of stuff makes Celtics fans speculate and go crazy. Especially right now, I’ll just say we’ll get there when we get there.”

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2023/3/21/23639331/jaylen-brown-nba-boston-celtics

[gambitx777]

Poole had an ok year last year, but he's not even close to good this year.

"But look how many points he scores."
Riiight....

He strengthens the tank. Ensures we aren't competing for anything next year and maybe it finally forces Beal to ask out.

We could also just let KP sign elsewhere if he opts out to accomplish the same goal and save ourselves from paying Poole.

Porzingis for Poole is beyond awful. Poole is a massively negative contract. Porzingis is a top 25-ish player by all the metrics.

He's definitely a top 25 big man right now

Sent from my SM-G991U1 using RealGM mobile app

[GoneShammGone]

Jaylen Brown non-committal to staying with the Celtics

“I don’t know. As long as I’m needed. It’s not up to me,” he says. “We’ll see how they feel about me over time and I feel about them over time. Hopefully, whatever it is, it makes sense. But I will stay where I’m wanted. I will stay where I’m needed and treated correct.”

When asked how long he wants to play with Tatum, Brown keeps his focus on the immediate future.

“I just enjoy the time that you have now,” he says. “If it’s your whole career, it’s your whole career. If it’s not, it’s not. Some of the greatest players of all time haven’t finished with their organization. Michael Jordan retired a Wizard. As much as we like it here and enjoy being here, you see where life takes you. You see how the process goes. All you do is really focus on what’s in front of you right now, to be honest. But I don’t really know or want to answer that question because that type of stuff makes Celtics fans speculate and go crazy. Especially right now, I’ll just say we’ll get there when we get there.”

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2023/3/21/23639331/jaylen-brown-nba-boston-celtics

Could the Celtics possibly be stupid enough to trade us Jaylen Brown for Beal? I can't really imagine that Brad Stevens could be that dumb. But on the other hand, if Tatum and Beal conspire to force his hand...

[NatP4]

Not really that stupid. Beal could be the final piece for a team like the Celtics. Brown isn’t even good. It would just be long term salary relief for us.

[DCZards]

Jaylen Brown is one of the best two-way players in the NBA.

[dckingsfan]

1. Todd - waisting a roster spot b/c of contract guarantees. Clearly not an NBA player.
2. Davis - was a replacement level G-league player to about a week ago
3. Huff - Carey was a waste of a roster spot that was thankfully released... only to sign this Laker reject
4. Bouyea - G-Leaguer
5. Cooks - career overseas guy. Wild he got a 4 yr deal.
6. Jackson - toolsy looking FA rookie but he's 24.
7. Nunn - corpse acquired in Hachimura deal
8. Gill - nice guy I guess. Fringe player
9. Gibson - Likely on his last deal unless Shepp wants to keep him another season
10. Goodwin - Delon clone who is unremarkable offensively but tries hard.
11. Avdija - regressed defensively, not progressed at all offensively. A significantly negative player atm.
12. Kispert - developing into a solid 8th man lol. Too low volume a shooter to really impact an offense like he should and a constant target on D. Solidly negative but shooting provides some value.

I just went through 12 guys. An NBA roster is 15 and two two-way players. The first 9 guys on the list shouldn't be playing for any NBA team but here we are. The next 3 are all solidly negative players. I suppose KP is supposed to make all these guys better?

Other than that Ms. Lincoln, how was the play?

[payitforward]

...Everybody was absolutely certain that our trade of Dinwiddie/Davis for KP was incredibly positive, almost transformative. That it made us a far better team.

No one saw KP as transformative. But we all recognized a talented player who was significantly better than the guys he replaced...

Yeah that's fair enough. I was guilty of overstatement.

...(except you, you apparently saw little different b/w Bertans & KP since both are 7-0 and dont rebound to your liking).

?
I thought it was a great trade! Unbelievably good! & I said so at the time.
& KP is a good rebounder, btw.

Given that I was openly/repeatedly critical of giving Bertans his contfact, I'm not sure what your point is.... I don't recall what your view was on our re-signing Davis for 5 years/$80m.

I thought he'd be impossible to trade. & it was obvious that Dinwiddie had to go. Plus, we got a R2 pick in the deal. Incredible!

...KP is a big reason why we even have 32 wins. You can say its not any better than last year but I'd counter that the supporting cast is horrific and probably the worst of Shepp's tenure.
(list of bums)

True tho -- what a sad rogue's gallery that "supporting cast" (i.e. our roster) has been -- for years now! If you go back to '19-20 & have a look, I'm not sure it's worse this year. & our record was worse that year as well.

