NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2022-23 (part 4 - The Final MVP Countdown!)

[Sharkboy242]

This end of season stuff is a mess and shouldn’t be weighted significantly in my opinion.

Any voter who’s worth a damn should take a step back and evaluate the season as a whole rather than slipping into these dumb little black hole narratives.

[Wolfgang630]

This end of season stuff is a mess and shouldn’t be weighted significantly in my opinion.

Any voter who’s worth a damn should take a step back and evaluate the season as a whole rather than slipping into these dumb little black hole narratives.

If there are voters who truly can’t decide then these games matter alot

[Wolfgang630]

Nba.com on Embiid last night lol

Latest performance: Embiid posted 29 points, 9 rebounds, and 5 assists in an Eastern Conference clash against the Bucks. Despite the 117-104 loss, Embiid imposed his will on both ends of the court.

[ty 4191]

Gianni’s may just win after all

Great game against Embiid, but I feel like we have short term memory. He just got beat by over 40, against the Celtics.

Yes but Embiid hasn’t been his dominant self lately

Embiid (last 3 games): 17.9

10 game preceding that: Game Score: 30.6

Massive difference.

Is it possible Embiid isn't used to playing this many games in a season, and is getting exhausted?

[mediocrityrules]

Nba.com on Embiid last night lol

Latest performance: Embiid posted 29 points, 9 rebounds, and 5 assists in an Eastern Conference clash against the Bucks. Despite the 117-104 loss, Embiid imposed his will on both ends of the court.

Imposed his will at both ends?? Brook went 21/6 playing directly against him. To say that he did a thing on the defensive end of the court is so far from the truth. Even on O he's below par for that game.

[BelgradeNugget]

Embiid should have to play at least 70 games to win MVP unless he has comfortably better stats than the field, which he doesn’t. Don’t give him MVP just as a pity award

Love how you mention that cutoff point, knowing it’s now impossible to achieve. This would disqualify Giannis too. Jokic is also struggling to reach that magical number.

No MVP has played less than 71 games (assuming 82 in a season), is it really unreasonable to expect someone with less games played to have a bigger margin to justify the award? I think Embiid has not made it clear he is better than Giannis and Jokic. The award should go to Jokic

Since Jokic is missing games too lately, here is at best the number of games played for these 3 at the end of the season:

1. Jokic 71
2. Embiid 68
3. Giannis 66

So it looks like we have new serious contender for the award, and deservedly so

Jason Tatum

- on his way to play 76 games
- personal record 51-21 rn
- team 2nd in the East
- good stats

He is checking all the boxes

[Sharkboy242]

This end of season stuff is a mess and shouldn’t be weighted significantly in my opinion.

Any voter who’s worth a damn should take a step back and evaluate the season as a whole rather than slipping into these dumb little black hole narratives.

If there are voters who truly can’t decide then these games matter alot

Sadly that's the case and I would argue that these are the problematic voters. A win in October is as good a win in March as far as team record goes, I don't know how or why people lose sight of that. The same goes for the marquee matchups.

This is why stats and analytics will always be better predictors and evaluators than humans. Numbers aren't fickle to human emotions. And I don't just say that as a Jokic fan, it's just silly seeing the MVP award be so open to interpretation to the point that some voters are literally treating it as a legacy award. It's a very specific thing that's defined by a very specific period of time, yet some voters are literally justifying their process based on other players past careers. It's so dumb.

Whatever though. It's not the grand majority of voters as far as I can tell. But there's always that one dude who--when looking at the past two seasons--puts Jokic in like third place or some ****.

[Exp0sed]

Love how you mention that cutoff point, knowing it’s now impossible to achieve. This would disqualify Giannis too. Jokic is also struggling to reach that magical number.

No MVP has played less than 71 games (assuming 82 in a season), is it really unreasonable to expect someone with less games played to have a bigger margin to justify the award? I think Embiid has not made it clear he is better than Giannis and Jokic. The award should go to Jokic

Since Jokic is missing games too lately, here is at best the number of games played for these 3 at the end of the season:

1. Jokic 71
2. Embiid 68
3. Giannis 66

So it looks like we have new serious contender for the award, and deservedly so

Jason Tatum

- on his way to play 76 games
- personal record 51-21 rn
- team 2nd in the East
- good stats

He is checking all the boxes

Jokic is sitting out these end of season meaningless games. Meaningless as in - have no bearing on the standings\seedings

It shouldn't be weighted equally
The same goes for Embiid whom i'm assuming will sit the rest of the way or maybe after one more win when the 76ers will be locked into 3rd

With that said, i told y'all just a couple of days ago that they are all gonna sit and Tatum might win it by default



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[Ryoga Hibiki]

Does Denver beating GSW without Jokic help or hurt Joker's case?

it definitely helps the Nuggets case in the playoffs, I think it might make sense to let this team figure out thing without Jokic

[losmi]

Nba.com on Embiid last night lol

Latest performance: Embiid posted 29 points, 9 rebounds, and 5 assists in an Eastern Conference clash against the Bucks. Despite the 117-104 loss, Embiid imposed his will on both ends of the court.

Imposed his will on both ends with 51.5 TS% and 129.0 DEFRTG lol.

[antonac]

I asked this in another thread but it's a somewhat serious question, albeit it with a little element of being a troll.

