2023 NBA Draft Thread

[amcoolio]

If Denver loses in the first round, does that mean they move up in the draft?

If they were in the play-in and lost then yeah. They're the 1st seed though, so where that pick lands at the end of the regular season is where it will stay.

So they are locked into either 28, 29, or 30? I thought the rest of the non-lottery was based on playoff performance

[JDR720]

I think the champs pick 30th and the runner up pick 29th. After that it's RS record.

[SWedd523]

Remember when some folks were saying trading Eason for the Nuggets pick wasn't bad because they weren't going to be that good?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

[Benjamin Linus]

I don't keep up with who says what on here but it sure seemed like 97% of this board hated that deal

[Bassman]

I don't keep up with who says what on here but it sure seemed like 97% of this board hated that deal

Yep, perhaps the most idiotic trade ever made by Mitch, as Denver’s clear trajectory for this season was nowhere near lottery or mid-level finish.

[bravor]

I mostly remember the other side of the coin, Eason would have been quite a good fit here (and even if he was up & down this season, he is really at worst a playable starter at the wing for this team).
But it was before the Bridges's mess too. I would guess they would have drafted him if they had known the incoming mess, especially considering the reports about his (good) work out in Charlotte pre draft.

But there is at least one good thing, salaries of a late 1st rounder are decent for flexibility (D. Bane being the perfect example as being the player he is -and the fit -, he allowed Memphis to negotiate good extensions ).

[JDR720]

Read on Twitter

[UNCNYC]

Its EXTREEEEMLY hard for me to pick a top five in this draft of FAVORITE players but if I HAD TO pick a top 5 players I would be most happy we drafted on draft day from a fans perspective those five would be in order

1. Craig Porter JR
2. Mike Sharavjamts
3. Jalen Wilson
4. Agustin UBAL
5. Reece Beekman

[GiggitySmalls]

Its EXTREEEEMLY hard for me to pick a top five in this draft of FAVORITE players but if I HAD TO pick a top 5 players I would be most happy we drafted on draft day from a fans perspective those five would be in order

1. Craig Porter JR
2. Mike Sharavjamts
3. Jalen Wilson
4. Agustin UBAL
5. Reece Beekman

So none of those will be top 5. No disrespect but what makes your never heard of players go top 5? Every year its the same. No hate but why? I already seen you say so and so would be a good macdaniels replacement. Thing is we don't need another and we didn't need him. Why is it that we are so short sighted on talet?

Sent from my SM-F936U using RealGM mobile app

[UNCNYC]

Its EXTREEEEMLY hard for me to pick a top five in this draft of FAVORITE players but if I HAD TO pick a top 5 players I would be most happy we drafted on draft day from a fans perspective those five would be in order

1. Craig Porter JR
2. Mike Sharavjamts
3. Jalen Wilson
4. Agustin UBAL
5. Reece Beekman

So none of those will be top 5. No disrespect but what makes your never heard of players go top 5? Every year its the same. No hate but why? I already seen you say so and so would be a good macdaniels replacement. Thing is we don't need another and we didn't need him. Why is it that we are so short sighted on talet?

Sent from my SM-F936U using RealGM mobile app

I could have sworn I added in there *FROM A FANS PERSPECTIVE*

I have listed my top five REPEADEDLY on this board. Haven't seen your name around so maybe you didn't notice. That five has consistantly been for the most part

Nikola Durisic, Brandon Miller, Jalen Wilson, Anthony black, Jalen Hood Schifino

The five listed above are the five I most want *FROM A FANS PERSPECTIVE*

[Chapelchilla]

Remember when some folks were saying trading Eason for the Nuggets pick wasn't bad because they weren't going to be that good?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

You are taking part of the equation that fit your seeming need to bash on everything about Hornets but leaving out the other parts.

So far the actual return on what was the Duren pick is -

Bryce McGowan (who seems like he could be at least a solid rotation guy or at best a future starter).

