Official Scottie Barnes Thread - Part 5

[brownbobcat]

It’s not better than Siakam’s. He’s made big strides in his handles since last year though.

I mean, Siakam has 7 seasons under his belt, really Siakam should have the better handle.

I think Barnes will eventually surpass Siakam's peak, but i'm not sure when.

Probably 2 more years or so. He doesn’t need incredibly tight handles though, he’s strong enough to push people off their defensive stances and get to his spots

He just needs more ball security in his handles like a Jimmy Butler or Kawhi. It’s still fairly sloppy but he has time to tighten them up.

Siakam has better handles than both of them but he’s weak as **** so he still settles for a contested middy or spin move.

Getting a handle on his upside as a scorer is very hard. Barnes has great touch and is slightly unorthodox with his movement and push shots. The flip side is that he is still quite clunky and lacks fluidity. Despite his raw strength, he occasionally has a hard time backing down a smaller set defender because of his high base. He's much more effective when he's on the move and the defender doesn't have the angle to stand him up.

The ability to create and function in space is going to be a huge X factor.

[HumbleRen]

I mean, Siakam has 7 seasons under his belt, really Siakam should have the better handle.

I think Barnes will eventually surpass Siakam's peak, but i'm not sure when.

Probably 2 more years or so. He doesn’t need incredibly tight handles though, he’s strong enough to push people off their defensive stances and get to his spots

He just needs more ball security in his handles like a Jimmy Butler or Kawhi. It’s still fairly sloppy but he has time to tighten them up.

Siakam has better handles than both of them but he’s weak as **** so he still settles for a contested middy or spin move.

Getting a handle on his upside as a scorer is very hard. Barnes has great touch and is slightly unorthodox with his movement and push shots. The flip side is that he is still quite clunky and lacks fluidity. Despite his raw strength, he occasionally has a hard time backing down a smaller set defender because of his high base. He's much more effective when he's on the move and the defender doesn't have the angle to stand him up.

The ability to create and function in space is going to be a huge X factor.

Curse of having high hips.

Giannis can get away with it cause he’s 7 foot with generational athleticism.

[HumbleRen]

I asked Bing on it's thoughts on Scottie becoming an all star next year, this is what it said.

Some of the players who are likely to be voted as starters or reserves for the Eastern Conference frontcourt are Giannis Antetokounmpo, Kevin Durant, Jayson Tatum, Joel Embiid, Bam Adebayo, Julius Randle, Jimmy Butler and Pascal Siakam. Barnes will have to outperform some of these players or hope that some of them miss games due to injury or rest to increase his chances of being selected.

Barnes will also have to improve his individual stats and help his team win more games to boost his All-Star case. He is currently averaging 15.5 points, 6.9 rebounds and 4.7 assists per game on 45.3% shooting from the field and 29.8% from three-point range4. These are good numbers for a second-year player, but not enough to stand out among the elite players in his position. He will have to increase his scoring efficiency, especially from beyond the arc, and show more consistency and impact on both ends of the floor.

Additionally, Barnes will have to earn more recognition and support from fans, players and media who vote for the All-Star starters, as well as coaches who vote for the reserves. He plays in a small market in Toronto, which may limit his exposure and popularity compared to other players who play in bigger markets or have more media attention. He will have to showcase his skills and personality more often and attract more followers and fans who will vote for him.

In conclusion, I think Scottie Barnes can become an All-Star next year, but he will have to work hard and overcome some challenges to achieve that goal. He has a lot of potential and talent, but he also has a lot of room for improvement and growth. In this context, a human might say that he is a rising star with a bright future, but he still has some hurdles to clear before reaching All-Star status.

[Tha Cynic]

Uninspired last couple of games from Barnes so far. He needs to go harder.

[whitehops]

Nah man, I can’t sip the koolaid this much lol.

Siakam has way more counters than Scottie does. Scottie isn’t doing more complex dribbles. He’s just doing workout ball dribbles, he isn’t really going anywhere with his combos.

