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Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM

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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#61 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:35 am

NickP wrote:
Dynamix wrote:
esqtvd wrote:Zu is in with 4 minutes left and a 20-point lead.

This is the FYu moment I was talking about, if you remember your Billy Beane Moneyball.

I wrote about it awhile back when I recommended buying out Marcus. ;-) Some folks forget.


Should've mentioned it more often, like with his +/-, so people would remember.

Exactly.



Our attentive readers do remember. :wink:

The rest are troll vulture garbage.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#62 » by Dynamix » Tue Mar 28, 2023 6:18 am

Buying out a starter and coach favorite with two years left would've been a pretty wild move. I'll always wonder how close we came (if at all) to trading him over these past few years.

If we're being honest, not too long ago Mook looked decent enough to at least still be part of the rotation. It's just that he fell off suddenly, and with Kawhi/PG missing their fair share of games, our record being what it is, plus time running out, we couldn't afford to roll the dice anymore on him bouncing back. Shame it took this long, but better late than never, I guess.

On a more positive note, Bones has been an absolute revelation with his playmaking. Was expecting him to just chuck like crazy, especially after a few weeks off. Definitely seems more comfortable in that role than T-Mann, but then there's the defense/physical aspect, which is much less favorable.

We really needed this from the kid after PG went down. Curious about the potential fit with Norm, since they're similar in several ways. And I'd bet a lot of Denver fans wouldn't mind having him back right now.

Speaking of which, although Luke has been killing it with Memphis lately, still think Gordon was a very solid pickup, who belongs in the playoff rotation, such as it is at the moment without our second best player.

Please stay healthy, Kawhi!
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Re: Starting Tease? 

Post#63 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 6:20 am

Wammy Giveaway wrote:
Read on Twitter


So yeah, Tyronn Lue is finally going to give Covington burn, as every Clipper fan on here, Twitter and in the arena demanded.

But remember, it's too late. Clippers have 36 losses, effectively eliminating them from a title shot. They needed to be between 10 and 35 regular season losses because previous NBA championship teams did so. They are guaranteed to lose in the playoffs should they qualify, but that doesn't mean they can't play spoiler either.



Yeah, well thanks for nothing, Mr. Narrative. AS IF Ty could have benched Morris and won 50 games with KL and PG injured, limping, or resting.

And THREE new starters as of tonight. And the 6th man Powell MIA since the All-Star break.

I don't get you people. "Fans" my ass. We WON.


Mercy. This is supposed to be fun. :D
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#64 » by Scoundreldays » Tue Mar 28, 2023 6:24 am

Morris did great for us the last 3 seasons especially in 2021. Unfortunately I think taking a larger role last season with Kawhi and PG hurt may have taken its toll on his body. Sad but it happens.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#65 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 6:49 am

Dynamix wrote:Buying out a starter and coach favorite with two years left would've been a pretty wild move. I'll always wonder how close we came (if at all) to trading him over these past few years.

If we're being honest, not too long ago Mook looked decent enough to at least still be part of the rotation. It's just that he fell off suddenly, and with Kawhi/PG missing their fair share of games, our record being what it is, plus time running out, we couldn't afford to roll the dice anymore on him bouncing back. Shame it took this long, but better late than never, I guess.



Exactly. Nothing the attentive reader of our board doesn't know. Dumping the semi-useless Marcus contract would have COST us a draft pick. His trade value was NEGATIVE.

We were/are on the hook for MORRIS @ $16M a year [and one more to go.] All of Clipper Nation has been d-bagging him since godknowswhen. Even at his best, he's been meh.

But who can take his place? Batum is 84 years old and just mostly rested for the last 2 weeks. Yes, he killed tonight. And then RoCo was crap in his big audition with Marcus gone

11 minutes, ZERO points, 2 rebs 1 asst 1 TO
minus-9

oops
almost like a Marcus Morris performance :o
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#66 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 7:30 am

Scoundreldays wrote:Morris did great for us the last 3 seasons especially in 2021. Unfortunately I think taking a larger role last season with Kawhi and PG hurt may have taken its toll on his body. Sad but it happens.



FTR--and I forget who noted it--MM's shooting % has sunk month after month all year, and shooting is all he brings, except intangibles like knowing the defensive rotations and boxing out.