The 27th pick in the draft
the 39th pick in Draft and the 42nd pick
another undetermined future pick

AKA lots of trade chips to move around if they want or plenty of prospects incoming

Also by being worse this year (Duren or MAYBE Eason may have helped them win a few they lost) they now have the 4th best odds in the lottery and the 34th pick as well

ALL of those factors matter when talking about that deal. Wait 2 more years and let's see how that trade looks for real.

[SWedd523]

Remember when some folks were saying trading Eason for the Nuggets pick wasn't bad because they weren't going to be that good?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

You are taking part of the equation that fit your seeming need to bash on everything about Hornets but leaving out the other parts.

So far the actual return on what was the Duren pick is -

Bryce McGowan (who seems like he could be at least a solid rotation guy or at best a future starter).

The 27th pick in the draft
the 39th pick in Draft and the 42nd pick
another undetermined future pick

AKA lots of trade chips to move around if they want or plenty of prospects incoming

Also by being worse this year (Duren or MAYBE Eason may have helped them win a few they lost) they now have the 4th best odds in the lottery and the 34th pick as well

ALL of those factors matter when talking about that deal. Wait 2 more years and let's see how that trade looks for real.

Lot of rationalization to say trading a lottery pick for a bunch of late firsts and seconds isn't a bad trade... which it was.

Gotta say though, kudos for making the argument that being worse this year as a result of the trade is actually a good thing

[Chapelchilla]

What Mitch does with the plethora of picks he traded for is absolutely relevant to whether or not the trade was good or not. How could anyone think otherwise?

Is having Duren (or maybe it COULD have been Eason) better then having Bryce and the other 4 or so guys who get taken with those picks he got?

That is not clear at all and it wont be for a few years. Fact.

Second - Unless you think that Duren or Eason was completely worthless in the win column for Detroit or Houston
(debatable though it remains possible neither is actually a particularly impactful on winning player)
it follows that not having them on the Hornets would have made our results worse this season.

Which is as it turns out is a good thing going forward. Especially if it leads to a top 3 pick.

My guess is they use some of the picks they acquired in the Duren deal to move around (either up in this draft or to get another first in the future).

When all those dominos fall and the picks are ALL in we can compare the impact that Duren has made to Bryce's and whatever those picks eventually turn into. That is the actual trade NOT Duren for the 27th pick this year.
It was cherry picking to compare part of the deal for us to the end of the deal for them.

That's not how it works. Not sure why you want to take that approach?

[JDR720]

The trade could end up being a good trade. But that doesn't mean, at the time, it made any sense. Especially for the reason of having too many young players like they said.

Williams is gonna be All-Star level. So Williams > Duran (even though he looks really good too).

The difference is will the 27th pick + the 2nd rounders (either players or trade assets) be better than Eason or whoever else we would've picked.

I think those odds are fairly decent, because Mitch has historically been very good at drafting in the 2nd round.


Bryce (assuming he is at least a solid bench scorer)
27th, 39th and 42nd.

Is probably better than Eason or whoever. Of course, if we sell those 2nds or draft a bad player and Eason ends up good then it was a massive failure.

[JMAC3]

Hornets traded 57th pick (Balsa Koprivica) for Mason Plumlee and JT Thor. Agree we need to see it bake out before we call it awful.

There was also an alarmingly high outrage when we traded Jalen McDaniels for Svi, 34th pick and that actually looks pretty smart after Mcdaniels averaged sub 7 points the remainder of the year.

[fatlever]

i would take svi over mcd straight up

[SWedd523]

What Mitch does with the plethora of picks he traded for is absolutely relevant to whether or not the trade was good or not. How could anyone think otherwise?

Is having Duren (or maybe it COULD have been Eason) better then having Bryce and the other 4 or so guys who get taken with those picks he got?

Yes.

For a number of reasons.

1. This isn't the NFL where quantity > quality. Better individual players provide more value than a handful of league avergage-ish players.

2. A single lottery pick is worth more than late firsts and seconds because higher draft picks historically equate to better players

3. They aren't even likely to maintain all of those picks for lack of roster space, so unless they fleece some other stupid FO, they're stuck punting them down the road.