It’s his aggressiveness to get into the chest of his defender when driving to the rim that’s open up his scoring ability.

That’s exactly the way I’ve thought of it, he’s not moving his body at all and just dribbling back and forth quickly. Defenders are taught to keep their eyes on the body not the ball so it doesn’t shake the defenders at all.

Sometimes keeping it simple can be super effective. James harden pretty much has his one rocking lullaby crossover and was able to get to the rim at will. Cade Cunningham has his rocker move out of a triple threat position which gets the best defenders off balance without even having to dribble. Barnes is a pretty stiff athlete like Lebron so maybe a simple hesitation move can be effective for him. With Barnes’ size/physicality he only has to get his defenders a little off balance and then can use his body the rest of the way. Not sure why he tries kyrie-like dribbling moves when there are much better options for him.

It’s still super early in his career though and him being able to create advantages for himself from the perimeter will open up his game immensely.

[HumbleRen]

Nah man, I can’t sip the koolaid this much lol.

Siakam has way more counters than Scottie does. Scottie isn’t doing more complex dribbles. He’s just doing workout ball dribbles, he isn’t really going anywhere with his combos.

It’s his aggressiveness to get into the chest of his defender when driving to the rim that’s open up his scoring ability.

That’s exactly the way I’ve thought of it, he’s not moving his body at all and just dribbling back and forth quickly. Defenders are taught to keep their eyes on the body not the ball so it doesn’t shake the defenders at all.

Sometimes keeping it simple can be super effective. James harden pretty much has his one rocking lullaby crossover and was able to get to the rim at will. Cade Cunningham has his rocker move out of a triple threat position which gets the best defenders off balance without even having to dribble. Barnes is a pretty stiff athlete like Lebron so maybe a simple hesitation move can be effective for him. With Barnes’ size/physicality he only has to get his defenders a little off balance and then can use his body the rest of the way. Not sure why he tries kyrie-like dribbling moves when there are much better options for him.

It’s still super early in his career though and him being able to create advantages for himself from the perimeter will open up his game immensely.

OG did it the entire season last year, it was so annoying lol.

I think these guys just learn so much new stuff in the off season and are so eager to try them out in the regular season but it just doesn’t translate because it’s so predetermined.

This year though, OG is way more controlled and efficient with his dribbles and that’s translating to his best year to date. Hopefully the same happens with Scottie next year.

[brownbobcat]

That’s exactly the way I’ve thought of it, he’s not moving his body at all and just dribbling back and forth quickly. Defenders are taught to keep their eyes on the body not the ball so it doesn’t shake the defenders at all.

Sometimes keeping it simple can be super effective. James harden pretty much has his one rocking lullaby crossover and was able to get to the rim at will. Cade Cunningham has his rocker move out of a triple threat position which gets the best defenders off balance without even having to dribble. Barnes is a pretty stiff athlete like Lebron so maybe a simple hesitation move can be effective for him. With Barnes’ size/physicality he only has to get his defenders a little off balance and then can use his body the rest of the way. Not sure why he tries kyrie-like dribbling moves when there are much better options for him.

It’s still super early in his career though and him being able to create advantages for himself from the perimeter will open up his game immensely.

You can have the best handle in the world but it means nothing if you can't hit shots or drive all the way to the basket. Defenders are on a knife's edge when Kyrie and Harden start their dribble because they can kill you so many ways. You have to play tight to respect the stepback. If you pressure too tightly, they can get to the rim with power (Harden) or finesse (Kyrie) and can finish with insane layup packages or find the open man. Defenders are just giving Barnes a buffer right now and daring him to shoot, there is no reason to bite on any fakes.

[whitehops]

You can have the best handle in the world but it means nothing if you can't hit shots or drive all the way to the basket. Defenders are on a knife's edge when Kyrie and Harden start their dribble because they can kill you so many ways. You have to play tight to respect the stepback. If you pressure too tightly, they can get to the rim with power (Harden) or finesse (Kyrie) and can finish with insane layup packages or find the open man. Defenders are just giving Barnes a buffer right now and daring him to shoot, there is no reason to bite on any fakes.