Morris played big minutes as Batum was struggling and also playing at the small-ball 5 instead of disastrous G-Leaguers Diabate and Moses. He did a great job. Well, actually, adequate. He didn't exactly earn his $16M but he didn't steal it either.

Let's not spit on his grave. Do I ever want to see Marcus Morris again? Wrong question. He got us this far, especially working Westbrook in.

So FTR: I hope Marcus Morris never suits up again in a Clipper uni because he won't ever be needed again. :wink:
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#67 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 11:19 am

Uh oh lol

Read on Twitter




Never mind
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#68 » by The High Cyde » Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:58 pm

That look was seething with venom lmao
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#69 » by playaloc916 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:13 pm

esqtvd wrote:Uh oh lol

Read on Twitter




Never mind

This looked pretty awkward when asked about RoCo being the backup. It's like the elephant in the room. The power of the internet calling for Lue and Morris' heads has probably reached Lue, and the FO (all the memes and trending posts/tweets, especially the "janky" drawing guy :lol: ), so it must be a very touchy subject.

Lue probably doesn't want to admit he overplayed Morris, and also doesn't want to completely give in to the internet mob, thus not confirming RoCo is the backup.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#70 » by playaloc916 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:20 pm

Scoundreldays wrote:Morris did great for us the last 3 seasons especially in 2021. Unfortunately I think taking a larger role last season with Kawhi and PG hurt may have taken its toll on his body. Sad but it happens.

Similar to what happened with Reggie. He was great as a complementary piece, but once he was forced to play starter minutes for an extended period of time, his play really suffered. But I would say the fall off for Morris was worse than Reggie's. At least Reggie still did things expected of a point guard. Morris has just been sort of "there" in the lineup. Almost like a Ryan Gomes lol.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#71 » by playaloc916 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:29 pm

The High Cyde wrote:That leak probably came from the front office, implying that they’ve thrown their weight at Lue to make it happen. You don’t go from starting then suddenly going to 0 mins by the coach alone.

So this is a very interesting point. One camp thinks that the FO stepped in and forced Lue to make the change. Another camp thinks Lue gives players an extended amount of time to play themselves out of a slump, and that Morris' time was basically up and he didn't show Lue enough, this the demotion.

I'm personally leaning towards FO stepping in. We all know Lue loves playing a million different lineups, yet the one constant was Morris. He could've easily moved Morris to the bench earlier as a part of his tweaking lineups, but he never did.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#72 » by madmaxmedia » Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:29 pm

playaloc916 wrote:
Scoundreldays wrote:Morris did great for us the last 3 seasons especially in 2021. Unfortunately I think taking a larger role last season with Kawhi and PG hurt may have taken its toll on his body. Sad but it happens.

Similar to what happened with Reggie. He was great as a complementary piece, but once he was forced to play starter minutes for an extended period of time, his play really suffered. But I would say the fall off for Morris was worse than Reggie's. At least Reggie still did things expected of a point guard. Morris has just been sort of "there" in the lineup. Almost like a Ryan Gomes lol.


Reggie and Mook carried a Kawhi/Norm/PG-less team (PG 31 games) to 42-40 record last season, but they're pretty much spent now. Even with Kawhi and PG back we are essentially at same W-L pace as last season.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#73 » by clipperlover » Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:51 pm

madmaxmedia wrote:
playaloc916 wrote:
Scoundreldays wrote:Morris did great for us the last 3 seasons especially in 2021. Unfortunately I think taking a larger role last season with Kawhi and PG hurt may have taken its toll on his body. Sad but it happens.

Similar to what happened with Reggie. He was great as a complementary piece, but once he was forced to play starter minutes for an extended period of time, his play really suffered. But I would say the fall off for Morris was worse than Reggie's. At least Reggie still did things expected of a point guard. Morris has just been sort of "there" in the lineup. Almost like a Ryan Gomes lol.


Reggie and Mook carried a Kawhi/Norm/PG-less team (PG 31 games) to 42-40 record last season, but they're pretty much spent now. Even with Kawhi and PG back we are essentially at same W-L pace as last season.


Sorry, but that is disinformation. Morris played 54 games last year. Mann, Zubac, Reggie, Luke, Amir and Isaiah were the only people that played more than 60 games as Clippers. Eric Bledsoe palyed as many games as Morris and he was traded away.