Not sure whom you think you're arguing with, Dat. You could lighten up your tone a bit. You'd think I wanted to put KP on trial, send him to the guillotine! Why don't you look at the tone of my responses to your posts?

Not to mention that you left out the biggest problem on our roster, the single biggest reason for our terrible record. But, I'm not interested in stimulating more attacks out of you.

[NatP4]

Left out:

Kuzma: net negative player receiving Kevin Durant usage.

Beal: making 33% of the salary cap to be a slightly above average starter.

[payitforward]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/270884/Knicks-Have-Potential-To-Make-Separate-Trades-For-Two-Star-Level-Players

Maybe they'd like Bradley Beal...??

[penbeast0]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/270884/Knicks-Have-Potential-To-Make-Separate-Trades-For-Two-Star-Level-Players

Maybe they'd like Bradley Beal...??

Assuming we are still in win now mode, what does NY have to offer that would improve us? That's why Dallas took the Kyrie risk, why we might take the Jaylen Brown risk. We are offering a win now talent for win now talent and to upgrade talent in that way you have to take on significant risk.

If we tearing down, then sure, Beal for RJ Barret and a few weak firsts while letting Kuzma and maybe Porzingis go as well. Deal Morris, Wright and possibly Gafford and go with the Go-Gos and our 1sts plus whatever toxic contracts they are willing to pay us to take. Be really really bad for 3 years or more, get one or even two stars (like Detroit), and pray they are the real deal and willing to stay in Washington.

[nate33]

Jaylen Brown non-committal to staying with the Celtics

“I don’t know. As long as I’m needed. It’s not up to me,” he says. “We’ll see how they feel about me over time and I feel about them over time. Hopefully, whatever it is, it makes sense. But I will stay where I’m wanted. I will stay where I’m needed and treated correct.”

When asked how long he wants to play with Tatum, Brown keeps his focus on the immediate future.

“I just enjoy the time that you have now,” he says. “If it’s your whole career, it’s your whole career. If it’s not, it’s not. Some of the greatest players of all time haven’t finished with their organization. Michael Jordan retired a Wizard. As much as we like it here and enjoy being here, you see where life takes you. You see how the process goes. All you do is really focus on what’s in front of you right now, to be honest. But I don’t really know or want to answer that question because that type of stuff makes Celtics fans speculate and go crazy. Especially right now, I’ll just say we’ll get there when we get there.”

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2023/3/21/23639331/jaylen-brown-nba-boston-celtics

Could the Celtics possibly be stupid enough to trade us Jaylen Brown for Beal? I can't really imagine that Brad Stevens could be that dumb. But on the other hand, if Tatum and Beal conspire to force his hand...

One thing worth mentioning: the Wizards could theoretically trade their 2023 pick on Draft Day in a manner that doesn't violate the Stepien Rule. They would draft the player for Boston, and then trade his rights to Boston. They would never be in position of having two consecutive future first round picks encumbered and therefore not be in violation of the Stepien Rule.

I bring that up because I don't think Boston would make a Brown for Beal trade straight up, but they might trade Jaylen Brown for Beal plus our #8 overall pick.

A better scenario would be to trade Beal plus our next unencumbered FRP (2027 or 2028) for Brown.

[Frichuela]

Jaylen Brown non-committal to staying with the Celtics



https://www.theringer.com/nba/2023/3/21/23639331/jaylen-brown-nba-boston-celtics

Could the Celtics possibly be stupid enough to trade us Jaylen Brown for Beal? I can't really imagine that Brad Stevens could be that dumb. But on the other hand, if Tatum and Beal conspire to force his hand...

One thing worth mentioning: the Wizards could theoretically trade their 2023 pick on Draft Day in a manner that doesn't violate the Stepien Rule. They would draft the player for Boston, and then trade his rights to Boston. They would never be in position of having two consecutive future first round picks encumbered and therefore not be in violation of the Stepien Rule.

I bring that up because I don't think Boston would make a Brown for Beal trade straight up, but they might trade Jaylen Brown for Beal plus our #8 overall pick.

A better scenario would be to trade Beal plus our next unencumbered FRP (2027 or 2028) for Brown.

I sincerely hope we don’t trade more future draft picks for the pleasure of renting someone like Jaylen Brown for a year- with the significant risk that he may walk out thereafter.