That’s why the hesitation move would be a good starting point for Barnes. Early in lebron’s career teams gave him a ton of space because they respected his driving a lot more than his perimeter shooting. Him getting a head of steam, throwing in a hesi to get the defender a little off balance meant he was able to muscle his way to the rim. Lebron obviously added a ton more moves throughout his career but that’s where he started and it’d probably be a good place to start for Barnes too.

[WuTang_CMB]

Read on Twitter

[ItsDanger]

I asked Bing on it's thoughts on Scottie becoming an all star next year, this is what it said.

Some of the players who are likely to be voted as starters or reserves for the Eastern Conference frontcourt are Giannis Antetokounmpo, Kevin Durant, Jayson Tatum, Joel Embiid, Bam Adebayo, Julius Randle, Jimmy Butler and Pascal Siakam. Barnes will have to outperform some of these players or hope that some of them miss games due to injury or rest to increase his chances of being selected.

Barnes will also have to improve his individual stats and help his team win more games to boost his All-Star case. He is currently averaging 15.5 points, 6.9 rebounds and 4.7 assists per game on 45.3% shooting from the field and 29.8% from three-point range4. These are good numbers for a second-year player, but not enough to stand out among the elite players in his position. He will have to increase his scoring efficiency, especially from beyond the arc, and show more consistency and impact on both ends of the floor.

Additionally, Barnes will have to earn more recognition and support from fans, players and media who vote for the All-Star starters, as well as coaches who vote for the reserves. He plays in a small market in Toronto, which may limit his exposure and popularity compared to other players who play in bigger markets or have more media attention. He will have to showcase his skills and personality more often and attract more followers and fans who will vote for him.

In conclusion, I think Scottie Barnes can become an All-Star next year, but he will have to work hard and overcome some challenges to achieve that goal. He has a lot of potential and talent, but he also has a lot of room for improvement and growth. In this context, a human might say that he is a rising star with a bright future, but he still has some hurdles to clear before reaching All-Star status.

Same comment style as some posters here. Surely, by pure chance.

[will]

Dammit, Scottish.

Still gotta play with the fraudulent 1A and 1B.

[OakleyDokely]

Read on Twitter

[will]

Read on Twitter

Scottish is a very nice playmaker.

[C-R-E-A-M-]

https://streamable.com/syf2gp

Another co-sign

[Vampirate]

Nah man, I can’t sip the koolaid this much lol.

Siakam has way more counters than Scottie does. Scottie isn’t doing more complex dribbles. He’s just doing workout ball dribbles, he isn’t really going anywhere with his combos.

It’s his aggressiveness to get into the chest of his defender when driving to the rim that’s open up his scoring ability.

That’s exactly the way I’ve thought of it, he’s not moving his body at all and just dribbling back and forth quickly. Defenders are taught to keep their eyes on the body not the ball so it doesn’t shake the defenders at all.

Sometimes keeping it simple can be super effective. James harden pretty much has his one rocking lullaby crossover and was able to get to the rim at will. Cade Cunningham has his rocker move out of a triple threat position which gets the best defenders off balance without even having to dribble. Barnes is a pretty stiff athlete like Lebron so maybe a simple hesitation move can be effective for him. With Barnes’ size/physicality he only has to get his defenders a little off balance and then can use his body the rest of the way. Not sure why he tries kyrie-like dribbling moves when there are much better options for him.

It’s still super early in his career though and him being able to create advantages for himself from the perimeter will open up his game immensely.

OG did it the entire season last year, it was so annoying lol.

I think these guys just learn so much new stuff in the off season and are so eager to try them out in the regular season but it just doesn’t translate because it’s so predetermined.

This year though, OG is way more controlled and efficient with his dribbles and that’s translating to his best year to date. Hopefully the same happens with Scottie next year.