Lue probably getting torn between the front office's desire to see RoCo on the court and the Hoop Troop's desire to have someone that can throw T-Shirts. Morris just doesn't have the same arm strength.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#74 » by MartinToVaught » Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:56 pm

playaloc916 wrote:Another camp thinks Lue gives players an extended amount of time to play themselves out of a slump, and that Morris' time was basically up and he didn't show Lue enough, this the demotion.

I'd maybe buy this reasoning if this was December/January. Not when he's still been digging his heels in and making excuses for Morris' abysmal play in March.

It's also undermined by Lue's favoritism. This "extended amount of time" only applies to his favorites, like Reggie and Morris. Other guys like RoCo are glued to the bench because they aren't his favorites. Different standards for different players.

The FO finally stepped in. It's the only explanation that makes any sense.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#75 » by madmaxmedia » Tue Mar 28, 2023 6:46 pm

clipperlover wrote:
madmaxmedia wrote:
playaloc916 wrote:Similar to what happened with Reggie. He was great as a complementary piece, but once he was forced to play starter minutes for an extended period of time, his play really suffered. But I would say the fall off for Morris was worse than Reggie's. At least Reggie still did things expected of a point guard. Morris has just been sort of "there" in the lineup. Almost like a Ryan Gomes lol.


Reggie and Mook carried a Kawhi/Norm/PG-less team (PG 31 games) to 42-40 record last season, but they're pretty much spent now. Even with Kawhi and PG back we are essentially at same W-L pace as last season.


Sorry, but that is disinformation. Morris played 54 games last year. Mann, Zubac, Reggie, Luke, Amir and Isaiah were the only people that played more than 60 games as Clippers. Eric Bledsoe palyed as many games as Morris and he was traded away.


Lue probably getting torn between the front office's desire to see RoCo on the court and the Hoop Troop's desire to have someone that can throw T-Shirts. Morris just doesn't have the same arm strength.


Then Marcus is just spent period. :lol:

But still, that those guys were able to win 42 games and we are on pace for maybe 44 is astounding to me.
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May I? Favoritism Vs. Unfinished Business 

Post#76 » by Wammy Giveaway » Tue Mar 28, 2023 7:36 pm

Unfinished business was also at play for Lue keeping Morris in the starting lineup. "He contributed to their first conference finals appearance while preventing three straight 3-0 deficits. For that, he deserves a championship, let's keep him." Unfortunately, they kept Morris for too long when they should have been playing their young players more. It took the Clippers being eliminated from winning a championship with the 10-35 loss range requirement that I did research on to finally make that move.

I wouldn't really pin the full blame on favoritism here when the cause is really unfinished business. The same kind of unfinished business that allowed Clippers to keep Reggie Jackson around just because a new nickname arose for his June performance and ability to start runs when down double-digit deficits. This made Clippers think, "If we can just get back to the playoffs and reach the Finals which always starts in June, Jackson will become scorching hot and win us a title." Remember, Jackson's June performances were the result of a modified 2020-21 NBA season caused by the COVID-19 pandemic. May has always been a cursed month for Clippers in general. For context, here are their records whenever their playoffs extend into May:

2005-06
- 1st round from April 22 to May 1: 4-1 (3-1 April, 1-0 May)
- 2nd round from May 8 to 22: 3-4
- April 3-1; May 4-4
- 2nd round exit to Suns

2011-12 (Lockout Playoffs)
- 1st round from April 29 to May 13: 4-3 (1-0 April, 3-3 May)
- 2nd round from May 15 to 20: 0-4
- April 1-0; May 3-7
- 2nd round sweep by Spurs

2013-14 (The Donald Sterling Scandal)
- 1st round from April 19 to May 3: 4-3 (3-2 April, 1-1 May)
- 2nd round from May 5 to 15: 2-4
- April 3-2; May 3-5
- 2nd round exit to Thunder

2014-15 (The 3-1 Collapse)
- 1st round from April 19 to May 2: 4-3 (3-3 April, 1-0 May)
- 2nd round from May 4 to 17: 3-4
- April 3-3; May 3-5
- 2nd round exit to Rockets

2020-21 (Double 2-0 Comeback, Triple 3-0 Prevention, First Conference Finals)
- 1st round from May 22 to June 6: 4-3 (2-2 May, 2-1 June)
- 2nd round from June 8 to 18: 4-2
- Conference from June 20 to 30: 2-4
- May 2-2; June 8-7
- Lost conference finals to Chris Paul

April Record: 10-6
May Record: 15-28
June Record: 8-7

For me, favoritism is more in the line of nepotism, like when Doc Rivers had his son Austin around. Jackson's is because Clippers feel compelled to reward him for his playoffs breakout, and were willing to protect him even at the expense of the team. Unfinished business can lead to favoritism but there has to be a reason for it.