4. A better trade should've been found if they wanted to move out of their second pick.


The Knicks traded the 11th pick for 3x firsts, two of which came from bad teams (Detroit and Washington).

We traded the 13th for 1x late first and 4x seconds, (first being from the best team in the Western Conference and 3 of the 4 seconds being playoff teams).

Compare those returns and tell me if they're even remotely in the same neighborhood.


Put your GM hat on. Would you rather have the 13th pick in the draft or the 27th, 39th, 42nd?


Some resources:

https://www.rrosenb.org/nba-draft-pick-value-by-draft-slot/
https://thedatajocks.com/nba-draft-pick-values/
http://nbasense.com/draft-pick-trade-value/2/kevin-pelton-2

FACT: The NBA draft is inherently top heavy and sees significant ROI dropoff outside even the top 5. The majority of second rounders don't even see second contracts. I don't care how you want to spin it. It's a bad trade in both theory and practice.

[bubowskee]

My main problem with the picks we have right now is that we cannot possibly use all 5 of them without trading/cutting guys with guaranteed money next season. It is good to have a pick in the 30s but once you have a couple, they get devalued. So while we have 27, 34, 39, and 42, and that is great. We will have to move at least two of those picks so hopefully you do that to move up in the draft, maybe to around 19-21. If we sit at these picks, you dont get much value, just last year Orlando traded 35 for a far our second from the Lakers and that is pretty consistent when you are that flush with this later picks.

[JMAC3]

What Mitch does with the plethora of picks he traded for is absolutely relevant to whether or not the trade was good or not. How could anyone think otherwise?

Is having Duren (or maybe it COULD have been Eason) better then having Bryce and the other 4 or so guys who get taken with those picks he got?

Yes.

For a number of reasons.

1. This isn't the NFL where quantity > quality. Better individual players provide more value than a handful of league avergage-ish players.

2. A single lottery pick is worth more than late firsts and seconds because higher draft picks historically equate to better players

3. They aren't even likely to maintain all of those picks for lack of roster space, so unless they fleece some other stupid FO, they're stuck punting them down the road.

4. A better trade should've been found if they wanted to move out of their second pick.


The Knicks traded the 11th pick for 3x firsts, two of which came from bad teams (Detroit and Washington).

We traded the 13th for 1x late first and 4x seconds, (first being from the best team in the Western Conference and 3 of the 4 seconds being playoff teams).

Compare those returns and tell me if they're even remotely in the same neighborhood.


Put your GM hat on. Would you rather have the 13th pick in the draft or the 27th, 39th, 42nd?


Some resources:

https://www.rrosenb.org/nba-draft-pick-value-by-draft-slot/
https://thedatajocks.com/nba-draft-pick-values/
http://nbasense.com/draft-pick-trade-value/2/kevin-pelton-2

FACT: The NBA draft is inherently top heavy and sees significant ROI dropoff outside even the top 5. The majority of second rounders don't even see second contracts. I don't care how you want to spin it. It's a bad trade in both theory and practice.

The Knicks picks they received from Pistons and Wizards are crazy protected. Maybe you sit on them for 3-4 years and you get lucky with a good pick, but it is pretty clear they didn't have a lot of trade value and still don't hence why Knicks gave up their own first for Hart this year vs either of these picks.

Detroit's 1st round pick to New York protected for selections 1-18 in 2023, 1-18 in 2024, 1-13 in 2025, 1-11 in 2026 and 1-9 in 2027; if Detroit has not conveyed a 1st round pick to New York by 2027, then Detroit will instead convey its 2027 2nd round pick to New York

Washington's 1st round pick to New York protected for selections 1-14 in 2023, 1-12 in 2024, 1-10 in 2025 and 1-8 in 2026; if Washington has not conveyed a 1st round pick to New York by 2026, then Washington will instead convey its 2026 2nd round pick and 2027 2nd round pick to New York

[bubowskee]

Fwiw the pistons and wizards picks are both going to convey unless something catastrophic happens. It just hasn’t happened yet but it will