All Barnes really needs is a reliable midrange, which i'm still confident he can do (he shot .369 from 16ft-3P, despite starting horribly.) I think he can be a .450 type player, not naying it's guaranteed or anything but it's difficult to judge if last year's .398 from 12-16ft was the outlier, or him shooting .297 there this year.

I'm not holding my breath of his 3 point shot, but it's possible he may have a few decent shooting years in the future of .350+.

But really, he he becomes good in the midrange, along with his frame, strength and passing skills, he'll become deadly.

[djsunyc]

That’s exactly the way I’ve thought of it, he’s not moving his body at all and just dribbling back and forth quickly. Defenders are taught to keep their eyes on the body not the ball so it doesn’t shake the defenders at all.

Sometimes keeping it simple can be super effective. James harden pretty much has his one rocking lullaby crossover and was able to get to the rim at will. Cade Cunningham has his rocker move out of a triple threat position which gets the best defenders off balance without even having to dribble. Barnes is a pretty stiff athlete like Lebron so maybe a simple hesitation move can be effective for him. With Barnes’ size/physicality he only has to get his defenders a little off balance and then can use his body the rest of the way. Not sure why he tries kyrie-like dribbling moves when there are much better options for him.

It’s still super early in his career though and him being able to create advantages for himself from the perimeter will open up his game immensely.

OG did it the entire season last year, it was so annoying lol.

I think these guys just learn so much new stuff in the off season and are so eager to try them out in the regular season but it just doesn’t translate because it’s so predetermined.

This year though, OG is way more controlled and efficient with his dribbles and that’s translating to his best year to date. Hopefully the same happens with Scottie next year.

All Barnes really needs is a reliable midrange, which i'm still confident he can do (he shot .369 from 16ft-3P, despite starting horribly.) I think he can be a .450 type player, not naying it's guaranteed or anything but it's difficult to judge if last year's .398 from 12-16ft was the outlier, or him shooting .297 there this year.

I'm not holding my breath of his 3 point shot, but it's possible he may have a few decent shooting years in the future of .350+.

But really, he he becomes good in the midrange, along with his frame, strength and passing skills, he'll become deadly.

lebron was a pretty bad shooter from 5-19 feet his first 5+ years in the league. the big difference tho is that he really attacked the basket and finished or drew fouls while also being a passer. that poor MR shooting isn't as important.

scottie almost never looks to draw fouls or score on halfcourt drives if there's a defender close to the rim which drastically alters his effectiveness - it puts alot more emphasis on his ability to hit MR shots. this is a mental approach more than developing a skill. we can live with poor MR shooting if he's drawing fouls and making defenses shift.

[HiJiNX]

https://streamable.com/syf2gp

Another co-sign

If Scottie puts it all together he can be the best player we have ever drafted. He gotta put in the work, though. Hopefully this season has taught him what it means to be in the NBA and that regardless of talent and physical gifts you gotta outwork everybody if you want to be great.

[djsunyc]

just trying to figure out what year you all win turn on him. 50/50 it's next season.

[ArthurVandelay]

just trying to figure out what year you all win turn on him. 50/50 it's next season.

Ha - you’re not wrong

I think the issue is Scottie is better suited as the glue of a great team. He’s the type of player who can do it all and hold a team together. He’s the type of player every coach loves. He’s not going to be a top scoring threat night in, night out. That’s why I’d love to see him paired with someone like Shaeden Sharpe.

[will]

just trying to figure out what year you all win turn on him. 50/50 it's next season.

Ha - you’re not wrong

I think the issue is Scottie is better suited as the glue of a great team. He’s the type of player who can do it all and hold a team together. He’s the type of player every coach loves. He’s not going to be a top scoring threat night in, night out. That’s why I’d love to see him paired with someone like Shaeden Sharpe.

No one is expecting Scottish to be a big-time scorer, though. Almost sure that has never been the thought process.

Great do-it-all type of player that will be a souped up glue guy on a great team.