Here's the funny part to the whole Morris thing. The Lakers got Markieff Morris as a buyout in 2020 NBA Playoffs and he actually contributed to their playoff run. Clipper's Marcus Morris was a trade where he had key contributions in 2021, but there's a chance that a future title run might not feature him at all. Morris could end up being a DNP-CD/garbage time player when all this is through - and that's if they can survive May.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#77 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 8:14 pm

You can't send Zu out this far
could see a lot of Plumlee if we face Jokic

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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#78 » by clipperlover » Tue Mar 28, 2023 8:43 pm

esqtvd wrote:You can't send Zu out this far
could see a lot of Plumlee if we face Jokic

Read on Twitter


I would really hope they have something new and unique in the works for a Jokic match-up. They have been going through the motions all season. I hope they have some good game plans waiting for the playoffs. Something that will take the opponents by surprise.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#79 » by esqtvd » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:05 pm

Some interesting stuff here.

https://clutchpoints.com/clippers-news-nicolas-batum-expected-to-start-moving-forward-robert-covington-taking-his-place-off-bench

People forget that Marcus was fine to start the year.

    Morris had started the season off hot for the Clippers, averaging 14.7 points and 5.1 rebounds on 48.8 percent shooting from the field and 40.2 from three.

Nobody disputes that Marcus's game has gone to hell on BOTH ends over the last 6 weeks or so.

    Since the All-Star break, Morris had been shooting just 39.7 percent from the field and 23.5 percent from three.

    The last few games had gotten tricky for the Clippers, as it became increasingly clear that opposing players like Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Jalen Williams, Brandon Ingram, Trey Murphy, and CJ McCollum were hunting Morris during games against the Oklahoma City Thunder and New Orleans Pelicans, respectively.

But there was never the right time to demote him when we added 3 new rotation players at the All-Star break--including the very chancy Westbrook project in the starting lineup.

I'm glad that Marcus was alerted and not disrespected, and apparently HE doesn't mind being put out of OUR misery.

    “It was nothing that Marcus did wrong,” Tyronn Lue explained. “We’re just trying something different. And when you’re not playing well, you want to try something different and Marcus was all for it. We have to sacrifice if we want to win at a high level and our guys have bought into that even in the playoffs two years ago, last year, and now.

And frankly, the lack of veteran leadership and accountability is still the wart on the pretty girl's face.

    The Clippers, in their own right, hadn’t been playing their best basketball. They weren’t following the game-plans of late, which had head coach Tyronn Lue joking about changing his approach.

    “Maybe I should,” Lue said with a laugh. “You make a good point, maybe I should if we keep making the same mistakes and you don’t do what we’ve been working on the last three years maybe I should change my tactic. I’m gonna work on that.”

It might be true that Ty has lost the team and it might cost him his job, but nobody can deny that Kawhi is no LeBron or Kobe who's gonna fry your ass if you don't stick with the game plan either. I'm never gonna let him off the hook and scapegoat the role players. This is HIS team.


Where we go from here is a dice roll. Batum can't keep hitting 80% of his threes OR play 31 minutes every night. Bones had 13 points and 8 assists with only one turnover and he's not even in the rotation. But there's no doubt there was spring in everybody's step without Mook's struggles looming over everyone's head [they like and respect him], and as Billy Beane said in Moneyball, even change for the sake of change can shake up and wake up a team from the doldrums.
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Re: Game #76: BULLS @ Clippers—Monday 3/27 7:30 PM 

Post#80 » by og15 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:13 pm

playaloc916 wrote:
Scoundreldays wrote:Morris did great for us the last 3 seasons especially in 2021. Unfortunately I think taking a larger role last season with Kawhi and PG hurt may have taken its toll on his body. Sad but it happens.

Similar to what happened with Reggie. He was great as a complementary piece, but once he was forced to play starter minutes for an extended period of time, his play really suffered. But I would say the fall off for Morris was worse than Reggie's. At least Reggie still did things expected of a point guard. Morris has just been sort of "there" in the lineup. Almost like a Ryan Gomes lol.

Wow! We just got a Ryan Gomes mention! Hahaha!

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