If we trade Beal it should be to restart again from the bottom-up, acquiring as much draft capital as possible.

Having said this, I can see Turd may be enough of a fool to contemplate trading future draft picks for someone like Jalen Brown…to keep “competing” for the elusive first round of the playoffs..

A preferred option is the rumored Heat trade for Beal on which we get a couple of 1st rounders (+maybe a swap), Herro and the corpse of Lowry..

[GoneShammGone]

Could the Celtics possibly be stupid enough to trade us Jaylen Brown for Beal? I can't really imagine that Brad Stevens could be that dumb. But on the other hand, if Tatum and Beal conspire to force his hand...

One thing worth mentioning: the Wizards could theoretically trade their 2023 pick on Draft Day in a manner that doesn't violate the Stepien Rule. They would draft the player for Boston, and then trade his rights to Boston. They would never be in position of having two consecutive future first round picks encumbered and therefore not be in violation of the Stepien Rule.

I bring that up because I don't think Boston would make a Brown for Beal trade straight up, but they might trade Jaylen Brown for Beal plus our #8 overall pick.

A better scenario would be to trade Beal plus our next unencumbered FRP (2027 or 2028) for Brown.

I sincerely hope we don’t trade more future draft picks for the pleasure of renting someone like Jaylen Brown for a year- with the significant risk that he may walk out thereafter.

If we trade Beal it should be to restart again from the bottom-up, acquiring as much draft capital as possible.

Having said this, I can see Turd may be enough of a fool to contemplate trading future draft picks for someone like Jalen Brown…to keep “competing” for the elusive first round of the playoffs..

A preferred option is the rumored Heat trade for Beal on which we get a couple of 1st rounders (+maybe a swap), Herro and the corpse of Lowry..

Oh I agree there are more attractive options out there than Jaylen Brown.... unfortunately, our genius GM gave over all his decision making power to Brad via the no-trade clause, so the first question you have to answer in any possible deal is: what's in it for Brad? For Boston, the relationship with Tatum gives a clear answer. Not so sure if Brad would be interested in Miami....

[Frichuela]

One thing worth mentioning: the Wizards could theoretically trade their 2023 pick on Draft Day in a manner that doesn't violate the Stepien Rule. They would draft the player for Boston, and then trade his rights to Boston. They would never be in position of having two consecutive future first round picks encumbered and therefore not be in violation of the Stepien Rule.

I bring that up because I don't think Boston would make a Brown for Beal trade straight up, but they might trade Jaylen Brown for Beal plus our #8 overall pick.

A better scenario would be to trade Beal plus our next unencumbered FRP (2027 or 2028) for Brown.

I sincerely hope we don’t trade more future draft picks for the pleasure of renting someone like Jaylen Brown for a year- with the significant risk that he may walk out thereafter.

If we trade Beal it should be to restart again from the bottom-up, acquiring as much draft capital as possible.

Having said this, I can see Turd may be enough of a fool to contemplate trading future draft picks for someone like Jalen Brown…to keep “competing” for the elusive first round of the playoffs..

A preferred option is the rumored Heat trade for Beal on which we get a couple of 1st rounders (+maybe a swap), Herro and the corpse of Lowry..

Oh I agree there are more attractive options out there than Jaylen Brown.... unfortunately, our genius GM gave over all his decision making power to Brad via the no-trade clause, so the first question you have to answer in any possible deal is: what's in it for Brad? For Boston, the relationship with Tatum gives a clear answer. Not so sure if Brad would be interested in Miami....

Yep. Can’t disagree. Brad has a historical relationship with Florida but he may prioritize playing with his St Louis pal in Boston. As you say, he has all the power given the idiotic NTC he was anointed with…

…and at the same time Turd may be overly excited at the prospect of “competing” with Brown for a year..even at the risk he may walk thereafter…Even more, Brown is likely to be offered another NTC in a desperate attempt to resign him, for the max possible of course…

In other words, let’s hope and pray that Brad Stevens saves the day and refuses the trade…

And for full disclosure: I really like Brown as a player, and think he may have another gear up in his production. He is MUCH better than Beal, no contest.

[payitforward]

I suppose anything that rids us of Brad's horrible contract is a sensible move, but I would rather take back young players & picks in such a trade -- i.e. not Jaylen Brown.

Worse yet, of course, would be to give up a pick in a Beal trade.

What good would Jaylen Brown do us? With Brad out & Brown in, would we become a contender in the EC? Obviously not. & giving up future picks would delay the process of reaching that goal.