So, the straw poll had Jokic first on more ballots but Embiid came out on top by merit of getting more 2nds. Now given in the instances where Jokic must have been finishing 3rd or lower, it would be due to Giannis and possibly Tatum coming in ahead. This means, more voters think Jokic is the better center, and lets face it, even the biggest Jokic hater wouldn't have him lower than 2nd in terms of centers.

Soooo that would mean Jokic is currently favourite to get first team all-NBA. And Embiid may well be MVP but he'll be in the 2nd team.

isn't that going to look weird?

[Wolfgang630]

Nba.com on Embiid last night lol

Latest performance: Embiid posted 29 points, 9 rebounds, and 5 assists in an Eastern Conference clash against the Bucks. Despite the 117-104 loss, Embiid imposed his will on both ends of the court.

Imposed his will on both ends with 51.5 TS% and 129.0 DEFRTG lol.

Yeah….lol

[losmi]

I asked this in another thread but it's a somewhat serious question, albeit it with a little element of being a troll.

So, the straw poll had Jokic first on more ballots but Embiid came out on top by merit of getting more 2nds. Now given in the instances where Jokic must have been finishing 3rd or lower, it would be due to Giannis and possibly Tatum coming in ahead. This means, more voters think Jokic is the better center, and lets face it, even the biggest Jokic hater wouldn't have him lower than 2nd in terms of centers.

Soooo that would mean Jokic is currently favourite to get first team all-NBA. And Embiid may well be MVP but he'll be in the 2nd team.

isn't that going to look weird?

I'm really curious to see how those that'll have Embiid at 1st place for MVP will fill out their All-NBA ballots.

It's one thing to give the MVP to someone just because he's crying for it, but another thing to put a 25-12-10 70TS% +14 per100 1st seed center on the 2nd team All-NBA.

Perhaps the new positionless All-NBA (the "Joel Embiid rule") that starts from the next season gives the voters a green light to put one of them at F this season.

[antonac]

I asked this in another thread but it's a somewhat serious question, albeit it with a little element of being a troll.

So, the straw poll had Jokic first on more ballots but Embiid came out on top by merit of getting more 2nds. Now given in the instances where Jokic must have been finishing 3rd or lower, it would be due to Giannis and possibly Tatum coming in ahead. This means, more voters think Jokic is the better center, and lets face it, even the biggest Jokic hater wouldn't have him lower than 2nd in terms of centers.

Soooo that would mean Jokic is currently favourite to get first team all-NBA. And Embiid may well be MVP but he'll be in the 2nd team.

isn't that going to look weird?

I'm really curious to see how those that'll have Embiid at 1st place for MVP will fill out their All-NBA ballots.

It's one thing to give the MVP to someone just because he's crying for it, but another thing to put a 25-12-10 70TS% +14 per100 1st seed center on the 2nd team All-NBA.

Perhaps the new positionless All-NBA (the "Joel Embiid rule") that starts from the next season gives the voters a green light to put one of them at F this season.

If you think Embiid is MVP you should put Jokic in the 2nd team.

The point I'm making is that even if that happens, per the straw poll, Jokic would still get 1st team all-NBA (providing he is consensus top 2, which he is) as his third place votes, which cost him the MVP, would default to seconds because Giannis is being voted in first as a forward.

Also, no one cares if you win 3 all-NBAs in a row without a ring, those precedents don't matter.

But yeah, the new all-nba positionless thing does seem like an Embiid rule.

[LordCovington33]

I asked this in another thread but it's a somewhat serious question, albeit it with a little element of being a troll.

So, the straw poll had Jokic first on more ballots but Embiid came out on top by merit of getting more 2nds. Now given in the instances where Jokic must have been finishing 3rd or lower, it would be due to Giannis and possibly Tatum coming in ahead. This means, more voters think Jokic is the better center, and lets face it, even the biggest Jokic hater wouldn't have him lower than 2nd in terms of centers.

Soooo that would mean Jokic is currently favourite to get first team all-NBA. And Embiid may well be MVP but he'll be in the 2nd team.

isn't that going to look weird?

Tatum got 1 second and 2 thirds - he pushed Giannis out of top 3 - not Embiid or Jokic. (Neither player got 4th or 5th placings)

Jokic had 42 1st and Embiid had 40. Still pretty close.

Since Embiid had 85 top 2 placings compared to Jokic’s 81, I think Embiid would still top First Team based purely on that poll.

[jokeboy86]

Great game against Embiid, but I feel like we have short term memory. He just got beat by over 40, against the Celtics.

Yes but Embiid hasn’t been his dominant self lately

Embiid (last 3 games): 17.9

10 game preceding that: Game Score: 30.6

Massive difference.

Is it possible Embiid isn't used to playing this many games in a season, and is getting exhausted?

He always gets exhausted which is why the 76ers are foolish to ask him and Harden, two players who still have conditioning problems, to carry them deep into the playoffs for a title. I know they already did this for the 1st 3 years of his career but the best thing the 76ers should do with Embiid from here on out is treat him like Kawhi Leonard and just make sure he's primed and ready to go for the playoffs. He's avg more minutes and doing more than he's ever done and he's not going to have enough left for the playoffs.

[bisme37]

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