Academic, I suppose, since I can't imagine any team in the league wanting to take on a 30-year old declining player with $208m guaranteed over the next 4 years. To put it another way, we are not going to get anything whatever back for Bradley Beal. That's not about him; it's about his contract.

We are headed straight for a series of years with 20-something wins, & nothing can prevent it. Literally nothing short of a miracle, I mean -- i.e. 3 or 4 stud-level draft picks over the next few years.

[FAH1223]

It's rare, extremely rare, for a trade (of players for players -- not picks) to make you better.

Everybody was absolutely certain that our trade of Dinwiddie/Davis for KP was incredibly positive, almost transformative. That it made us a far better team.

After 71 games last year our record was 30-41. This year it's 32-39.

Sadly, there is no path for this team to improve in the next few years. We'd have to luck into drafting an instant superstar in R1 this year & an instant outstanding starter in R2 this year. Then do almost as well in the '24 draft.

Why play this tired game if building false narratives? Whats the end goal here? Another lame I told you so? No one saw KP as transformative. But we all recognized a talented player who was significantly better than the guys he replaced (except you, you apparently saw little different b/w Bertans & KP since both are 7-0 and dont rebound to your liking).

KP has been the best player on the Wizards roster this season (despite Beal having a solid bounce back year). KP is a big reason why we even have 32 wins. You can say its not any better than last year but I'd counter that the supporting cast is horrific and probably the worst of Shepp's tenure.

1. Todd - waisting a roster spot b/c of contract guarantees. Clearly not an NBA player.
2. Davis - was a replacement level G-league player to about a week ago
3. Huff - Carey was a waste of a roster spot that was thankfully released... only to sign this Laker reject
4. Bouyea - G-Leaguer
5. Cooks - career overseas guy. Wild he got a 4 yr deal.
6. Jackson - toolsy looking FA rookie but he's 24.
7. Nunn - corpse acquired in Hachimura deal
8. Gill - nice guy I guess. Fringe player
9. Gibson - Likely on his last deal unless Shepp wants to keep him another season
10. Goodwin - Delon clone who is unremarkable offensively but tries hard.
11. Avdija - regressed defensively, not progressed at all offensively. A significantly negative player atm.
12. Kispert - developing into a solid 8th man lol. Too low volume a shooter to really impact an offense like he should and a constant target on D. Solidly negative but shooting provides some value.

I just went through 12 guys. An NBA roster is 15 and two two-way players. The first 9 guys on the list shouldn't be playing for any NBA team but here we are. The next 3 are all solidly negative players. I suppose KP is supposed to make all these guys better?

Wizards Twitter meanwhile is stuck upon Wes Unseld Jr. being the worst coach in history.

[payitforward]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/270884/Knicks-Have-Potential-To-Make-Separate-Trades-For-Two-Star-Level-Players

Maybe they'd like Bradley Beal...??

Assuming we are still in win now mode, what does NY have to offer that would improve us?...

I don't think we are in "win now" mode. I think we are in "who cares about winning" mode. Or maybe that's "lose now, so what?" mode. This team has never prioritized winning.

As to what we'd get to improve our team, that's simple: picks & young players. Whatever combination; it doesn't matter. However little -- that doesn't matter either. We are moving a problem (Brad's contract -- not Brad). You don't get a solution in return for a problem.

...That's why Dallas took the Kyrie risk, why we might take the Jaylen Brown risk. We are offering a win now talent for win now talent and to upgrade talent in that way you have to take on significant risk....

What's the risk? That he would walk next year? That would be wonderful! We need to rebuild from the bottom up. It'll take a while. Jaylen Brown does us no more present-tense good than Brad does.

If we tearing down, then sure, Beal for RJ Barrett and a few weak firsts...

I have no interest in Barrett but better his contract than Brad's, & maybe there could be a 3d team in the deal to increase the number of picks we get.

There are no "weak firsts." Or weak seconds either, for that matter -- there are just guys who work out & guys who don't. Both kinds come from all over the draft.

...Be really really bad for 3 years or more, get one or even two stars (like Detroit), and pray they are the real deal and willing to stay in Washington.

We are already really really bad, & we will be getting worse; it seems inevitable. At least if we face reality & begin a genuine rebuild, at least we have some chance of some day being better.

[Frichuela]

On the role player side, here is one possible piece to trade for that will help this sorry franchise start to turn the corner…

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